Bold new plan for police pursuits:
Constable Peter McAulay, 24, was hit early [on the morning of Sept. 27] after setting up road spikes to try and stop two teenagers in an allegedly stolen vehicle. A 16-year-old boy and 15-year-old girl have been charged with attempted murder after Constable McAulay was rushed to Brisbane's Princess Alexandra Hospital with serious head injuries and broken bones and fractures.
After the horrific crash, Queensland Police Union President Ian Leavers is calling for remote vehicle immobilisers to become mandatory in new cars.
"I started in 2012. I have written to three successive prime ministers but it is now time for action, bipartisan support. With remote engine immobilisers there will never be a need for a police pursuit," Mr Leavers told Today. "The primary situation is to protect lives and property. It can improve safety. It is a great thing. It is a no-brainer. We need to change the Australian design regulation. Within five to 10 years there will never be another police pursuit. We will be able to disable any stolen car at any point in time and ensure safety. It is commonsense."
The proposed engine immobilisers wouldn't just be able to stop a car in its tracks, police would also be able to track vehicles through GPS.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by mhajicek on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:42AM (20 children)
Serial killers immobilize their helpless victims as they travel.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:52AM (11 children)
and criminals onl;y target older vehicles, the ones without the kill switch. This is a bad idea (like it needs to be explained?).
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:04AM (9 children)
but if I ever buy one, it's going to be a 1974 Dodge Challenger.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:13AM (8 children)
Word to the wise: Never buy any motor vehicle produced in the USA during the 1970's. Citation: K cars! jmorris's K cars! Maladaptive! Disfunctional! Prone to degradation and incidents of dis-repair! A Republican dream era in Detroit!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:18AM (7 children)
Used to own 2 early 70's Detroit cars. Not the greatest on fuel economy (nothing was), but maintenance was super cheap. There were something like 16 bolts in the whole engine compartment and you could fit 1-2 people in all the open space.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:49AM (6 children)
And why would you need to stuff a couple people into your engine compartment, unless you were trafficking? "ICE Officer! Pullover that K-car! Stat!"
(Score: 2) by Nuke on Thursday October 04 2018, @09:49AM (5 children)
I used to do work on the engine while sitting on a front mudguard (US = fender) facing inwards with my legs inside. I also kept a spare 5l can of oil in there, toolboxes, tow rope etc.
(Score: 3, Informative) by fyngyrz on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:07PM (4 children)
We call them fenders because they are there to fend off damage to the main car structure, and also, because they don't do a single thing to guard against mud, so calling them mudguards would be... silly. Same reason we call the storage area in the rear of the vehicle a trunk; because it's a box with a lid, not something you stick your foot into (a "boot")
We also call where you park a car a driveway, and where you drive your car a parkway, so there's that. Our sanity is not very uniform... ;)
(Score: 2) by insanumingenium on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:40PM (3 children)
We call it a trunk not because they are a box with a lid, but because they initially were literally trunks strapped to the back of vehicles, such a useful idea it became standard to simply built into the bodywork.
Here is an example you can still buy new for the purpose [snydersantiqueauto.com]
(Score: 2) by fyngyrz on Thursday October 04 2018, @10:09PM (2 children)
Yep. It's like a trunk, and it's used like a trunk, and we used to carry trunks around just as you describe (and well before motor vehicles did it, too... check out stagecoaches, personal coaches, etc.) Perfectly apt description.
Then there's shipment (sent by truck) and cargo (sent by ship.)
Slim chance... fat chance... same.
Vegetarians eat vegetables. Humanitarians eat... humans?
I love English. It's such a mess. :)
(Score: 4, Funny) by Reziac on Friday October 05 2018, @06:51AM
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."
--James D. Nicoll
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 2) by insanumingenium on Friday October 05 2018, @03:14PM
Which always makes me think of the perhaps cliched quote (I believe it is attributed to James Nicoll, but frankly I am not certain of its parentage at this point).
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:14AM
Yeah because it won't become a shady industry in itself - the disabling of killswitches. At which point police will only need to chase criminals. Oh wait!
(Score: 5, Insightful) by melikamp on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:26AM (5 children)
Constable was punched in the nose after turning over a wheelbarrow to try and stop two teenagers with an allegedly stolen sack of apples. A 16-year-old boy and 15-year-old girl have been charged after Constable was rushed to the nearest first aid kit with mild head injuries and heavily bruised ego.
