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posted by Fnord666 on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:01AM   Printer-friendly
from the boeing-boeing-gone dept.

CBC is reporting that Boeing's CEO is gone. While offially he resigned, there's little doubt he had much say in the matter.

Boeing's chief executive officer has been forced out by the board of directors amid continuing problems with the company's troubled Max 737 aircraft.

The Chicago manufacturer said Monday that Dennis Muilenburg is stepping down immediately. Board chairman David Calhoun will take over as CEO on Jan. 13.

There's the usual platitudes about believing in the MAX8 and the company's future under "great new leadership ", but what else could they say?

See also: Boeing fires CEO after disastrous year with 737 MAX


Original Submission

Related Stories

Promised Production Halt of Boeing 737 Max 8 Begins; Follow-On Effects Already Under Way 7 comments

Boeing's promised 737 Max production halt begins:

The airline manufacturer had announced last month it would stop making the troubled craft at least until it was no longer grounded, but hadn't set a date. However the line has officially stopped producing planes while Boeing officials wait for regulators to give it the OK to fly again.

[...] The latest update estimated the grounding would last through at least mid-2020, Boeing said in a statement Tuesday.

Boeing will reassign 3,000 workers after 737 MAX production halt

Boeing Co said it will reassign 3,000 workers to other jobs as it halts production of the grounded best-selling 737 MAX jet in mid-January.

The announcement came after American Airlines Group Inc and Mexico's Aeromexico disclosed they were the latest carriers to reach settlements with Boeing over losses resulting from the grounding of the 737 MAX aircraft.

Neither airline disclosed the compensation. A number of airlines have struck confidential settlements with Boeing in recent weeks. Boeing said it does not comment on discussions with airlines.

Boeing's biggest supplier lays off 2,800 workers because of 737 Max production suspension:

Spirit AeroSystems (SPR), which makes fuselages for the Max as well as other items for Boeing, announced Friday that it is furloughing approximately 2,800 workers. Shares of the Wichita, Kansas-based company fell more than 1% in trading.
"The difficult decision announced today is a necessary step given the uncertainty related to both the timing for resuming 737 Max production and the overall production levels that can be expected following the production suspension," Spirit AeroSystems CEO Tom Gentile said in a press release.

Boeing wants to resume 737 Max production months before regulators sign off on the planes:

DoJ Criminal Investigation: Boeing Test Pilot Lawyers Up, Takes the 5th 26 comments

I know, yet another Boeing story. But it's like herpes — the gift that keeps on giving.

The same day that Boeing CEO Muilenburg crashed and burned as Boeing CEO, the criminal investigation into Boeing heated up, with Boeing's test pilot hiring criminal lawyers and refusing to turn over documents to the Department of Justice under the 5th amendment, saying in effect that turning them over "may tend to incriminate him."

The embattled US aircraft maker Boeing has reportedly sent US regulators "troubling communications" related to the development of the 737 MAX – on the same day that the CEO, Dennis Muilenburg, was forced to step aside.

According to a senior Boeing executive, the documents include new messages from Mark Forkner, a senior company test pilot who complained of "egregious" erratic behavior in flight simulator tests of Boeing's MCAS anti-stall system, and referred to "Jedi mind tricks" to persuade regulators to approve the plane.

The executive, speaking on condition of anonymity, told the Seattle Times that the Forkner communications contain the same kind of "trash talking" about Federal Aviation Authority (FAA) regulators as the earlier messages released in October.

So what would make Forkner, the test pilot, lawyer up?

Forkner, meanwhile, has reportedly hired his own criminal defense lawyers and invoked his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination to avoid turning over records to the Department of Justice, which has opened a criminal inquiry into the company's handling of the 737 Max's development.

It was Forkner who requested that information about MCAS be omitted from flight manuals and pilot training, rendering the pilots of both the doomed Lion Air and Ethiopian flights helpless when the system kicked in, pushing the plane's nose down repeatedly until they ultimately lost control.

But the timing of the latest information release is likely to increase anger surrounding Boeing's handling of the crisis, even as a new CEO, David Calhoun, takes the reins early next year.

[Ed Note - Emphasis added by submitter]

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  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:18AM (11 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:18AM (#935742)

    How about " sorry for killing all those Ethiopians"

    • (Score: 2) by takyon on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:22AM

      by takyon (881) <takyonNO@SPAMsoylentnews.org> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:22AM (#935745) Journal

      RIP in peace

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    • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:44AM (9 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:44AM (#935754)

      How about "RTFM you 2nd rate sand jockey pilots!"

      • (Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:07AM (8 children)

        by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:07AM (#935769) Journal
        It wasn't in the manual.
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        • (Score: 3, Insightful) by requerdanos on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:53AM (1 child)

          by requerdanos (5997) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:53AM (#935783) Journal

          It wasn't in the manual.

