U.S. Life Expectancy Fell By 1.5 Years In 2020, The Biggest Drop Since WW II:
Life expectancy in the United States declined by a year and a half in 2020, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which says the coronavirus is largely to blame.
COVID-19 contributed to 74% of the decline in life expectancy from 78.8 years in 2019 to 77.3 years in 2020, according to the CDC's National Center for Health Statistics.
It was the largest one-year decline since World War II, when life expectancy dropped by 2.9 years between 1942 and 1943. Hispanic and Black communities saw the biggest declines.
[...] "The range of factors that play into this include income inequality, the social safety net, as well as racial inequality and access to health care," Curtis said.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @04:25PM (12 children)
And thoughts.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Revek on Wednesday July 21 2021, @05:01PM (10 children)
Prayer prevents critical thinking. So, no thoughts.
This page was generated by a Swarm of Roaming Elephants
(Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:04PM (8 children)
As a spiritual non-atheist, non-agnostic, I disagree. I fervently pray all the time that the people who won't get vaccinated and wear masks employ critical thinking bereft of political and emotional interference.
Spirituality and critical thinking, or logic and reason, are not mutually exclusive modalities in which to live your life.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by slinches on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:27PM (5 children)
I agree that critical thinking and prayer are not mutually exclusive. However, the decision on covid vaccines and mask wearing are mostly political and emotional up to this point rather than rational regardless of which side of those debates you fall on. The only conclusion that I think can be firmly drawn from a rational evaluation of the available data at this point is that the vaccines are effective against covid and have low enough risk that those at elevated risk from covid (e.g. underlying conditions or 65+) should take them. And from what I can tell, the vaccination rates for that population are quite high (~90%) with the remaining population groups getting vaccinated at rates relatively proportional to their covid risk levels. So it seems to me like people are generally making rational, evidence based choices based on their own particular circumstances.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:08PM (4 children)
In some cases, mask wearing may be more driven by behavior or tendency [psychologytoday.com] than a decision. But if the article's correct ... we have a huge part of the US population with what would appear to be a pretty serious behavioral situation.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:43PM (2 children)
Yeah, living in the USA causes autism. It just happens to correlate with all the vaccinations they get. But it's actually caused by parents that won't control their spoiled brats
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:27PM (1 child)
Autism is the new gay, to be condemned and corrected by therapy.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 23 2021, @03:09AM
Both are forms of arrested development, failure to mature
(Score: 2) by slinches on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:59PM
That's a clickbait opinion article on Psychology Today. So, not correct at all beyond the references existing is a pretty safe bet.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:59PM (1 child)
I don't know who modded you Troll for that. I'm in the same camp of "not an atheist, but not belonging to any one religion either" and don't see the problem there. Specific kinds of religion, like the Abrahamic ones, are definitely counter to critical thought, but believing there is a God isn't.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @02:00PM
The problem is inherent to large organizations. Not even necessarily religious ones - think about Apple's notorious "reality distortion field." Or any number of non religious Republicans that keep insisting that covid isn't real.
Rabbinic tradition is all about study and critical thinking. Most of the Hebrew Bible is written so that it is just difficult enough that you have to think about it to understand it.
When Thomas doubted Jesus had been resurrected, Jesus told him to touch his body, feel his wounds. Almost all of the resurrection story - the most important thing in Christianity by far - is about people believing their eyes after seeing Jesus, when they knew he must be dead.
Islam, honestly I don't know enough about the Koran.
But the religion isn't against critical thinking. Only the churches have made it so, because their power on Earth depends on it.
(Score: 2) by Snotnose on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:24PM
I must be god because everytime I pray I'm talking to myself.
When the dust settled America realized it was saved by a porn star.
(Score: 2) by Opportunist on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:46PM
More like sprayers and coughs.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @05:11PM (31 children)
>> "The range of factors that play into this include income inequality, the social safety net, as well as racial inequality and access to health care," Curtis said.
Sure, blame it on the colored people. Race is a social construct, a mask would have saved your life no matter what color you are.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by fakefuck39 on Wednesday July 21 2021, @05:36PM (12 children)
Race is a social construct, but there are differences in genetics too - not a lot, but they're there. For example, even when you compensate for income disparity and access to medical care, blacks have a much higher chance of dying from a heart attack. They also have a 40% higher chance of dying from covid. Now, a part of that 40% is most certainly because they're on average less well-off.
