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posted by martyb on Thursday May 10, @06:49PM   Printer-friendly
from the waiting-to-inhale? dept.

Increasing amounts of research show that hazardous smoke residues can be absorbed through the skin, ingested, and inhaled months and even years after smoke has dissipated.

The latest study, published Wednesday in the journal Science Advances, shows how tobacco smoke from outdoor air can seep into a nonsmoking classroom and coat its surfaces, and how those hazardous chemicals often become airborne again and circulate throughout buildings via central air-conditioning systems.

From The Washington Post : Thirdhand smoke is widespread and may be dangerous, mounting evidence shows


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  • (Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @06:55PM (10 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @06:55PM (#678053)

    We are now literally being scared by smoke and mirrors.

    • (Score: 4, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:06PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:06PM (#678057)

      The stress induced by reading about the dangers of third hand smoke and how that stress will shorten our lives.

      • (Score: 4, Funny) by c0lo on Friday May 11, @01:02AM

        by c0lo (156) on Friday May 11, @01:02AM (#678213)

        Forth hand smoke

        I see your forth hand and raise you my hind leg.

      • (Score: 2) by acid andy on Friday May 11, @09:08AM

        by acid andy (1683) on Friday May 11, @09:08AM (#678299) Journal

        The stress induced by reading about the stress induced by reading about the stress induced by reading about the dangers.... Screw it, I'm going back to bed!

        --
        Make hay whilst the intervening mass is insufficient to inhibit the perceived intensity of incoming solar radiation.
    • (Score: 2) by bzipitidoo on Thursday May 10, @07:37PM (1 child)

      by bzipitidoo (4388) on Thursday May 10, @07:37PM (#678075) Journal

      Although the media is in the business of selling news, eliciting fear and drama are tops for motivating customers to buy, and the media overdramatizes and sometimes outright lies so that it's often hard to tell which of the many things to fear should be feared the most, have you considered that maybe this 3rd hand smoke problem is real?

      Its sounds like far from the most serious problem we face, but if dealing with it is cheap, simple, and quick, why not take those few modest actions?

      • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:00PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:00PM (#678083)

        Nothing is ever cheap, simple, and quick and typically requires a regulated industry like asbestos remediation or mold removal. You know, where the tent the entire building with hermetically sealed space plastic and go in with respirators and hazmat suits and charge $4k/hour to swab ever square cm.

    • (Score: 2, Funny) by nitehawk214 on Thursday May 10, @08:22PM (4 children)

      by nitehawk214 (1304) on Thursday May 10, @08:22PM (#678094)

      If the smoke causes cancer, you should be afraid of it.

      As for mirrors... well, have you looked in a mirror recently?

      --
      "Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
      • (Score: 4, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 10, @08:36PM (1 child)

        Living longer drastically increases your cancer risk as well.

        --
        "Buzzy, you're probably the dumbest person I've ever encountered. Well, there is aristarchus, so make it 2nd dumbest."
        • (Score: 2) by darkfeline on Friday May 11, @05:36PM

          by darkfeline (1030) on Friday May 11, @05:36PM (#678502) Homepage

          But smoking allows you to both live shorter and drastically increase your cancer risk at the same time. Two smoker's lungs with one stone!

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @10:07PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @10:07PM (#678141)

        Heh, you are taking my semi-serious joke way too seriously. I get that it can be a real problem, but just walking down a street with any car traffic will undoubtedly expose you to more pollution than some surface a smoker was close to. I'm not a smoker, but I dread the day when we start banning every activity that has a .01% chance of a negative outcome.

        I do not like the culture of fear and hysteria that is being tightly coupled to "live properly or ELSE". Alcoholics have a higher chance of getting into a fight or causing random damage, shall we go back to prohibition? Overweight people have more health issues, shall we send them to a forced government labor camp to get skinny?

