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posted by martyb on Monday July 26 2021, @05:01PM   Printer-friendly

Editor's note: this in the 50,000th story submission to SoylentNews! Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this milestone!

England’s Covid unlocking is threat to world, say 1,200 scientists:

Boris Johnson’s plan to lift virtually all of England’s pandemic restrictions on Monday is a threat to the world and provides fertile ground for the emergence of vaccine-resistant variants, international experts say.

Britain’s position as a global transport hub would mean any new variant here would rapidly spread around the world, scientists and physicians warned at an emergency summit. They also expressed grave concerns about Downing Street’s plans.

Government advisers in New Zealand, Israel and Italy were among those who sounded alarm bells about the policy, while more than 1,200 scientists backed a letter to the Lancet journal warning the strategy could allow vaccine-resistant variants to develop.

[...] New coronavirus infections in the UK are at a six-month high, according to government figures, and the number of people in hospital and dying with Covid are at their highest level since March. Thursday’s data showed 3,786 people in hospital with Covid and another 63 virus-related deaths.

Downing Street, which has defended the lifting of all remaining legal restrictions on social gatherings in England on 19 July, is hoping the rapid rollout of vaccines will keep a lid on the number of people becoming seriously ill.


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:08PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:08PM (#1160050)

    Spreading influence just like they said Brexit would do. Take that libs!

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by ikanreed on Monday July 26 2021, @06:10PM (2 children)

      by ikanreed (3164) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @06:10PM (#1160082) Journal

      Millions dead so a few overdressed nonces can feel superior? It's just like the good old days of the empire.

      • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:21PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:21PM (#1160121)

        I'm sure fancy clothes look great on you.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:14AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:14AM (#1160253)

        Several million dead Pommies, would anyone care?

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:16PM (8 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:16PM (#1160055)

    It's a small island. It shouldn't be too difficult to set up a naval blockade. Just bomb the runways to keep aircraft grounded, and shoot down anything that crosses the Channel. We can airdrop needed supplies since they can barely feed themselves

    • (Score: 4, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:58PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:58PM (#1160075)

      Why airdrop supplies? Just tell the news not to show the starving or dead kids on TV, like with Yemen and Syria.

    • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:43PM

      by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:43PM (#1160127)

      Like they said in Snowcrash, "It's not smart to declare war on a nuclear power".

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Gaaark on Monday July 26 2021, @08:01PM (2 children)

      by Gaaark (41) on Monday July 26 2021, @08:01PM (#1160135) Journal

      It shouldn't be too difficult to set up a naval blockade. Just bomb the runways to keep aircraft grounded, and shoot down anything that crosses the Channel.

      Been there, tried that. Had a Heil of a time.
      --A. HItler, H. Goering, K. Doenitz

      --
      --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
      • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:30AM (1 child)

        by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:30AM (#1160225)

        Hitler moved just a little too early. If he had delayed a couple of years he could have had the A bomb first.

        Now that basically everybody has the A bomb, all we have to do is ensure that GB can't deliver theirs anywhere outside their island.

        --
        🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @04:04PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @04:04PM (#1160384)

          You'd have to find all the submarines to do that. Good luck!

    • (Score: 2) by turgid on Monday July 26 2021, @09:18PM

      by turgid (4318) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @09:18PM (#1160162) Journal

      I have a rubber dinghy, oars and a crate of beer.

    • (Score: 3, Touché) by c0lo on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:42AM (1 child)

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:42AM (#1160249) Journal

      We can airdrop needed supplies since they can barely feed themselves

      Drop some Poles or others that work on low wages, the brits would rather starve and let their crops rot [euronews.com]

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:35AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:35AM (#1160255)

        Whinging that they can't get cheap Euro labour is not really much different to complaining that the darkies won't work since they abolished slavery.

        I'd pick vegies for £20 an hour if I wasn't working, I won't pick them for £2 a day.