After the horrific incident, Queensland Police Union is calling for remote person immobilisers to become mandatory on new Australians.
"I have written to three successive prime ministers but it is now time for action, bipartisan support. With remote person immobilisers there will never be a need for a police pursuit," Mr Weener told Today. "The primary situation is to protect lives and property. It can improve safety. It is a great thing. It is a no-brainer. We need to change the Australian baby regulation. Within 10 to 20 years there will never be another police pursuit. We will be able to disable any suspicious person at any point in time and ensure safety. It is commonsense."
The proposed neck-worn electro-shock person immobilisers wouldn't just be able to stop a person in his/her tracks, police would also be able to track people through GPS.
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:09AM
It is all too common for people to be divided by superficial qualities such as class or race. The poor congregate and struggle to attain food and shelter. The vanishing middle class faces a heavy tax burden and a dying job market, often blaming the poor for their issues. The various races squabble amongst one another at the behest of the elites. And the rich live lavishly, largely insulated from the troubles of the rest of society. Yet, despite all of this, a situation has arisen that threatens to demolish all of these barriers.
There were three children. The first was Sally, a little white girl born into an affluent family where all of her desires were met. Second, there was Benjamin; he was an African American boy who grew up in an inner city area known for poverty and crime. The third and final child was Young, who was born into a strict, abusive middle class family on the verge of collapse. These children all had vastly different backgrounds, to the point where you would never expect them to interact in any significant way. However, that was wrong.
These children shared one huge commonality, which was important enough to unite them all together. Just what brought these children together? No, a better question would be, 'Who brought these children together?' The answer to that question was the man standing near them.
His name was Jefferham. Jefferham strongly believed in unity. In fact, no one was more firm in their support of unifying the world and all of its people than Jefferham. This great man worked tirelessly to destroy the barriers that separated the various classes, races, and genders. It was he who unified these children. It was he who brought them together. And he did so by forcibly violating them.
Unity. Those children stood united by the fact that their pleas for mercy were ignored by Jefferham! They stood united by the sheer soul-crushing terror they felt whenever Jefferham turned his lustful gaze towards them! They stood united by the fact that they could die at any second if they dared to incur the wrath of Jefferham! They stood united by the fact that their screams and cries of despair and agony only served to make Jefferham become even more violent! They stood united!
And it didn't end there. There were more children by the names of Eric, Thomas, and Jacky. Those unsuspecting children would soon stand united as well! No, it wasn't just them, but the entire world.
Yes, under Jefferham's kind and caring guidance, the world would enter into an age of unity never before seen. And it would happen one child at a time. Jefferson smiled and licked his lips in anticipation...
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @09:16AM
Well put! Anonmodding you +1
Police advocate for a police state, news at 11.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Spook brat on Thursday October 04 2018, @12:09PM (1 child)
<sarcasm>Nah, neck-worn is old-school, [wikipedia.org] we need to focus on the next thing coming. [theonion.com] The future is in brain implants, and there's already a reference implementation. [wikipedia.org] Mandatory implantation at birth will shortly lead to universal adoption. It will pacify any uncooperative subject immediately upon activation. Can be triggered remotely, and has an option for autonomous monitoring and punishment for thoughtcrime! Direct brain stimulation is also available for promoting/rewarding appropriate behaviors.
The police force's job will be so much easier once the implant program is fully adopted, I can't imagine anyone objecting to it.</sarcasm>
Travel the galaxy! Meet fascinating life forms... And kill them [schlockmercenary.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 06 2018, @04:36AM
We laugh and cry but in a few years this will be the bleak reality. But I think it will be more like Brave new world than Nineteen eighty four in that it probably won't be the government chip but the facebook chip, voluntarily installed at target's request and expense. And the mindless masses will accept it gladly, much like smartphones today, without slightest shred of second thought or indeed fear. And it will be a very complicated thing and do much more than zap us when we talk about the president's scandals. Likely it will alter our behavior only slightly but all the times, certainly at the beginning. Government access will merely be added to the current lawful interception [wikipedia.org] statutes for the usual reasons.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:55PM
Manna by Marshall Brain includes spinal column interrupters as a key component of Utopia.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:34AM (1 child)
Now that's not nice.
