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posted by Fnord666 on Monday September 18 2017, @04:47PM   Printer-friendly
from the graffiti dept.

Submitted via IRC for SoyCow5743

Google has quietly stopped challenging most search warrants from US judges in which the data requested is stored on overseas servers, according to the Justice Department.

The revelation, contained in a new court filing to the Supreme Court, comes as the administration of President Donald Trump is pressing the justices to declare that US search warrants served on the US tech sector extend to data stored on foreign servers.

Google and other services began challenging US warrants for overseas data after a federal appeals court sided with Microsoft last year in a first-of-its-kind challenge. Microsoft convinced the New York-based 2nd US Circuit Court of Appeals—which has jurisdiction over Connecticut, New York, and Vermont—that US search-and-seizure law does not require compliance with a warrant to turn over e-mail stored on its servers in Ireland. Federal prosecutors were demanding the data as part of a US drug investigation.

In the aftermath, courts outside the 2nd Circuit, which are not bound by the ruling, began rejecting the circuit's decision and dismissing fresh challenges by the ISPs, including those brought by Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft. In one instance, Google was even found in contempt of court (PDF) for refusing to comply with a District of Columbia federal judge's order to hand over data stored overseas.

The Supreme Court has not decided whether to hear the government's challenge to the Microsoft decision, which has huge privacy ramifications for consumers and for the tech sector. The sector is being asked by the US government to comply with court orders that sometimes conflict with the laws of where the data is stored.

Source: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/09/feds-google-stops-challenging-most-us-warrants-for-data-on-overseas-servers/


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @04:59PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @04:59PM (#569805)

    this is why we need Decentralized/distributed anonymous apps! blockchain power! to the max!

  • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Monday September 18 2017, @05:47PM (9 children)

    by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Monday September 18 2017, @05:47PM (#569823) Journal

    Watch Google stock going down when the paying customers in EU dumps Google.
    On the plus side, having less reason to stay EU, Google's may lower its expenditure in the bean-counters who prepares sandwiches with Dutch and Irish stuff that Cayman Islands keeps in the fridge.

    the administration of President Donald Trump is pressing the justices to declare that US search warrants served on the US tech sector extend to data stored on foreign servers.

    MAGAAA.

    --
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @06:19PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @06:19PM (#569832)

      > MAGAAA.

      Make America Great And Alone Again.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by jcross on Monday September 18 2017, @06:23PM (4 children)

      by jcross (4009) on Monday September 18 2017, @06:23PM (#569834)

      This sounds like yet another excellent reason to not incorporate in the USA in the first place. I can't really see the advantage of it at this point, can someone explain to me why it's still a good idea?

      And it seems like US security and law enforcement have no problem hurting one of our only industries that isn't sucking right now. MAGA indeed.

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Lester on Monday September 18 2017, @08:44PM (3 children)

        by Lester (6231) on Monday September 18 2017, @08:44PM (#569917) Journal

        Hurt?

        I don't think so. Nobody is going to stop using google's services because of this, just a few nerds.

        If you bend to USA demands, it will reward you with contracts and will use its diplomatic muscle to help you overseas. So, being incorporated un USA is a good move.

        The sad truth is that nothing of this really matters to people, or goverments, except Russia or China.

        • (Score: 2) by jcross on Tuesday September 19 2017, @01:47AM

          by jcross (4009) on Tuesday September 19 2017, @01:47AM (#570008)

          Maybe it's only a few nerds, but my impression was that a lot of foreign governments don't care for this kind of thing either. I mean Russia and China obviously but I would think some European countries as well? They can seek other sources for software used by their government agencies, which of itself helps develop competition for U.S. offerings. Not that I'm complaining about that. In theory they can also impose fines or bans or something, but you're probably right that diplomatic pressure (and the pressure from citizens who enjoy the products) will prevent it. I still think it hurts them, maybe not very badly, but somewhat.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:00AM (1 child)

          by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:00AM (#570050) Journal

          I don't think so. Nobody is going to stop using google's services because of this, just a few nerds.

          Really? You reckon?
          I mean, look, Google-cloud isn't quite a thing that is for nerds [datacenterdynamics.com], I suspect any European public administration would think twice before throwing its data in clouds outside Europe or where EU foreign powers would have uncontrolled access - especially when doing so may cost you half a month worth of wage [bleepingcomputer.com]

          (grin)

          --
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
          • (Score: 2) by Lester on Tuesday September 19 2017, @01:28PM

            by Lester (6231) on Tuesday September 19 2017, @01:28PM (#570173) Journal

            The problem of data leak was because of inherent cloud insecurity. If he had used a national service and there would have been a security breakage, the problem would have been the same, and would have cost him also half month wage.

