On the 15th of March, the German Bundesrat (Federal Council) voted to amend the Criminal Code in relation to internet based services such as The onion router (Tor). The proposed law has been lambasted as being too vague, with privacy experts rightfully fearful that the law would be overapplied. The proposal, originating from the North Rhine-Westphalian Minister of Justice Peter Biesenbach, would amend and expand criminal law and make running a Tor node or website illegal and punishable by up to three years in prison. According to Zeit.de, if passed, the expansion of the Criminal Code would be used to punish anyone “who offers an internet-based service whose access and accessibility is limited by special technical precautions, and whose purpose or activity is directed to commit or promote certain illegal acts”.
The proposal (German)
(Score: 2) by Whoever on Sunday March 17 2019, @02:38AM (14 children)
... and whose purpose or activity is directed to commit or promote certain illegal acts”.
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Sunday March 17 2019, @03:14AM
Do you really want to argue that much of the activity on the Tor network is directed to committing illegal acts?
Sure, that's not the purpose of Tor, but as worded that doesn't matter.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @03:23AM (7 children)
Does that include hiding Jews in your attic?
Please, don't give us any of that "illegal" crap. The government can make anything "illegal".
Oh well, hopefully, as always, I hope people are working on a solution to state/corp intrusion on our communications.
(Score: 0, Redundant) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Sunday March 17 2019, @03:49AM (3 children)
You say that like it's a bad thing.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 2, Touché) by Runaway1956 on Sunday March 17 2019, @04:02AM (1 child)
Dammmit mud duck - you're getting spammy. Go take a chill pill. Or an upper. Whichever one is on your schedule . . .
(Score: 1, Offtopic) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:45AM
ROR [warplife.com]
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 2) by Arik on Sunday March 17 2019, @04:41AM
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @04:37AM (2 children)
You realize that you are limited to five Jews in the attic, unless you have a permit from the Office of Hiding Jews.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @09:40PM
I have five Jews and a disabled homosexual. Do I need to seek a permit?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 18 2019, @01:12AM
you are limited to five Jews in the attic
How many can I have in the ash tray?
(Score: 5, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Sunday March 17 2019, @04:17AM (3 children)
You're not reading it correctly (assuming you've read the article). Although Tor is mentioned by name, the law can be applied to any online service which uses technology to protect the data it offers - such as your email provider. Do you use a password to log on here, at Soylent? Obviously, you are breaking the law by using technology to aid in anonymously spreading malicious ideas and concepts.
(Score: 2) by Whoever on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:41AM (2 children)
I glanced at the article, but, since I don't read German, I realized that probably, neither I nor the article's author really know the truth of how the "and" clause should be applied.
(Score: 4, Funny) by driverless on Sunday March 17 2019, @07:17AM (1 child)
...
-- Tiffany Malloy
(Score: 2, Funny) by fustakrakich on Sunday March 17 2019, @10:46AM
--Wernher von Braun
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @02:33PM
It is not. If you read the proposal, the abstract says the bill calls for "monetary penalty or deprivation of liberty for anyone who makes internet based services available that are limited in access by special technical means. Tor provides access to the "darknet" (trans: I guess anything that is not gatekept by Google or Facebook). The "darknet" is limited in access by special technical means. The "darknet" contains, besides other access controlled services, offerings with criminal relevance, for example trading in narcotics, child pornography, weapons, malware, identification papers and criminal services."
The target is tor, and other services that hide the endpoints of internet traffic.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @03:34AM (4 children)
Seems like we should simply make the actions illegal and not worry about what methods were used. Like banning knives to prevent stabbings, a law that targets the tool is easily misapplied, maliciously modified down the road, and often causes more problems than it fixes.
"What’s worse is that the proposed changes are so vaguely worded that many other services that offer encryption could be seen as falling under this new law. While the proposal (full German text) does seem to have been written to target Tor hidden services which are dark net markets, the vague way that the proposal has been written makes it a very real possibility that other encrypted services such as messaging might be targeted under these new laws, as well."
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Sunday March 17 2019, @04:04AM (3 children)
Wrong target? I don't think they've missed their target, at all. The aim is censorship. This gives them one more tool to prevent double-bad think and double-bad speech, and to punish those who engage in double-bad speech. The censors know what they are doing.
(Score: 2) by driverless on Sunday March 17 2019, @07:21AM (2 children)
It's not just badly worded, it's atrociously worded to the point of being almost incomprehensible legal gibberish. Until someone publishes what the actual wording of the changed legal text is, it's almost impossible to figure out what it will or won't say.