Australian cops are not serial killers.
Perhaps you are thinking of a different country.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:40PM
The idiot cop deployed a spike strip,
and was then stupid enough to position himself where he could get hit by the car
(after it went out of control post hitting the spike strip)
Give that idiot a darwin award if he dies, and some common sense training if he doesn't.
There's no reason for high-speed car chases these days anyway,
using a helicopter or drone to track them without endagering innocent bystanders is a much safer approach,
as a bonus that doesn't need a big-brother dystopian kill switch in our cars
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:06AM
Maybe if those fucking pigs didn't set up road spikes and disable the handling of that car, it wouldn't have veered out of control and wasted that worthless piece of fascist flotsam.
This is why we have insurance. Just let the car go.
(Score: 3, Troll) by aristarchus on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:08AM (11 children)
What is with all these bizarre submission from the nether world down under? Shirley everyone knows that Nude Zealand and the Former Penis Colony of Austrailing just a bit, do not form a normal data set for anything normal. There is always the post-Imperial British Derangement Syndrome to consider. So the Auzzie police think they need to have remote kill-switches in
the Linux kernelautomobiles, so as to, um, prevent situations such as we saw in the Original"Mad Max" [wikipedia.org] movie, where the bad guys force the good guys to become the bad guys, and then the entire world is nuked, or some such, to give us Mad Max 2, or, The Road Warrior. [wikipedia.org] No one knows where he goes, but whether it be Tina Turner, or Charlize Theron, it does not end well.My point? We could have been much better served, as a community, with an aristarchus submission. Of late the personal foibles of editors have be leaking on to the front page. I am not one to complain very much, but this has gotten so bad as to make even me question TMB's participation in The SoylentNews. I say, open the tank of nitrous, because all problems are solved by sufficient velocity.
(Score: 4, Funny) by Gaaark on Thursday October 04 2018, @11:46AM (5 children)
"Shirley everyone knows that Nude Zealand and the Former Penis Colony of Austrailing"
I read for insight and I got this.
Sigh.
....
And don't call me Shirley.
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:19PM (3 children)
Not only did we get that ^ but it was posted by someone who actually claims to be something of a philosopher. You'll find equal or better philosophy over at stormfront, which was discussed here very recently.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @10:19PM (2 children)
-10 humor impairment
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday October 04 2018, @10:26PM (1 child)
Sophomoric humor from a philosopher? Yes, someone is impaired here.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by aristarchus on Friday October 05 2018, @07:35AM
Obviously you were never with Ludwig Wittgenstein when he was on a tear! You think Kavanaugh could be a foul-mouthed drunken Young Republican frat boy? Got nothing over philosophers! [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Friday October 05 2018, @06:55AM
You wanna share what you're drinkin'? :D
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:04PM (1 child)
> Shirley everyone knows that Nude Zealand and the Former Penis Colony of Austrailing just a bit
> My point? We could have been much better served, as a community, with an aristarchus submission.
The evidence points to "no".
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday October 05 2018, @08:55PM
Lack of evidence is not evidence of lack, so the censorship of aristarchus proves nothing.
(Score: 2) by AndyTheAbsurd on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:41PM
I've often wondered how those two movies are supposed to be connected - the settings are just so different. Apparently, there was a character known as "The Historian" that was supposed to appear in all of the films (except maybe the first) who would follow Max around, frantically writing down his exploits. I suppose that we're to treat "Max Rockatansky" and his actions very much as people today treat the legend of Hercules/Herakles - not as "fact" or "canon" but as a series of intriguing stories that have survived down through the ages.
Please note my username before responding. You may have been trolled.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:24PM (1 child)
I keep watching the submissions queue for your articles. They're fun to read! Plus, I'm wondering how long it will be before you've found a way to link World Socialist Web Site to the alt-right.
(Score: 3, Funny) by aristarchus on Thursday October 04 2018, @09:45PM
Patience, my young Paduwan! Only Sith deal in absolutes.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by black6host on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:13AM
And remember, The War on Drugs. Who wouldn't want a world where the bad guys couldn't get away and hurt people in the process. Guffaw I say!!! I wouldn't want such a world. Especially if it meant giving up my privacy, my control of my fucking life, etc. I'm getting tired of this stuff. Same old if you're not for us your against us stuff. Disgusting.
