from the what-could-possibly-go-wrong-with-a-gigawatt-laser-in-space? dept.
China wants to put a solar farm in space by 2025
According to China's state-backed Science and Technology Daily, Chinese scientists plan to build and launch small power stations into the stratosphere between 2021 and 2025, upgrading to a megawatt-level station in 2030 and a gigawatt-level facility high above the earth before 2050. Without atmospheric interference or night-time loss of sunlight, these space-based solar farms could provide an inexhaustible source of clean energy. The China Academy of Space Technology Corporation claims such a set-up could "reliably supply energy 99 per cent of the time, at six-times the intensity" of solar installations on earth.
China's proposal suggests converting solar energy into electricity in space, before beaming back to Earth using a microwave or laser and feeding into the grid via a ground receiving system.
Also at the Sydney Morning Herald.
See also: China Wants to Build the First Power Station in Space
Related Stories
The United States Navy is testing power beaming satellite technology.
Recently, one of [the] groups at America's Naval Research Laboratory (NRL) hit a milestone in the development of power satellite technology by launching their Photovoltaic RF Antenna Module (PRAM) test satellite.
The idea underlying power satellites is called "power beaming". Power beaming systems use one of three different frequencies of light to transmit significant amounts of power over a distance wirelessly. Last year NRL had a successful demonstration of a land-based power beaming system using an infrared laser.
Doing it from space presents a whole new set of challenges though, and not necessarily just technical ones. Dr Paul Jaffe, the technical lead on the PRAM project, described the process of being selected for an orbital launch as equivalent to Shark Tank – numerous PIs pitching their ideas for a trip to orbit. After several years of trying, PRAM finally got it's time to shine on an X-37B launch on May 17th.
PRAM won't actually shine though – it's surface is covered in black solar panels, and its innards consist of the first hardware ever launched to orbit that converts solar energy into microwaves.
Although it won't actually beam power back to Earth, the 30cm PRAM satellite will test and gather metrics to compare with Earth based systems, including
- Efficiency of conversion of solar energy to microwaves
- Thermal management using the radiative cooling system
- Power Density
- Base station design
- Optimal Illumination orbit
Addressing fears around use of the platform as a weapon, Dr. Jaffe notes "If you put a magnifying glass in front of your WiFI router, it doesn't start melting anything."
Related:
China Plans Space-Based Solar Power Stations
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Mykl on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:36AM (11 children)
Sounds great that you can generate so much power up there. But there must be a huge loss involved when converting the frickin' laser beam back to useable energy back on Earth.
For that matter, what happens when an evil mastermind gains control of the satellite and points the giga-laser at something else (oh, say, an enemy ship sailing past an artificially constructed island)?
(Score: 3, Funny) by c0lo on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:45AM
There's this documentary [wikipedia.org]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 4, Interesting) by takyon on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:57AM
Magnasanti [youtube.com] destroyed by stray Chinese microwave beam, 6 million deceased.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:28AM
That depends on how many migratory birds fly through the beam.
(Score: 2) by bradley13 on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:34AM (7 children)
Efficiency is not too bad: you convert the electricity to microwaves (radio waves), which is a pretty natural conversion. You then beam them to a huge antenna on the earth. The antenna itself can be fairly sparse - a bunch of wires strung up over a few square kilometers. We know how to do efficient radio reception, and that's all this really is. It's also surprisingly safe. People think "microwaves, you'll cook everything". But: Suppose you plan your antenna to cover an area 10km x 10km. And you beam down 1 GW of power to that array. That gives you a power density of 10 watts/square-meter. That's nothing - normal sunlight is 100x as strong.
The technology isn't difficult - I remember reading an essay by Jerry Pournelle 30 years or more ago, where he desribed this kind of system.. The challenge is getting all that equipment up in space.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:54AM (1 child)
That's an extremely large antenna; it would probably be terribly expensive to build. Now reduce the area to 1kmx1km (still huge), and the intensity goes up 100-fold.
