Since the settlement of Jamestown in 1607 and the start of the Colonial period, the U.S. has been predominantly white.
But the white share of the U.S. population has been dropping, from a little under 90% in 1950 to 60% in 2018. It will likely drop below 50% in another 25 years.
White nationalists want America to be white again. But this will never happen. America is on its way to becoming predominantly non-white.
The U.S. federal government uses two questions to measure a person's race and ethnicity. One asks if the person is of Hispanic origin, and the other asks about the person's race.
A person is defined as white if he or she identifies as being only white and non-Hispanic. A minority, or nonwhite, person is anyone who is not solely non-Hispanic white.
[...] Whites were not the first people to settle in what is now the U.S. The first immigrants were a people known today as American Indians and Alaskan natives, also commonly referred to as Native Americans. They arrived in North America around 14,000 years ago.
When Christopher Columbus arrived in America in 1492, there were around 10 million American Indians living in the lands north of Mexico. But by the 1800s their numbers had dwindled to about 1 million. They are now the smallest race group in the U.S.
The first sizable stream of immigrants to what is now the U.S. were whites from England. Their arrival at Plymouth in 1620 in search of religious freedom marked the start of large waves of whites coming to this land.
When the U.S. was established as a country in 1776, whites comprised roughly 80% of the population. The white share rose to 90% in 1920, where it stayed until 1950.
[...] Although the majority of the U.S. population today is still white, non-whites account for more than half of the populations of Hawaii, the District of Columbia, California, New Mexico, Texas and Nevada. And, in the next 10 to 15 years, these half dozen "majority-minority" [PDF] states will likely be joined by as many as eight other states where whites now make up less than 60% of the population.
Census Bureau projections show that the U.S. population will be "majority-minority" sometime between 2040 and 2050. Our research suggests that this will happen around 2044. Indeed, in 2020, there are projected to be more non-white children than white children in the U.S.
Source: phys.org; original at The Conversation.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @06:47AM (4 children)
This submission has no place on SoylentNews! It is racist bullshit fake news. Points:
There is not White. White is a back-formation from American race-based chattel slavery. Fuck Whitey.
There has never been a "white majority". Do you think that the entire area of what was to become Virginy was majority White? NO! They had them some minority English, which in some cases they were able to eradicate (Roanoke, not Jamestown). which proved to be a winning strategy, if only it had been consistently carried out, as it was against those Damn Vikings [youtube.com], but when Native Americans don't count. Bloody Brits, "Hughley has gone native!"
Hawaii, by the way, has never had a white majority. It was only allowed to become a state by admitting, first, mind you, the white supermasitic state of Alaska first, which, really, has also never had a majority white population, even during the gold rush, or during the Great Grifting For the Citizen allowance of Oil Revenues that Made Sarah Palin agree to get knocked up so many times, against her better judgment. And subsequent events have proven her right. So Sad.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:21PM (3 children)
150 years from now, when "white" accounts for less than 25% of the population, all the rest of you will STILL envy us.
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:46PM (1 child)
The way things seem to be going, its probably going to be illegal. Maybe I can get a colour change.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @06:03AM
Now that they have identified the genes for skin color it should be possible to change a person's skin tone with treatments
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:25PM
Infographic (map and sort of a bar graph) here:
https://i.redd.it/4gn3mzutnuv21.png [i.redd.it]
Basically, white people are an endangered subspecies, currently at about 6% of the population and rapidly declining. This is compounded by the fact that white-appearing traits are mostly recessive.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:05AM
All I want for Christmas is my White Genocide! Life would be so much better without fat white bitches calling 911 because black folk be being human.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:08AM (41 children)
So, can we vote to have this racist Fine Article removed from the Front Page, or do our Overlord Editors mean we have to be white supremacist website?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by PiMuNu on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:05AM (13 children)
Modded up. I wish I could mod more.
FFS this article is offensive clickbait. Nothing technical, nothing of interest at all.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:20AM (12 children)
It is true what the white supremists are saying as TFA proves, the only difference is if you find it bad that this happens.
Saying this is offensive is the samee as saying it's offensive that snow is white.
(Score: 3, Funny) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:25AM (11 children)
You fucking snow white racist! Do you not see that this is not news, and that even bringing it up is racist news? Now we will all end up being siwash half-breeds like The Mighty Buzzard, and I say that with the greatest respect.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:50AM (10 children)
Better a "half-breed" than a half-wit! Is there no depth to which your complete lack of self-awareness will not allow you to sink?