  • (Score: 1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:21PM (7 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @05:21PM (#1160060)

    "lIsTeN tO tHe ExPeRtS" [dailymail.co.uk]

    Positive cases are down over 20% in the last week [data.gov.uk] there's multiple reasons for that, a general explanation is people now accept the virus is endemic.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:02PM (5 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:02PM (#1160112)
      How is deaths being up more than 50% in the last week an improvement again? And cases up over 26%? And this is from your own link …
      • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:29PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:29PM (#1160125)

        Deaths trail hospital admissions which trail positive tests. The effect of removing restrictions for a week can only currently be seen in tests - which is why you need to look at the historical pattern to see the reduction in hospital admissions and deaths. When you do that, glance at the Vax rates and see if you suspect a correlation

      • (Score: 2) by turgid on Monday July 26 2021, @09:11PM (3 children)

        by turgid (4318) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @09:11PM (#1160160) Journal

        Surely the parent was being ironic? It's a link to the Daily Mail after all, and look at the crazy way (s)he wrote "listen to the experts,"

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:07PM (2 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:07PM (#1160180)

          The crazy camel case shows that they think listening to the experts is a bad thing, unless the linked article is anti-science propaganda.

          • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:17AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:17AM (#1160218)

            What expertize do social workers, midwives and dentists have on the subject? There was not "more than 1,200 scientists" signing the letter, that claim is wrong, scientifically!

          • (Score: 4, Informative) by turgid on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:24AM

            by turgid (4318) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:24AM (#1160304) Journal

            The linked article is anti-science, anti-intellectual propaganda from the Daily Mail, a known and persistent apologist for and proponent of the far right.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @11:46AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @11:46AM (#1160327)

      Rand Paul, Anthony Fauci and the witch-hunt against science [wsws.org]

      Over the past month, the New York Times, Washington Post, and Wall Street Journal have all published editorials and op-eds endorsing the “credibility” of the theory that COVID-19 was released from the Wuhan Institute of Virology in China....

      In claiming Fauci bears responsibility for genetically engineering COVID-19, Paul, Rogin and the Wall Street Journal editorial board are basing themselves on the conspiracy theory advocated by Nicholas Wade [wsws.org].

      Wade claimed that two of the world’s leading virus researchers, Ralph Baric and Shi Zheng-li, developed a “method for engineering bat coronaviruses to attack other species.” This work at the WIV, Wade alleges, was “funded by the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), a part of the US National Institutes of Health (NIH).”

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Troublesome_Inheritance [wikipedia.org]

      The book has been widely denounced by scientists, including many of those upon whose work the book was based.[10][11][12] In August 2014, The New York Times Book Review published an open letter signed by 139 faculty members in population genetics and evolutionary biology.[10][11] After publication, the letter was signed by four more faculty members. It read:

      Wade juxtaposes an incomplete and inaccurate account of our research on human genetic differences with speculation that recent natural selection has led to worldwide differences in I.Q. test results, political institutions and economic development. We reject Wade's implication that our findings substantiate his guesswork. They do not.

      We are in full agreement that there is no support from the field of population genetics for Wade's conjectures.[23]

      No wonder the D team needs CRT, and no wonder NYT needs the 1619 Project. Out of the other side of their mouths, they're rehabilitating "scientific" racism.

  • (Score: 0, Flamebait) by Opportunist on Monday July 26 2021, @05:34PM

    by Opportunist (5545) on Monday July 26 2021, @05:34PM (#1160065)

    With the numbers looking more and more like this is over, we sure need some way to invigorate the pandemic. I want to stay in my home office, for fuck's sake, get infected, idiots!

  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @05:40PM (2 children)

    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @05:40PM (#1160068)

    According to the New York Times, our North-East Florida counties are on-par with the UK as a whole for COVID infection rates. Yeah, we're a world menace as well. Today they're shutting down a WalMart for an all-day disinfection, not saying why exactly, but the fact that local hospitals are just about at-capacity again is a clue.

    --
    🌻🌻 [google.com]
    • (Score: 1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:35AM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:35AM (#1160226)

      but the fact that local hospitals are just about at-capacity again is a clue.

      A clue that hospitals are not in the business of leaving resources underutilized.

      • (Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday July 28 2021, @03:58AM

        by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 28 2021, @03:58AM (#1160558) Journal

        A clue that hospitals are not in the business of leaving resources underutilized.

        By design, hospitals typically don't operate at capacity. Because what happens when there's a big emergency, not just covid, that requires a bunch of hospital beds? You'd get a bunch of unnecessary deaths every time some large accident happened, for example.

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Monday July 26 2021, @05:53PM (58 children)

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @05:53PM (#1160072) Journal

    2 + 2 + 2 = what?

    The COVID is just a SARS virus, with a specialized hook. The vax sensitizes your immune system to the hook. Any SARS with the hook should be targeted by your immune system, once sensitized to the hook. Any SARS without the hook is no longer a COVID.