I wonder, do you think Mad Max's car had an immobilizer in it? Would have been a damned short movie, lol.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:25AM (3 children)
In fact we're nearly there now. Automakers have bulk agreements which allow them to fit cars with connections to cellular networks without incurring a per-car fee or data charges. These connections will allow for software updates and enable vehicles to communicate with each other; theoretically paving the way for better autopilot systems. These connections also allow for locating vehicles which have been stolen or are up for bank repossession, remote door lock/unlock, diagnostics, etc. While none of these examples is related to law enforcement, it's not difficult to imagine a future where an officer pursuing a car is able to call in the license plate in to dispatch who then retrieve the VIN and request some type of 'safe stop' via a call to the manufacturers LEO hotline.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:14PM (2 children)
Only to find out the license plate was stolen from another car.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:08PM (1 child)
Fun fact, that is why you are supposed to blur the license plate when you put pictures online of vehicles. Apparently, there are criminal organizations that slurp up pictures of cars from their state. They then use those photos to put fake license plates on their vehicle that copy the ones online that match the make, model and color of the car. At a glance, you cannot tell the difference.
I actually wonder what it would be like to have someone copy your plate like that and then get in a chase. There you are, motoring along then BAM! kill switch. If people think there is an outrage at chases before, just wait for that to happen.
(Score: 2) by toddestan on Saturday October 06 2018, @05:33AM
That's one of the reasons I thought it was stupid when my state went from embossing the letters and numbers on their license plates to having them completely flat. Faking a plate with the embossing can be done but isn't trivial. Faking a flat license plate is a lot easier.
Supposedly the embossing makes it harder for cameras to OCR the plates which is why it was done.
(Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:25AM (7 children)
On 2012, Washington resident Michael David Crawford, while wearing home-made body armor and a helmet with metal plates taped to it, stole a car then led the Lakewood police on a high speed chase.
After crashing the car, he fired a pistol at one of the officers, who returned fire thereby killing Mr. Crawford.
He left behind a wife and child. [thenewstribune.com]
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:00AM (1 child)
Either that story is fake news or you're not the real MDC... Which is it?
(Score: 4, Interesting) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:29AM
I get email intended for all manner of Michael David Crawfords. I'm quite diligent about replying to the email intended for the Australian transplant surgeon named Michael David Crawford.
Get This: there is a _Psychiatrist_ named Michael David Crawford.
But the guy I wrote about: that was the Gospel Truth. I looked him up after a cop gave me crap for not having updated my address, as the guy who got shot was a registered sex offender.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 2, Funny) by qzm on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:24AM (2 children)
Great..
Now you are dead, I assume you will stop posting?
Please?
(Score: 2, Flamebait) by aristarchus on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:02AM
Come, now! jmorris has been brain-dead for much longer then MDC has been allegedly dead, are you going to insist the jmorris stop posting as well? Actually, that is not all that bad of an idea. Now about this PartTimeZombie character . . . .
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:27AM
The Silicon anti-defamation league and the Fresh Start Club reject your anti-living sentiments!
(Score: 3, Funny) by Gaaark on Thursday October 04 2018, @11:49AM
Fraaaaank! NOOOOooooooooooo.......
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:03PM
So you're saying that imobilizing the car before it crashed would have prevented him from firing at the cops?
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:51AM (16 children)
It's really odd that police helicopters in most countries seem to be unarmed.
Firing at a vehicle is much safer if done from above, and we've been able to do this for ages. You fire a 50 caliber machine gun vertically down into the engine.
It's at least safer than spike strips, horizontal gunfire, and using a cop car to whack the other vehicle out of control. We do all those things, so no complaints about safety please. It's all relative.
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:09AM
Sounds like good jobs for the boys who get bored after coming back from Afghanistan.
Get the police an attack chopper. I think I saw an old documentary about it. There's no way it could be problematic to blow a car to pieces at high speed with ordinance that will mostly go through/around and create jobs for pothole repairmen, who will have to fish the cops' tires out first.
SOP for dead body on the highway is complete closure for at least 3 hours. Gonna be popular quickly on the 405.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:11AM (11 children)
0) Machine gun? The cops are supposed to arrest their suspects where possible not execute them. It's called due process.