That said, German law is famous for its "gummiparagraphen", elastic paragraphs that sound over-reaching when you read them but are never applied in the strictest form in which they're written.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @08:44AM
tl;dr ... Summary "mission accomplished".
(Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Tuesday March 19 2019, @12:10AM
Mind you, it's still clearer than many tech patents.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:19AM (3 children)
If you combine this "can't secure your shit on the internet" with the data protection law "you must secure your shit on the internet" doesn't that basically outlaw the internet?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:37AM
Dummy, that's the intended effect.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Sunday March 17 2019, @10:50AM (1 child)
It's their "buttered cat" philosophy
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @02:40PM
That made me think of the "mustard cat" scene in one of Bertolt Brecht's works. A nazi was telling this story that if you tried to get a cat to eat mustard, you could take a tube and squirt some into its mouth, but it would not take it, and you would have nothing much to show for the effort but the scratch marks. Now if you waited for the cat to sleep, then took the tube and squirted the lot of it into its asshole, the cat would gladly lap up all of the mustard it could get.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Azuma Hazuki on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:49AM (4 children)
Scheisse, and here I thought after 70-some-odd years they'd know better. What is it about that place that makes it do things like this?
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 4, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Sunday March 17 2019, @06:53AM (2 children)
Looks like any other country filled with self-loathing white people.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @08:50AM (1 child)
As their spokesperson Runaway should know.
(Score: 0, Offtopic) by Azuma Hazuki on Sunday March 17 2019, @06:55PM
Then again we all know what kind of person he really is, as he laid it all out here [soylentnews.org] and as I've made damn sure to document for posterity so whenever anyone thinks he might actually be a reasonable human being I can trot that out :D
For a guy who says he doesn't support Trump or his policies, doesn't support white supremacy or white nationalism, and isn't a racist, it's amazing how he's stopped just short of saying "the 14 words" in their correct order here. And elsewhere. Read up if you have any doubts. And notice that when confronted on this, instead of disavowing all that "don't make my kids slaves to make brown people happy" shit he just says he was talking about what WOULD happen if there were a civil war, not that he explicitly is calling for one (which he is).
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday March 17 2019, @10:40PM
Germans work hard, and as a result they play hard. The best products Germans produce, called "shittin' tables," are the best in the world.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Sunday March 17 2019, @06:49AM (4 children)
ISIS is using the Internet better than we are using the Internet and it was our idea. I want to get the brilliant people from Silicon Valley and other places and figure out a way that ISIS can’t do what they’re doing. I would certainly be open to closing areas where we are at war with somebody. I sure as hell don’t want to let people that want to kill us and kill our nation use our Internet!!!!
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday March 17 2019, @06:57AM (2 children)
Ya know, Donny - if you would keep your mouth shut sometimes, people might not realize how dumb you are. Try this, and see how well it works. Sit there, behind that big desk in the Oval Office, and glare at people like you're mad. Don't say a word, just glare. You're actually pretty good at glaring, with that big, dumb-looking face of yours. Hell, you could even get a nice Meerschaum pipe to chew on while you glare. A pipe makes the glaring even more impressive. Put whatever the hell you want in the pipe - nice fragrant tobacco, even more fragrant cannabis, or some bubble water. Light it, or not, just chew on the pipe, and keep your mouth shut.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @08:48AM
Holy shit. Pot meet kettle much?
This irony is so delicious that I think I'll have a second helping.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @09:21AM
Having have found an actual pic of the insidious Runaway, from an avatar at some other site he was banned from, I must say he knows of wherefor he speaks! The urony is that he cannot, evidently, take his own advice.
Too late for you, Runaway, We all already know all too well how dumb you are. And this post clintons it.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @12:02PM
So are
white supremacistsyour base.(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @05:59PM
But I'm too busy trying to put out the fires from NZ convincing people that freedom of speech isn't such a good idea to bother with this kind of mundane tyranny. This is evil, but I've got better things to do than argue against it right now.
If you're German, send a letter pledging to vote against your MP equiv. if they vote in favour of this. That done, start pointing out to any pro-censorship folk you run into that censoring the evidence of the holocaust is a worse idea than printing it in every history textbook. Exposing people to horrors drives them away from that which caused them, not towards it.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 17 2019, @08:45PM (1 child)
all the people using tor or other means to commit crimes need to use their ill gotten gains to pay for hits on politicians. do everyone a favor.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday March 17 2019, @10:41PM
Real assassins like to meet their clients in person. The best you're gonna get anonymously on ToR are hackers-for-hire and drug dealers.