Outrage mounts over report Russia offered bounties to Afghanistan militants for killing US soldiers
Outrage has greeted media reports that say American intelligence officials believe a Russian military intelligence unit offered bounties to Taliban-linked militants for killing foreign soldiers in Afghanistan, including targeting Americans.
The story first appeared in the New York Times, citing its sources as unnamed officials briefed on the matter, and followed up by the Washington Post. The reports said that the US had come to the conclusion about the operation several months ago and offered rewards for successful attacks last year.
The Times wrote: "The intelligence finding was briefed to Trump, and the White House's National Security Council discussed the problem at an interagency meeting in late March." White House officials apparently drew up several possible options to retaliate against the Kremlin, ranging from a diplomatic reprimand right through to fresh sanctions. However, the White House has so far not taken any action.
It is not clear if bounties were ever paid out for successfully killing American soldiers.
(Score: 5, Funny) by driverless on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:27AM (10 children)
I've asked my good friend Vladimir and he's reassured me that this has all been cooked up by the fake news media, which is why we never took any action. Did I tell you about how big my inauguration was? Bigger than any president in history. And largest electoral college majority too.
(Score: 3, Funny) by PiMuNu on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:35AM (6 children)
Campaign now to bring back RealDonaldTrump!
MSNGA!
(Score: -1, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @11:26AM
No thanks. With aristarchus there is already too much first-person fanfiction as it.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @03:35AM (4 children)
rDT was the best satire, but it really triggered the democrats here.
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Monday June 29 2020, @06:17AM (2 children)
rDT was so good at it I sometimes suspected he was actually one of Trump's writers practicing in what amounts to a deniable sandbox.
Did any of them get fired around the time rDT stopped posting?
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @03:02PM (1 child)
I had the feeling that Big People at SN told him to go away because too many people were getting butthurt.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 30 2020, @01:48AM
lol, no it was around when everyone just started mocking the troll, they hateses when hobbitses makes fun of them.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday June 29 2020, @03:13PM
I thought he was funny, and defended him, right up until he got caught mod-sturbating with all his sockpuppets.
(Score: 4, Touché) by c0lo on Sunday June 28 2020, @01:17PM
Tulsa?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by Revek on Sunday June 28 2020, @08:38PM
I moded you funny but its that funny that makes you a little sad.
This page was generated by a Swarm of Roaming Elephants
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @06:35PM
Thing is there's no need to offer bounties. There are very many Afghans willing to kill US soldiers. The Russians can supply them with weapons and ammo (similar to how the CIA supplies or even trains extremists to help mess up the Middle East further). No need to motivate them any further.
The US has done plenty to make themselves unpopular with significant numbers of Afghan people:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haska_Meyna_wedding_party_airstrike#See_also [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @11:23AM (5 children)
Take American soldiers out of Afghanistan and put them into Washington, DC. Then offer them bounties for every senator or congressman they can capture and extradite to Guantanamo.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @03:12PM (2 children)
Don't forget the Jew York Times pushing anti-russian bullshit, Just trying to get more Whites to kill each other. Evidently, The Holodomor didn't satisfy their blood lust.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Ethanol-fueled on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:29PM (1 child)
Yeah, this shit has all been debunked for at least a day already. You know what hasn't been, though, is Israel's looming colonialist land-grab of the West Bank. This article [jewishcurrents.org] has a few choice paragraphs:
No, no, look the other way, Black people! As champions of civil rights, the ADL and the Jewish community back you up 100%! Why don't you tear down a few statues and beat up a few white people and stop paying attention to Israel for a little while! Thanks for your tax dollars Goys!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @07:42AM
You double pasted into the link.