        The main takeaway I'm getting is that all surfaces should be periodically cleaned, but going into hysterics imagining that every child is going to get cancer because some teacher smoked a cigarette 30 feet from the building is just ridiculous. This should be a PSA, not a sky-is-falling announcement.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @10:24PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @10:24PM (#678148)

          I think you have the wrong endgame in mind. For an example look at what they are saying about babies now: DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES LET YOUR BABY BE HIT BY DIRECT SUNLIGHT. Then: YOUR BABY IS AT RISK FOR VITAMIN D DEFICIENCY, BUY VITAMIN D SUPPLEMENTS HERE.

  • (Score: 4, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:19PM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:19PM (#678065)

    Is making out with a smoker second, third, or 2.5-hand smoking?

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:30PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:30PM (#678072)

      How did you pass the obvious 1.5 hand smoke?

    • (Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:24PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:24PM (#678095)

      It depends on the position.

    • (Score: 2) by arslan on Thursday May 10, @10:39PM

      by arslan (3462) on Thursday May 10, @10:39PM (#678156)

      It is an orgy of all of em.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @07:08AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @07:08AM (#678285)

      I was asked once if I ever smoked during sex... I really don't know... I never looked down there to see.

  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Farkus888 on Thursday May 10, @07:23PM (13 children)

    by Farkus888 (5159) on Thursday May 10, @07:23PM (#678067)

    This cannot possibly be the thing we should be focusing on the make humanity safer. Let's hope none of these people ever sit at a camp fire or in traffic. But it isn't just the smoke you say, the stuff in the smoke like arsenic. Of course but only if you never eat rice or anything someone used a pesticide on. I won't deny those things are there and measurable. By that many stages of disconnect it has to be homeopathic levels of concentration. Anyone who drank a soda or ate a Twinkie walked a flight of stairs was exposed to far higher levels of danger to their health.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Freeman on Thursday May 10, @08:20PM (12 children)

      by Freeman (732) on Thursday May 10, @08:20PM (#678093) Journal

      Smoking is typically habitual. Sitting in front of a campfire and not moving, if the smoke blows in your face, not so much. There is plenty of research that shows Tobacco is harmful to your body. Chewing it or smoking it, just don't do it.

      --
      "I said in my haste, All men are liars." Psalm 116:11
      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 10, @08:27PM (6 children)

        I'm sorry, when did my body become yours that you feel free to tell me what I can and cannot do with it?

        --
        "Buzzy, you're probably the dumbest person I've ever encountered. Well, there is aristarchus, so make it 2nd dumbest."
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Freeman on Thursday May 10, @08:48PM (4 children)

          by Freeman (732) on Thursday May 10, @08:48PM (#678109) Journal

          When your poor choices affect my health and the pursuit of happiness. You want to smoke, that's fine. Just don't do it in my face.

          --
          "I said in my haste, All men are liars." Psalm 116:11
          • (Score: 3, Touché) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 10, @09:11PM (1 child)

            Fair nuff. That's not what you said up above though. There's an important difference between saying "you shouldn't" and "don't".

            --
            "Buzzy, you're probably the dumbest person I've ever encountered. Well, there is aristarchus, so make it 2nd dumbest."
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @02:14PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @02:14PM (#678382)

              i understood what he wrote to have an implicit 'to ensure your good health', as opposed to a moral imperative that you follow the decree of his benevolent authoritarian based decision making.

              of course, if you regularly do unhealthy things and drive without a seatbelt and have a heart attack while driving and your still burning cigarette causes the gas fumes to ignite and you end up hurting a lot of people, i request that my insurance rates don't go up due to your lifestyle choices.

              and if you arent insured, i request the people that got hurt by those actions are provided medical care by the state/government, and that the driver gets an expensive lesson. it would be sad if the driver has a family and is bankrupted, but someone has to learn from experience, or at least provide an example to others when the driver's costs aren't covered.

              but you're cooler than that. you is just you in general, not you as a person.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:21AM (1 child)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:21AM (#678227)

            Your fear of voodoo taboos doesn't impress me much. "Don't do it in my face" you say. So, how close to you is "in my face"? Are you going to claim a personal space of five feet, or do you think you need a mile?

            • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Friday May 11, @03:13PM

              by Freeman (732) on Friday May 11, @03:13PM (#678412) Journal

              I'm fine with the current laws regarding smoking. It's about as good as we can get when taking into account personal freedom and public health.

              --
              "I said in my haste, All men are liars." Psalm 116:11
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @03:31PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @03:31PM (#678421)

          Lighten up, Francis.

      • (Score: 2) by Farkus888 on Friday May 11, @01:03AM (1 child)

        by Farkus888 (5159) on Friday May 11, @01:03AM (#678215)

        Yes, but second or third hand smoking as described in the article isn't a thing people habitually seek out either. I'm saying the dose of sitting in front of 1 camp fire = years of third hand smoke. I think 1 bad traffic jam is worse than years of third hand smoke. Let's prioritize.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 12, @05:01PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 12, @05:01PM (#678873)

          Conjecture is good. Research is better.

      • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday May 11, @01:10AM (2 children)

        by c0lo (156) on Friday May 11, @01:10AM (#678220)

        Sitting in front of a campfire and not moving, if the smoke blows in your face, not so much...
        ...just don't do it

        Don't ever eat smoked goods. Yes, do consume as much nitrite preserved salami as you like.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @10:52AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @10:52AM (#678305)

          Don't ever eat smoked goods. Yes, do consume as much nitrite preserved salami as you like.

          And there is of course Sodium Benzoate and related... cancer in a lab, but of course it has to be used in food regardless since there is no alternatives and the benefits outweigh (mostly profits) the cancers it causes.

        • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Friday May 11, @03:08PM

          by Freeman (732) on Friday May 11, @03:08PM (#678408) Journal

          I do try to stay away from all smoked goods as they taste like smoke. Which isn't a flavor I enjoy.

          --
          "I said in my haste, All men are liars." Psalm 116:11
  • (Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:23PM (16 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @07:23PM (#678068)

    Carbohydrate withdrawal symptoms:

    Fatigue
            Sugar cravings
            Dizziness
            *Difficulty focusing (or Brain Fog)*
            *Nausea*
            *Difficulty Getting To Sleep*
            *Irritability*
            *Stomach Irritability*

    https://ketosummit.com/what-is-keto-flu-how-to-cure-keto-flu [ketosummit.com]

    Smoking withdrawal symptoms:

    intense cravings for nicotine
            tingling in the hands and feet
            sweating
            *nausea and abdominal cramping*
            *constipation and gas*
            headaches
            coughing
            sore throat
            *insomnia*
            *difficulty concentrating*
            anxiety
            *irritability*
            depression
            weight gain

    https://www.healthline.com/health/smoking/nicotine-withdrawal [healthline.com]

    I'd also say that fatigue and dizziness are smoking withdrawal symptoms left off that list, and sore throat, coughing, and headaches should be included for keto flu. So every element of sugar withdrawal is also an aspect of smoking withdrawal. Really the only difference is craving a cigarette instead of cabs and losing weight instead of gaining it.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 10, @08:34PM (5 children)

      Why do some folks feel the need to try to tie whatever they have in front of them at the moment to everything else ever? If they're not saying gluten causes all of society's ills, they're saying carbs do. You're never going to find the one thing wrong with your life, because there's not just one thing wrong with it.

      --
      "Buzzy, you're probably the dumbest person I've ever encountered. Well, there is aristarchus, so make it 2nd dumbest."
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:52PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @08:52PM (#678114)

        Food, diet and body purity are a staple of religion. There is evidence that this is hard coded in our brains.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:15PM (3 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:15PM (#678124)

        Gluten causes millennials to become transsexual. Now how do you feel about gluten?

        • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday May 10, @09:19PM (1 child)

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday May 10, @09:19PM (#678127) Journal

          How does that work? I'm cisgender and love bread, especially the wholemeal type.