1) A helicopter isn't actually a great platform for shooting at stuff accurately. There aren't that many top snipers in the world: https://coastguardnews.com/hitron-snipers-taking-on-smugglers/2008/06/04/ [coastguardnews.com]
Lastly there's no need to chase most of these road vehicles. You just need to identify the suspects well enough.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by darkfeline on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:24AM (1 child)
>A helicopter isn't actually a great platform for shooting at stuff accurately.
For a human, maybe. I would find it hard to believe if a computer stabilized gun couldn't hit a target the size of an engine, given modern gun stabilization on tanks and naval ships.
My question is, how the hell was the officer hit setting up spikes? Was he running out in front of the car with the spike strip in hand? How did he expect that to turn out?
It'd be trivial to just load spike strips into some kind of launcher and just launch them across the road, if officers getting hit laying spikes were a real problem.
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:31AM
Great plan! Let's hook a frogbot up to a helicopter, allow a human to choose the target and let her rip. What could possibly go wrong?
For every better convenience link the bot up to the net so the footage can be posted real time to friendface and youtube (youbot?) and allow the internet to vote on its actions.
We could call it: The Suspectinator
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:52AM (4 children)
Which is why I proposed using sharks with lasers.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:29AM (3 children)
This is racism against helicopters.
I sexually Identify as an Attack Helicopter. Ever since I was a boy I dreamed of soaring over the oilfields dropping hot sticky loads on disgusting foreigners. People say to me that a person being a helicopter is Impossible and I'm fucking retarded but I don't care, I'm beautiful. I'm having a plastic surgeon install rotary blades, 30 mm cannons and AMG-114 Hellfire missiles on my body. From now on I want you guys to call me "Apache" and respect my right to kill from above and kill needlessly. If you can't accept me you're a heliphobe and need to check your vehicle privilege. Thank you for being so understanding.
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Thursday October 04 2018, @11:54AM
You are now ApaChe.
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2, Troll) by VLM on Thursday October 04 2018, @01:19PM (1 child)
I heard Kavanaugh lovingly caressed the canopy of a helicopter in a non-consensual manner 35 years ago, the helo said it was OK but she was consuming huge quantities of ethanol gasoline at the time thus too intoxicated to legally consent #BelieveAllRotaryWingAircraft
(Score: 3, Funny) by Bot on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:29PM
> read Kava's diary for the day
> "instructions unclear, hand stuck in the tail rotor"
BUSTED!
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by Snospar on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:08AM (1 child)
Helicopters are fine shooting platforms, I saw it on that documentary "S.W.A.T." on the TV. The shooter just has to remember to say to the pilot "Hold her steady now" and then any shot (not matter what the distance) is possible.
Kinda makes you wonder why the pilot's don't just keep the helicopter steady at all times!
Huge thanks to all the Soylent volunteers without whom this community (and this post) would not be possible.
(Score: 3, Funny) by richtopia on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:23AM
I've tested computer simulators for this type of scenario. While the helicopter makes a good shooting platform, I've found it more effective to jump from said helicopter and pull a parachute out of your ass immediately before landing on the roof of the vehicle.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:45AM (1 child)
This has to be the most sensible answer. Don't chase cars/bikes. Tag them, identify them, and track them. They have to stop somewhere, sometime.
By all means, fence them in, form a net around them, but understand that they can and will stop eventually.
Do we have the tech yet to tag a car at speed to track it?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:00PM
We once were moving in that direction. Between about 1998, and 2001, there were some highly publicized incidents, in which innocents were killed during police chases. There was talk about stopping police chases. Or, high speed chases. Sure, chase down the car doing 60 in a 40 mph zone. It's just some dumbass who needs a reminder. But, that 100 mph chase through a school zone? Every_single_son_of_a_bitch involved in that chase needs to see the inside of a prison. Suspect, cops, and anyone else controlling one of those vehicles.
The talk never got very far, but it was slowly gaining momentum. It seemed that maybe in another five to ten years, high speed chases might end. Some smaller towns had already enacted policies against high speed chases.
Then, that raghead had a bunch of fruitloops drive airliners into the WTC and the Pentagon. And, that was the end of that.
As of 9/12/01, things were back to "normal", with testosterone and adrenaline making all the chase decisions. Rationality went back out the window.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:25PM (2 children)
"Firing at a vehicle is much safer if done from above"
Er. No.
