Submitted via IRC for AnonymousLuser
Biohacker Josiah Zayner accused of being an unlicensed practitioner
Celebrity biohacker Josiah Zayner says he's under investigation for practicing medicine without a license. The onetime NASA scientist, known on social media for his DIY medical procedures, was sent a letter by the California Department of Consumer Affairs after it received a "complaint of unlicensed practice of medicine" against Zayner. While anyone can file a complaint with California's medical board, the fact it is now investigating means it considers the accusations credible.
WTF!!!! I have been accused of practicing medicine without a license because of genetic self-experimentation and showing people how to access publicly available knowledge.
The truth is... https://t.co/j9Yoy0rKPR
— Josiah Zayner (@4LOVofScience) May 14, 2019
Biohackers are individuals that perform medical experiments outside university labs and accredited companies. Zayner found fame online for a raft of stunts, including carrying out a fecal transplant and injecting his own arm with CRISPR. He's also well known for his disdain for the US Food and Drug Administration, which he accuses of blocking innovation and putting lives at risk.
[...]California's medical board has requested an interview with Zayner on June 11th, informing him he is "welcome to bring an attorney" but that it's not obligatory. It's not clear what will happen next, but practicing medicine in California can be a misdemeanour or a felony, and carries penalties of up to three years in jail and a $10,000 fine.
Additional Coverage:
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/5/19/18629771/biohacking-josiah-zayner-genetic-engineering-crispr
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/613540/celebrity-biohacker-josiah-zayner-is-under-investigation-for-practicing-medicine-without-a/
(Score: 4, Insightful) by takyon on Friday May 24 2019, @03:41AM (12 children)
Whose business is it if he experiments on his body? He'll either become a cautionary tale, or somebody else will.
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(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @03:58AM (1 child)
As soon as we know "Whose business is it..." we'll know who he's pissed off.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @02:38PM
As long as abortion of any kind, including self-induced, is questionable and subject to banning, so shall any activity involving self-treatment that involves publicity.
The powers that be wish to remain and retain the powers that people recognize as the powers that be.
People gene splicing themselves for fun and profit is not going to go down well with people in charge that can't profit from controlling it; knowledge is too powerful, and generally requires suppression if licensing or some series of elaborate complexity isn't devised to keep the commoners common.
(Score: 3, Informative) by stormwyrm on Friday May 24 2019, @04:01AM (5 children)
That doesn't look like the only thing this clown is doing. From the Vox article:
Bad enough that he makes a mockery of the scientific process, he is actively encouraging others to do as he does. "Nudge, nudge, wink, wink, don't inject the stuff I sell into yourself (though I do it, and just maybe it will work for you)," just might not fly.
Numquam ponenda est pluralitas sine necessitate.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Friday May 24 2019, @04:09AM (1 child)
If he is exaggerating the capabilities of his kits, then he should receive a strongly worded letter to tell him to cut the noise down.
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(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @05:27AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @07:29AM (2 children)
Why do you consider this a mockery of science? To me, experimental validation a cornerstone of good scientific practice, and isn't self-experimentation a lot more ethical than experimentation on other animals -- so that part I have no problem labelling as "good science". Since I don't know anything about this guy except TFS, where's the mockery coming from?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by nitehawk214 on Friday May 24 2019, @02:19PM
No published results, no theories, no tests, just random biohacking. This is not science at all, let alone "good".
And the guy makes a profit on it? Without any oversight what keeps him from outright lying, selling fake products that he does not use himself. Buyer beware only works if the buyer can be informed on what they are buying.
What makes him any different than homeopathy or any number of quack cures?
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 26 2019, @02:31AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @09:22AM
It's a California thingy. Next they'll probably charge drug addicts with practicing medicine without a license for taking illegal drugs.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @11:17AM (2 children)
Oooh, I can answer that one..those people who've made the field of medicine a business, and paid good money to get protectionist laws passed to preserve their profits.
If you want another reason why fucking around this way is a bad idea, unless this guy permanenly lives in a BSL 3-4, are you quite willing to run the risk of
(Score: 2) by takyon on Friday May 24 2019, @11:49AM (1 child)
Hello? ... We've got a faulty implant.
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(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @02:41PM
argh!, the fscking ipad I was using at the time (don't ask...just don't) appears to have brainfarted and lost about half the comment!