          That rarely slows the RTFM people down in the slightest.

        • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @05:59AM (5 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @05:59AM (#935812)

          You should double-check your Runaway Stabilizer Trim checklist and memory items, then.

          • (Score: 2) by sjames on Tuesday December 24 2019, @10:32AM (4 children)

            by sjames (2882) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @10:32AM (#935851) Journal

            Nothing there had any suggestions for what to do if it was physically impossible to turn the trim wheels without the electric motors (that you just turned off as per the runaway trim checklist).

            • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:53PM (3 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:53PM (#935922)

              Then you do the memory item for unable to manually trim, which is to release elevator pressure on the jackscrew and have both pilots turn the wheel with both hands on their handles while the stick relaxes. Now I understand that the roller coaster maneuver is totally counter-intuitive, but to claim that it isn't in the manual or trained for is just wrong. Besides, MCAS doesn't provide continual input, and the one of the planes didn't even attempt to correct the trim with the thumb switches before hitting the cutoff, which is also in the directions given by Boeing for the MCAS.

              • (Score: 2) by sjames on Tuesday December 24 2019, @10:32PM (2 children)

                by sjames (2882) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @10:32PM (#935928) Journal

                Good luck with that manouver at 4000 feet departing an airport.

                • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 25 2019, @08:52AM (1 child)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 25 2019, @08:52AM (#935995)

                  I have no problem saying a real and living pilot in that stressful situation may be unable to recall the memory items, documentation, and training. I don't have a problem saying those actions and maneuvers may be impossible to successfully execute in that situation even if they were properly recalled and attempted. But both of those are completely different than the claim it wasn't in the checklists, manuals, and training.

                  • (Score: 2) by sjames on Thursday December 26 2019, @07:56PM

                    by sjames (2882) on Thursday December 26 2019, @07:56PM (#936348) Journal

                    Arguably, if the checklist suggests clicking your heels three times and saying "there's no place like home", it's not really much of a checklist.

                    More to the point, IIRC the advice to try the roller coaster maneuver was later rescinded, so after that, there literally wasn't anything.

                    I'll leave for another day the question of which is worse, a known probably useless suggestion or nothing at all.

                    It might have been useful if the manual actually outlined MCAS and it's possible role in runaway trim.

                    Of course, the best answer would have been to provide a way to disable just MCAS and leave electric trim on, but that would have meant documenting the existence of MCAS.

                    But granted, there was technically a procedure, it just wasn't useful in practice.

  • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:28AM (15 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @02:28AM (#935748)

    Earlier generation 737s are found to have structural deficiency, at the wing joints of all places.

    Boeing went to gutter during this clown's reign. You would think Boeing is a Chinese outfit.

    Firing this guy is not enough. Good chunk of the board went along with him, and the guy replacing him is one of them.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by barbara hudson on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:20AM (6 children)

      by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:20AM (#935776) Journal
      The 787, Boeing wanted to be far less a manufacturer and more a systems integrator. Outsourcing as much as possible, as cheaply as possible. It's going to take a decade to undo all the bad decisions and sucky processes that they put in place, and rebuild the expertise they've lost.

      The real question is, can they recover? The rest of the world isn't standing still waiting for them to catch up. We saw this with Chrysler and multiple mergers, it's going to be ugly for the next decade no matter how you slice it.

      In the end they may just break up into their component industries - defence, space, civil aviation. And let the vulture capitalists do their thing on the parts that can't stand on their own.

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      SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:36AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:36AM (#935833)

        Well they did by "firing" the robotic system they had for riveting body panels. They're back to doing it by hand now...

        However, their wing building system seems to work OK.

        737 had bigger problems in the 80's with an edge case that could cause the rudder to quickly shift full on OPPOSITE LOCK. Took awhile for the problem to be discovered (after a few crashes), and for the engineers (not the MBAs) who insisted that the edge case couldn't happen actually was happening to believe it, and they grudgingly changed the rudder actuators...

      • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Tuesday December 24 2019, @05:50PM (4 children)

        by Grishnakh (2831) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @05:50PM (#935901)

        >The real question is, can they recover? The rest of the world isn't standing still waiting for them to catch up. We saw this with Chrysler and multiple mergers, it's going to be ugly for the next decade no matter how you slice it.

        There's a big difference here, however. In the auto industry, there are a a LOT of competing companies. If you don't like Chrysler or its other brands, you can buy a Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, Mazda, Subaru, VW/Audi, Volvo, BMW, Mercedes, etc. There's no shortage of competitors, and there's no shortage of production capacity either: you're not going to be kept waiting because you chose a Toyota instead of a Dodge.