Now, here's something interesting about that 40% extra for blacks. That number is from this site
https://covidtracking.com/race [covidtracking.com]
Let's compare that to CDC data
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/community/health-equity/racial-ethnic-disparities/disparities-deaths.html [cdc.gov]
what we're looking at here is the difference between the red and blue bars.
15.1% of deaths, while 12.5% of the population. That only shows an extra 2.6% extra deaths for blacks. Not 40% as covidtracking.com says. So what's the deal here?
Now let's look at income inequality.
https://www.federalreserve.gov/econres/notes/feds-notes/disparities-in-wealth-by-race-and-ethnicity-in-the-2019-survey-of-consumer-finances-20200928.htm [federalreserve.gov]
Whites have a mean net worth 10x what the blacks do. But when you get admitted to a hospital, they have to take you whether you have money or not, and no doctor looks at your color or paystub. And if you can't pay it, you get medicaid. And if you didn't apply for medicaid, you still don't pay the hospital and just get sent to collections. You definitely don't get denied a ventilator or a bed or a doctor. Which makes sense - because the difference between blacks and whites dying of covid, is only 2.6%.
It's funny they don't mention this in the article - that income inequality and race seem to not really matter at all. Well, they do I guess, to the grand total of 2.6%. But that doesn't make headlines or make people angry enough to riot, and we need our racial inequality riots, don't we.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:04PM (3 children)
Fuckface fucks the numbers again. The 15.1% share of deaths is 20.8% more than the 12.5% population share, not 2.6%. It gets worse in the age-standardized distribution.
(Score: 0, Troll) by fakefuck39 on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:32PM (2 children)
I'm sorry, what now? 12.5% of the population should have 12.5% share of the deaths. To get to 15.1%, their share of the population needs to increase by 2.6%, of the entire population. What you did here is change what I was talking about - % of population share increase, to "percent of growth of that subpopulation." Which is not what I was comparing. So you made up something and called this thing only you said stupid. You do that a lot. Probably because of your incurable autism.
The reason we're not using the age-standardized graph here sherlock, is because we're comparing the first link to the second link, and while the second link shows both datasets, the first link only shows the non age standardized data. Fucking retard.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:26PM (1 child)
15.1% is 2.6 basis points higher than 12.5%, but 15.1% is 20.8% higher than 12.5% - aka 12.5*1.208=15.1
So that means blacks are dying at a rate 20.8% higher than their population numbers would indicate they should be.
(Score: 1, Troll) by fakefuck39 on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:49PM
yes sherlock, (15.1-12.5)/12.5=20.8%. congratulations, you've clearly completed 8th grade.
>but 15.1% is 20.8% higher than 12.5%
yes, but you're comparing the wrong thing
>So that means blacks are dying at a rate 20.8% higher than their population numbers
which is comparing the black population baseline, to what the black population should be, if the population representation matched their covid death portion. which is not what we're talking about here. we are comparing it to the total population.
now go back, read the original post, and reply on topic. In fact, the fist link clearly states what we're comparing, in the fucking title.
but I get it. you're one of those people that doesn't even bother looking at what we're discussing, and just like to spam "gotchas" with preschool arithmetic. good for you. we all need to be entertained by people making fools of themselves.
(Score: 4, Informative) by Immerman on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:29PM (1 child)
Not commenting on anything but your own math error - that 2.6% is not the increase in rate at which blacks die - in fact I don't believe it tells you anything meaningful.
As an extreme example - assume some group were only 0.01% of the population, but died at 10x the normal rate - they're such a small fraction of the population that they'd still only be about 0.1% of the total deaths (=0.01% of the population * 10x the death rate). Subtracting the two percentages as you did would get 0.09% - which by your logic would suggest that they were dying at almost the exact same rate as everyone else.
To get the death rate compared to the average you need to divide by their fraction of the population, rather than subtract: 15.1%/12.5% = 1.208, or in other words assuming those numbers are accurate, they're dying at 20.8% higher rate than the average.
Basically, to get the total death rate for a population from the subgroup death rates you'd have to add the proportional rates for each group, e.g.
Group 1 size * group 1 rate
+ size 2 * rate 2 + ...
+ size N * rate N
etc. = total number of deaths
The same math works if you're dealing with percentages rather than absolute numbers - in that case you're essentially just pre-scaling all the sizes (and the total) to a representative population of size 100.
(Score: 2, Troll) by fakefuck39 on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:41PM
hold on, I get your basic arithmetic, but we're comparing the two links here - that's the whole point of my comment. Did you look at the links? No, so let me paste this here:
1st link:
"Nationwide, Black people have died at 1,4 times the rate of white people."
the numbers it lists are "Deaths per 100 000 people by race"
those are not deaths that need to be standardized to the size of that group - the group size is already 100k people for any race. So why would "assume some group were only 0.01% of the population" matter, since the sample we're looking at is 100k for each race?