(Score: 2) by HiThere on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:58PM
IIUC, when you reduce the area, you decrease the efficiency. Optimally I think you want the wires of the antenna to be 1/2 or 1/4 wavelength apart. And to be 1/2 or a full wavelength in length, but it's been a long time since I even considered the matter, and I was never an expert. (I know that capacitors can be used to tune the antenna somewhat, and that special components can affect the size needed...see pocket AM radios.)
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday February 19 2019, @11:28AM (4 children)
If Sunlight is 100x, or 100 times, as strong -- can they come up with some way to put Solar Panel on the ground? Where it will take up much less space than that HUGE Antenna. Or, what about Clean Coal? Why not build a Clean Coal plant, very reliable, their Energy Grid will love it. And build Condos on the land they save. Or rent that land to Farmers. No bird zapping beam!!!
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @01:04PM (3 children)
hey why don't we burn the coal in space, and then beam down the power? no carbon emissions clouding the atmosphere! and if you burn the coal on the moon, you can make a carbon atmosphere and make plants grow!
(Score: 2) by takyon on Tuesday February 19 2019, @02:02PM
Can we terraform the Moon with sulfur hexafluoride?
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1, Redundant) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday February 19 2019, @03:04PM
Interesting thoughts. China grew a plant on the Moon. But it died when night came -- much too cold there at night. Need some of that good old Global Warming!!
(Score: 2) by fyngyrz on Tuesday February 19 2019, @04:40PM
Because there's no oxidizer there.
--
Are you drunk?
☐ Yes
☐ No
✓
(Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:19AM (7 children)
I'm positively giddy at the prospect. This is one of those technologies that could catalyze space based industry, tourism, and colonization. According to TFA the up mass is 1,000 tons assumably to GEO. That's 20 of the (not yet complete or tested) Long March 9 launches or 52 Falcon heavy launches.
I hope it works, and I'm excited to see them try. It's bittersweet though; I wish my country had been the one to try it. It's amazing what you can do when you aren't stuck in foreverwar.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:30AM (1 child)
The west can't not build one in response. Not only is this necessary for power generation, it will be necessary for maintaining MAD between the west and China.
(Score: 2) by Spamalope on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:41AM
Yep. Maybe just a few ground based anti-sat beam weapons. If they're very vulnerable to the right countermeasure we may not want one ourselves. (Fusion is right around the corner, right?!? Same as the last 50 years...) They may only make sense in China's specific situation (given current launch costs). Ex: China may want power in non-Han areas to be something they can turn off at will, while also being a weapon if there is a revolt (over things like having a Han person forcibly live in the home to prevent their culture from being passed on to the kids maybe).
Power sats are beam weapons too without a doubt.
I'd think South Korea, Japan and Taiwan ought to be verifying they've got the appropriate anti-sat capability about now.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:45AM (2 children)
If it transmits any sizable amount of power, it is also a powerful weapon. Just direct the microwave or laser for a short time to your target instead of the power receiving station.
(Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:33PM (1 child)
Keep in mind that it will be in a geostationary orbit. They'll only be able to shoot targets on that side of the planet.
(Score: 2) by Mykl on Tuesday February 19 2019, @10:23PM
Only counting for over half of the world's population.
This may come as a shock to you, but there are people who care about targets that are not the US. But given that's all you might care about, here are some key US allies that could absolutely be targeted:
- Japan
- South Korea
- Taiwan
- Philippines
Or perhaps it could secretly be a Fully Operational Battlestationtm, able to alter its orbit?
(Score: 2) by HiThere on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:00PM (1 child)
I think 2025 is insanely optimistic...maybe. If it was intended to power things that were out in space you could scale down the size a lot, and still receive hefty benefits. (Don't necessarily believe anything ANY politician says.)
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Tuesday February 19 2019, @08:50PM
It does sound optimistic, but it's not completely inconceivable to have a small pilot plant operating that quickly. Japan did a public ground demo of the power transmission tech in 2015 and a larger experiment from LEO last year. (Assuming they are using concentrators and a turbine) The turbine that is off-the-shelf technology that would have to be modified for use in free fall, and IIRC GE did proof of concept R&D on that in the 80s.