        This just isn't true of large commercial aircraft. There's only 2 competitors currently, and they both have a gigantic production backlog. If you order a plane right now, you're looking at 5-10 *years*(!!) to get it, from what I've read.

        No, the world isn't standing still: the Chinese are building up their main aircraft maker to make planes in this class, but it may be difficult to get non-China airlines and customers to trust them, and they still don't have their plane ready yet. Japan has a joint venture going on between Mitsubishi and Toyota and Subaru to build a new regional jet, but this isn't big enough to compete against the 737MAX, let alone anything larger; assuming this venture is successful, it'll still be quite some time before they're ready to compete with larger jets. I'm kinda surprised the Russians haven't tried competing here: they still have some companies there that know how to build large jets, left over from the cold war days, and they probably aren't doing anything terribly profitable right now.

        • (Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:38PM (3 children)

          by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:38PM (#935907) Journal
          Airbus already manufactures airplanes in the USA, and has seen a jump in orders. Maybe they'll open up other plants in the USA to take advantage of the labour surplus from idled Boeing workers. Just announcing that would cause an increase in 737 cancellations. Long term, "if it's Boeing, it ain't going." Recovery from this will take a decade.
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          • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Tuesday December 24 2019, @11:05PM (2 children)

            by Grishnakh (2831) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @11:05PM (#935938)

            Yes, but spinning up a new aircraft plant isn't that easy. Just look at what Boeing went through with their Dreamliner plant in SC. But yeah, they could try poaching Boeing employees to get it jump-started; it would be really funny to see them do this and succeed. Just look at all the success foreign automakers have had in opening up auto plants in the US, using US workers, and outcompeting domestic automakers, making far better-quality products here than our own shittily-managed companies could.

            • (Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Wednesday December 25 2019, @12:55AM (1 child)

              by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Wednesday December 25 2019, @12:55AM (#935953) Journal
              Once the criminal investigation into Boeing gains steam (the test flight engineer who said leave out the mcas problems from the flight manuals just lawyered up and took the 5th), and the inevitable SEC investigation into whether Boeing manipulated its stock price by not disclosing material information to investors, and the shareholders lawsuits get done, Boeing may need to unload a few factories on the cheap to raise capital.
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              • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Wednesday December 25 2019, @02:37AM

                by Grishnakh (2831) on Wednesday December 25 2019, @02:37AM (#935964)

                Sounds good to me! I'm sure they'll be much better used by Airbus than by our own aircraft maker.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:23AM (7 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:23AM (#935778)

      This kind of thing will happen when one overlooks details.

      Getting a quick signoff followed by rounds of executive bonuses amidst layoffs of the workforce often end this way.

      It is almost impossible to recover the lost skills the Craftsmen and engineers acquired constructing the company's earlier products.

      It takes at least twenty years to season an engineer or skilled Craftsman, only a few minutes to lay one off.

      • (Score: 4, Informative) by legont on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:07AM

        by legont (4179) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:07AM (#935813)

        Yes, right, but it is not only skills that is hard to get back. This kind of work needs dedication. One needs at least a few engineers who are able to tell the CEO to fuck off. This is only achievable with a life time employment policies. "Resources" can't make safe airplanes (as well as safe software). CEO is replaceable, a good engineer is not.

        --
        "Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
      • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:09AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:09AM (#935815)

        Like my father. He was bought out and the company hired two people with money left over for the same amount. Less than a year later, they were negotiating the non-compete in his buyout contract. Things had gone to crap so bad without him and he left with so much institutional knowledge, they offered to pay him almost 3 times his FTE rate to come in as a consultant. Luckily he is also smart enough to not give them all his secrets, so they keep having to pay him to come back.

      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:59AM (4 children)

        by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday December 24 2019, @06:59AM (#935826) Journal

        This kind of thing will happen when one overlooks details

        I feel very uneasy when "robust engineering practices" are filed under "details".
        Be it only because the nature has this bad habit of keeping its laws immutable, disregarding the "genius" of MBA-think.

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/@ProfSteveKeen https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
        • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:10AM (3 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:10AM (#935828)

          I've told this story before, but I've had PHBs push out designs that we all knew would fail a certain percentage of the time because they did the math and the chance of failure, according to our estimates, was so low that the savings minus insurance cost was cheaper than doing a future-proof design.

          • (Score: 4, Interesting) by c0lo on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:31AM

            by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:31AM (#935832) Journal

            Meh, PHBs are fucked enough to think nobody can contradict them (it's a job selection criteria, without the sociopathic qualities they don't get to the PHB status).
            Too bad others have to suffer/die to prove them wrong.