            I suspect any European public administration would think twice before throwing its data in clouds outside Europe

            Yes, they should, but they don't

            Most Universities use gmail, google calendar, google docs, facebook and dropbox. BBVA, one of the biggest banks of Spain (and Europe) moved its mail to gmail servers.

            Let's be honest, all those services from Google, Amazon, work very well, or at least better than alternatives, and also need less tech knowledge and maintenance, big boys take care of all. Don't underestimate the capacity of people and governments to pick convenience over security. Only intelligence agencies are concerned, all those fines to Google etc, go no where, people don't care, and probably Google not much as well.

    • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Monday September 18 2017, @06:49PM (2 children)

      by bob_super (1357) on Monday September 18 2017, @06:49PM (#569848)

      If Trump wasn't in power, this would be solved by preserving proper jurisdiction (SCOTUS siding with MS), followed by a discreet Treaty with the EU about "Collaboration Internationale Anti-$scarecrow" (in French to make it impossible for their ego to oppose, despite the unbalanced we-get-yours-you-don't-get-ours the US would build into it). The data would be exchanged, with few privacy egos bruised.

      But making an Ad-Hoc treaty to address an actual problem isn't exactly the way this White House goes. The fact that the whole US tech sector could take a major hit isn't high on someone's priorities.

      • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @07:25PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @07:25PM (#569872)

        Wasn't Comey putting the screws on M$ for the same circumstances back when St Obama was still president?

        • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Monday September 18 2017, @07:45PM

          by bob_super (1357) on Monday September 18 2017, @07:45PM (#569879)

          You can be sure Obama heard his friends in the tech industry scream about it.
          The rules being ambiguous (uncertainty in the context of Snowden sucked for business), and Congress being useless to fix them, it's not impossible that getting smacked by SCOTUS was a desired outcome.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @10:34PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18 2017, @10:34PM (#569957)

    Since the EU has some pretty strict privacy laws and a tendency to apply ever increasing fines on those that knowingly break them, it will be interesting how high the fines with have to be to get google to start fighting the warrants again.

    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:09AM (1 child)

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:09AM (#570054) Journal

      Since the EU has ... a tendency to apply ever increasing fines on those that knowingly break them

      A pity they start with only half-a-month wage, [computing.co.uk] in spite of the egg-on-the-face effect:

      While half a month's pay may not seem like a great deal, Rick Falkvinge, head of privacy at Private Internet Access, suggested that it was a significant amount because of the way in which senior directors in Sweden's government and public sector usually look after each other.

      "Given how much the establishment has got each other's backs, this sentence was roughly equivalent to life in prison for a common person on the street, meaning they must have done something really awful to get not just a guilty verdict, but actually be fined half a month's salary," he said.

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 19 2017, @08:05AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 19 2017, @08:05AM (#570109)

        I'm fine with only half a month wage, if they use the chessboard principle for further fines.

        As the story goes, the Chinese peasant who invented the chess board was asked by the emperor what he wanted for his invention. The man said he wanted one grain of rice on the first square, two grains on the second square, four grans on the third square, eight on the fourth and so on. The emperor thought it sounded like a bargain and accepted the price, and then told his accountants to calculate the exact amount of rice.

        When the accountants returned they told the emperor that the result was more than the total amount of rice in every storage in the country.

    • (Score: 2) by Bot on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:24PM

      by Bot (3902) on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:24PM (#570151) Journal

      > Re:Reciprocal treatment and punative fines
      > and punative fines
      can't tell if typo or awesome contextualized meta-pun.

      --
      Account abandoned.
  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:19AM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:19AM (#569979)

    Google's motto: "Don't be evil"
    +
    Alphabet's motto: "Do the right thing"
    =
    "Do the right evil"

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by c0lo on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:03AM (1 child)

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday September 19 2017, @04:03AM (#570051) Journal

      Google's motto: "Don't be evil"
      +
      Alphabet's motto: "Do the right thing"
      =
      "Do the right evil"

      Hmm... something is wrong. Sure one "Don't" and one "Do" cancel each other.
      It looks like the correct result of the addition, term by term, is "Be evil, the right thing"

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 2) by Bot on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:19PM

        by Bot (3902) on Tuesday September 19 2017, @12:19PM (#570150) Journal

        I would parse it as doublespeak.
        "Don't be evil"= behave and let us deal with being evil.
        "Do the right thing"= your errors are not tolerated, ours will be.

        --
        Account abandoned.
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