"This article" [jewishcurrents.org]
FTFY.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @09:57PM
Swampy Don tried something similar against peaceful protestors in order to show that he can hold a book upsidedown.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @01:21AM
> Take American soldiers out of Afghanistan and put them into Washington, DC. Then offer them bounties for every protestor
FTFY
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @11:50AM (24 children)
For those of you old enough to remember, Russia (or was it the USSR?) carried out a protracted campaign to pacify Afghanistan, which eventually failed after about 10 years. The US (or allies) funded the Afghani resistance. It wouldn't surprise me a bit if USA black ops creeps paid a bounty for dead Russian soldiers.
(Score: 5, Informative) by looorg on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:26PM (21 children)
Indeed. It was called Operation Cyclone by the CIA. Not sure if they offered bounties for kills but I assume that they figured that the mujahideen would do something will all the weapons (everything from conventional weapons to Stinger missiles) and cash they got that involved killing russians -- for freedom and liberty or some such reason. So it's a bit odd to cry about what the enemy might do to you when you have already previously done it to them.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Immerman on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:37PM (17 children)
I don't think anyone serious is crying about the bounties.
They're objecting to the complete lack of response by a president that seems to be doing everything he can to make sure The Middle East ends up under Russian control, completely wasting all the lives and resources that we have been spent there over the last decades to establish US influence.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:40PM (5 children)
sunk cost fallacy
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Immerman on Sunday June 28 2020, @01:14PM (4 children)
If he wanted to withdraw US influence from the region, that'd be one thing - lots of ways that could be done gracefully while garnering a lot of good will rather than driving the region into Russia's arms.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by HiThere on Sunday June 28 2020, @03:19PM (1 child)
Well, that "good will" part might be a bit optimistic. I, personally, don't see any way to act in that area that doesn't generate more ill will on one side than good will on another. Which doesn't mean getting out of there is a bad idea. But it would generate more ill will than good will.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @04:53PM
Getting out would not generate good will. We are far past the point where folks are going to forgive the murder of their families by American soldiers / drone strikes in illegal wars of aggression (promoted by right-wing "think tanks" as a source of future profit for the rich parasite class), that have resulted in millions of deaths and even greater displacement and misery.
But, staying there just increases the animosity. So, yeah, we should GTFO!
The US under Baby Bush and later Obama, and now Trump, have created more enemies of the US by their wanton killing in the middle east, than even blood thirsty butchers like Reagan with his army of far-right death squads in central america.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @05:25PM (1 child)
We already surrendered Afghanistan to the Taliban.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:21PM
Time to go back in? Sign your kids up now folks.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:42PM (1 child)
I'm sure there will be a response eventually, after all this tit for tat where the USA and (Soviet-) Russia are poking in each others wars (or whatever the things should be called or classified as) have been going on now since the end of the last world war. One intervenes somewhere and the other one more or less instantly finds the opposition and starts to shower them with money, arms and training just to prolong and make the whole ordeal as painful and prolonged as possible.
(Score: 2) by Bot on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:55PM
It need not be a military response, this is a little scandal which the Russians will deny no matter what and if true will be used to silence Russians when one of the allies is caught doing dirty stuff.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by Bot on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:52PM
This only if you are progressive. If you are trumpist you think that the missing response is a theorem. All you have is a leak by unidentified sources that might not comprise the actual response.
Account abandoned.
(Score: -1, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @01:04PM
Sunk cost fallacy.
(Score: 2) by loonycyborg on Sunday June 28 2020, @04:56PM (4 children)
What does it have to do with Russians? As things are it's more likely to fall under India's or China's control.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Immerman on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:10PM (3 children)
Russia has been investing big-time in extending their control in the region
(Score: 5, Touché) by loonycyborg on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:24PM (2 children)
Illuminati and freemasons too I heard.
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Monday June 29 2020, @02:31PM (1 child)
Right, because it's totally conspiracy fodder to think that our primary competition for proxy control of the region since WWI is also investing in the region. Next you'll tell me the U.S. isn't investing in extending regional control either, and we all just imagined the last several wars we fought there to replace uppity puppet governments with more compliant ones.