            --
            https://www.youtube.com/@ProfSteveKeen https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
          • (Score: 3, Informative) by barbara hudson on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:10PM (1 child)

            by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:10PM (#935875) Journal
            Ford Pinto gas tank. Calculated it was cheaper to pay out insurance claims than put in a shield to protect the tank from a bolt head puncturing the tank in a collision. Which was true until juries heard about this callous calculation and really boosted wrongful death and injury awards. Punitive and moral damages indeed .
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            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:57PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:57PM (#935923)

              Thankfully, the WCS in our case is that the product prematurely fails and releases some magic smoke. I'm sure the peanut counters factored in the chance of them buying a replacement for the failed unit as well.

  • (Score: 5, Informative) by stretch611 on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:22AM (3 children)

    by stretch611 (6199) on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:22AM (#935830)

    After nearly destroying the company, (and while unlikely, it is still a possible scenario,) he gets to walk away with a $14 million severance package. Additionally, it is possible, that he can get $40 million once everything is done.

    Yet, at the same time, the 737 max line will be stopped starting in January until it is re-certified. Of course, Boeing is promising to keep people on and transfer them to other aircraft assembly lines, but don't hold your breath.

    While the rest of the board is still there making their millions, and promoting a different board member to the CEO position. Let's face it, they are just as guilty as he is. I am sure most, if not all were there when everything went to sh!t, and were part of the decision making process as well.

    Boeing offshored its engineering for $9/hour. [bloomberg.com] Also, here [forbes.com] and here [techworm.net].

    And, no, this is not just Boeing... it is literally everywhere... in Boards across the US... and it has spread internationally as well.

    Rabin, the former software engineer, recalled one manager saying at an all-hands meeting that Boeing didn’t need senior engineers because its products were mature. “I was shocked that in a room full of a couple hundred mostly senior engineers we were being told that we weren’t needed,” said Rabin, who was laid off in 2015.
    ...
    Boeing has also expanded a design center in Moscow. At a meeting with a chief 787 engineer in 2008, one staffer complained about sending drawings back to a team in Russia 18 times before they understood that the smoke detectors needed to be connected to the electrical system, said Cynthia Cole, a former Boeing engineer who headed the engineers’ union from 2006 to 2010.

    Of course ask any corporate board and they all say they pay their CEO's top dollar and give them wonderful bailout packages in order to retain the top talent. Yet it is obvious that they are not getting talented people at all. The ones that they have (the engineers and other non-board employees) are the ones with talent, yet they are undercut in pay and let go on a whim. What is really happening, is that the CEO of company A sits on the board of Company B; The CEO of company B sits on the board of Company A... all forming a wonderful circle jerk of Scrooge Mc Duck (or Montgomery Burns if you prefer) style money fights.

    And no, this is not just Boeing... It is happening at the vast majority of corporate boards across the US and has even spread internationally.

    --
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    • (Score: 5, Touché) by c0lo on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:36AM (2 children)

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday December 24 2019, @07:36AM (#935834) Journal

      Of course ask any corporate board and they all say they pay their CEO's top dollar and give them wonderful bailout packages in order to retain the top talent. Yet it is obvious that they are not getting talented people at all.

      Your fault for not understanding the MBA lingo.
      "Top talent" means "talent at the top" not "most talented people in every critical position".

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/@ProfSteveKeen https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:14PM (1 child)

        by barbara hudson (6443) <barbara.Jane.hudson@icloud.com> on Tuesday December 24 2019, @03:14PM (#935876) Journal
        "Talent at the top" - how come in retrospect it usually means nothing more than "good hair"?
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        SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 25 2019, @12:30AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 25 2019, @12:30AM (#935946)

          And good hand-shake skills.

          Corporate helicopter awaits to take them to their private jet. All funded through our tax dollars. Awarded by our Congressmen.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:33PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 24 2019, @09:33PM (#935920)

    the 787 max would probably have been sound.
    problem is that nothing is made by not humans.
    so for countries that need transport not everything can just be a plane.
    sure we have democrazy ... but we also have engineers and to some degree scientists.

    whilst scientist just say (or should say) what is possible, engineers have to live with the outcome.

    and i am not saying it is wrong or right, since i am neither, but the 787 max8 cannot exist because (some of) the world is not yet ready for it. and all engineers agree.
    maybe better asphalt and irrigation should be the "max 8" for ethiopiastan and static and bridge building for indonistan?
    putting the lives and future of a whole country in some mack-rick idiot betting (correctly but wrong) on jet-engines only, needs to claw on each engineers soul providing the means ...? yes? if no, then let's see them build it themselfs ... nothing magic about it, but it might require good roads, food and the possibility to manufacture and transport parts on the ground first?

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