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @10:23AM (9 children)
ok, Quarter-breed Okie. Better? At least not a Texan.
(Score: 3, Touché) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @10:29AM (6 children)
If you'd read TFA or even TFS you'd know most Texans are brown people nowadays. Why do you hate brown people?
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @10:38AM (5 children)
It is not the brownness, it is the being Texan. As an Okie, you should know that. Did I ever tell you the one about the Okie that moved to Texas, and raised the IQ of both states? And still, Buzzard, you are on the wrong side defending racist posts on SoylentNews. The Vaxxing article was of the same caliber. I'm not saying it was aliens, but, you see where this is going.
And if you think I have intervened in this FA, where were you back in '14, when we had the great "Asians at Harvard" "I'm not racist, but. . . " polite SN discussion?
(Score: 5, Touché) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @10:59AM (4 children)
If I were defending racists, I'd be on your side. Today I'm defending everyone's right to discuss facts about demographics without ideologue racists shitting up the conversation.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @11:11AM (3 children)
So did this "completely neutral and entirely scientific" article include the word 'forever' or was it added by the undoubtedly just as "completely neutral and entirely scientific" submitter/editor?
(Score: 4, Funny) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @11:17AM
It's from TFA's editors. What, you expect non-clickbait headlines from ad-sponsored sites? You must be new to the Internet.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday May 02 2019, @04:59PM (1 child)
What's the problem with the word, "forever"?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:03PM
It's an awful long time. And, White Genocide is Forever!
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @11:51AM (1 child)
No, is quarter-wit okay? Why is it that the "unracist" left thinks it's okay to hurl racial epithets at anyone who fails to conform to the narrow, racist stereotypes the left projects onto them?
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:26PM
I can't speak for all 'breeds, but I know some who take great pride in being breeds. Fek Sensitive Suzy, no matter where she lives, or what color her skin.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:18AM (25 children)
The article doesn't take a position, only presents facts rather dispassionately. Facts are never going to be racist no matter how much you want them to be.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:41PM (3 children)
Sometimes you can tell a lot by what facts people like bringing up.
Like if someone kept talking about how goats have pussies like women. Well.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @06:06AM (1 child)
That is an offensive racial slut against muslims! How dare you!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @09:28AM
Wasn't a Muslim that brought it up. Why are you so triggered? Oh, no, AC! Not the Livestock!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 04 2019, @03:52PM
Well, but you have to admit that even if so, "buttsex" means something else when we're talking about goats.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by sshelton76 on Thursday May 02 2019, @03:20PM (12 children)
It would be nice if it had it's facts straight though.
The claim that whites have EVER been a majority in this country is flat out wrong and laughable on it's own.
Those statistics don't account for the natives, it doesn't account for the slaves and it doesn't account for anyone who wasn't a land owner / able to vote. Even women were uncounted, regardless of race.
The article paints it as though whites are being outbred by people of color. That's not what is happening. What is happening is that people who were not counted before are being counted and people who previously would have selected vanilla, because "Whitening your family line" was a desirable thing not too long ago, are now electing to call themselves other flavors such as chocolate or butter pecan.
True story. I have a niece.
Her mom is white, her dad is brown.
What should my niece select?
Should she go by her skin color which is a light mocha, or should she go with what she is culturally which is white?
Most people would have her select "black". Most people are idiots.
(Score: 2, Informative) by khallow on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:02PM (9 children)
Except, of course, for over a century as noted in the article.
Except that they do. There weren't that many natives, slaves, and other non-land owners of color. What you're missing here is that for a few centuries, a vast number of Europeans moved over. That's why there are so many whites here.
I'll note also that if we counted Hispanic white as white, which we did so for every other such group, then white isn't even close to becoming a minority.
(Score: 4, Informative) by sshelton76 on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:43PM (8 children)
Well I was about to call you out and ask for citations, because I just knew you were wrong.
Then I did my own research going back to the actual census records.
You're right, I'm wrong.
I'm uncertain where my original information came from that I used to form my opinion, but it was wrong and I'll be more careful in the future.
For the record, the information I had been going on was a statistic claiming that "white" americans had always been a minority and that when you account for "the unaccounted for", that whites only ever made up a maximum of 30% of the population and this figure had been dropping steadily since desegregation and the repeal of miscegenation laws. But since I'm unable to find a source there is no way to defend it.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:53PM (3 children)
Similarly, Irish, Poles, European Jews (I guess mostly Ashkenazi Jews) were all considered bottom of society and disreputable - butt of many racist jokes of the time. None of them would be considered members.