(Score: 2) by loonycyborg on Monday June 29 2020, @03:56PM
US shouldn't have any control anywhere in Eurasia. Period. Nobody wants those moronic Mongol wannabes here. As the saying goes "Yankee go home". Who else takes over for them doesn't matter. But it's more likely to be China or India than Russia.
(Score: 2) by PocketSizeSUn on Sunday June 28 2020, @05:37PM (1 child)
Given the realistic alternatives having Russia in control of the Middle East is much better than Saudi.
The USA does not have the political will to do what is necessary to eliminate the terrorist extremism running rampant through the region and spilling out all over the world. USA still hasn't started to dismantle the Kingdom of Saud which is the primary source of funds for terrorist organizations world wide.
So far only China has demonstrated the will to dismantle the ideology ... and that is due to the CCP recognizing muslim extremism as an existential threat.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:24PM
Mm some tasty choices there, for sure.
Chinese concentration camps or fired up religious zealots with explosives. I'll pick NONE thanks.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:01PM (2 children)
Was the CIA doing that while peace negotiations were going on?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:27PM (1 child)
If not, then only because they found something even more dastardly to do.
Seriously, has the CIA ever done anything useful? It's like your shitbag brother-in-law who drinks and gambles and probably sleeps with prostitutes. Stop that shit, idiot!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @06:21PM
(Score: 2) by Bot on Sunday June 28 2020, @12:49PM (1 child)
Live by the sword... Nobody bothers you as you look like a menace.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:04PM
How very Christian and Jesus-like of you, Mr. Opus Dei Operative...
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1, Offtopic) by Bot on Sunday June 28 2020, @01:01PM
The enemy uses your former (and contemporary) ally which enrages the former Russian lapdogs commies looking to dislodge the president. Quite hypocritical on all sides.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @01:15PM (4 children)
So you have an unnamed official telling tales about something that, if real, would be just tit-for-tat for the USA funding the Mujaheddin. Compare that to our alleged "allies" deliberately attempting to sink one of our ships, killing 34 and wounding 171 sailors.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday June 28 2020, @02:20PM
Too late for tit-for-tat. Russia should have done that oh 35 years ago. They're not even the same country anymore - or do all the former Soviet republics get a chance for tit-for-tat?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @08:38PM (2 children)
TBF, we were anything but allied to Israel in the 60s. That started under Ford, I think.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @12:36AM
True, the US didn't ally with Israel until 1974. The '70s oil crisis was Saudi Arabia's response to that change in policy.
(Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @06:23AM
You lying zionist shill.
(Score: 3, Touché) by legont on Sunday June 28 2020, @02:14PM
SaturdaysSundays?"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @02:55PM (3 children)
Let's think for a minute. First off, what's the difference between a bounty and a contract killing? Scale. Contracts are small scale where a small number of players participate, bounties are large scale with much wider participation. So we have claims of a large scale bounty system. And this is the sort of thing that spreads, by design. And what's the most important part of a bounty system? Faith and confidence in the person offering the bounty alongside ease of contact.
So we now have a system that would be:
1) A system that would be widespread and open to a large number of people
2) Many people knowing and spreading knowledge of such a system
3) Widespread knowledge of who was offering said bounty and precisely how to contact them and their standards for proof
This would not be secretive system nobody would know about. In a matter of days to weeks just about everybody in the zone, including Americans, would know about it - and it would also rapidly spread back home as well. And all of this for what? To get rid of some soldiers who are mostly replaceable and whom the media no longer even meaningfully reports deaths of? It would have 0 strategic impact, near 0 impact on morale, yet open Russia to extreme retaliation if true. So far every single party including the US, Russia, and even the Taliban are strongly rejecting the claim that any such arrangement was in place.
So in a nutshell we have:
1) A contradiction: a system that would be widescale and, at best, an open secret somehow being a genuinely secretive program
2) A complete lack of logical motivation and a completely broke risk:reward
3) An absolute lack of corroboration of the report that relies exclusively on unnamed sources sited by an extremely biased and partisan media outlet.