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:37PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:37PM (#678135)

            Keep eating bread and your boobs will turn into moobs. Your ass will get hairy, then your upper lip. Your hair will fall out in a horseshoe pattern. Before you know it, you'll be wearing only shit stained tighty-whities and a food stained wife beater wondering what happened.

            BEWARE!

        • (Score: 3, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 10, @11:35PM

          I think it's the other way around, truth be known. When's the last time you saw a millennial who's confused about their gender dig in to a plate of biscuits and gravy? It's pretty obvious to me that they're suffering from a severe gluten deficiency.

          --
          "Buzzy, you're probably the dumbest person I've ever encountered. Well, there is aristarchus, so make it 2nd dumbest."
    • (Score: 5, Funny) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday May 10, @09:30PM (4 children)

      by realDonaldTrump (6614) Subscriber Badge on Thursday May 10, @09:30PM (#678133) Homepage Journal

      I'm very lucky. I've never used tobacco. But I eat whatever I want. Whether it's a juicy cheeseburger or a dark, sweet chocolate cake. Dr. Bornstein says my health is "astonishingly excellent." He says I'm "the healthiest individual ever elected to the Presidency" And Dr. Jackson says I "might live to be 200 years old."

      --
      #StopTheBias [twitter.com]
      • (Score: 1) by Captival on Friday May 11, @12:16AM (2 children)

        by Captival (6866) on Friday May 11, @12:16AM (#678202)

        It's been almost 2 years and this is still what you're doing?

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:01AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:01AM (#678211)

        Notice he only said "tobacco".

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by Mykl on Friday May 11, @12:14AM (3 children)

      by Mykl (1112) on Friday May 11, @12:14AM (#678200)

      [list of similar symptoms with different causes],

      Congratulations, you're halfway toward your Homeopathy certificate!

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:50PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:50PM (#678358)

        Ok, you need a mechanism... It isn't hard:

        The predominant effects of nicotine in humans include increased release of catecholamines into the bloodstream that increase pulse rate and blood pressure, the release of plasma free fatty acids, and the mobilization of blood glucose

        https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3389568/ [nih.gov]

        Thus smoking cessation may lead to lower fasting blood sugar and thus similar symptoms to carbohydrate withdrawal. This also explains the weight gain since the person begins craving food due to the sudden blood sugar vs insulin/etc imbalance. If they do eat more carbs in response they gain weight, if not (ie those on a special diet) then they lose weight.

        Now I just need to collect some data and do some NHST to prove my theory correct. See how easy it is to do modern medical research?

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @04:44PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @04:44PM (#678462)

        Hilariously if I follow the citation (107) for that claim there is nothing about glucose at all. The medical literature is great!

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @04:54PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @04:54PM (#678474)

        More sources though:

        Both groups showed an increase of glycemia following smoking, more marked, however, in the group of diabetics. In 16 cases the experience was repeated once more, and an even higher increase of the blood glucose values was recorded as a result of the new nicotine charge. Conversely, no glycemia rise was noted after smoking nicotine-free cigarettes nor after smoking tobacco cigarettes but without inhaling the smoke.

        https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7455580 [nih.gov]

        Smoking cessation is associated with transient metabolic changes including increased β-cell secretion in response to glucose and fasting insulin resistance. These alterations may be associated with or contribute to the body weight gain after smoking cessation.

        https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24179100 [nih.gov]

        I wish I could find out what made them write this:

        Blood sugar plummets in many people when first quitting

        http://whyquit.com/joel/Joel_03_21_blood_sugar.html [whyquit.com]

        Is it just so well known that nobody even studies it directly anymore?

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by c0lo on Friday May 11, @01:15AM

      by c0lo (156) on Friday May 11, @01:15AM (#678222)

      Really the only difference is craving a cigarette instead of cabs [sic] and losing weight instead of gaining it.