Now, they're just lumped in with the rest.
My take is that we're probably 2-3 generations from just not giving a damn. At that point, things will be so mixed up, it's not worth the bother of deciding what ethnicity someone is supposed to be.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by sshelton76 on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:00PM (2 children)
Agreed and that's essentially my take on the whole mess even if it seems like I'm saying something different.
This topic has spawned a few hundred responses. Looks like my more indepth explanation of my position and the position I hope my children take, has dropped over to the second or third page. But it amounts to, we only have about 4MB of genetic material that separates any of us. More genes code for hair than for skin color. Race in modern society is a pointless construct intended to divide rather than unite us. Anyways that's the summary of it. I went into quite a bit more depth and put in citations to defend it. Hope you'll track it down and give it a read.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @03:45AM (1 child)
>> Race in modern society is a pointless construct intended to divide rather than unite us.
I do not completely agree with you. My cousin lives with me here in the US. We are Malaysian, and he has been waiting for a marrow donation without luck so far. We've been told that the chances of a match are very, very poor outside the group of donors of Southeast Asian ancestry.
(Score: 1) by sshelton76 on Friday May 03 2019, @10:34AM
Yes but if a person could qualify and step up, you wouldn't care what color his skin or what his background right?
Haplotypes like that are useful in demonstrating the regions that were isolated long enough to diverge genetically.
But unless you're going to ban miscegenation because of the higher incidence rate of certain diseases based on race, (e.g. blacks are more susceptible to sick cell anemia but as a consequence they are less susceptible to malaria) then pursuing race instead of regionalism / culture is sort of a dead end.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:31AM (3 children)
Good on you man. We could use more folks willing to change their position when they find out they're wrong. Mostly they just move the goalposts and keep arguing.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday May 03 2019, @01:08AM (2 children)
Who does that! I am shocked that TMB would even suggest such a thing! (Oh, TMB, where do you want me to set down these goal posts?)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 04 2019, @03:49AM (1 child)
Goddamn! You can be an obnoxious fuck! Can't you ever give it a rest?
(Score: 3, Informative) by aristarchus on Saturday May 04 2019, @04:46AM
No.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @01:58PM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 04 2019, @03:44AM
I have a niece.
WOW! Small world!
(Score: 1, Troll) by bzipitidoo on Thursday May 02 2019, @03:48PM (2 children)
Did you know that animals defecate, the sun rises in the east, slavery in America was based on racism and was the cause over which the Civil War was fought, and Protestant colonists from England were Puritan zealots as well as naughty, disobedient rebels who strayed from the Catholic Church and were in defiance of Papal decrees that divided the entirety of the New World between Spain and Portugal?
Just a few facts.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:15PM
Slavery in the US wasn't based upon racism, it caused racism. Most of the racism targeting Blacks in the US is a result of propaganda that had been spread to rationalize enslaving Africans. Africans were hardly the first choice, the tried enslaving the indigenous peoples, but that didn't work as they generally escaped before too long.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:33AM
All good to know but none of that is news to anyone. Well, possibly aristarchus but nobody else.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @04:28PM (3 children)
Well at least now you've gone full jackass for everyone to see. I mean you've done it plenty before, but this is just laughably transparent.
The fact this was accepted by the editors is a clear signal that Aristsrchus has been right all along, SN is infested by the alt-right. At least there are plenty of others calling this bullshit out too.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:12PM
Eeeee-yup. Been calling this out for over a year and shouted down every time. Cassandra Syndrome strikes again!
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 4, Touché) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:36AM (1 child)
Stating facts is racist now? Guess I won't tell you that you're an idiot then.
Get it straight though, I don't give a rat's ass who the majority demographic is or even if there is one. As far as I'm concerned, you're all trespassing but I'm willing to put up with you in exchange for air conditioning and the Internet.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @02:12AM
Delusion, a fun party game all incels can enjoy alone after the waifu burns itself up.
Oh right, you sleep with catfish, but I think that basically counts.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @02:42AM
The scientific facts are that there is no such thing as race.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:45AM
Not a nice thing to say. Not nice. SPAM MOD TO OBBLIVION!!!!
