Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

posted by martyb on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:33AM   Printer-friendly
from the context-for-con's-text dept.

Internet Archive Adds "Context" with Warnings

The Internet Archive is warning users about debunked 'zombie' coronavirus misinformation

The Internet Archive is alerting users when they've clicked on some stories that were debunked or taken down on the live web, following reports that people were spreading false coronavirus information through its Wayback Machine.

As NBC reporter Brandy Zadrozny noted on Twitter, the site includes a bright banner on one popular Medium post that was removed as misinformation. Its video archive also creates friction by making users log in to see some videos containing false information, like a reposted version of the conspiracy documentary Plandemic. These videos also include critical comments from Wayback Machine director Mark Graham who described the warnings to Zadrozny as an example of the "importance and value of context in archiving."

What Critical Thinking? Wayback Machine is Now Complicit in Big Tech Censorship

What critical thinking? Wayback Machine is now complicit in Big Tech censorship:

The statements, views and opinions expressed in this column are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of RT.


Original Submission 1, Original Submission 2

This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(1)
  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:46AM (7 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:46AM (#999160)

    The statements, views and opinions expressed in this column are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of RT.

    If I wanted to know what Vladimir Putin's opinion/view I'd ask him directly instead of reading his pet news site.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:48PM (6 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:48PM (#999346)

      There are many reasons the USSR collapsed, but one thing that played a major role in it was soft power from America.

      Soft power of course is just making people "like" your ideas, views, culture, or whatever else. You can win wars without a single bullet being fired. And it doesn't have to be anything especially nefarious. For instance a Russian I have immense respect for at one point teared up talking about... Donald Duck. A grown man of no especial emotional disposition. Why? Under the government in the USSR media, news, information, and politics in general had been tightly controlled. This [johndclare.net] is a great list of jokes genuinely from the era that were somewhat commonly told, in private. One at least somewhat related to what we're talking about:

      This is Armenian Radio; our listeners asked us: “When Nixon visited Moscow, he and Khrushchev ran around the Kremlin in a race. Nixon came the first. How should our media report on that?”

      We’re answering: “The report should be as follows: ‘In the international running competition the General Secretary of the Communist Party took the honorable second place.’ Mister Nixon came in one before last.”

      The reason Donald Duck was so important to him, and to many others, is because of what it represented. As he said, "Everybody was watching Donald Duck." It represented freedom from what had been decades of increasing control of media, discourse, and politics in general. Of course you probably see where I am going with this. RT is hardly Putin's news or whatever. It's just news. The only thing is that it doesn't play ball with our media manipulation.

      For instance when a protester against Maduro set one of the aid trucks coming into Venezuela on fire, our media ran with the story that Maduro had attacked the convoy and numerous politicians used this to try to justify an more 'direct action' towards the country. Within 24 hours of the event, RT ran a story [rt.com] with video showing it was likely a protester who set the convoy on fire. A couple of weeks later, after it became clear the public wasn't down with an invasion, the US media finally and very briefly ran a handful of articles such as this one [nytimes.com] saying little more than what RT had weeks prior.

      That is the reason for the huge push against RT by the US establishment. They cover stories that our media will not. Including ones such as this. Archive.org starting to play ball with media manipulation is the complete antithesis of everything it stood for. They will imminently be stepping up to full on censorship in relatively short order. In my opinion we are increasingly playing out a sort of role reversal of the USSR and it's simply fascinating. The regularity with which the 'bad guy propaganda' ends up being the more accurate source of information should indicate where the propaganda is coming from.

      • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:18PM (5 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:18PM (#999377)

        RT is *funded* by the Russian government.

        Putin controls the Russian government.

        Q.E.D.

        There's no wiggle room there tovarisch.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:49PM (2 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:49PM (#999388)

          That is the reason for the huge push against RT by the US establishment. They cover stories that our media will not.