>The same math works if you're dealing with percentages rather than absolute numbers
you're doing that math twice. you're taking the number adjusted for that race's % of the total population, and adjusting it again.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @10:52AM (5 children)
As you later acknowledge that was actually 20% greater deaths per capita than the mean (which in turn is somewhat greater than the white only deaths per capita. After all, per capita deaths is a better comparison right?
What's missing here is that the black population as a whole is much more urban than the white population. While there are some occasional rural exceptions, the urban regions tend to be much more heavily hit than rural areas. Thus, even in the complete absence of any sort of racial bias, one would expect more covid deaths in the black population per capita.
(Score: 2) by fakefuck39 on Thursday July 22 2021, @11:11AM (4 children)
>20% greater deaths per capita than the mean
I acknowledge it in the way where I tell a retard that's not what the first link is talking about, since the title is comparing blacks to whites, not blacks to blacks.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @11:36AM (3 children)
FTFY.
(Score: 2) by fakefuck39 on Thursday July 22 2021, @11:46AM (2 children)
you should fix yourself buddy. you are comparing blacks to blacks. I don't know how much more clear i can make that for you. it's clearly something your brain is unable to comprehend.
(Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @12:34PM (1 child)
I've already corrected your incorrect statement. Time to get with it.
Repetition doesn't make erroneous statements less erroneous.
(Score: 1, Troll) by fakefuck39 on Thursday July 22 2021, @07:24PM
>I've already corrected your incorrect statement. Time to get with it.
autism
>Repetition doesn't make erroneous statements less erroneous.
is not curable
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:08PM (17 children)
> Race is a social construct
No data, but along with the social construct comes differences in services. Just a guess, but the hospitals that serve our minority populations (in USA) may not offer the same actual level of care that suburban hospitals offer?
This is certainly true for grocery stores and other kinds of stores--the inner city stores don't have nearly the same quality/variety of food and goods as can be found out in the wealthier and whiter burbs.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:14PM (16 children)
Businesses (both grocery stores and hospitals) can better take the risk of providing additional goods and services in areas filled with people who pay their bills and don't steal, than in areas filled with people who don't pay their bills and do steal.
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:47PM (6 children)
No businesses or other customers should have to deal with blacks. They are a burden that is not ours to bear. send them back home so Whitey can't oppress them.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:41PM (5 children)
Pop quiz, fuccboi! Who brought them to the US in the first place?
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:51PM
That is the worst troll feeding I've ever seen Azuma, and you left the racist gate wide open.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:30PM
Let me guess... the White savior? Saving civilization with his superior knowledge of pickup trucks.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:52PM (2 children)
Jews, mostly, but you already knew that.
Go on, then. Spam me, baby!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @11:41AM (1 child)
Given how capable Jews are, one wonders why we bother having any other ethnicities at all.
So what of all the other ethnicities involved in the slave trade? Do they not count if there are Jew cooties around?
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:36PM
"We?"
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:27PM (8 children)
Not to mention the risk of businesses getting looted and burned to the ground, like what can happen when there are "mostly peaceful" protests.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:01PM (7 children)
True, but I reckon the first group--you know, the vulture capitalist types like Bain Capital and all the other "equity" firms?--do a lot more damage overall. We can deal with the looting on the ground after we go after the Romneys and Trumps of the world, I say.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:34PM
The ecosystem functions better when you have animals, plants, fungi and blood-sucking parasites all in balance. The Romneys and Trumps, like ticks, provide a repository for viruses and bacteria that would otherwise be lost, harming diversity.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @10:56AM (5 children)
I think you probably ought to try to show that the vulture capitals do "damage" overall. For a glaring example of how this reckoning fails, I doubt the entirety of the vulture capitalist ecosystem has done as much damage as the 1967 Detroit riots.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday July 22 2021, @05:39PM (4 children)
Okay, but your gut feelings mean shit. Numbers. Back up that claim or shut the fuck up.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @10:48PM (2 children)
What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. If you want numbers so bad, why don't you start?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday July 23 2021, @01:22AM (1 child)
You make the claim, you back it up.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 23 2021, @08:42PM
Looking forward to you backing up your claim [soylentnews.org], then.