    So, what is the real story here? Is the vax ineffective? Or, at least a lot less effective than anticipated? The whole strategy of targeting that hook is failing?

    ‘unethical experiment’ could allow vaccine-resistant variants to develop

    What is that claim based on, exactly?

    I think I'm seeing a bunch of experts who have wielded unprecedented influence for 1 1/2 years, feeling threatened with a loss of influence. It's time to whip up public sentiment and hysteria, so that the masses remain compliant.

    Bottom line is, you can't keep the world locked down indefinitely. If the vax is so very effective, get everyone vaccinated that you can. Then, sit back, lighten up, and let nature take it's course. If the vax isn't all that effective - well - you gave it your best shot. It's still time to sit back, lighten up, and let nature take it's course. Mankind is almost certainly not going extinct because of COVIDS.

    The survivors will remember all of us who died - for awhile.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @06:05PM (46 children)

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:05PM (#1160079)

      the strategy could allow vaccine-resistant variants to develop.

      The Trump and DeSantis (Florida) COVID strategy seems to have been all along to allow it to spread throughout the population to gain herd immunity and wear some kind of fig leaf about vulnerable populations being protected by "measures."

      The complaint I have had about this strategy all along, beyond the hundreds of thousands of younger people living with after-effects of a serious COVID infection, not to mention the thousands dying, is the millions infected who are acting as a breeding pool for variants. Mutations are random, but the more times you roll the dice the sooner you hit that magic combination that's something you wish the world never saw during your lifetime.

      --
      🌻🌻 [google.com]
      • (Score: -1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:23PM (19 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:23PM (#1160092)

        Every emergent human virus in history followed an evolutionary curve towards higher transmission and lower pathogenicity. If anything, the selection pressure of lockdowns and masks could have strongly selected for the former but not the latter. Fortunately, signs are the delta variant follows the standard curve. This pandemic is coming to an end!

        • (Score: 4, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @06:37PM (9 children)

          by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:37PM (#1160102)

          This pandemic is coming to an end!

          Confidently spoken AC! Sadly, the infection rates say otherwise.

          Every emergent human virus in history followed an evolutionary curve towards higher transmission and lower pathogenicity.

          Bravo for the bravado! The walk is random, the evolutionary pressure is toward lower pathogenicity where said pathogenicity could kill or otherwise impair the host from spreading the virus, but that doesn't mean that random walks through nasty lifelong after-effects which don't prevent the host from spreading the disease are suppressed in any way.

          Much like the Ophiocordyceps unilateralis fungus' effects on ants, I think some of our leaders have been infected by COVID and are driving the population toward perpetuation of the pandemic.

          --
          🌻🌻 [google.com]
          • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:57PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:57PM (#1160111)

            infection rates for the week are down [soylentnews.org]. Compared to previous waves, hospital admissions and deaths are down. To the crux of your argument, why are you discounting a mutational anomaly in any of the other common human viruses? Are you locking yourself in perpetual bs4 containment because influenza kills thousands every year?

            By relaxing restrictions in summer the UK prevents overwhelming the social healthcare system in winter. None of the "experts' recall that was the only justification for restrictions to begin with.

          • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:05PM (7 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:05PM (#1160113)

            Every emergent human virus in history followed an evolutionary curve towards higher transmission and lower pathogenicity.

            Ebola, smallpox, and polio would love to get up close and personal and have a chat with you if you're unvaccinated. And AIDS, untreated, is a death sentence.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @07:20PM

              by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:20PM (#1160119)

              The common cold seasonal flu has fluctuated for decades, sometimes hitting 50-60,000 deaths in the U.S. alone, other seasons having a much lower death rate closer to 10,000.

              --
              🌻🌻 [google.com]
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:50PM (2 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:50PM (#1160131)

              Polio is fecal-oral transmission, AIDS and Ebola are transmitted in body fluids. Protective hygiene measures most humans practice act as effective barriers to evolutionary selection, as were the sores smallpox caused.

              • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday July 26 2021, @10:18PM (1 child)

                by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @10:18PM (#1160184) Journal

                How Is Polio Spread? -- Fecal-Oral Polio Transmission
                Polio transmission most often occurs through contact with stool from an infected person. This spread of poliovirus can happen in one of several ways, which include:

                Eating food or drinking liquids that are contaminated with poliovirus. Poliovirus is commonly found in sewage water.