      So true. Anecdote, I know, but I'm a heavy smoker and I never craved for taxis.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:28PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @09:28PM (#678131)

    Well duh

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:13PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:13PM (#678165)
  • (Score: 2) by istartedi on Thursday May 10, @11:25PM (5 children)

    by istartedi (123) on Thursday May 10, @11:25PM (#678173)

    Here in California they're running a commercial where they say that smoke can come through your electrical sockets and harm babies.

    I think we've officially hit the "reefer madness" stage of the anti-tobacco campaign. I mean, I'm willing to wait for the science; but during the wild fires last year I probably got the equivalent of a few packs of smokes directly inhaled. My neighbors smoke, and I only worry about them starting fires, not the cigarette smoke itself.

    I'm definitely not going to lose any sleep over an evil nicotine ghost sneaking in through the light-socket and strangling me with cancer in the middle of the night.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:58PM (3 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:58PM (#678191)

      Link to the commercial?

      • (Score: 2) by istartedi on Friday May 11, @10:57PM (2 children)

        by istartedi (123) on Friday May 11, @10:57PM (#678601)

        Here it is. [youtube.com]. "second hand smoke from a neighbor's apartment can enter your home through air vents, through light fixtures, and even through cracks in the walls and floors"

        • (Score: 2) by istartedi on Friday May 11, @11:02PM

          by istartedi (123) on Friday May 11, @11:02PM (#678602)

          The ghost was in another commercial. Here's that one. [youtube.com].

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @11:42PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @11:42PM (#678617)

          For some reason its the electrical sockets that really got me, too bad that didnt make it into the video.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:56PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 11, @01:56PM (#678367)

      It sounds like a funny video, is it online?

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:46PM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 10, @11:46PM (#678183)

    Anti smokers are bad. But as a non-smoker (cant stand the taste), I have noticed the ex-smokers are the worst of the lot. It is not enough for them to quit they have to go all ban happy on everything. They can not control it so they want laws written so they can not relapse. Show some self control...

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Friday May 11, @01:18AM (1 child)

      I did a month ago. The nausea lasted about a week, but it's been a month now and I am _still_ getting headaches.

      Any substance that has such a profound affect on the human body is without a doubt A Tool Of The Devil.

      --
      Every call you get with blocked ID, answer it with "Hello Mrs Crawford".
      • (Score: 3, Funny) by c0lo on Friday May 11, @08:56AM

        by c0lo (156) on Friday May 11, @08:56AM (#678297)

        I did a month ago.

        It's so easy, right? I never had any problem to quit smoking.
        Like today for example, I already quit smoking for about 20 times and it's only early evening!

  • (Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Friday May 11, @01:09AM

    ... mostly permit smoking during the workday.

    A Texan who was among my collaborators at CERN fired up a cigar every day at noon.

    Our entire office building smelled like an ashtray that was sorely in need of the SuperFund.

    --
    Every call you get with blocked ID, answer it with "Hello Mrs Crawford".
  • (Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Friday May 11, @01:16AM

    HEPA filters were invented by the Manhattan Project to get Plutonium dust out of the air. You can get them at big box stores. In the Great White North, Canadian Tire sells them.

    They are the best thing for airborne allergens; I bought one for my ex who suffered crippling sinus headaches every day, even during the Winter, because she is allergic to dust mites. Her filter worked really well for her.

    I once had the opportunity to register "hepafilter.cn" but I figured I'd have to actually be in China to legally have .cn registrations. Happily, hepafilter.cn [hepafilter.cn] really did sell HEPA filters.

    I tried the link just now - hepafilter.cn is for sale. Perhaps its domain is expected to be worth more than its life-saving products.

    To my great dismay I later discovered that some .cn registrars will register .cn domains for foreigners that aren't in China yet; such domain's registrants will be the registrar with the I-Promise-And-For-Sure assurance that the domains will be returned to the registrar's customers when they establish Chinese business.

    Sucks to be MDC. :-(

    --
    Every call you get with blocked ID, answer it with "Hello Mrs Crawford".
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