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:10AM
It will be interesting to see. They just might as the general US population is so clueless. There are a lot of uneducated people everywhere on the globe but nowhere is it a greater shame than in US where information is readily available, especially if you're privileged by being a white person.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:43AM
I had a white neighbor, but he got old, and died. His house was bought by Chinese, as in the Chinese government. They leased it out to Smurfs, Blue people, with a Momma Smurf, and a Papa Smurf, and a few baby Smurf. Not a problem until they started having parties and playing music to all hours of the morning. So now I go to rallies in Southern States, where they still have Monuments to those who fought against the Smurfs, like in Charlottesville, and I raise my white arm above my white body, to proclaim, "Smurfs will not replace us!" But the problem is, Smurfs are cartoon characters, and I cannot find a wife, or even a "baby-momma", so I guess, at some point, I will just have to go with being an American Smurf, like everyone else, and stop thinking that I am special because I am white. Because, you know, if I thought that, I would be racist. And nobody wants to be racist. Right?
(Score: 4, Interesting) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:51AM (44 children)
There are no "whites", there are only "non-blacks". "White" is a retro-conception which depends on American Racist chattel slavery. Whites are only whites because they are not slaves. This is why this shit did not exist in the Greek world or under the Roman Empire. But Americans managed to screw the pooch and bring race into it. And in the process, they allowed white trash to think, "Well, at least we are not members of the Traditionalist Worker's Party, White Supremacist and Mother-in-law Banging." [wikipedia.org] See? No "N******s", no "W******s"! Joined at the hip-hop by the very history of the Nation. Americans really need to punch some Nazis in the face.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:19AM (15 children)
True, there is no singular white race or ethnicity. Strange that neither the alt-right or ctrl-left can shut up about it then.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:22AM (9 children)
Who you talking to, Honky? Gringo? GuauRen?
(Score: 3, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Thursday May 02 2019, @01:00PM (8 children)
"Guairen" doesn't mean "whitey." It means "stranger."
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:01PM (7 children)
I am a gweilo. Yes people call me this to my face. I don't find it offensive. I know what it means. It is a rather apt description when amongst yellow based people. I really don't care if they think it is derogatory. They do still use my actual name in conversion. Other than that it's Bring the gweilo with you :-)
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:33PM (6 children)
Ghost man is a pretty cool description, actually. Probably most any Caucasian would like being called a ghost man - unless he's a Goth or something like that. It sets us apart, and makes us special, right?
(Score: 3, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:14PM (4 children)
"Guai" is more along the lines of "freak" or "supernatural evil" than "ghost." The Japanese "youkai" is cognate to "yaoguai" in Mandarin and uses the same characters, something like "charm/strange/supernatural" + "freak/evil/demon/monster." It's not a nice thing to be called.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @06:45PM (3 children)
You're using facts, and being rational. Remember how "yankee doodle" started out? It was an insult. Americans took that insult away from the Brits, took it, owned it, and celebrated it. Same here. It is given that the term is an insult, but the white guy in question has taken that insult, and owned it. Now, it means "ghost man", and he can celebrate the notoriety and whatever else comes with the term.
Black folk haven't mastered that yet, but they have something of a handle on it. Among black people, "nigger" has a boatload of meanings. "My Nigga" can be, and is, taken however any two blacks want to take it. Insult, endearment, comisseration, whatever.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday May 02 2019, @06:59PM
Not even a close comparison. "Guailao" carries overtones of fear with it. "Nigger" was created to be the verbal equivalent of the whip across a black man's back. I wish to hell they'd stop throwing it around. It's one reason I try not to use "dyke" either and cringe when gay guys throw "fag" around.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by AthanasiusKircher on Friday May 03 2019, @03:30AM (1 child)
Yes, they definitely have, several times in history. The fact you're using "black" is proof of it. "Black" used to be an insult for at least a century or more, usually indicating a "full black" in the days when it was more desirable to be thought a mulatto or quadroon than 100% "black." But the Black Power movements of the 1960s reclaimed that word.
Before that, black intellectuals like DuBois reclaimed "Negro" which was thought to be associated with the history of slavery in the late 1800s, but they rehabilitated that word so that by the 1920s and 1930s it was the preferred polite term (still around in the UNCF initials).
So yeah, "black folk" definitely have done this. For some more history see my discussion here [stackexchange.com].
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday May 03 2019, @02:40PM
Nice article, thank you. But - I don't see the mastery of taking ownership of words there. Mostly, because it's so serious. Yankee Doodle? There was little if any serious discussion - it was fun, and mocking. "So, those slobs think we're yankee doodles? Let's just show them how a yankee doodle can whip their asses!" https://allthingsliberty.com/2013/12/short-history-yankee-doodle/ [allthingsliberty.com]
The rehabilitation of words referring to Black folk was dead serious. Things like Yankee are the subject of school boys, juvenile young soldiers, and the slightly older young soldiers, not to mention every drunkard in any pub.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @06:10AM
We were at a party with some of her friends and mine when one of her friends called me that. My friends missed it. Her friends were horrified at the social lapse.