You've got no room to complain about people contradicting you when they provided just as much evidence as you (0=0), you toxic little dingbat.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday July 26 2021, @01:00AM
How about this? No city has dropped in population by almost a factor of three due to vulture capitalists. In fact, if someone had been recycling dying capital and property back in the 1960s and 1970s, Detroit might be in a lot better shape now (abandoned property is a large contributor to the problems of Detroit today).
While Detroit has been in decline [biggestuscities.com] since 1950, there were two decades in which Detroit lost 20% or more of its population (as measured by the US Census). The first was 1970-1980 when it dropped from 1.5 million to 1.2 million, right after those 1967 riots. (The second was 2000-2010 when it dropped from over 900k to a bit over 700k.)
Even more telling, the Detroit metropolitan area peaked in 1970 (with a second, lower peak in 2000). That coincides well with the riots and their aftereffects.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @05:15PM (15 children)
Excess deaths in the U.S. - it's like a bad flu season, but worse:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/01/14/us/covid-19-death-toll.html [nytimes.com]
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 3, Informative) by slinches on Wednesday July 21 2021, @05:33PM (7 children)
The CDC is still tracking it here:
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm [cdc.gov]
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:12PM (6 children)
Weekly counts of deaths by age group is a great one. Are the declining deaths in the older age groups in 2021 because so many died last year, or because of generally safer behavior post pandemic?
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by slinches on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:37PM (3 children)
Yeah, that really illustrates the non-uniformity of risk across age groups. The effect on deaths for those under 45 is almost undetectable with massive spikes over the already higher base rates in older groups.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:54PM (2 children)
The number of deaths 25-45 is still low, but percentage wise it has increased significantly. In other words, people in that age group were about twice as likely to die as normal during 2021...
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by slinches on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:17PM (1 child)
True, but it seems to me that the data suggests most of the rise in the 25-45 range is likely not directly due to covid. The increase doesn't correlate with the spikes in cases for each wave. Rather, it's more of a uniform increase in the baseline which would correlate better with the lockdown actions and changes in behavior associated with the public response to the pandemic.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:50PM
Yep, that seems a likely explanation... judging by the way people started driving around here I'm not surprised - very few people on the road, but the ones who were out were nutso.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by ChrisMaple on Thursday July 22 2021, @02:16AM (1 child)
Combination of factors. The grim reaper took the weakest elders in 2020. In 2021, old people are the most vaccinated.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @04:06AM
Misread elders=editors
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Barenflimski on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:44PM (6 children)
Where do the 80,000 drug overdoses due to lockdown's fit into this?
(Score: 5, Touché) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @06:58PM (1 child)
Right up there with AIDS deaths... a good start. /s
Oh, I forgot, since Rush L. came out as addicted now we have to acknowledge that human beings also can become addicted to drugs, not just degenerates.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:37PM
Oh, wait...
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:01PM (1 child)
The increase in overdoses was only 22,500 compared to the 12 months prior:
https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2020/p1218-overdose-deaths-covid-19.html [cdc.gov]
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by Barenflimski on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:37PM
Interesting.
(Score: 2) by Opportunist on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:52PM
Like you weren't bored in the lockdown...
(Score: 2, Troll) by fakefuck39 on Wednesday July 21 2021, @10:49PM
So the 75,000 OD deaths the year before the pandemic would not have happened in 2020, because jesus would have stopped them. The 70,000 OD deaths in 2018 would not have happened either, because orange god, father of jesus would have stopped them.
Hey sherlock holmes, the 80,000 deaths would fit into a chart from 2019. A chart that predicts 2020 deaths using the previous OD increases.
They're as much due to lockdown as the alcohol your mother drank while pregnant was due to the spanish flu.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Rich on Wednesday July 21 2021, @07:58PM (49 children)
Could it be that the Russians drink themselves to death, while the USAians do so by eating?
I dug out the first BMI development statistic I could find on the internet. Entirely non scientific, but might be a hint to start further investigation. Range from 1980 to 2008. For 1980 it indicates 25.1 for Germany+Belgium, and 25.3 for the US. For 2008, Germany+Belgium have climbed to 26.2, while the US shot up to 28.3. The growth looked pretty linear. I found another article on the Lancet site (spanning 1975 to 2014), where the "high income english speaking countries" opened up a similar gap.