Moving shooter, moving target, variable distance, variable windspeed, variable angle of gravity, variable G loading on the shooter, not to mention turbulence. Even expert marksmen have difficulty with these shots. It is a very rare skill. The U.S. hosts a top sniper competition for NATO countries. They've televised it a few times. The only guys who make this shot regularly, are the Americans. And that is because we train specifically for anti-insurgency more than anybody else.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:29PM (1 child)
Seriously, "variable windspeed"???? WTF. You're out of your mind.
The shot is taken from the minimum safe helicopter height, aiming straight down. In an area with normal buildings and trees, that height is about 50 feet. Wind and turbulence will do nothing to 50 caliber at a distance of 50 feet.
Neither the vehicle nor the helicopter are moving erratically. (if they do for a moment, wait a bit) Both travel along a highway, one right above the other. There isn't any interseting G loading.
Seriously, WTF? This isn't some sniper shot going horizontally for miles in Afghanistan. It's a vertical shot, directly down, from a stabilized gun turret at close range. For 50 caliber, it is practically point-blank.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:29PM
Yes, but are you sure that, just in case, it might not be a good idea to instead use a radar-guided missile to disable the suspect's vehicle?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:09AM (3 children)
what? a 24 yo gets hurt trying to catch a 16 and a 15 yo and you want to do what? .... idiots, send grown-ups next time!@#
(Score: 2) by qzm on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:21AM (2 children)
Not to mention that just a little training about the use of road spikes would have helped...
Straight anywhere near them after deployment, or deploying them without enough time to get clear is... Irrational? Foolish?
But no.. We all need immobilisers controlled by the government.. Yes.. that's much more sensible than a little common sense.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:42AM
Why would anyone be anywhere near an object that is going to be hit by a car?
Is this Darwinism?
(Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Friday October 05 2018, @10:39PM
Sensible no, but it is the sort of thing the authorities really want, and have wanted long before this incident. This particular incident, and any similar they can dredge up, just get used to frighten the citizens into accepting their appointed lot.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ledow on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:17AM (4 children)
You should always question when a technology for this kind of thing turns into presumption of guilt.
If a cop car has road spikes (a "stinger" in the UK), then they are presuming that most cars won't ever need to be stopped, just the ones they put it in front of.
If they have handcuffs, or batons, or even a gun, that they hardly ever pull out, then they are presuming that most people are actually not doing anything to necessitate their usage.
But when you start down "we want every car to have this... JUST IN CASE that person turns out to be a criminal one day" or even "we pull guns on EVERY vehicle stop", that's when you've gone too far. You're presuming that most people are guilty - not just a small majority, but that almost everyone is potentially guilty.
In all my life in the UK, I've encountered the police about 5-6 times. Each time, they asked me to stop. They presumed I would. If I was in a vehicle they pulled in gently behind, not assuming I was going to drive off. They asked me a question or two. Never assuming that I'd actually done anything wrong. A couple of times they were obviously exercising their discretion and could have been nastier if they wanted, but decided to just believe "Oh, no, sorry, I really didn't notice that light was out... I'll get it changed".
They usually made some kind of joke and apology for stopping me unnecessarily. We went our ways. There was never any hint of a weapon, force, trying to crowd-me-out, or anything else. It was always like being stopped by a little old man who does the caretaking. "Excuse me, sir, sorry, could I just stop you a moment". There was never a presumption that I was doing whatever I was doing maliciously or deliberately.
As soon as the presumption of innocence is lost you'll get stuff like this, and things will continue to escalate.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:40AM (1 child)
Yeah the world is going to suck in 10 to 20 years when everything is tracked and everything is recorded. The generation after will not appreciate how nice life used to be.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:42PM
What are we going to do about it?
Oh right, we have to vote for the Republicrats because the Dempublicans are more evil! Or the other strategy sure to cause a revolution overnight: stick it to the man by not voting at all!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:53AM
Soylentils! We have found the Cereal Killer!
(Score: 3, Funny) by mhajicek on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:15PM
In the US if they're pulling you over for a taillight out they walk up with one hand on their sidearm, shine a million candlepower light right in your eyes, and ask you where you've been drinking tonight.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:50AM
They are the _QUEENSLAND_ Police*, so you do have to make allowances.
