posted by
martyb
on Sunday July 09 2017, @07:09AM
from the can-you-plan-to-fail...-and-succeed? dept.
from the can-you-plan-to-fail...-and-succeed? dept.
CHICAGO — To graduate from a public high school in Chicago, students will soon have to meet a new and unusual requirement: They must show that they’ve secured a job or received a letter of acceptance to college, a trade apprenticeship, a gap year program or the military.
To make this stranger, all the students automatically meet this requirement since they are pre-approved for a community college:
A top CPS official also acknowledged, however, that every Chicago public high school graduate essentially already meets the new standard because graduation guarantees admittance to the City Colleges of Chicago community college system.
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Chicago Won't Allow High School Students to Graduate Without a Plan for the Future
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(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @07:13AM (1 child)
In absolute numbers, Chicago is second worst for urban decay, having lost 925,364 residents since 2010. Only the financial sector sustains the economy, and without it, the city would have fallen over and sunk into Lake Michigan long ago. Another disaster like the Loop Flood of 25 years ago should just about finish it. Once the Federal Reserve leaves, Chicago will be a ghost town.
To fulfill the graduation requirement, the answer should be: get a job in a bank.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @11:05PM
The financial sector extracts wealth from the economy.
It produces nothing.
...and they've been doing that in greater and greater quantities for the last 4 decades.
If cities and states and the nation were to do things intelligently, they'd form their own publicly-owned banks.
Instead of having the interest on money collected from the populace going to the privatized parasites, all of that money could be funding projects that benefit the populace (AKA "paying ourselves interest").
Note that they already do this in North Dakota.
They've been doing it for over a century.
They weathered The Great Depression better than the other states and are doing likewise in the Bush-Obama-Trump Depression.
A really smart gal [google.com] ran for Treasurer of California on the Green Party ticket with this as her platform.
(I voted for her.)
...and The Orange Clown's favorite president is Andrew Jackson, who killed off the Second Bank of the United States and brought on The Panic of 1837 (a depression that lasted 1837 - 1842).
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @07:44AM (1 child)
Perhaps the goal is to increase the average income of CPS graduates?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @07:51AM
Like the top cop assigned to my high school used to say, you're going to get a job or you're going straight to jail!
(Score: 3, Interesting) by frojack on Sunday July 09 2017, @08:08AM (8 children)
12 years of school, at tax payer expense.
Kept your grades up.
Want to take a couple years off and drive around the country.
No chance of getting a job, because they're withholding your diploma.
Being admitted to City Colleges doesn't mean you can pay for it - or that the degree would be worth anything if you graduated.
Seems a bit of a money grab.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @08:21AM
Besides, who needs a college degree anyway? There are plenty of full stack tech jobs that require only a high school diploma or equivalent, right? High school graduates look at lucrative jobs openings and don't know yet every job is fake and the real requirement is an H1B visa.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday July 09 2017, @11:45AM (4 children)
So, you do some paperwork, and submit it to the community college(s), with copies for the high school. You can demonstrate that you have a "plan", get your diploma, then go do whatever the hell you were going to do anyway.
It sounds like a dick move, really. The law's authors meant well, I suspect, but there are always unintended consequences. Or, as you say, a money grab.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday July 09 2017, @04:17PM (3 children)
Not to mention that it's meaningless because nobody graduates High School in Chicongo. That's GED city, baby.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @10:38PM (2 children)
I wouldn't even get a GED. The entire school (not education) system is a disaster and no one should play along with it, out of principle. Become an autodidact and get a real education; any employer who doesn't hire you over that was foolish and not worth your time anyway.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @11:28PM (1 child)
...because it's just that easy.
Most people don't need teachers, mentors, or experts; they come out of the womb ready to lick the world.
/sarc
Some claim that the son of a tradesman [google.com] became the greatest writer in the English-speaking world--in an era where there was no public education and only the children of the wealthy could have such a "luxury".
Many recognize that it is far more likely that an aristocrat [google.com] with all the advantages of inherited wealth wrote all that stuff.
Not saying it's not possible to educate yourself, but most folks need lots of guidance along the way.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday July 10 2017, @07:33PM
"Most people don't need teachers, mentors, or experts; "
The school system provides teachers. Mentors and experts are often enough unrelated to the teaching profession. Very, very, VERY few people are self educated, but many people have been educated without much if any formal education.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Sunday July 09 2017, @12:44PM
Without even looking I can tell you this being Chicago some account is collecting money per application, doesn't really matter if its coming from taxpayers or directly from the kids.