A correlation between overweightness and morbidity is established, so even aside from CoViD and social factors decreasing life expectancy should be expected. And at least simple reasoning would suggest that the promotion "body positiveness" in recent years is not going to change that trend.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:30PM (3 children)
Impossible. People are "Healthy At Every Size" and anyone who dares to suggest otherwise is clearly a bigot.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:39PM (2 children)
I've seen some extra-healthy Americans driving around in mobility scooters. They're so healthy they can't even waddle around on their own anymore. Mmm... Big Macs.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @09:38PM
Paid for by tax dollars... particuarly galling when they wheel up to the microphone and bitch about Obamacare.
(Score: 2) by Rich on Thursday July 22 2021, @05:55PM
When I was little, I read a story where Donald Duck and his tribe (only Uncle Sam himself would be more US-American) stumble upon a degenerate population that relied on such scooters to get around. IiRC, something with the scooters screwed up. The Ducktowners educated them to exercise and that population excitedly celebrated their freedom from the scooters.
How things have changed.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 21 2021, @08:36PM
Don't forget to take your Brain Force Plus supplements, kids. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGAAhzreGWw [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by Pav on Thursday July 22 2021, @01:42AM (27 children)
Most of the rest of the developed world taxes "empty" sugar and carbs, funds public school sports programs, encourages pedestrians and the use of bicycles by their infrastructure choices, and have stronger labour laws so people actually have time and can afford to exercise should they want to (obesity is associated with poverty). For whatever reason the anglosphere is much more hands-off... particularly the USA, UK and (until recently) New Zealand. My own country (Australia) was also stating to move in a more positive direction but things have stalled for over a decade because of the current government.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @04:11AM
Who the hell taxes empty carbs? I could fly to any part of the world and feast on empty carbs for less than it costs in Los Angeles to get an Uber to McDonalds.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @11:17AM (25 children)
And of course, bragging about screwing up one's transportation infrastructure.
Probably because the "anglosphere" is more democratic.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Pav on Thursday July 22 2021, @12:27PM (23 children)
I suppose, technically, if one builds a state media apparatus [foreignpolicy.com] around ones citizens and they vote (with a few [wikipedia.org] exceptions [wikipedia.org]) for the "right people" it's a democracy. It's certainly better than the democratic "rule by the poor" Socrates complained so bitterly about in ancient times, and instead simulates Socrates' ideal of "rule by philosopher kings". How's that working out?
As an aside a while back my (Iranian) partner couldn't believe the USA had five years less average lifespan than the country in which we live (Australia), so she looked it up... she's a bit of a data nerd. Iranians generally have a pretty positive view of the US and the west in general and hate their own regime, though don't want a US puppet regime either but that's the only other option that seems available. This choice has actually discouraged revolution until now... although the sanctions are biting REALLY bad just at the moment... worse than they have for decades (with protests, blackouts, water infrastructure failure, medical shortages etc...). My partner fully expected US lifespans to be right up there. Apparently in the short time since I'd looked it up the delta between Australia and the US lifespans had actually grown from 5 to 7 years, with the US numbers being pretty similar to Iran. She was pretty horrified, and said she gave more credence to what a US-based friend had been telling her for years. She knows a lot of bright expat engineers and mathematicians from her time at Isfahan university who've subsequently travelled all over the world... the Field Medalist Maryam Mirzakhani [wikipedia.org] wasn't directly known to her, but she was known to a couple of her friends.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by khallow on Thursday July 22 2021, @12:50PM (22 children)
The obvious rebuttal is that's a false supposition. There's a lot of frothing in that article, but where's the evidence that anyone is listening to that state media apparatus? I might have missed some large example, but here's what your linked story came up with:
They're reaching a "significant" community in the US somewhere. Not the scale you're claiming. And of course, we have the usual anti-democratic handwringing over people voting the wrong way.
There was justice. Plato's ideal of "rule by philosopher kings" ended up with Plato wasting a lot of his life trying to pursue that ideal.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Pav on Thursday July 22 2021, @09:47PM (21 children)
You might want to start with the new revolving door that has opened up between "journalism" and the three letter agencies - it's in their bio's... it's not like they're hiding it. As for circumstantial evidence, I bet you haven't even heard of eg. the OPCW leaks... which appears to have shown up a false flag ie. the Douma gas attack in Syria. At least you would have heard about the problems with the "weapons of mass destruction" narrative a generation or so ago. The OPCW inspectors on the ground in Syria didn't see evidence of a chemical attack, and whistleblew against the OPCW when their report was doctored to show the opposite. After comparing the original interim report, the released OPCW report, and parsing that with their own expertise and what is publicly known many third party academics have come out in support... MIT Professor Ted Postol has been the most vocal, and has also collaborated on a paper on the suspect nature of the supposed gas attack in Khan Shekoun, Syria. There have even been UN hearings about this... but UTTER SILENCE in mainstream media. The Julian Assange, Edward Snowden etc... message seems to have been absorbed. And it's not just US three letter agencies - Luke Harding (MI6 guy) was the origin of the (since debunked) Russiagate. In my own country (Australia) the feds have been intimidating the Australian Broadcasting Corporation eg. the raid and confuscation of computers in an attempt to out the Afghanistan war crimes whistleblowers. New Zealand is wanting to exit the Five Eyes because of this and other un-democratic BS.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Saturday July 24 2021, @11:40PM
For some catharsis here's one of the few consistent US left wing voices raging on tech censorship [youtube.com] in particular (and calling out his own side of politics).
(Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Sunday July 25 2021, @04:10AM (19 children)
And we ended up here.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Sunday July 25 2021, @03:39PM (18 children)
It's not my fault you bristle at what's been obvious for years to pretty much everyone else in America [poynter.org] (well 70ish percent anyway). Media censorship is done and dusted, and that was achieved two... TWO administrations ago. Todays Whitehouse is so past that they're now on to talking about censoring private messages [riotimesonline.com] - get with the program!
And I'm not sure why you ignored the on-topic majority of my post just to argue against the sky being blue.
(Score: 0, Redundant) by khallow on Monday July 26 2021, @12:07AM (17 children)
And the latest gibberish:
What's really peculiar about your complaints is how frivolous they are. Your state doesn't have empty calorie taxes? So what? Minor changes in the US government's official media apparatus? No reason to care there. There's a journalist who used to be a spook or vice versa? Well, there's a lot of overlap in skill sets between those two careers and contrary to your assertion, the "new" revolving door is centuries old. I'm not feeling a need to regulate peoples' life choices here any more than I was with the sugar, exercise, etc.
Assad is allegedly getting slandered by the OPCW because the chemical attack in question might not have come from him? Oh dear, let's serenade his sorrow with the microviolins. I notice that little has come out of this hubbub. Assad is still the largest power in Syria.
Finally, there's no evidence of the alleged plan to censor private messages. The whole story you linked is spun from a misinterpreted Politico story and goes downhill from there.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Monday July 26 2021, @02:30PM (16 children)
Apparently your brainwashing can't countenance the fact US life expectancy was dropping year on year before COVID. Of course the linked Smithsonian Magazine article can't appear to apportion any blame to bad healthcare up front... but solely on gun ownership causing suicides in rural areas, and on drug use, therefore upholding their half of the state media apparatus (remember children... what 70% of Americans mistrust and naively call (the key word) "partisan" is the very definition of state media [wikipedia.org]. Because the magazine must also maintain its academic pretensions it burys important details. For anyone studious enough to read the actual article they'll find out US healthcare is so bad that of the top 10 causes of death—heart disease, cancer, unintentional injuries, chronic lower respiratory disease, stroke, Alzheimer’s, diabetes, influenza and pneumonia, kidney disease, and suicide... only cancer witnessed a decrease in mortality rates... seven others increased. Preventative care (the most cost effective healthcare) is "frivolous" according to khallow, as is decent after-the-fact healtcare apparently. Regarding SMS censorship the Politifact article wasn't specific - saying that SMS censorship is not meant for individuals is gaslighting... surely you're not THAT politically naive. But it's unambiguous that they're looking to build censorship in. If your boiled-frog-patriotism makes you think that once the capability is there they won't find a way to justify using it nefariously and/or on individuals, then good for you.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Monday July 26 2021, @09:25PM
Ooops... the "linked Smithsonian article" wasn't, but now is [smithsonianmag.com].
(Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Tuesday July 27 2021, @05:47AM (14 children)
(Score: 2) by Pav on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:44PM (13 children)
You expect to lose, so you do... and you rage against people who don't accept that kind of thing. This is not a good habit.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:46PM (12 children)
(Score: 2) by Pav on Wednesday July 28 2021, @06:13AM (11 children)
And I suppose bad US policy has nothing to do with US citizens being prey animals for the healthcare industry. Aparently even weed-smoking ex bricklayers understand that they can have an amusing rage-filled yet significant [youtube.com] influence on such politics. Nihilistic whining about how government will always screw you over is just sewing handles onto your arse-cheeks.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday July 28 2021, @11:56AM (10 children)
(Score: 2) by Pav on Wednesday July 28 2021, @11:14PM (9 children)
Except the US baseline is going backwards eg. the UK actually has slightly more COVID deaths per million as of July 2021 [statista.com], but even the most poverty-stricken areas [theguardian.com] of the UK have gone backwards less than the US as a whole.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday July 29 2021, @05:20AM (8 children)
That is correct. So what?