          The Russian-funded RT is just as important, if not more important, than the US-funded Voice of America.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:47PM (1 child)

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:47PM (#999404)

            The Russian-funded RT is just as important, if not more important, than the US-funded Voice of America.

            Just as (or more) important For the Russian government (i.e., Valdimir Putin) it absolutely is. Just as VOA is for the US government

            Comparing RT to Voice of America (which is *explicitly* a propaganda outlet for the US government) proves my point pretty completely.

            Don't try to make the argument that RT is *anything but* an integral part of Putin's propaganda machine. Just as Voice of America is an integral part of the US' propaganda machine.

            I don't trust VOA either.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:53PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:53PM (#999419)

              That is the reason for the huge push against RT by the US establishment. They cover stories that our media will not.

              They are biased and always looking for ways to embarrass the West, but RT publishes uncomfortable truths and unpopular opinions. That is why they are worth paying some attention to.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @04:42AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @04:42AM (#999513)

          Look into what news sites are funded by the Russian Direct Investment Fund [archive.is] after the money has made its way through Israel, Britain, and the banksters.

          Hint: they're the ones screaming most loudly that everyone else is a Russian troll.

        • (Score: 0, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @05:08AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @05:08AM (#999521)

          This argument requires substantial cognitive dissonance to even put forward. The exact same argument you're making there would suggest NPR is little more than Trump's opinions/views, BBC little more than Boris Johnson's opinions/views, and so on. Government funding of media does not imply absolute governmental control of said media. And similarly, "independence" of funding does not imply independence of thought. For instance the New York Times has increasingly overtly become a political tool for the DNC, though they have (to my knowledge) no formal ties or funding from such.

          Beyond the logic here, you can also see this even in how things are covered. Before the media in the US became so politicized it was a normal thing for 'mutually exclusive' coverage on topics. An example today would be on the lockdowns. In the past you would have seen coverage both for and against lockdowns which is reflective of society in general. On RT you can find exactly that with numerous articles with views and arguments for both remaining in (if not strengthening) lockdowns, as well as views and arguments for the exact opposite. By contrast in the US media the media has colluded to not only focus exclusively on the side of the lockdowns, but to actively condemn and demonize any opposition to such. On this note the US media is increasingly even trying to create some narrative where if you oppose the lockdowns you must be some sort of a secret Russian troll or directly controlled by them. Let's just ignore the skyrocketing rates of deaths of despair [abc7news.com] --- no the only reason somebody might oppose the lockdown is because.. Putin. So again I'd ask again, where's the propaganda coming from?

  • (Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:52AM (7 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:52AM (#999161)

    So please just write: "We restrict this because this may harm money flow" instead of trying to excuse with "verified facts". If a big money is in game, there are no "verified facts" because every verification authority can be bribed, and that's what we get if we put the information exchange network under control of corporations.
    Let's call it "American national censorship". They certainly do not censor blatant lies about Kim Ir Sen in American articles. They do not censor the information about "women rights" which are false by the law of many African countries. They censor what causes problems to the American economy.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:26PM (5 children)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:26PM (#999234) Journal

      "American national censorship".

      Labeling something as the bullshit it is is not censorship.

      • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:37PM (2 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:37PM (#999241)

        Because you are.
        If Soylent starts doing it however, your squeals will be EPIC. Because naturally, you are a hypocrite as well.

        • (Score: 4, Touché) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:41PM (1 child)

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:41PM (#999245) Journal

          Let's label you Bullshit, then

          You just did. Well, you attempted to, at least....

          Notice how my post is still there and has not been censored.

          • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:47PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:47PM (#999251)

            Notice how my post is still there and has not been censored.

            Precisely. However, you are all for denying others the right you so much enjoy. Thanks for proving the "hypocrite" label, Mr. Bullshit.

      • (Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:25PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:25PM (#999315)

        stfu, you dumb partisan bitch.