                Touching surfaces or objects contaminated with poliovirus (for instance, by changing diapers), and then placing the contaminated hand in the mouth.

                Sharing foods or eating utensils with someone infected with poliovirus.

                How Is Polio Spread? -- Oral-Oral Polio Transmission
                Less commonly, polio transmission occurs through contact with respiratory droplets or saliva. When an infected person sneezes or coughs, droplets spray into the air. The infected mucus or saliva can land in other people's noses or throats when they breathe or put their fingers in their mouth, nose, or eyes after touching an infected surface.

                Your claim is mostly right. But, polio isn't restricted to spreading by slobs who never wash, either. In centuries gone by, raw sewerage was often dumped into rivers, for people downstream to get their drinking/cooking water from.

                People with pretty good hygiene could get polio easily.

                 

                • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:28AM

                  by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:28AM (#1160223)

                  Good hygiene is in the eye of the evaluator. As for "most people" most people on this planet live in conditions which polio spreads easily, even to those who have the highest standards of hygiene for their local region.

                  Does AC not recall the time when Polio was a disease which struck most often and most deadly in the countries with the "best" hygiene on the planet?

                  --
                  🌻🌻 [google.com]
            • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:32PM (2 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:32PM (#1160166)

              Ebola, smallpox, and polio would love to get up close and personal and have a chat with you if you're unvaccinated.

              The more ignorant the faithful, the wilder the rants. Stop running your mouth for a bit, and let the light of knowledge shine into your eyes. Maybe it'll hit a neuron or two in that empty expanse beyond the lenses... a faint hope I know, but still.

              The poliovirus is merely the hyped strain among the huge group of enteroviruses that all have the same quirk; usually asymptomatic (95% for polio), in some small percent of cases (less than 1% for polio, mostly in adults) they are able to attack the nervous system and cause a flaccid paralysis. Eradicating (as if!) this one strain, definitely does a big, fat lot of nothing to all those other enteroviruses out there.
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poliovirus#Pathogenesis [wikipedia.org]
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poliomyelitis#Paralytic_polio [wikipedia.org]
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio-like_syndrome [wikipedia.org]
              "Polioviruses and other enteroviruses isolated from faecal samples of patients with acute flaccid paralysis in Australia, 1996-2004"
              https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16737480/ [nih.gov]

              The when, how, and why polio outbreaks started to happen, is also a bit revealing:
              https://uh.edu/engines/epi1527.htm [uh.edu]

              And then a little bit about the polio vaccine.
              2019: "More polio cases now caused by vaccine than by wild virus as 4 African countries report them"
              https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/polio-cases-now-caused-vaccine-wild-virus-67287290 [go.com]
              2020: "Vaccine-derived polio spreads in Africa after defeat of wild virus"
              https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/sep/02/vaccine-derived-polio-spreads-in-africa-after-defeat-of-wild-virus [theguardian.com]

              Corollary: forget the word "polio", the thing is very definition of a counter to your propaganda work.

              • (Score: 2, Informative) by Myfyr on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:35AM

                by Myfyr (3654) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:35AM (#1160305)

                I would encourage people to actually read those last two articles. Although they don't quite show what the parent poster thinks they show, they are interesting. Specifically, they highlight the difference between the more expensive vaccine used in the west (injected; inactivated virus; impossible to transmit/mutate), and the cheaper vaccine used in africa (oral; contains weakened virus; easier to administer; safe for the recipient, but the live virus can spread to others and mutate).

                So we have the following section from the last article, which is directly relevant to the whole discussion about England opening up:

                When a child receives the oral vaccine, the weakened virus replicates in the intestine, encouraging the production of antibodies, and can be present in excreta. In an area where there are high enough levels of immunity in the population, this usually does not present a problem, even if sanitation is poor.

                But in areas where there is both poor sanitation and a lack of general immunisation the virus can survive and circulate for months, mutating over time until it poses the same risk of paralysis-causing disease as wild polio.

                While the situations aren't exactly equivalent, maybe it's not a good idea for England to open up too early?

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @08:24AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @08:24AM (#1160308)

                from your link

                Amid the coronavirus pandemic, many major vaccination campaigns needed to stamp out polio have been disrupted across Africa and elsewhere, leaving millions of children vulnerable to infection.

                While so-called vaccine-derived polio is a known risk, the emergence of these cases so soon after the announced eradication of wild polio in Africa is a setback.