It's money and political will. Isn't it always?
(Score: 3, Funny) by corey on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:46AM (2 children)
SimCity!
(Score: 1) by Crypthulhu on Tuesday February 19 2019, @07:28AM (1 child)
My thoughts exactly. I feel like there was a random failure % where the beam would miss and cause massive fires and destruction.
*NORK*
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:49PM
Only in the old ones, supposedly they were better by SimCity 3000. Is China waiting till then?
https://simcity.fandom.com/wiki/Microwave_Power_Plant [fandom.com]
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @09:23AM (1 child)
It sounds like the ideas for the orbital power satellites described by O'Neill in his High Frontier plan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_High_Frontier:_Human_Colonies_in_Space). It's only 40ish years late!
(Score: 2) by fritsd on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:46PM
Sounds like the terrorist training centre "under the wire" in "The Cool War" by Frederik Pohl.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Tuesday February 19 2019, @01:54PM (6 children)
This is a stupid idea, completely unrealistic in terms of cost, maintenance, everything. Is it April 1st in China.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday February 19 2019, @03:25PM (3 children)
I think you're right. Too bad they didn't learn from the disasterous 3 Georges Dam project!
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday February 19 2019, @03:35PM (1 child)
Who are these three people named George?
Why is the project 'damned' instead of 'cursed' ?
The lower I set my standards the more accomplishments I have.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday February 19 2019, @04:08PM
You're British, right? Surprised you don't know that one. Britain did Tea Act. Which China loved because the Tea came from China. But, Americans didn't want it (expensive & bad quality). George 3 said, drink up or else. We did the "or else." Known as, revolution!!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @07:19PM
When they said "just stupid", they really weren't calling you.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday February 19 2019, @03:37PM (1 child)
You describe exactly why such a project the support of politicians and then act surprised why it would get national resources allocated to it.
The lower I set my standards the more accomplishments I have.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Tuesday February 19 2019, @04:14PM
> why it would get national resources allocated to it.
I didnt RTFA - has this really got national resources allocated or is it just a puff piece in some news outlet (albeit a state owned one).
I didn't want to accept their cookies.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 19 2019, @03:52PM (3 children)
What happens when a bird flys through the beam? Does it catch fire? Does it explode?
(Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Tuesday February 19 2019, @05:37PM
The power density of the return beam will have less power than the noonday sun.
For scale, to match the power of the sun overhead at noon you have to focus the entire beam from a 10 megawatt array into an area smaller than a Wal-mart store. It is exceptionally hard to focus a beam that precisely from geostationary orbit 36,000 kilometers away.
(Score: 2) by HiThere on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:03PM (1 child)
That depends a lot on the exact design, but they're talking about microwave power rather than laser, so the bird would be safe. It's probable the cows grazing in the field under the antenna would also be safe. But the bird is moving fast enough that it wouldn't even get warmed significantly.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Tuesday February 19 2019, @06:26PM
The plans they were talking about 40+ years ago involved a grid of wires as the microwave receiver. You stick them up on 10 foot poles and how much energy is underneath depends on your system efficiency. With a well built system you could graze livestock underneath it without any problems at all.
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by PinkyGigglebrain on Tuesday February 19 2019, @04:00PM
A space based microwave beam in the Gigawatt power range controlled by China, or any of the current world "super powers", is really high on the list of things I do NOT want to see anytime soon.
"Beware those who would deny you Knowledge, For in their hearts they dream themselves your Master."
(Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Tuesday February 19 2019, @09:47PM (1 child)
I believe this is the original source of the article.
http://www.stdaily.com/zhuanti01/tjyzsc/2019-01/25/content_748479.shtml [stdaily.com]
(Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Wednesday February 20 2019, @01:56AM
Well, half the population of Vancouver, BC can understand that.