      • (Score: -1, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @09:22AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @09:22AM (#999552)

        Ok Boomer.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:58PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:58PM (#999259)
  • (Score: 2, Redundant) by progo on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:30PM (2 children)

    by progo (6356) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:30PM (#999177) Homepage

    In a few years it will be "this item was removed because it contains harmful information."

    A few years after that, "404" -- it was never archived. Your inbound link is a problem that must be rectified.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:00PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:00PM (#999189)

      A few years after that again: "You dweebs though corporate America was Liberal?! Heh! Anyway no LGBT content here; this is a family archive site."

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:33PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:33PM (#999322)

        This is the most interesting thing about this all. I think if anybody takes even a remotely impartial look at the actions and behaviors of companies like Google, who they are is rapidly revealed. And that's not sunshine and rainbows. They're just using people as useful idiots. The interesting part of this being that I think even the people being used probably, at some level, understand they're being used but they so *desperately* want the rhetoric to be true that they just turn off their brains.

        Of course the real truth is that corporate America is neither liberal or conservative. They're above politics. It's simply as a tool to strengthen their position, increase their revenues, and stabilize their workforce. Whichever group is easier to exploit to obtain their own personal ends, is the facade they'll put forward.

  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:38PM (1 child)

    by SomeGuy (5632) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:38PM (#999179)

    So, have they flagged those videos with that orange idiot babbling about Lysol injections? How well will that work out for them?

    With the insane amount of polarization on the issue, people are going to demand almost every story related to Covid-19 to be marked as "disinformation".

    "Let's reopen the country!" [Disinformation - People will dahie!]
    "Let's all stay home forever!" [Disinformation - The eeeeekonomey will be be destroyed!]
    "Let's be smart about this and use appropriate caution" [Disinformation - There are no smarts!]

    Anything originating from Twitter and Facebook should automatically be flagged as disinformation. Probably Soylentnews too, but those are all already all at -1 Troll. :P

    • (Score: 4, Informative) by bart on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:16PM

      by bart (2844) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:16PM (#999196)

      This already happened in the Netherlands. Respected social geographer and retired professor in statistics Maurice de Hond has been blogging and youtubing about what he finds wrong about the lockdown measures. Some idiot managed to take down his Youtube posting (since reinstated minus 40000 views or so) because de Hond disagrees with some/most of the official measures.

      On http://maurice.nl [maurice.nl] you can find his thinking (in Dutch unfortunately). In short he shows strong arguments that infections _outside_ pretty much do not happen, so the whole 1.5 meter 'new normal' is completely useless outside. On the other hand, crowds inside do spread the virus via aerosols, so he's strongly in favor of masks in crowded confined spaces. He also emphasizes that for people under 40 the probability of dying when infected is 1/40000, and even when you're 70 it's only 1/80.

  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Mojibake Tengu on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:51PM (15 children)

    by Mojibake Tengu (8598) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:51PM (#999181) Journal

    I already noticed what's happening on Wayback, too often to slip ignored as a technical glitch:

    When a politically controversial site[1] gets destroyed, often by just removing its database backend while keeping a domain husk still visible, Wayback's response is culling the most informative pages off from all timeline, leaving only worthless junk accessible. However, leaving the same-time junk stuff on is what reveals the true intent: it was the erased info what was actually targeted.

    Question is, who operates the Wayback Machine thusly, but I call this is a demolition of history, not a preservation. And it stinks like a plan.
    I am glad someone else noticed this behavior too, that makes me looking less paranoid and more realistic.

    [1] Recent victim example is David Icke's website

    --
    Respect Authorities. Know your social status. Woke responsibly.
    • (Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:04PM (10 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:04PM (#999191)

      Recent victim example is David Icke's website

      If Nazis want their freeze peaches they can make their own archives. And watch them get ddosed :).