(Score: 2) by Pav on Thursday July 29 2021, @12:56PM (7 children)
**points at the topic** BTW the topic is incorrect - it's the biggest drop since WWI + the spanish flu epidemic. I guess that makes living in the USA the WWI bit.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday July 30 2021, @03:02AM (6 children)
(Score: 2) by Pav on Saturday July 31 2021, @12:20AM (5 children)
It's just fascinating to see someone call pretty basic evidence-based arguments for public health a non sequitur while living in the middle of concurrent disasters proving otherwise. I'm certainly making no excuses for eg. Australias privatised quarantine system, but at least it gives us repeated clear demonstrations of which strategies work both from an economic and health standpoint when dealing with an initial COVID outbreak eg. New South Wales (minimal business disruption + investing in contact tracing to outrun the incubation period), vs Queensland and Victoria (three-day lockdowns to contact-trace and get all primary contacts quarantined).
(Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday July 31 2021, @01:24AM (4 children)
There's another word for this, "reason". Non sequitur means "irrelevant". Talking about how fascinating the irrelevant thing is, doesn't make it more relevant.
For a glaring example of this, what is the "evidence" evidence for? Turns out it's your ability to retreat to the same pet topics you've retreated to the last time we had this exercise. Well, until those pet topics start having some bearing to the original discussion, they're non sequiturs by definition.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Saturday July 31 2021, @09:24AM (2 children)
"Non sequitur" means something doesn't necessarily follow. Your bewilderment and bluster at cause and effect IS amusing though.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday August 01 2021, @02:36AM (1 child)
Oh look, now a straw man. Really. Learn how to argue and stay on topic.
(Score: 2) by Pav on Monday August 02 2021, @01:45AM
Such a shame about the evidence though isn't it.... ;)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 03 2021, @06:46PM
*eating popcorn*
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @03:07PM
Yeah, taxing sugar and the like doesn't really do anything if people don't have access to healthy food and know how to make makes that they actually like with it.
What's more, the diet alternatives aren't necessarily any better. In mist cases the substitution they make to be healthy make them no better.
(Score: 2) by Dr Spin on Thursday July 22 2021, @06:57AM (2 children)
the "high income english speaking countries" opened up a similar gap.
The obvious inference is that speaking English kills. (Do the math)
You all need to start learning Spanish right now!
Warning: Opening your mouth may invalidate your brain!
(Score: 2) by Rich on Thursday July 22 2021, @03:56PM (1 child)
Oh, that's a bit far fetched. The direct correlation would be that speaking English makes you fat.
Ich schreibe also lieber mal auf Deutsch weiter, um nicht zuzunehmen. :)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @05:46PM
That doesn't save you. Plenty of fat germans around. The only difference is morbid-obesity is not so advanced outside America.
(Score: 3, Informative) by dak664 on Thursday July 22 2021, @02:48PM (12 children)
COVID mortality correlates with low 25-hydroxy-vitamin D blood levels, below 20 ng/ml. The liver makes that from vitamin D3 which is made in the deepest layer of the epidermis upon exposure to ultraviolet-B. However UV-B damages most cells so indigenous peoples develop skin pigment that gives just enough D3 for immune health.
Direct consequences are 1) COVID peaks in the winter months, 2) Dark-skinned people living in less sunny climates have greater mortality 3) People spending most of the time indoors have greater mortality, 4) Obese people have greater mortality (D3 is fat soluable so it takes more sunlight to bring up the blood levels), 5) People with reduced kidney and liver function (e.g. >65 years old) have greater mortality (the kidneys activate the circulating 25-hydroxy D into the form that regulates the immune system)
But the narrative is, there is nothing you can do to prevent COVID other than being vaccinated. As long as the media is in lock-step with big pharma captured regulatory agencies, needless deaths will continue to mount.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 22 2021, @05:58PM
So, what you are saying is that the poor in India just happened to be able to afford that sun screen? Or suddenly they don't get any sun because they live in their giant 200sq.ft. houses? Or were they morbidly obese? I mean, which one resulted in the recent overrun of hospitals and O2 shortages?
That's BS. You can also stay away from other people - works against all other viral infections too. But if you are unwilling to stay away from humanity in general, yes, vaccine is the only to reduce your chance of dying. Like you know, that polio thing or measles or that whooping cough or maybe tetanus or rubella. They also were lock-step in that big pharma?