When explained to my friends they thought it was an awesome nickname.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @04:45PM (2 children)
Fuck you. There is Aryan, Hamitic and Semitic. White = Aryan.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:09PM (1 child)
No, it doesn't. Aryan means the Indo-European people of the Vedas.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @05:56PM
and who descended from them, you goofy fucker?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @12:28AM (1 child)
"There is no such thing as race, you fukking racist! White people suck!"
This has always confused me.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @01:11AM
Must be a white person, then. They are easily confused, and panicked into hateful racism.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by bradley13 on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:28AM (26 children)
Well, no, it's not that simple. Slavery was and is evil. However, it is not and never was a white-vs-black issue, nor an issue particularly tied to the US - except in children's history books and people looking for simple explanations to complex problems. Just as an example, allow me to point out that the International Agreement for the suppression of the White Slave Traffic [wikipedia.org] was only signed in 1904. It wasn't even the last such treaty - it had a number of successors.
Anyway, TFA is waving the white-supremacy flag in a typical effort to demonize people who object to immigration. That's not correct, but it does intimidate a certain number of people, which is the purpose of the tactic. The real issue isn't about race, though, it's about culture. The US has developed a particular culture over the past decades and couple of centuries. This culture can maintain itself against a certain level of immigrations, as the immigrants and their descendents adapt. However, if the rate of immigration becomes too high, the integration may go the other way: the host culture being overwhelmed by the culture of the immigrants.
That is the real issue, and what many people actually fear. Trying to avoid this issue by crying "racist" is an old trick, and it doesn't work so well anymore.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 3, Informative) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:45AM (12 children)
Bradley, you are a racist. Are you really so afraid that Americans might actually start eating spagetti with marinara sauce? It would be the death of the British roots of American culture, you know. Here, read some non-racist shit:
From a rejected aristarchus submission, https://soylentnews.org/submit.pl?op=viewsub&subid=33318 [soylentnews.org] which it may benefit you to read, original source at https://www.salon.com/2019/04/29/fox-news-and-the-synagogue-shooter-right-wing-network-airs-similar-views-every-day/ [salon.com]
You should know better than this, Bradley, since you are living in a multi-ethnic and multi-lingual non-American country. Try to represent your native country better, you know, non-racistly??
(Score: 5, Insightful) by bradley13 on Thursday May 02 2019, @11:02AM (10 children)
No, exactly not. I am perhaps a culturist. Some cultures are better than others, or at least the results of those cultures are better. Would you rather live in Canada or in Somalia? In Ireland or in Pakistan?(*) Where do you think the differences come from? The short answer is: culture, which underlies social behavior, which in turn is the foundation of the economic and political systems. The immigrants demonstrably agree that the culture they are moving to is better, else there would not be millions of them risking their lives to get there.
Mind, I have nothing against any individual immigrant, as long as they adapt to their new culture. However, I do object to mass immigration, because too much immigration, too fast, prevents integration and endangers the receiving culture.
--
(*) It would be absolutely fair to note that a Pakistani might well prefer Pakistan to Ireland. That's fine - too much Irish immigration to Pakistan could threaten the dominant culture there as well. There's nothing wrong with appreciating your own culture - and also nothing wrong with wishing to see it preserved and protected.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by aiwarrior on Thursday May 02 2019, @11:41AM (9 children)
I actually review myself in this way of seeing things. Quite simple but I cannot find a non knee-jerk way of refuting what Bradley says. Alas, i think it reflects the common folk prudence, and I think you could put any race in this common folk bag. People have their lives in a cultural context and fear change they do not understand nor desire.
They do not mind Mohamed or Juan as long as they are nice folks who have the same core(cultural) values as them. They like their children including their daughters, they are trustworthy and honest people. They also like to be able to perceive these traits, so having understanding of the language is crucial. Without understanding of cultural values and customs Mohamed and Juan become "they" and there is where things are bad for both the values of Ms Johnson as well as Juan.
I just reminded myself about the mayor of London being of Pakistani descendence, and i highly doubt he would be comfortable with much of the customs of his ancestors being applicable in London. Hell this just proves the point that it is not about race, it is about culture. The community recognized his values as being part of the community and that is it. I am so fed up of this American racism/non-racism wars it stinks.