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Mojibake Tengu on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:17PM (3 children)

        by Mojibake Tengu (8598) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:17PM (#999231) Journal

        If a political concept of free speech is genuinely honest and candid, and not just some partisan propaganda stunt trick, then the free speech must be granted to everyone, even to uninformed, stupid, disoriented or even adversaries.

        Otherwise, it is not free speech but a false distraction of mind.

        --
        Respect Authorities. Know your social status. Woke responsibly.
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:46PM (2 children)

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:46PM (#999250) Journal

          Great, I'm glad we're in agreement that Internet Archive's right to freely speak about dangerous misinformation must be protected.

          'Cause it almost sounds like people think those labels they are applying should be censored!

          • (Score: 2) by Mojibake Tengu on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:39PM (1 child)

            by Mojibake Tengu (8598) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:39PM (#999366) Journal

            For preserving Internet history, I am pretty sure the Internet Archive was supposed to be a technical tool, not a political one.

            --
            Respect Authorities. Know your social status. Woke responsibly.
            • (Score: 4, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:54PM

              by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:54PM (#999370) Journal

              They're documenting the history of when those fraudulent claims were removed the from site they no longer exist on.

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:44PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:44PM (#999247)

        And why would anyone sane not be against such "progress"?
        Do explain, oh anonymous DDOS proponent.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:52PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:52PM (#999278)

        What about people who want to study these things? Burning books has never worked, allowing ideologies to be openly examined and debated in the light of day always works.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:51PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:51PM (#999417)

          Burning books has never worked, allowing ideologies to be openly examined and debated in the light of day always works.

          Which "books are being burned" (yes, I recognize you're using that term metaphorically)?

          If I have a physical book and make notes on the inside cover, am I "burning the book?"

          That's the metaphor. You're either too stupid to recognize it or are attempting to spread disinformation.*

          *See what I did there?

      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:28PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:28PM (#999317)

        You're the "nazi", Bolshevik Jew's idiot.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @05:44AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @05:44AM (#999526)

        So psychotic conspiracy theorists are now Nazi's as well? Will the increasing number of people to whom this wondrous term can be applied never cease?

        • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @06:03AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @06:03AM (#999530)

          Everyone I don't like is a Nazi. It's a long list and it keeps growing.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by meustrus on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:26PM (2 children)

      by meustrus (4961) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:26PM (#999233)

      I dunno, every time I've tried to find any significant amount of dynamic content from something like a web forum, it's not there. I can't think of a political reason for any of those sites. I always just assumed they couldn't possibly have the storage space to actually archive the entire literal internet.

      FWIW, the missing content linked back to the original site, so it's possible that if you look at recent backups, you can click links and not realize you've left the archive. It isn't until the original content is deleted that those links start failing.

      --
      If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:19PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:19PM (#999378)

        The entire Internet only takes 42Gb once you remove all the pr0n.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:54PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:54PM (#999420)

          The entire Internet only takes 42Gb once you remove all the pr0n.

          Thanks! This [xkcd.com] makes a *lot* more sense now!

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:19PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @10:19PM (#999400)
  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by c0lo on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:52PM (22 children)

    by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday May 26 2020, @12:52PM (#999182) Journal

    The "context" contains factual information, marked as being a Wayback Machine addition, nothing from what was archived is missing.
    So... why are those idiots protesting?

    --
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:46PM (11 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:46PM (#999209)

      Other than banner popups being undesirable in every situation (those annoying cookie notices, newsletter spam, paywall screeching), what disturbs me is the login requirement. I have never considered an archive.org account, what purpose do they serve other than uploading content (and now to "create friction")?

      • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:27PM

        by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:27PM (#999235) Journal

        Good point! Not enough for me to get all inflamed, but a good point nevertheless.

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 3, Funny) by fyngyrz on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:40PM (9 children)

        by fyngyrz (6567) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:40PM (#999325) Journal

        I have never considered an archive.org account, what purpose do they serve

        Well, sounds like you have no use for them at all, so why worry about them putting banners/popups/whatever on the content they archive?

