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posted by martyb on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:12AM   Printer-friendly
from the it's-not-YOUR-computer-any-more dept.

Quoted from the http://tidbits.com/article/17633: "If you're running macOS 10.12 Sierra or earlier, and do not want to upgrade to 10.13 High Sierra right now, be careful because Apple has started pushing High Sierra to older Macs and making it all too easy to upgrade inadvertently." [...]


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  • (Score: 2) by TheRaven on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:51AM

    by TheRaven (270) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:51AM (#599597) Journal
    One of my colleagues made the mistake of upgrading to High Sierra. His Mac has gone from uptimes of a month or two between security updates to multiple crashes per day. That may be specific to his machine, but there's a known bug in High Sierra's WindowServer that pegs CPU usage at 100% if you plug in an external monitor and use a scaled resolution. I'm not upgrading until these are fixed.
    --
    sudo mod me up
  • (Score: 2) by WizardFusion on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:02AM (4 children)

    by WizardFusion (498) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:02AM (#599600) Journal

    Are they using the same tactics as Microsoft did with Windows 10? Did they not learn anything?

    • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:46AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:46AM (#599605)

      This is inaccurate. High Sierra only prompts to install the OS update if both the "Automatcally download updates in the background" and "Install OS updates" are selected in the system settings.

      When prompted you have to click "Install" for the OS update to be installed. It is not the Windows 10 "Hey, look, a shiny red X that actually installs an OS".

    • (Score: 2) by theluggage on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:43PM

      by theluggage (1797) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:43PM (#599657)

      No. I'm not overjoyed by the way they casually promote major OS updates to possibly non-tech-savvy users (we all know who has to pick up the pieces) but the way Apple do it it is only going to catch the compulsive clickers (in which case the installation will probably be blocked by all the malware and "purify my Mac" apps they've already installed).

      Its pretty clear what the "Upgrade" button is going to do. None of this MS-style "Don't click 'Yes I Do Don't Want It' if you don't wish to reject the opportunity to not decline this upgrade" malarkey.

    • (Score: 5, Informative) by Knowledge Troll on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:49PM (1 child)

      by Knowledge Troll (5948) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:49PM (#599660) Homepage Journal

      Are they using the same tactics as Microsoft did with Windows 10? Did they not learn anything?

      What would they learn exactly? That most of the people will roll over and cave and do it anyway?

      There wasn't any real fallout from the Windows 10 rollout.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 22 2017, @07:50AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 22 2017, @07:50AM (#600091)
        Yeah nobody went to jail for "unauthorized modification of a computer system", which I believe is illegal in some countries.

        Imagine if I did what Microsoft did and upgraded strangers PCs to windows 10 against their owners wishes. How many years in jail would I get.

        Or what if I made and spread crapware that would show a dialog box that sometimes installed it if you clicked OK and at other times installed it if you clicked the X to close it. Would that be legal?
  • (Score: 5, Informative) by RedBear on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:50AM (8 children)

    by RedBear (1734) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:50AM (#599607)

    Sorry, but Apple does not "push" automatic OS updates a la Windows 10. It gets downloaded in the background, but it's still just an installer app sitting in the Applications folder. I've seen that notification offering to install the new OS in previous versions of Mac OS X. I've only ever seen it appear a couple of times and then it seems to stop showing up even if you don't upgrade. You can "hide" updates in the App Store (Software Update) application, but I don't know for certain if that would keep the notification from appearing.

    It's my understanding that even if you hit that Install button on the notification you still need to go through a couple of steps in the installer application that pops up. If you don't want to install, you just quit the installer. It doesn't just reboot your Mac and start the upgrade without any further interaction. At least that's how it's always been in OS X in all the versions I've been involved with. Which is all of them up to El Capitan (10.11, they're talking about 10.13).

    Unless something has drastically changed with Apple since El Capitan, this is basically hyperventilating BS which has appeared with virtually every OS X upgrade. The only way to install the update without wanting to is to simply have no idea what you're doing with a computer. Which, admittedly, is a widespread condition.

    For general system or application updates a very similar notification appears that has the options "Install" and "Later v". You can get rid of those by sliding them off the screen or simply clicking the main body of the notification and then quitting the Software Update window that pops up. These things are really no big deal. And there's none of that Windows-esque "Oh, you wanted to shut down? How nice, I'll now spend 45 minutes auto-installing all the updates you didn't want me to install right now, even though you really need to go somewhere which is why you were shutting down."