@Aristarcus you are an agitator, disguised with a fancy classical pseudonym, but the truth is that you are sophist of the modern kind. Pretending to be high and righteous but dogmatic when the time to battle arguments comes. Evidence is that when you start your answer you do an ad-hominem calling Bradley a racist first and foremost.
The article talks about a demographic transformation in the United States. Race and ethnicity is a demographic subject matter so what is wrong in bringing it to debate. Even for the case where this would be a trojan horse for racist ideologies, dogma is never the answer.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @12:10PM
Well said.
A side musing about the good ole US: it's not even that unlikely to have a Juan Johnson here, though pronunciation rules would have to be a bit confusing.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Phoenix666 on Thursday May 02 2019, @01:12PM
I think you and Bradley are stating it well. I'd chime in that I like the cultural enrichment that immigrants bring; I like the Melting Pot. But I don't like cultural replacement, because the core American ethos has triumphed spectacularly in producing the world's sole superpower and measurably increasing freedom and opportunity across the world. After all, who is it that is buying the products made in China, India, the Philippines, Vietnam, and many places around the world that are lifting millions of people out of poverty? Whose system of higher education is it that has opened its doors to the world's best, who are actively and avidly producing technical and scientific innovation? Whose robust agriculture has produced such bounty that it feeds the world? Whose leadership was it that produced the League of Nations and later United Nations in an effort to avert future world wars by solving national differences through dialogue?
Those qualities, and many more, are worth preserving and fighting for. They are worth welcoming others to come and share them, not overwhelm and discard them.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:13PM
Yet his culture has now polluted London which has resulted in the streets becoming more like the middle east with every passing year.
Acid attacks, knife murders, uncontrolled thieves, pack rape, child sexual exploitation and grooming. Soon London may be just like Pakistan. Well done you!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:27PM (2 children)
https://gellerreport.com/2017/08/ayling-kidnapped-muslim.html/ [gellerreport.com]
England is screwed. Time to move somewhere else.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @03:17PM (1 child)
Actually, I think you are the one who is screwed if you are relying on the Geller Report for your news. Just sayin'.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @06:15AM
Are you saying there is anything on that site that isn't true? If so feel free to point it out.
Here's a start: https://gellerreport.com/?s=muslim+rape [gellerreport.com]
Are you an England Muslim Rape Denier?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:39PM
Amen, Brother! Praise the lord, and pass the ammunition, and we'll go hunting some agitpropists! Very nearly all of Aristarchus rejected submissions are agitprops.
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:14PM (1 child)
It's just my name. Are you racist toward Greeks, as well?
Which is it? High and mighty, or down low and dogmatic? Do you know what "dogma" means?
Not an ad hominem when it is true. Do you think he is not? Rather more quiet about it than some of the nut-job islamophobes here abouts, but read his posting history.
(Score: 2) by aiwarrior on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:26PM
Truly a sophist :)
As i am in a good mood and it is holiday tomorrow.
> It's just my name. Are you racist toward Greeks, as well?
Greeks? Who spoke about Greeks? The whole classical period encompasses history in the whole Mediterranean Sea[1]. Given my nationality (portuguese) and skin color being racist against greeks would be akin to this Dave Chappelle sketch. Here, relax [2] see the sketch and see how racism is really exposed.
>Which is it? High and mighty, or down low and dogmatic? Do you know what "dogma" means?
Oh yes I do, and again I can back it up with a citation [3]: "a fixed, especially religious, belief or set of beliefs that people are expected to accept without any doubts". You see where the righteousness and mighty is connected to you and dogmas? There is no low or highs in dogma, there is expectation to accept truths absolute with no discussion as when you did not even start by answering your peer's thesis. Instead you insulted him. This is the true path of a sophist, mincing words and etymologies in the hope of distracting from the core of the matter.
> Not an ad hominem when it is true. Do you think he is not [...]?
So you say. Ipse dixit [4]. This time from the Romans so you get to assume I am racist against all the Roman empire and get the meaning of classical right.
In plain english, what i mean is chill out. People have the right to have different points of view, and if you disagree with them try to bring them to your side. Not create divides that further degenerate. Even if he is a racist, his argument was a good window into understanding what makes people uncertain and unsure about the changes in the world. Here in Europe the debate is the same and people have the right to feel proud in their cultures. It is their identity. Ottomans, Austro-Hungarians and some others have tried stripping away the identities of the peoples and this led to massive nationalistic movements that created world nightmares.