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-humber-57921768 [bbc.com]
Tough to be that guy I guess. If only he read your comments and got educated on that Vitamin D thing...
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday July 23 2021, @01:27AM (10 children)
Why not both?
I got 2x Pfizer shot, and take 4000IU of D3 (and 400mg of magnesium as glycinate complex with it) daily. And also drink ginger tea and cook with turmeric + black pepper and cayenne on a regular basis. Covid appears to do damage by injuring vascular epithelium; ergo, keeping a strong immune response, cooking with foods that thin the blood, and being vaccinated should, all together, provide the most possible protection. I'm not exactly young, I'll be 33 in a couple of weeks, but this looks about as good as it gets.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 23 2021, @09:54AM (1 child)
I remember the days when 33 qualified as "not exactly young." At least I can on good days ... usually.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday August 01 2021, @02:38AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 23 2021, @05:07PM
- Beck, Loser [genius.com]
--
DJT should use this tune at his rallies.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by dak664 on Saturday July 24 2021, @11:09AM (6 children)
While I have no medical license I do have some knowledge of cell biology and first-hand experience with covid and the aftereffects. As I understand it there is a viral phase, easily overcome by most people, followed by the removal of infected cells by various mechanisms, which is a bitch if that involves most of your lung epithelium. For me it was two weeks of leather lung, gasping for air after a few minutes off the oxygen concentrator.
On the last day of oxygen I developed parethesia in my feet and swelling from the knees down. That lasted for six months and only recently has begin resolving. The timing was interesting - the immune system was done with the infected cells and perhaps turned to other issues. My take is the antibodies to the covid spike protein can also attack normal cells, i.e. long covid is an autoimmune response. If so the last thing you want is a vaccine that boosts spike antibodies. Antibodies drop after six months for good reason!
I won't be having the vaccine, thank you very much. Incidentally, ivermectin every 10 days gave symptomatic relief. YMMV but the risks are minimal.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Sunday July 25 2021, @04:23PM (5 children)
It's very interesting that ivermectin provided you symptomatic relief. The stuff is specifically targeted at *invertebrate* organisms, and works by holding open the glutamate-gated chloride channels common to their physiology, hyperpolarizing their cells. P-glycoprotein keeps it from crossing the human blood-brain barrier, which is a good thing since IIRC that's the only place in human physiology where analogous receptors are found.
In theory there is no mammalian *or* viral target for this...so what, exactly, is it doing? I am not aware of any immunomodulatory or anti-inflammatory effects of ivermetcin, and from what I've read its antiviral effects would only become relevant at hideously toxic doses.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 3, Interesting) by dak664 on Monday July 26 2021, @10:02AM (4 children)
A recent paper lists 20 possible antiviral mechanisms.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41429-021-00430-5 [nature.com]
In my case I think the autoimmune response is stifled by binding to both ACE-2 receptors and spike protein analogs. The relief occurs over 3-4 hours, a bit too rapid for antiplatelet effects. Of course there could be several things going on at once.
You quote that standard objection to IVM, that toxic levels would be needed for any effect. That initial observation was in cultured mouse cells. It was repeated with human lung tissue and found effective at usual anti-parasite doses. Big pharma graps at any straws to discredit IVM, which is probably safer than aspirin. If IVM would be found effective against influenza their vaccine profits would plummet. Or any of the cheap antivirals showing effect against covid, which they are busily trying to slightly modify so they can get patents and charge through the nose.
Incidentally July 24 was World Ivermectin Day. It was not widely reported in mainstream media but a big deal on the internet.
https://trialsitenews.com/world-ivermectin-day-news-views-and-more-1/ [trialsitenews.com]
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:27PM (3 children)
Fascinating. I had no idea this worked this well and may very well encourage my idiot anti-vax brother to get some (if he hasn't already) since he insists on not getting the shots. I've already got him following the same vitamin and mineral protocol I use and taking ginger tea daily, so if this really works, it might save his idiot life.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by dak664 on Wednesday July 28 2021, @02:35AM (2 children)
Well we need betas, gammas, and deltas in this brave new world. After the alphas die off from hubris they can repopulate the planet. Horse wormer paste works for me but it seems the veterinary ivermectin injectionable is as pure as it gets. Why not stock both, if you are a sub alpha?
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday July 28 2021, @03:16AM (1 child)
Sorry, a what now? You lost me here. If we're going to use that stupid terminology I'm a sigma female, so forget trying to fit me into any sort of hierarchy.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday August 01 2021, @02:40AM