I would predict this will be implemented in the future as a graduation tax... you want your kid to graduate, you'd pay anything right, so they'll increase prices to pay anything levels much like college tuition or health care. I would not be surprised if in a couple years there's a $500 "application fee" or you don't get your letter until you pay up and the cancellation-with-refund date is before the graduation letter due date so they get to keep a semester of tuition. Or it'll be used to enter the kids into the debt system.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday July 10 2017, @06:22PM
Being admitted to City Colleges doesn't mean you can pay for it
And writing it down in your plan doesn't mean you actually have to attend.
Is it terrible to give HS kids an assignment to at least consider their future options?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @09:44AM (4 children)
This is a massive lawsuit waiting to happen, and with good cause, unless the high school plans to immediately hire every last graduating student who was unable to find a job, with absolutely no exceptions whatsoever. Even then it's a lawsuit with good cause, but then the school would have a tiny leg to stand on.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Sunday July 09 2017, @12:39PM (3 children)
I wonder how they'll handle special ed / special need kids. I'm sure this being Chicago there will be corruption and massive opportunity to fudge the numbers.
Another mystery is the school to prison pipeline kids... All of the opportunities listed are closed to kids in the pipeline due to their growing criminal record. So essentially if you have a record you can't graduate which may be considered illegal discrimination. You can imagine the civil lawsuit for a "good boy trying to turn his life around".
(Score: 2) by Pino P on Sunday July 09 2017, @09:06PM (2 children)
All? I thought Chris Rock said "anyone in the community could get in" to community college: "crackheads, prostitutes, come on in!" And it's not just a comedy routine; he's serious about recommending community college [thehill.com].
The summary agrees that all are eligible: "graduation guarantees admittance to the City Colleges of Chicago community college system." Or was something left out?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 10 2017, @12:22AM
The summary agrees that all are eligible: "graduation guarantees admittance to the City Colleges of Chicago community college system."
Georgia has a partial-tuition thing for all graduates with a high enough GPA.
Killery had an idea based on that half-assed notion.
There's also The Kalamazoo Promise [wikipedia.org]
So, that's privately-funded, not publicly-funded.
A problem that these free-college notions have is dropout rates.
[1] Chart in article.
.
...and Rahm Emanuel is such a total douche.
I don't understand how that Reactionary has managed to get himself elected on a Democrat ticket in a Democrat city.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by VLM on Monday July 10 2017, @09:40PM
Its one of those marketing slogans vs rules lawyer things.
I was so bored I looked at the admissions book and there's requirements for placement testing (ACT/SAT or otherwise) and some hoops to jump thru before the graduation inducing acceptance letter is generated. Also it looks like a legal minefield if a kid took a class in high school at the CC then got kicked out as a high school kid for academics or cheating or weed possession or WTF barring future attendance.
Locally, at my old HS and CC, it was fuzzy if you could get a transcript if you owed the district money. Now they use "parchment.com" which charges money to send transcripts to some institutions and no charge for others and it appears pretty random. The local CC I attended many years ago has boosted its application fee (because it can..) to $30 and requires placement testing at your expense. Other than sheer raising of money "because we can" I'm not sure what the point is of a $30 application fee. "We have a monopoly on a desired product, we like slush funds for doing nothing especially when the kid does all the manual data entry over the internet, we're gonna take your money and you're gonna like it."
I can see where some criminality could prevent gaining an acceptance letter thereby preventing the degree granting.
After I got my associates a long time ago I went to night school at a "real" college for my bachelors and night school was open guaranteed acceptance as long as the check cleared, but that doesn't mean it was free or anyone could get in, it just meant there was a fixed and very low bar, but I sure it blocked some people.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @10:53AM (1 child)
>It's not programmers you have to convince but lawyers and judges.
Yea, great comeback: other lawyers and a judge would ___surely___ be fooled by GRSecurity's codicil.
GPLv2 says no additional terms (to agreement between GRSecurity and further distributees)
GRSecurity creates codicil or side-bar agreement thus adding additional terms (to agreement between GRSecurity and further distributees).
Programmers such as you snarkily say "hehehe you'd have to convince a lawyer or a Judge".