I know the topic is about the US but some things may apply. Europeans are for the first time joining in a very unique political union so that the peoples cultures and customs are not threatened or diluted. For the first time Europeans come to accept that Polish or Estonian values have the same roots and goals as that of the Portuguese, the Spanish or the German. This is a lot to get on people's minds and it is an extremely delicate balance that is put to question the first time there is a breeze. Adding an uncontrolled amount of people with new values and cultures to this balance leads to knee jerk reactions and the rise of things that fortunately we did not see for a long time. Do not be idealist, be practical. Border control is a practical administrative affair not a discriminative one. The parallel to the US is similar. People are open to latin american peoples moving in and trying to climb the ladder. They are open to them wanting to thrive and add something to the culture. What they are probably not open is that their way of life becomes diluted and less important than the one from people they welcomed to their house.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_antiquity [wikipedia.org]
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBC-9k3y1ew [youtube.com]
[3] https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/dogma [cambridge.org]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Alfred on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:11PM
then aristarchus said
LOL.
Did bradley even hold up a pike before aristarchus skewered himself on it?
It's almost like "If you come at me you are going to throw a left hook." *Throws Left Hook
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @12:04PM (10 children)
And it lost it cca 2000. There's no original culture in US right now, almost no culture at all (except aristarchus and a few others), only the Super Eternal September remained.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday May 02 2019, @12:12PM (9 children)
Pffft. Culture oozes from our every orifice. It's just not like yours or sanctioned by the intelligentsia, so you discount it. The sad fact that you're one day going to realize is that being a much more populous nation, we produce far more things of cultural significance to your nation than you do to ours.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday May 02 2019, @01:32PM (4 children)
Here, the AC is bragging because they knew the internet before it got flooded by a bunch of newbies. Not because it was any better. Exclusivity.
One thing forgotten about culture is that its primary purpose is to homogenize. To give people common reference and models for ideas and behaviors. Your office foe has contrived it so that no matter what you do, you still have to wash the coffee pot? It's checkmate. Little things turn into big misadventures? It's a three hour tour. Want to describe what happens when a zillion people permanently join your niche community? It's an eternal September.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:23PM (3 children)
No, "status signalling" has nothing whatsoever to do with it. It's about identity. Most people's identity are directly tied into the the delusion or race or a slightly better that of ethnicity. Threaten that and you are threatening a portion of the individual's identity. There is nothing more panic inducing than to be threatened with a realization that you might not be the person you are, or that the culture you most dominantly identify with is anything less than superior. Or that said culture might actually be changing or (heavens forbid) diluting due to external influences. So the fooforaw about culture isn't that one wants to signal superiority, it's that one's existence is being challenged.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday May 02 2019, @03:47PM (1 child)
We get that your identity is special because you have all these exclusive cultural experiences.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @02:15AM
Lol, what a stupid response to that GP, you really highlight your own ignorance.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:32PM
I think you're somewhat confused about what ethnicity is. Ethnicity is a cultural grouping that may or may not be from folks of a similar genetic background.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group [wikipedia.org]
Recently, ancestry.com updated my genetic information based upon increased sample sizes. It's something I did a few years ago out of curiosity and it really reinforced the reality that nation of origin is frequently a poor indicator of grouping if you're not also sharing the cultural values of the people there.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:50PM (1 child)
Counter view to culture? I think you're old enough to remember when crossing state lines could result in "culture shock". Even regions within a single state had different cultures.
Today, much of that culture has been lost. You can criss-cross the US today, and never be far from a Wal-mart, a Pilot, or a McDonald's. Unless you go looking for it, you can miss regional cooking entirely. Corn festival, lobster fest, and others have all been replaced by Beer Fest, Octoberfest, and Mardi Gras. No one has time for any of the other old festivals.
I wouldn't mind returning to the days when everyone from West by-God Virginia was a hillbilly, and proud of it. It was the Clinton clan that convinced some asswipe of a governor in W. Virginia to take down the signs. "Welcome to Wild and Wonderful West Virginia!" Now, the state is just another stop on the interstate.
You're actually an Okie, right? Don't you miss any of what has been lost in Oklahoma in the past fifty years?
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:46AM
Still does. TN is massively different than OK, culture-wise. The question "do you work" is a legitimate thing to ask folks in the south, apparently. I've been asked it multiple times and I don't look anywhere near retirement age. In OK or TX working's a given unless you're tending house or extremely disabled.
Nah, just a few specific expressions of it. That's been happening since culture was a thing though, so it's just one of those punches you gotta roll with. When I can get a Braum's sundae in TN, I may start considering your position to have merit.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @06:43PM (1 child)
In your case, much of it seems to "ooze" out of your asshole. Or, so it seems to me.