*The best that money can buy.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:01AM
Just get to the end game. You get out of line, POOF your head comes off.
Government wont ever stop taking things from you.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @08:33AM
> "I started in 2012. I have written to three successive prime ministers but it is now time for action, bipartisan support. With remote engine immobilisers there will never be a need for a police pursuit," Mr Leavers told Today. "The primary situation is to protect lives and property. It can improve safety. It is a great thing."
Mhm. I'm sure it will be also be against the law to stop random people's cars on the highway, so that won't be a problem. This is why computer security is such a quiet field, and there haven't been any breaches in decades. Also why something called "five eyes" doesn't exist.
> "It is a no-brainer."
Well, that's one thing we agree on. Only someone with no brain could think that this is a good idea.
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Thursday October 04 2018, @12:06PM (1 child)
Just make it so the cops have to go to the judges house, wake him up or pull him off his wife or whatever, present all the evidence, let the judge have time to assess all the evidence, weigh the pros and cons, get the judge to type up the warrant and sign it and I say, "Hey....go for it. Shut that vehicle down!"
But only then.
And yes, I know women are judges too. :)
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @12:33PM
My money is on the crooks who have a device to immobilize the cop cars...
(Score: 3, Informative) by VLM on Thursday October 04 2018, @01:26PM (1 child)
If we're just trying to fill a DnD or Pathfinder sourcebook with magical trinkets that won't realistically work in the real world, why not a magic wand that when waved de-authorizes bullets from firing?
I mean, if you give up on requiring technical feasibility for your demands, you may as well ask for lord of the rings and harry potter props. I think the cops should demand every cruiser have Hermoines giant purse so they can store infinitely long spike strips conveniently. Also instead of guns like American cops they should have magic wands.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by takyon on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:15PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bright_(film) [wikipedia.org]
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Thursday October 04 2018, @01:31PM (2 children)
Why are police chases even needed? If you have really done something wrong, there is no escape.
Around here you can't drive on any of the major roads without your car being scanned, IDed and recorded at multiple points. You can't use a credit card or cell phone without instantly giving away your location. They have just started to implement facial recognition systems - eventually you won't even be able to walk down the street without instantly showing up in a database.
But sure, let the government remote control your car, your cell phone, and your electric toothbrush because they need even more power over you.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:10PM
They have a serious problem in the UK with people stealing motorbikes and scooters, especially from delivery people, and then using the vehicle to commit crimes especially for stealing phones and other items of value from people on the street.
This is prompting people to invent better ways to protect bikes and motorbikes and scooters
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/may/05/bike-theft-proof-van-moof-yerka [theguardian.com]
A while back few cars had an immobiliser. The after market sales shot up around here in the 90s when car theft went through the roof. Now it is unlikely a car will be stolen unless it is highly valuable and thieves can haul it away or get around the alarm / immob system quickly.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Thursday October 04 2018, @02:47PM
Because in some cases the driver poses an imminent threat to life or property just from the way they are driving. When the police backing off does not change that behavior a judgment call is made that the risk of potential in damage from stopping the car outweighs the risk of letting it go and observing from the air and far behind.
And in some cases the cops are just cowboys. Many departments, though, have just such an assessment as above. Especially if a heli is involved with high oversight many departments will slow their pursuit cars back and give the driver space - it's how the pursued driver reacts to that which determines how aggressive they have to be in stopping it.
The real question is why do the police insist on putting officers out on a highway with a known dangerous driver speeding past, instead of equipping cars with a winch system such that the cop could stay protected in the car. Hell, come to that have it radar triggered in a way that it doesn't even take the cop's judgment of dragging the strip. That would require work but isn't magical thinking, just a degree of cost in creating such a system.
This sig for rent.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @01:54PM (1 child)
bobby really liked jennifer. he knew she was trailer trash but she was pretty with her blond hair and skinny like himself. somedays they would talk to each during lunch break. not often but sometimes and he would hear stories about how her father got drunk again and kicked the dog. but bobby was mostly alone at school havinv few friends but his computer at home.
jennifer liked john. he was tall and strong but not too smart and didnt live far from jennifer.
one evening jennifer was faced with a dilemma: meet bobby at the icecream shop or wait for john to pick her up in his new car.
she decided to go see bobby but just before she could enter the ice cream parlour, john pulled over, a bit nervous, grinning at bobby thru the windshield and spoke to jennifer.
bobby thought he recognized the car but when he hurried outside to speak to jennifer, she was already driving away with john.
later the next day, he heard the news, that jennifer and john where at the police station and that the car john was driving was stolen.