Just stating the facts would be enough, without even an argument.
But hey, programmer, you know far more about the law than lawyers and such right?
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Sunday July 09 2017, @11:59AM
Wrong story.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by theluggage on Sunday July 09 2017, @12:46PM (4 children)
So, you can't graduate until you get a job or college placement, but you can't get a job or college placement until you graduate...
Seriously, though - assuming that the policy wasn't written by Joseph Heller - this may be a good way of putting pressure on schools to provide better careers/further education advice and support so that they can claim high graduation rates.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Sunday July 09 2017, @01:11PM (1 child)
This is indeed basically catch-22 worthy. One could hope this leads to better career- or guidance-counseling from the school but I doubt that. Even if it does that would in no way by itself mean that the student can or will actually take said advice. It might not help them at all.
One alternative way of viewing this makes it sound almost like blackmail from the school, you have to have figure out your life by age 18 (or whenever it is that you graduate US High schools at). Also isn't a high school education mandatory these days? Graduation can't be since it's in large up the the student but being enrolled? I guess they could just re-institute the draft for all students that by the age of high school graduation doesn't have a college acceptance letter or a "real" job.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @05:03PM
I forsee lots of 'dropouts' and the GED industry having a nice uptick in that area.
(Score: 2, Informative) by nitehawk214 on Sunday July 09 2017, @06:17PM
Or an excuse to defund schools with sagging graduation rates.
Ive never understood the push to pull funding from under performing schools. Aren't those the ones that need the most help?
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 10 2017, @12:34AM
He wanted to be a civilian but they wouldn't let him.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @02:12PM (1 child)
Well, this is exactly how it was done in Soviet Russia. What it does not say is that most who don't satisfy the requirements will go to prizons which is probably true for Chicago.
Russians were somewhat more humane though as they offered professional schools instead of high for folks who were unlikely to satisfy. Coledges were also free, ofcource.
Pay or rot in prizon seems a westen invention.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @08:46PM
"IN Soviet Chicago, the school graduates YOU!" Hmm, seems like a meme has died.
(Score: 2) by Thexalon on Sunday July 09 2017, @03:03PM (1 child)
One option specifically suggested for students who can't get a job or can't get into college is to enlist in the military. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Sunday July 09 2017, @05:42PM
I don't recall the book exactly now, it's has been so long since I read it, but I do remember the movie (Starship Troopers, for those wondering what the hell we are talking about) vividly. It's not entirely similar since all those people we get to hear in the movie did it because they wanted to do it or wanted to get something back - they wanted to become politicians, one wanted to have many babies (getting a license was easier if you where a citizen apparently) and the "hero" wanted to be with his Girl (he was the only one we hear about that went in for an odd reason). Non was forced due to them being high-school dropouts, at least we don't hear about them in the movie. That said we don't know about all the cannon/bug-fodder, but from the once we hear from.
(Score: 2) by SanityCheck on Sunday July 09 2017, @06:37PM
Step 1: Move out of Chicago
Step 2: ????
Step 3: Prosper
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 09 2017, @11:04PM (1 child)
You can't be a housewife. It figures; that isn't a liberal-approved occupation.
You can't start a business. This isn't a "job" because you never get hired.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by rondon on Monday July 10 2017, @12:33PM
I think you've raised an interesting point, even despite the virtue signaling. Does this discriminate against teenage mothers who want to graduate and raise their children. Or even fathers for that matter?
For the second point, it would be exceedingly easy to show that you were "hired" by an LLC that you have formed, so I doubt that is going to stop anyone.
In fact, that may be a money making opportunity for an enterprising student - fire up an LLC that will hire any other student on a "piecework" or "part-time" basis (with no work or hours) just so they can graduate.
(Score: 2) by nobu_the_bard on Monday July 10 2017, @01:14PM
Why is this a problem? My High School required this also, and has for decades. There was also a "graduation project" you had to complete to return some value to the community; most students simply did some community hours cleaning up parks or something. You didn't need to do a whole lot. Could do enough work to qualify for the project inside 2-3 hours.
The Honor students usually build another pointless monument on the HS campus- a recent class built another war memorial, this time to Vietnam, for example. Because of the projects the school has lots of statues and plaques and stuff.
In practice, the "graduation plan" aspect was a pretty minor obstacle. You only had to show you had a plan. You did not need to actually stick to the plan, or have the plan be realistic.