                At issue is the fact that the oral polio vaccine – preferred in some places because of its ease of delivery and the lack of need for sterile syringes – uses an attenuated or weakened version of polio.

                When a child receives the oral vaccine, the weakened virus replicates in the intestine, encouraging the production of antibodies, and can be present in excreta. In an area where there are high enough levels of immunity in the population, this usually does not present a problem, even if sanitation is poor.

                But in areas where there is both poor sanitation and a lack of general immunisation the virus can survive and circulate for months, mutating over time until it poses the same risk of paralysis-causing disease as wild polio.

                Use of the oral polio vaccine was discontinued in the UK in 2004 and the US in 2000, and the UN agency advises that the use of the oral vaccine should be discontinued after polio is judged to be eradicated because of the risk of vaccine-derived outbreaks.

                So, I'm not sure what you are arguing about, but it sounds like you think that polio was not a major problem? Because the 1% got paralyzed that means it is not a problem? 1% is 3,000,000 paralyzed in USA alone. The cost of that is many times more than the cost to vaccinate the entire world. Think about it.

        • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:50PM (8 children)

          by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:50PM (#1160130)

          Lower pathogenicity?

          Smallpox was still murderous with 30% fatalities after more than two thousand years preying on us.

          • (Score: 0, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:58PM (7 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:58PM (#1160157)

            Smallpox was still murderous with 30% fatalities after more than two thousand years preying on us.

            WTF? What is *your* explanation then for why it got named "SMALLpox" as opposed to the "great pox" which was *syphilis*?

            Hard facts (as opposed to "oral histories") look like a much more recent virulence gain event, instead.
            https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38243108 [bbc.com]

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:48PM (6 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:48PM (#1160169)

              Increased virulence due to selection pressure for immune breakthrough is what the scientists appear concerned about. Why that's a UK issue when international borders remain open and vaccination rates are lower in other countries is a mystery.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:03PM (5 children)

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:03PM (#1160178)

                Increased virulence due to selection pressure for immune breakthrough is what the scientists appear concerned about.

                Isn't the peddling of leaky COVID vaccines the thing they REALLY should be concerned about, then?

                The poliovirus, for one notable example, not ate the civilization as of this morning, despite all the selection pressure. As opposed to Marek's disease in chicken.
                "The vaccine's inability to prevent infection and transmission allows the spread of highly virulent strains among vaccinated chickens."
                https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek's_disease#Prevention [wikipedia.org]
                Vaccine's inability. NOT the chicken violating lockdown. :)
                They are locked down in their cages for most of their lives. A fat lot of good it has done with regard to the disease.

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:37PM (4 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:37PM (#1160192)

                  Isn't the peddling of leaky COVID vaccines the thing they REALLY should be concerned about, then?

                  No, "leaky" vaccines inoculate without reducing transmission. Covid vaccines reduce viral load [medrxiv.org] (4 fold reduction) and PCR positivity [oup.com] (~80% lower in asymptomatic individuals). I understand the concern but there's nothing "leaky" whichever vaccine study you look at - they all indicate reduced transmission.

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:16PM (3 children)

                    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:16PM (#1160202)

                    No, "leaky" vaccines inoculate without reducing transmission.

                    No, you are factually wrong.
                    "administration of the vaccine does not prevent an infected bird from shedding the virus,[3] though it does reduce the amount of virus shed in the dander, hence reducing horizontal spread of the disease."
                    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek's_disease#Prevention [wikipedia.org]

                    Therefore, the "reduce viral load and PCR positivity" are feel-good words about nothing. The point very much stands.

                    • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:56PM (2 children)

                      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:56PM (#1160211)

                      Inoculation is not immunization. From your own link (p3 of the "prevention" sub-section):

                      The Marek's disease vaccine is a leaky vaccine, which means that only the symptoms of the disease are prevented. Infection of the host and the transmission of the virus are not inhibited by the vaccine. This contrasts with most other vaccines, where infection of the host is prevented.

                      The studies I already cited show both transmission and infection are reduced by COVID vaccines, they are not "leaky".

                      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:29AM (1 child)

                        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:29AM (#1160246)

                        Could you please have read the words I specifically quoted for you, before arguing that black is somehow white if you squint hard enough?
                        Let me repeat them here, in case they were too unnoticeable for your weary eyes the last time:
                        "it does reduce the amount of virus shed in the dander, hence reducing horizontal spread of the disease."