(Score: 3, Funny) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:47AM
That's my penchant for hot wings. Unavoidable side effect.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by exaeta on Thursday May 02 2019, @03:54PM (1 child)
The Government is a Bird
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @06:22PM
Right?
We have so many racist law enforcement personnel that they have been fomenting a race war for a long time. So much oppression by racist using the cover of law to excuse their immoral behavior.
We should really work on fixing up those laws. Let the racist assholes continue their existence, but demolish the systems of oppression they built.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 05 2019, @07:44PM
Where you didn't waste a nigger because an Irishman or Chinaman was cheaper and more disposable.
And keep in mind the same people preaching white superiority were importing as many foreign fuckers as they could through intermediaries in order to get the peasant white folk to blame the f'reigners for taking all their jobs rather than looking up the hill at the assholes making the money and looking back down on them.
America, fuck us harder! Metaphoric rape fetishists unite.!
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:55AM
This is why we need the White Sharia! [splcenter.org], so that we will have lots more white babies, and THOTs will leave the Chads and Sudans to have sex with pasty white incels. Well, one can dream, and even wet dream, can one not?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @07:58AM (12 children)
This is a dog-whistle submission, much like the earlier one about vaccination. Can't our Eds scope these out an reject them? Or is there some (((white))) agenda we soylentils are not privy to?
(Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:20AM (9 children)
A dog-whistle is something only one side recognizes. This is anything but that.
It's factual. Everybody seems to agree that it is happening: the left, the right, libertarians, communists, democrats, republicans, conservatives, liberals, etc.
So it can't be a dog-whistle. We may disagree on if the facts are desirable, undesirable, or unimportant.
For example, if you want to preserve culture, then this is a disaster. If you actually want multiple distinct and interesting cultures, this is a disaster. It all gets mushed together, and/or white people just get wiped out.
It is notable that white people have always been a tiny minority of the world. They habitually care about non-white people, but this is almost never reciprocated. The non-whites seem eager to dance on the graves of the whites. A current example is the rapidly deteriorating situation in South Africa, with government-sanctioned violence. (following in the footsteps of Zimbabwe)
In recent years, the left has taken to denying that non-whites can be racist. This is to counter the damning evidence that whites are the least-racist group in America today.
We see ridiculous stuff like claims that all-black groups are diverse. We see complaints demanding that the US should be less white, but none that any place should be less non-white. It's always a demand that white people cede their land, but never a demand that non-white people cede theirs. It's all one-sided.
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:43AM (1 child)
You fucking dog! Probably a female dog! Biatch! Your kind are done with, obsolete, archaic, old-fashioned, and white! All hail the White genocide! We will all be better for it, even the "white" people.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:52PM
You're the one hearing the whistle, bitch.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @02:44PM (2 children)
Just because something is a fact doesn't mean you don't have an ugly agenda when you're bringing it up.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 03 2019, @12:50AM (1 child)
True but not wanting it ever stated under any circumstances absolutely does mean you have an ugly agenda that requires its cover-up.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 03 2019, @05:50PM
And no one advocated that, nice straw man you knocked down. People are saying the article is not fit for a "news for nerds stuff that matters" discussion, and given the context of underlying racism around here (oh sorry, CULTURAL PRIDE) the article isn't some sort of free speech litmus test.
Your dissembling here is a tacit approval of the bigoted users.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:07PM (2 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:35PM (1 child)
The legislature here in WA just legalized discrimination against Whites and Asians in the name of diversifying the public sector. Granted, they don't say that they're doing that, they're just allowing public institutions to take race into consideration as one of the factors.
I'm still unclear as to how it is that this isn't going to result in lower standards for the other groups or other forms of discrimination against Whites and Asians. Also unclear is how it is that Asians were able to overcome racism enough to not need the help, but Africans and Hispanics are apparently unable to.
The whole thing is massively racist and just reinforces the notion that certain groups are inferior.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday May 05 2019, @05:03AM
If race doesn't exist, I'm wondering how they plan to determine which people get the affirmative hire. Maybe race only exists if you're white or Asian. Otherwise you're just oppressed.
[closed-captioned for the sarcasm-impaired]
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @05:17PM
yeah. white people even wrote books about it. like Time Machine, for instance.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @08:51AM
There's that term again. Someone's being told how to think.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 02 2019, @09:23AM
Only the dogs hear the dog whistle as if your usage of an anti-Semitic meme confirms.