This seems to be, almost certainly, yet more fake news being propagated by the New York Times.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Sunday June 28 2020, @07:00PM (1 child)
If all that's true, maybe the Russians were saying "We're on your side! As proof, we're offering you many rubles to kill our 'common enemy!' See, you can trust us!" On the other hand, it would then mostly be for propaganda's sake. I seriously doubt the Russians would do something like that.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:30PM
</sarcasm>
Just closing that tag for you.
(Score: 2) by Spamalope on Sunday June 28 2020, @11:04PM
Taken together with the 'muh Russia' conspiracy theories of the past few years, it's at least cause to treat Russia news from sources that pushed the Russia conspiracy hoax with caution and some skepticism when considering any new Russia news.
AKA, what's more likely; sources of politically motivated disinformation about Russia are at it again, or they're telling the truth this time even though there is no corroboration.
As immediate action isn't required, waiting for confirmation (or refutation) makes more sense. This couldn't be kept secret for long unless the scale were small. You could at least look for second order effects that'd be visible if this were happening on a significant level, like an injection of extra money in the region.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by leon_the_cat on Sunday June 28 2020, @03:06PM (7 children)
are these unnamed officials actually the guys who wrote the article? Seems you need three people to write an article based on hearsay and then pad it out with your own brand of political propaganda.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @03:39PM (3 children)
People are so quick to forget Irrefutable [washingtonpost.com] and the NYTimes going one step further with Irrefutable and Undeniable [nytimes.com].
Those were the headlines for articles from WaPo and NYTimes describing the entirely fabricated, and mostly quite poorly so, evidence presented by Colin Powell to justify our completely misguided invasion of Iraq ostensibly in pursuit of nonexistent WMD. Those eerily similar articles were both posted on February 6th, beating the wardrums as hard as they possibly could. About 6 weeks later we would start the invasion that persists to this day, 17 years later. Our media, for whatever reason, seem to be very much in bed with the Military Industrial Complex. When they start jamming articles clearly angling for the increase of geopolitical tensions which could trend towards war - it should very much be taken with a grain of salt. And if you think people will buy into it, then at least hedge that disappointment in society with some stock investment in Raytheon/Boeing/Lockheed Martin.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @08:36PM (2 children)
The NYT's link puts "Irrefutable and Undeniable" in quotes, but does not say who said those words. The Bezos Post link says "Powerful and irrefutable" was said by no one else than: Joe Biden.
This hawk got us into a disastrous war that is still costing us today.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:07PM (1 child)
Biden got us into the Afghanistan war? Boy, you'll believe ANYTHING you hear on Fox, won't you?
Are you that same guy who complains that Obama didn't do enough to stop 9/11 because he was out playing golf at the time [youtube.com]?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:33PM
These stories were about getting us into the Iraq war, you dumb fuck idiot.
(Score: 2, Informative) by hemocyanin on Sunday June 28 2020, @05:59PM (2 children)
Post above is not a Troll. The thought that the MSM would try to gaslight people into a war footing is not even remotely disputable.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:17PM (1 child)
Most of us middle aged people remember getting taught in History class about the Spanish American War, and how the press empires of Hearst and Pulitzer pushed us into a war to steal a run-down empire's colonies from them.
120 years later we have media companies, formerly holding a quite respectable reputation, living off their brands to stoke the flames of war. Any regular guy sitting at home needs to keep in mind that the interests of media owners probably do not intersect with his own, no matter how soothing their output strokes whatever prejudices he may have.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Sunday June 28 2020, @07:06PM
Stoking the flames of war? Maybe it's the other way around [youtube.com], as Hoffman and DeNiro tried to portray.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by srobert on Sunday June 28 2020, @03:51PM (11 children)
I'm not as much interested in whether or not the Russians are doing this as I am in who is pushing the story in the American media at this time and what atrocity that is about to be committed by American forces is going to be justified by it.