                        Also it's very interesting in what version of logic and the English language your "are reduced" can be taken to violate the stated condition you quoted just above that, which is "not inhibited"?

                        Summarizing: this excuse won't fly, is there another one?

                        • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:26AM

                          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:26AM (#1160311)

                          it does reduce the amount of virus shed in the dander

                          The vaccine prevents symptoms such as formation of ulcers and legions around feather follicles which is why there's less virus in the dander. Again, birds are not immunized by the vaccine, their immune systems do not fight the virus. They are inoculated by the vaccine so that symptoms of disease do not develop.

      • (Score: 1, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Monday July 26 2021, @06:31PM (10 children)

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @06:31PM (#1160099) Journal

        seems to have been all along to allow it to spread throughout the population to gain herd immunity

        Uhhhmmmm, maybe. But let's remember that all the vaxxes were developed under Trump's administration. The Biden administration has developed nothing new, alright? In effect, Biden is resting on Trump's laurels.

        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Tork on Monday July 26 2021, @06:39PM

          by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @06:39PM (#1160103)

          Uhhhmmmm, maybe. But let's remember that all the vaxxes were developed under Trump's administration.

          Ummm... k. Except the reluctance to get vaccinated is a partisan thing and the unvaccinated are bearing the brunt of it all right now.

          --
          🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @06:40PM

          by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:40PM (#1160104)

          all the vaxxes were developed under Trump's administration

          In spite of the Trump administration's slash and burn of science funding before the pandemic hit.

          --
          🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:10PM (6 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:10PM (#1160114)
          The pfizer vaccine was developed by two turkish emigrees in Germany, with ZERO support from the US or Trump, was the first approved, and is still the best option. And Trump continued to downplay the dangerous nature of Covid even after he secretly got the vaccine himself. So fuck you and your lame attempt to rewrite history.
          • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:16PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:16PM (#1160118)

            Trump continued to downplay the dangerous nature of Covid

            Far better to trigger mass hysteria with prophecies of doom, right?

            • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Tork on Monday July 26 2021, @07:30PM

              by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @07:30PM (#1160126)

              It says a lot that you cannot find a middle-ground with him. 🙄

              --
              🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:01PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:01PM (#1160198)
              More than 600,000 dead, now the number 1 cause of death, sounds to me like a pretty accurate prophecy of doom. Funny thing, when it crossed 100,000, I told everyone it would surpass half a million because I understand exponential growth. It should have been obvious to everyone. But of course numeracy is at an all time low.
          • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Monday July 26 2021, @09:10PM

            by ElizabethGreene (6748) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @09:10PM (#1160159) Journal

            Was that before the Sputnik Vaccine [wikipedia.org]?

          • (Score: 2) by legont on Tuesday July 27 2021, @03:42AM

            by legont (4179) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @03:42AM (#1160266)

            No, Moderna is better and Russian's Sputnik V is the best at this point.

            --
            "Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @11:19AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @11:19AM (#1160320)

            Take your Trump vaccine, bigot! [healthfeedback.org]

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:05AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:05AM (#1160310)

          As I recall, the Covid issue wasn't just something that happened in the USA. I know you have no love for Trump, but try not to turn this into Trump-Biden thing. That's just lazy.

      • (Score: 2) by slinches on Monday July 26 2021, @06:42PM (11 children)

        by slinches (5049) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:42PM (#1160105)

        You could also rephrase that approach as adjusting policy in response to the risk profile of the virus. The "measures" you scare quoted are pretty well understood (physical isolation, sanitization and testing) and the extent of those actions can be adjusted based on the level of risk and the costs of implementation (in terms of lost productivity in addition to the direct cost). Yes, doing so means that there's some increased risk of mutations and some are impacted by the disease that may have otherwise avoided it. Although, those saved lives come at the cost of livelihoods and lives of others. Maybe fewer die of COVID, but many more suffer from hunger or get behind in rent and eventually lose their homes. People who have built their own business can't keep their doors open and shut down or have to take on multiple jobs working 60+ hrs a week just to make ends meet. Is that really a better outcome? How many should suffer in order to save one life? These are the decisions our policy makers are having to make. There is no perfect answer that avoids all loss, just some potential strategies to help minimize it that no one knows will work before implementing them. So, I'm glad there are different jurisdictions handling things in different ways that represent the will of the people in that area.

        • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @06:56PM (2 children)

          by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:56PM (#1160110)

          many more suffer from hunger

          When did malnutrition become an issue in the U.S.? During shutdown, friends of ours rode around on schoolbuses distributing "free school lunch" to families in need.

          I'm glad there are different jurisdictions handling things in different ways that represent the will of the people in that area.

          I agree with your points about balance, although I question how "inevitable" some of your enumerated consequences are, or should be since they are mostly social constructs which can be modified.

          As for "will of the people" I look forward to the actual 2022 Florida Governor's race, I wonder how skewed the current polls are which show him with a ~5% lead.

          --
          🌻🌻 [google.com]
          • (Score: 2) by slinches on Monday July 26 2021, @07:52PM (1 child)

            by slinches (5049) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:52PM (#1160132)

            When did malnutrition become an issue in the U.S.? During shutdown, friends of ours rode around on schoolbuses distributing "free school lunch" to families in need.

            Based on how many stories I'd heard about food banks being out of essentials and needing donations, I'm sure it's been at least higher than normal during the peak of the lockdowns. I'm glad your friends were willing to donate their time and get food to those who needed it.

            As for "will of the people" I look forward to the actual 2022 Florida Governor's race, I wonder how skewed the current polls are which show him with a ~5% lead

            I guess we will see. I don't live in Florida, so I have no experience with the political tenor of the population there, but generally most politicians will do what is most likely to get them reelected. However, I'm guessing what happens between now and election day 2022 will be more important to that outcome than just the pandemic related policies to date.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Monday July 26 2021, @09:27PM

              by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday July 26 2021, @09:27PM (#1160165)

              I'm glad your friends were willing to donate their time and get food to those who needed it.

              As am I, however disappointed I might be that we can't (won't) structure the economy in such a way that these forms of "emergency food for hungry children" aren't needed in the first place.

              generally most politicians will do what is most likely to get them reelected.

              Generally, that is true, however... our Governor has been acting more like a candidate trying to run for President by emulating the style and populist appeals of the 2016 Presidential race winner than a Governor of his state. Losing the race in Florida would seem to be bad political strategy to me, but, then, so would inciting a riot and sending a mob to storm the Capitol building - so clearly I don't think like everyone involved in this process.

              --
              🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:53PM (7 children)

          by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:53PM (#1160133)

          Want to reopen businesses?

          Australia and New Zealand showed the way.

          Knock it down hard and have testing where you can catch single cases, then isolate when and where there's a need, and you can have pubs and theaters open otherwise.

          • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:49PM (4 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:49PM (#1160155)

            Want to reopen businesses?
            Australia and New Zealand showed the way.

            MWAHAHAHAHA! *snicker*
            https://nypost.com/2021/07/21/australia-under-lockdown-sees-worrying-jump-in-covid-19-cases/ [nypost.com]

            Update your preaching please, unless you aim to be a laughingstock.

            • (Score: 5, Informative) by Mykl on Monday July 26 2021, @10:28PM (3 children)

              by Mykl (1112) on Monday July 26 2021, @10:28PM (#1160189)

              Your link is 6 days old.

              Since then Melbourne has managed to record 2 days in a row with no 'in the wild' cases (11 new cases yesterday who were in isolation for their entire infectious period). We're back on top of it and are on track to ease restrictions again in the next day or two.

              It should also be noted that we're super worried about 140 cases in a day in Sydney - most US states would be delighted for a number that small.

              By all means feel free to criticize our vaccine rollout, which has been terrible (we're in last place of OECD countries). But as-needed lockdowns have managed to keep our infections and deaths much, much lower than the rest of the world despite our dreadfully low vaccination rate.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:05PM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:05PM (#1160200)

                It should also be noted that we're super worried about 140 cases in a day in Sydney - most US states would be delighted for a number that small.

                When in my nice little European country it is 37 cases in a day with no such thing as a lockdown, I can only look at you the super crazied with a mix of pity and apprehension; the latter for if the persistent raving madness is in some way contagious.

                • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:34AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @02:34AM (#1160254)

                  37 cases probably puts you in Moldova or Slovenia, with 1/2 to 1/4 of NSW's 8 million population respectively. They also have around 260,000 cases each and 5000 to 6000 deaths. Australia as a whole with its 25.5 million population only has 33,000 cases and 920 deaths for the whole period. Super crazed it may be, but it works and then they can open up like nothing happened instead of watching dozens die a day like you did and we are.