    Macs don't do that crap unless you tell them to. I will eat my hat and never upgrade to Sierra or later if it turns out I'm mistaken. Which is a strong possibility anyway since Apple no longer makes any computer worth buying, and probably won't until Tim Cook is booted out. The man seems to want to reduce Apple to selling nothing but expensive fashion statements.

    --
    ¯\_ʕ◔.◔ʔ_/¯ LOL. I dunno. I'm just a bear.
    ... Peace out. Got bear stuff to do. 彡ʕ⌐■.■ʔ
    • (Score: 2) by coolgopher on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:36PM (5 children)

      by coolgopher (1157) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:36PM (#599631)

      Actually, I discovered they still sell the mid-2015 MacBook Pro which has the sane features - i.e. magsafe, and no idiotic touchbar.

      That could very well be the last Mac I buy. *sigh*

      • (Score: 4, Insightful) by RedBear on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:42PM (4 children)

        by RedBear (1734) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:42PM (#599655)

        Actually, I discovered they still sell the mid-2015 MacBook Pro which has the sane features - i.e. magsafe, and no idiotic touchbar.
        That could very well be the last Mac I buy. *sigh*

        I hear that kind of thing a lot these days.

        I have two 17" Unibody MacBook Pros. A 2009 and 2011. The 2011 was bought used, as a backup in case the 2009 died. I like the size of the screen, especially as I get older and have more difficulty with tiny high resolution screens with ridiculously tiny text. You have to use it to understand. My wife phrased it thusly, "Wow, this is almost like using my iMac. There's so much room, and everything is big enough to see." This can't be replicated with a smaller screen no matter how many pixels you stuff into it. I hate all of Apple's new stuff, even before the Touch Bar and the "no you can't have all those useful ports, why, because we said so".

        When these two MBPs can no longer be revived or replaced, I honestly don't know what I'll move on to. There is nothing comparable in existence that isn't an ugly plastic multi-colored monstrosity. Apple shows no signs of ever making a new 17" or even 16" MBP. What's this rolling down my cheek? Is it a tear of infinite sadness? Yes... yes, I think it is.

        --
        ¯\_ʕ◔.◔ʔ_/¯ LOL. I dunno. I'm just a bear.
        ... Peace out. Got bear stuff to do. 彡ʕ⌐■.■ʔ
        • (Score: 2) by TheRaven on Tuesday November 21 2017, @05:28PM (1 child)

          by TheRaven (270) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @05:28PM (#599737) Journal

          I wasn't convinced by the touchbar, but a couple of my colleagues have got them and they're surprisingly useful - the escape key is still the corner so your fingers can find it (so vi users are happy) and it's programmable by applications, so you they can have context-specific shortcuts that aren't as confusing as the behaviour of a function key changing depending on the selection.

          That said, I still have a late 2013 MBP, in spite of our policy of upgrades after three years, because 32GB of RAM is the one upgrade that I actually want and it's not available yet. I had been blaming Intel for not supporting LPDDR4, but Dell has managed to put 32GB of DDR4L into a laptop and there's only a 15% power difference between LPDDR4 and DDR4L.

          --
          sudo mod me up
          • (Score: 4, Informative) by RedBear on Tuesday November 21 2017, @07:54PM

            by RedBear (1734) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @07:54PM (#599825)

            I wouldn't care about the Touch Bar if it had been just an addition. What I can't tolerate is the removal of physical media keys that have been basically the same for 20 years, that I can practically use by reflex now even in the dark. To have those not be reliably accessible without going through an extra step is not acceptable to me. Touch interfaces are useless unless you're looking at them, which car manufacturers have to keep rediscovering.

            But even if that problem were solved, the increased cost, poor battery life, lack of higher memory capacity, lack of upgradeability, and lack of any of the common ports I'm still constantly using are all bridges that I cannot cross. The Touch Bar is almost the least of the issues with the latest MBPs. Just saw another Apple pro on YouTube a few days ago do a hardcore panning of the current MBP which he said he would NEVER, EVER BUY, and he was far from the first one to say that.