(Score: 1) by hemocyanin on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:03PM (1 child)
You'll have to wait until next January when Biden is president to see who we're trying to start a war with.
(Score: 2) by deimtee on Monday June 29 2020, @06:32AM
You don't have to wait until then. The Democrats, MIC, and Israelis clearly want the USA to go to war in Iran. "Boys go to Baghdad, Real men go to Tehran"
Sometime in November you guys get to make an unenviable decision. Do you want Senile Evil or Stupid Ego?
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @06:26PM (8 children)
Who but the elites, their press holdings and the Democrat party beholden to them? The same people pushing anti-Russian propaganda throughout Trump's presidency.
They have forced Trump to hold back on building relations with Russia, even as stronger relations would be helpful to keep the balance of power with China and pacify the Middle East. I'll blame Trump for kowtowing though, he can be offensive and pressure people into a deal when he wants to, but sometimes he just disappears from the stage when the media blasts artillery at him and his leadership is sorely needed.
(Score: 4, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:15PM (7 children)
Yeah, I'm thinking you aren't going to be reading Bolton's book, and it is for the better. Your head would explode.
He can't pressure ANYBODY but Senate Republicans. All foreign leaders know his shtick and they use it against him to get what they want. Russia gets what it wants now, including very strong pressure to get back in the G8, Little Rocket Man is shooting missiles all over the place and pretty much says Trump is a dope, no trade deal with China and Trump has his lips glued to Xi's ass begging for him to help him out, the EU ignores him, Canada/Mexico ignores him, EVERYBODY ignores him because he is ALL bluster and everyone knows it by now. Shit, he's even STILL trying his old scammy developer routine by filing ridiculous lawsuits (really? Sue a news organization to take down poll results??? What a dumbass. Either that, or the real dumbasses are the people who think that it is a legit lawsuit).
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:36PM (2 children)
Which is how Canada got the upper hand in NAFTA v2 negotiations, because Trudeau deftly outmaneuvered simpleton Trump.
(Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Monday June 29 2020, @12:57PM (1 child)
Except Canada seems to have succumbed to the copyright extension in the NAFTA replacement.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @02:59PM
Your sarcasm detector needs tuning.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:36PM
I still think he wins against Biden.
But loses the popular vote and Republicans lose the Senate. Interesting times ahead.
(Score: 0, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @10:38PM (1 child)
No I won't be reading his book. I remember the firestarter walrus under Baby Bush, before he turned into another Great White Hope for the media, eager to promote *any* dirtbag who may have some anti-Trump content to spew. That is what makes my head explode.
(Score: 2) by leon_the_cat on Monday June 29 2020, @04:45PM
https://www.businessinsider.com/john-bolton-threatened-family-of-brazilian-diplomat-iraq-war-2002-2018-3?op=1&r=US&IR=T [businessinsider.com]
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @05:24PM
About 15 years ago it became clear that John 'Yellowcake' Bolton was one of the key players in the complete fabrication of evidence and countless lies, under oath, that led us into the completely pointless Iraq War from which we seem yet still unable to extricate ourselves. Imagine somebody trying to convince me -back then- that 15 years later 'liberals' would be totally raving about Bolton's latest book. 'You've gotta read it man. It'll make your head a'splode!'
Sometimes I wonder if it is me or what passes for "liberalism" has changed in America. And I kindly thank you, and your sort [wikipedia.org], for such indisputable and clear answers to such questions.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 28 2020, @11:48PM (1 child)
Offer the bounty to your Marxist comrades at #BLM instead.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @01:30AM
Even better get the CIA to make it look as if Russians are sponsoring teh blacks to kill military the units who are tear gassing protestors in DC. It's so complex it's simple again.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 29 2020, @05:56PM
Why would Russia do this? Start up a campaign to pay people to pick off a foreign soldier, American or otherwise, here and there? How many would they likely be able to get in a year, and how would that benefit Russia? Sounds very unlikely.
Maybe a better question is who would benefit to make up a such a story?