15 years later bobby was the ceo of the largest active lo-jack providing company of australia, jennifer was expecting her 4th child and john was seemingly stuck in a revolving door at the prison.
the professor switched off the hyper-extrem-photon beam bender 100 years in the future and asked his class of post-neo socialist students to explain the role the new found freedoms and rights of woman in the 20st century played in the just watched story ...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 05 2018, @01:23PM
a female student raised her hand and suggested "it alllowed the creation of many unjustified "troll" down mods" to which the whole class burst out laughing...
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:17PM
Fuck you gestapo Ian Leavers. EU already has mandatory crash reporting for new cars, which enables automatic surveillance. Yeah sure, sure it'll never be used. No new car for me.
I don't understand this bullshit these people have of micromanaging everything. Shit happens, does not mean everyone has to suffer for something really, really, really marginal. Obviously these people want that they are not under survaillance, so police cars and police and other officials personal cars are not under surveillance. Only "civilians" are.
Unfortunately not enough people care or understand what's going on. It'll happen, all civilian cars will be tracked, road payments and speeding tickets will be automatically deducted from your bank account. Once self driving cars are perfected, higher road use payments will be issued.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday October 04 2018, @03:54PM (7 children)
And they never will. This is plain laziness, and that's the most benign explanation I can come up with.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 4, Interesting) by takyon on Thursday October 04 2018, @04:09PM (6 children)
This is a technological solution that would also be a problem.
Considering how computerized cars are today, and how much they will be once self-driving cars go mainstream, GPS tracking of most vehicles is inevitable. The kill switch is trickier since it could be exploited by a third party. There may be ways to "credibly" implement it. For example, "AI" in the car itself could recognize that police sirens are blaring, and enter into a temporary mode where a short-range wireless command to STOP would be accepted. This system could be fooled, but it would be more difficult.
Instead of stopping the car, the maximum speed could be temporarily limited, to 30 MPH for example, but with slow deceleration. This could avoid the kill switch being exploited in order to instantly rear end someone, and would make it a lot easier for cops to catch up with the car.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:27PM (1 child)
> once self-driving cars go mainstream
Bad assumption. I don't think this will be happening, there are just too many edge cases where it won't work correctly/will cause accidents.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:18PM
There's what, $50-100 billion on the line at this point? I have another story here [techcrunch.com] about a SoftBank and Toyota partnership.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday October 04 2018, @05:36PM (3 children)
I don't trust this stuff at all. You KNOW it's gonna be implemented completely half-assed and some cracker's going to steal whatever master keys are used for this and use it to cause utter havoc. Ever play Rockman.exe/Megaman Battle Network? Imagine that except with no helpful Navi avatars to actually bust viruses. A scenario like this actually happened in the first game where WWW member Madoi and her navi Coloredman.exe (yikes...) hacked Dentown's traffic signals.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 4, Insightful) by takyon on Thursday October 04 2018, @06:27PM (2 children)
I have zero doubt that you don't trust this stuff. But at some point, almost every car on the market will become a surveillance device and potential police informant. Maybe a decade later, and there will be a Cash for Clunkers 2.0 designed to remove older cars from the streets. Maybe another ten years later, and the old cars will be all but banned due to an emissions law. At the end of it, you'll only be able to own cars that spy, assuming you own a car at all (see new business models based on driverless).
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday October 04 2018, @09:54PM
Yyyyyyyup :/ Sure seems that way. Now, growing up poor in NYC means I never learned to drive, so I just walk or take the bus everywhere, but at some point I am going to need to learn, and at some later point will likely get a car. There's really no way around it in the US...
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 06 2018, @01:42PM
and maybe by then people will realize that we need to kill all these government leaches.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by crafoo on Thursday October 04 2018, @04:14PM
Citizen, your liberty is making my enforcement duties unsafe. Therefore we demand that you willingly give up your liberties so that I may enforce my will upon you and your family without fear or consequences.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 04 2018, @07:08PM
Film at 11.