        For instance, I hear that Facebook spams the hell out of the products people who use it... makes no difference to me, I never go there.

        --
        Hypocrisy is the Vaseline of political intercourse.

        • (Score: 2) by takyon on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:41PM (8 children)

          by takyon (881) <reversethis-{gro ... s} {ta} {noykat}> on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:41PM (#999344) Journal

          Previously, you only needed an archive.org account to upload files or leave reviews (comments). You didn't need an account to watch a video.

          --
          [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
          • (Score: 3, Insightful) by fyngyrz on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:28PM (7 children)

            by fyngyrz (6567) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:28PM (#999363) Journal

            Some of this shite you should probably have to pass both a critical thinking test and achieve a 110+ score on a dynamic IQ test before viewing.

            The quality of general Internet stuff — and in many case, that translates literally to the factual accuracy of it — is amazingly low.

            Seems to me like requiring an account is a pretty low bar.

            They're not a government operation; they have no obligation to have a particular door policy as far as I know.

            --
            Junk - stuff we throw away. Stuff - junk we keep.

            • (Score: 2) by takyon on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:39PM (6 children)

              by takyon (881) <reversethis-{gro ... s} {ta} {noykat}> on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:39PM (#999365) Journal

              And I have no obligation to donate [archive.org] to an archive that is adding unnecessary "friction" to suppress political content.

              --
              [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
              • (Score: 3, Insightful) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:15PM (2 children)

                by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:15PM (#999375)

                It is a bit sad that you consider deliberate misinformation to be "political content", and the effort to show it for what it really is to be "suppression".

                • (Score: 2) by takyon on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:38PM (1 child)

                  by takyon (881) <reversethis-{gro ... s} {ta} {noykat}> on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:38PM (#999382) Journal

                  It is a bit sad that you consider deliberate misinformation to be "political content"

                  People can decide for themselves whether or not "Plandemic" is deliberate misinformation.

                  It's just the beginning. Now that IA has opened the door, there will be a flood of complaints about lots of other content until more stuff gets gated away or deleted.

                  and the effort to show it for what it really is to be "suppression".

                  I didn't mention the banner, which is a separate thing. DeathMonkey says it's extra information. Fair enough.

                  Requiring a login to view political content is merely a nuisance designed to add "friction" as The Verge notes. The quarantined content will simply be viewed less often as a result. It's a "feature" that doesn't improve the Internet Archive experience.

                  --
                  [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
                  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:54PM

                    by PartTimeZombie (4827) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @09:54PM (#999392)

                    Plandemic is deliberate misinformation. The people who make it are lying liars, whose trousers are currently combusting.

                    The Internet Archive is ensuring that people who might want to view the video from their site are aware of this.

                    Telling giant porkies is not political speech, and pointing the lies out is not suppression.

              • (Score: 2) by NotSanguine on Tuesday May 26 2020, @11:59PM (2 children)

                And I have no obligation to donate [archive.org] to an archive that is adding unnecessary "friction" to suppress political content.

                You are absolutely under no obligation donate to those guys. In fact, you definitely shouldn't.

                Now that we've got that settled and you have that extra money burning a hole in your pocket, I suggest a *worthy* charity: The NotSanguine Lifestyle Enhancement Fund.

                While it isn't tax deductible, you won't find a more grateful and greater good producing place for your donation.

                --
                No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
    • (Score: 1, Interesting) by NPC-131072 on Tuesday May 26 2020, @02:11PM (6 children)

      by NPC-131072 (7144) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @02:11PM (#999211) Journal

      So... why are those idiots protesting?

      They're protesting because they're idiots? If we had a global Ministry of Truth, silly ideas like the right to protest or heliocentrism would never be accepted.

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:48PM (5 children)

        by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:48PM (#999254) Journal

        Internet Archive is merely using their freedom of speech to warn people about misinformation.