It should have looked something like..
(Score: 3, Touché) by SomeGuy on Friday May 24 2019, @04:00AM (4 children)
Of course, they don't want people to even consider the possibility that they might be able to fix health issues themselves, or through someone that does not cost a bazillion dollars.
Got to keep everyone going to almighty perfect doctor and spending their entire life savings and thensome on useless watered down pills that don't fix shit.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @04:05AM (3 children)
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @07:09AM (2 children)
The "treatments" designed to suck you dry before letting you die, aren't what you'll cheer for when YOU get sick.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by nitehawk214 on Friday May 24 2019, @02:22PM (1 child)
Uhh, the current system is far more advanced than 100 or 50 years ago. Yeah, its expensive, it sucks, it's inefficient, sometimes it's even bullshit; but don't pretend things were better when it was snake-oil salesmen and Kellogg's cornflake enemas.
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @07:58PM
nobody said that. you're just making shit up. just like idiots who keep voting two party even though it's completely rigged. fuck the medical establishment. gov sanctioned glorified drug dealers; while they throw people in cages for treating themselves with a fucking plant.
(Score: 1, Troll) by khallow on Friday May 24 2019, @04:18AM (3 children)
Professional licensing is a commonly overlooked cause of inequality in the US (and probably elsewhere) due to its impact on mobility. If you live in a part of the US that is relatively poor off (or where you're heavily discriminated against), you can move to a part that is doing better. There's centuries of history of this happening with many famous US residents doing this.
Professional licensing gets in the way by being a barrier to entry for anyone outside of the region where the licensing holds. It can range from minimal, such as paying fees or minor registration work all the way up to years of additional education just to do a job that one can already do. But if you or a significant other risk losing a relatively good job by moving to an area where an onerous license needs to be obtained. This provides a powerful disincentive to move, if improved employment or circumstances is countered by losing a career to licensing requirements in a new state.
Here, I get why people could be concerned about medical ethics and such. I don't share those concerns because I think we're killing more people than we save with the current level of medical ethics. There has to be a balance between visible medical risk and the invisible opportunity costs of saving future lives. I think present day medical ethics and regulation has gone way over that border, particularly since it's created huge incentives for large scale medical fraud (not even doing its job in the first place).
(Score: 1) by nitehawk214 on Friday May 24 2019, @02:27PM (2 children)
I am not sure I follow. Having too high an ethical standard creates incentive for medial fraud?
I suppose there is a lot of medial fraud going around...
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday May 24 2019, @06:07PM
Khallow is in favor of a libertariantard "free market" for backhoes and quack medicine. The irony is this:
khallow's opinion on ethics? That's almost as good as this bio-hacker having opinions on medicine! Ha! Good one, khallow! Oh, my, I can't stop Laughing! Ha! Ha ha!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday May 24 2019, @11:52PM
Well, I guess there's always some incentive no matter what the standards are. But it can greatly increase the incentives, for example, if the standards are so high, that they have to be ignored in order for the activity to happen.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @04:35AM (2 children)
...will be a crime of practicing unlicensed programming.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Friday May 24 2019, @05:00AM
This will happen. Obviously we can't let anyone outside of OpenAI work on creating a "strong" artificial intelligence. Anyone who attempts it will get the SWAT treatment.
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(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @08:02PM
yep. they're already talking about fining companies for security/privacy failures. eventually they will make you beg for permission to write code just like sheople beg permission to get married, divorced, travel, etc. can you blame the masters? morons who think they are free act like total slaves and register their businesses and willingly fund the enemies of the country/free people anywehre. act like a slave and they will treat you like one.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @09:46AM
(Score: 2) by Bot on Friday May 24 2019, @11:44AM (2 children)
No, he should not be able to sell DIY kits because the buyer is NOT DOING IT HIMSELF.
Other than that, whatever he does with own body is more ethical than whatever medicine does with the bodies of others so the judge should stay the fuck away. The line between a res publica and a res privata is clearly crossed.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @11:51AM (1 child)
We shouldn't sell hammers or drills either.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Alfred on Friday May 24 2019, @02:01PM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 24 2019, @07:45PM (1 child)
Technically true, I suppose, having put his hat down to stay long enough on a 2-yr postdoc. I suppose forever now that will be attached to his name to puff up his resume and anything he does.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday May 25 2019, @12:12AM