            --
            ¯\_ʕ◔.◔ʔ_/¯ LOL. I dunno. I'm just a bear.
            ... Peace out. Got bear stuff to do. 彡ʕ⌐■.■ʔ
        • (Score: 2) by ilsa on Tuesday November 21 2017, @07:00PM (1 child)

          by ilsa (6082) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday November 21 2017, @07:00PM (#599790)

          I've been buying the 2015s because a) I'm not paying an extra grand for what amounts to gimmicks, and b) the whole USB-C marketplace is just too unstable and I'm still not convinced that USB-C won't end up being a giant shitshow.

          When Jobs still lived, he liked minimalism but (for the most part) within reason. Under Cook, Apple has gone minimalist to the point of absurdity, presumably to maximize their accessories revenue.

          Can you believe that their USB-C power supplies don't even come with a cable? You have to buy the bloody USB-C cable *separately*! It's petty to the point of nonsensical.

          • (Score: 2) by RedBear on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:08PM

            by RedBear (1734) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:08PM (#599838)

            When Jobs still lived, he liked minimalism but (for the most part) within reason. Under Cook, Apple has gone minimalist to the point of absurdity, presumably to maximize their accessories revenue.
            Can you believe that their USB-C power supplies don't even come with a cable? You have to buy the bloody USB-C cable *separately*! It's petty to the point of nonsensical.

            I can and do believe it. They have certainly become a company that seems to want to nickel and dime their customers to death. Except their nickel and dime are $50 and $100. I estimated I would need about $300 worth of adapter dongles to replicate the ports I currently use, on top of the hundreds of dollars price increase for the new MBP. They've really lost their damn minds at Apple.

            --
            ¯\_ʕ◔.◔ʔ_/¯ LOL. I dunno. I'm just a bear.
            ... Peace out. Got bear stuff to do. 彡ʕ⌐■.■ʔ
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @04:36PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @04:36PM (#599712)

      [...] "You can "hide" updates in the App Store (Software Update) application, but I don't know for certain if that would keep the notification from appearing." [...]

      Updates can only be hidden (when logged in) in the 'Purchased' section of the App Store. In the 'Updates' section (doesn't require login), updates cannot be hidden.

      • (Score: 2) by RedBear on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:36PM

        by RedBear (1734) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:36PM (#599860)

        Updates can only be hidden (when logged in) in the 'Purchased' section of the App Store. In the 'Updates' section (doesn't require login), updates cannot be hidden.

        I don't believe that's correct. The latest OS X upgrade tends to appear as a big graphic "ad" in the Updates tab, and it can be hidden by right-clicking and choosing Hide from the context menu. After that it never appears in the Updates tab again. I forget whether it just says "Hide" or "Hide Update". Probably the latter.

        In the Purchases tab the context menu item says "Hide Purchase". That's different from what I was talking about. Unless things have changed in Sierra/High Sierra.

        In my experience the Updates tab does require login when you try to install 3rd-party application updates, at least if there are non-free apps you've purchased from the App Store.

        --
        ¯\_ʕ◔.◔ʔ_/¯ LOL. I dunno. I'm just a bear.
        ... Peace out. Got bear stuff to do. 彡ʕ⌐■.■ʔ
  • (Score: 3, Informative) by Rich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:25PM

    by Rich (945) on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:25PM (#599625) Journal

    I have a 2009 MBP as "daily driver" which can't runis excluded from updates to newer than 10.11. Looks like that's a feature now, which can save a lot of hassle :) (though mine, downgraded to 10.9, still keeps nagging me for upgrading iTunes to a crappier version...). Time to re-iterate once more that it continually went downhill past Snow Leopard.

  • (Score: 2) by ilsa on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:51PM

    by ilsa (6082) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:51PM (#599785)

    I updated last week, and I've had some very strange issues that are seriously pissing me off.

    -Parallels is unstable, with the UI hanging (but not the underlying VM). If I force quit it and relaunch, that usually comes back
    -iCloud decided to hide all my folder contents even though I wasn't using the folder sharing thing. It also decided that most of the files that *were* in my icloud drive were "ineligible" or some bullshit. I ended up having to back all the data from my icloud folder, completely disable icloud drive, reboot, and put everything back, and then things *seem* to be ok again.

    Apple has really fucked up this dev cycle. iOS has gotten at least 5 patch updates just in the last two months, and this is the most unstable I've ever seen OSX, which is ironic considering that this is supposed to be a 'service pack' release.

    C'mon Apple, if I wanted to use Windows, then I'd BE using windows. The whole point of buying Apple is getting a higher calibre of product that I can trust. If they can't do that anymore, then their value proposition against Microsoft evaporates.

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