        Why do you hate free speech?

        • (Score: 1) by NPC-131072 on Tuesday May 26 2020, @05:54PM (4 children)

          by NPC-131072 (7144) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @05:54PM (#999304) Journal

          Why do you hate free speech?

          "Freeze Peach" - you'll be defending nazis next [aclu.org]

          • (Score: 5, Touché) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:17PM (3 children)

            by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:17PM (#999313) Journal

            I defend the Nazi's right to speak. And I also defend the counter-protestors' right to call them assholes.

            See that where the fake free speach people are at now. They want ONLY the Nazi's to have the right to speak and any criticism, such as a warning label, is prohibited.

            • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by NPC-131072 on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:08PM (1 child)

              by NPC-131072 (7144) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:08PM (#999358) Journal

              "I defend the Nazi's" -- DeathMonkey 2020

              Another hit on hatebase [hatebase.org]

              • (Score: 3, Touché) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:26PM

                by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @08:26PM (#999362) Journal

                The smart people understand how apostrophes work.
                And the dumb people like Nazis.

                Not sure you have a winner on your hands here...

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @01:01PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @01:01PM (#999593)

              I am sure I have read you defending people's right to hit Nazi's. Rather hypocritical of you isn't it, to encourage physical attacks on people for their beliefs.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:55PM (2 children)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:55PM (#999257) Journal

      So... why are those idiots protesting?

      See....you actually think they care about free speech. They don't.

      You'll notice they're actually trying to censor the Internet Archive here....

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:58PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:58PM (#999280)

        An archive that allows politics to be part of the archival process cannot be fully trusted by future researchers. They may never know how stupid some people were being at this point in time. Passing as full a history as possible to the next generation is how we prepare them for the future.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @10:26AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday May 27 2020, @10:26AM (#999561)

          An archive that allows politics to be part of the archival process cannot be fully trusted by future researchers.

          Tell that to those who manage these archives [archives.gov].

  • (Score: 0, Troll) by zion-fueled on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:09PM (1 child)

    by zion-fueled (8646) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:09PM (#999192)

    So next step is letting them update articles like they do on the live version. We printed lies so let's change the headline or text silently and nobody can call us on it. Have screenshots? They fake. Just check out the wayback machine....

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by c0lo on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:28PM

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday May 26 2020, @01:28PM (#999204) Journal

      Unless, of course, it doesn't happen that they change the title/content.
      And until now, this FA included, you have no support in reality that they did.

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
  • (Score: 2, Troll) by meustrus on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:45PM (4 children)

    by meustrus (4961) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @03:45PM (#999249)

    I like to think the original plan for internet content assumed that the people browsing it were inconsequential nerds. If the info was wrong, they'd know, because nerds are smart. Even if they didn't, it wouldn't matter, because nobody listens to nerds anyway.

    Everything changed when the normies came online. You can't assume people will use their critical thinking to say, huh, this is an archive, I wonder why the content was taken down in the first place? Worse, now everyone is online, so you can actually affect real life politics by manipulating enough idiots with it.

    I'm not saying I like this development. I liked the old days when nobody expected anything on the internet to be "true" and I was free to peruse a combination of primary sources and wild hypotheses using my own critical thinking as an effective filter.

    Unfortunately, this development is completely logical when we must coexist with idiots that vote. It would probably be better to take the Wayback Machine offline completely, maybe move it to some kind of university-paid-access model for internet historians, rather than start down the path of treating selectively annotating the historical record.

    --
    If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
    • (Score: 4, Touché) by Kitsune008 on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:38PM (1 child)

      by Kitsune008 (9054) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @04:38PM (#999272)

      Independently verified from the current QOTD at the bottom of this page:

      All the world's a stage and most of us are desperately unrehearsed. -- Sean O'Casey

      ;-)

      While I may agree with you philosophically, I would not agree with the policy you propose.

      It would probably be better to take the Wayback Machine offline completely, maybe move it to some kind of university-paid-access model for internet historians, rather than start down the path of treating selectively annotating the historical record.

      Who decides what to take offline? How are the decisions made? Can the process be changed, and why, and by who? How transparent is this process?

      Who watches the watchers?

      • (Score: 2) by meustrus on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:35PM

        by meustrus (4961) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:35PM (#999342)

        Who decides what to take offline? How are the decisions made? Can the process be changed, and why, and by who? How transparent is this process?

        That's the point. Take everything offline. Then, give everything to organizations that pay for special access. No decisions to be made. No process to be changed.

        Don't like the access policy? Can't afford a license? Then go build your own internet archive. The WayBack Machine suppresses competition in archival services by being free. If it weren't, we may even see competing archives, focused on different areas, serving different customer bases.

        Then again, there are definitely flaws in my proposal, especially around who loses access. It is basically putting internet archives behind a paywall similar to the academic journal system, so it inherits all of those flaws.

        But the motivation gets back to what you said: "Who watches the watchers?" If the unwashed masses really can't be trusted with the raw information, I think it would be better to take it all away from the people that probably don't need it, i.e. those being linked to old propaganda as if it were current credible news, than to water it down for the people that absolutely do, i.e. those studying the old propaganda with the expectation that it speaks to a historical reality.

        --
        If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
    • (Score: 4, Touché) by progo on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:54PM (1 child)

      by progo (6356) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @06:54PM (#999333) Homepage

      I like to think the original plan for printing press assumed that the people printing and reading from it were inconsequential monks. If the info was wrong, they'd know, because monks are smart. Even if they didn't, it wouldn't matter, because nobody listens to monks anyway.

      Everything changed when the normies learned to read. You can't assume people will use their critical thinking to say, huh, this is just a machine; I wonder why some content is censored by law in the first place? Worse, now everyone is reading, so you can actually affect real life politics by manipulating enough idiots with it.

      I'm not saying I like this development. I liked the old days when nobody could print and read on a massive scale anything someone thinks to be "true" and I was free to consult monks and judges as primary sources and use wild hypotheses using my own critical thinking as an effective filter.

      Unfortunately, this development is completely logical when we must coexist with idiots that have been moving into cities. It would probably be better to take printing presses offline completely, or maybe move it to some Church-run model for arbiter of knowledge, rather than start down the path of stamping public books with the King's seal of approval.

      • (Score: 2) by meustrus on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:57PM

        by meustrus (4961) on Tuesday May 26 2020, @07:57PM (#999350)

        Hah, always an annoying means of responding.

        The problem is that your metaphor doesn't work. The WayBack Machine is not the internet itself. It's an archive of the past.

        It's more like a library than the printing press itself. Not just any library, though - a library which purports to hold copies of every version of every text that ever existed.

        Such a thing would be enormously useful for historians. It would also be enormously dangerous for the existing power structure, which makes it enormously useful for Russian trolls to sow chaos. Maintaining checks on the existing power structure without degenerating into anarchy is a very hard problem. Annotating history like this is a poor solution.

        Anyway, I'm not sure I understand how "the King's seal of approval" is a better system than "some Church-run model for arbiter of knowledge". Either system looks equally bad in the long term, with the "Church-run model" probably being better in the short term until the aristocracy are able to capture it to their advantage. You'll have to explain to me why I should prefer one form of censorship to another.

        Besides, look at the incentives. I trust universities to want access to the best truth available, and I trust them to make that truth available to their students. Even if you're concerned about their political bias, they still need accurate information for their communication model to function correctly. Incidentally, the Vatican actually does have a secret library with some of the only copies still in existence of some highly blasphemous texts. They may not be willing to share, but their desire to know their enemy has saved entire competing religions for some future historians to analyze. Competing religions which were destroyed, in large part, by the actions of kings who disapproved.

        --
        If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
(1)