              • (Score: 2) by boltronics on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:34AM

                by boltronics (580) on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:34AM (#1160584) Homepage Journal

                Yep I'm in Melbourne and back in the office today. Lockdown is over. Still some restrictions such as mask requirements and limits on gathering.

                --
                It's GNU/Linux dammit!
          • (Score: 2) by slinches on Monday July 26 2021, @10:16PM (1 child)

            by slinches (5049) on Monday July 26 2021, @10:16PM (#1160183)

            Australia and New Zealand showed the way.

            Quite, but you missed step 1. "be an island nation"

            • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:28PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:28PM (#1160206)

              Australia and New Zealand showed the way.

              Quite, but you missed step 1. "be an island nation"

              Not being "island nations" must be very worrying for Canada and Mexico.

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:07PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:07PM (#1160138)

        There is a world of difference between herd immunity (from vaccination) and a mass infection event (from deliberate mismanagement).

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:37PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:37PM (#1160149)

        Everyone shall die. Yes, that includes you. No, locking yourself into a cell won't make you immortal. No, locking up everyone else won't do that either.

        A "horrible disease" that is detectable in mere 10% of yearly crop of corpses killed by whatever, is disease of the minds that are incapable to disbelieve the media. Nothing else.

    • (Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:21PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:21PM (#1160090)

      I think I'm seeing a bunch of experts who have wielded unprecedented influence for 1 1/2 years, feeling threatened with a loss of influence.

      That's because your news sources paint you wonderful little pictures of guys in lab-coats trying to protect their yachts.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @04:14AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @04:14AM (#1160277)

        Of all the tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under the omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber barons cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

        -cs Lewis

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @03:17PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @03:17PM (#1160375)
          lol I know you're trying to sound intellectual but you're basically just smugly saying: "I think my guy will bring lube."
    • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Monday July 26 2021, @07:21PM

      by Freeman (732) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:21PM (#1160122) Journal

      2 dozen + 2 baker's dozen + 2 pounds = Someone else's headache.

      --
      Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
    • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:47PM (3 children)

      by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Monday July 26 2021, @07:47PM (#1160129)

      There's more than one way to make a spike protein, and some of them are more or less sticky with vaccine-produced antibodies.

      So far the vaccines have kept most of their effectiveness against all the variants. Whether that's guaranteed to go on, outside what I know.

      It is hard to imagine a variant that could evade any possible vaccine and we can win arms races given how quick the turnaround of a new mRNA vaccine is.

      • (Score: 1, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Monday July 26 2021, @08:21PM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Monday July 26 2021, @08:21PM (#1160143) Journal

        There's more than one way to make a spike protein,

        Something like that has crossed my mind. OK, so I'm curious - how many ways are there to make a spike protein that binds specifically to the human ACE2 receptor? Apparently, that isn't something that happens commonly in nature. A quick off-the-cuff search for pathogens that target the ACE2 gives me nothing except the COVID in the first 3 pages of results.

        Do you know enough to narrow down the search with meaningful terms?

      • (Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:45PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:45PM (#1160153)

        So far the vaccines have kept most of their effectiveness against all the variants.

        BZZT WRONG!
        https://www.straitstimes.com/world/israel-sees-decline-in-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-rate-due-to-delta-variant [straitstimes.com]

        • (Score: 2) by FatPhil on Tuesday July 27 2021, @08:58AM

          You do realise that a "decline (of 30%)" is exactly the same thing as "keeping most (namely over 60%) of their effectiveness".

          So instead "BZZT WRONG!" you should have had "YOU'RE RIGHT!". Words clearly have different meanings on planet CT-woowoo.
          --
          Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by c0lo on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:56AM

      by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 27 2021, @01:56AM (#1160250) Journal

      If the vax isn't all that effective - well - you gave it your best shot. Then, sit back, lighten up, and let nature take it's course.

      Or you can try to develop a better vaccine, you already have the productions lines ready.
      Or you can invest in your hospitals capacity to avoid being overwhelmed and forced to ration the heath care capacity.
      Or you can cancel Runaway spouting his false dilemmas, his poor imagination is a handicap but he's too dunning-kruegerd to see it. How about we suggest him take a vacation in the wilds of La Plata/c0lorado, I hear [soylentnews.org] the insect life there is marvelous this time of the year.

      Or all the above and many more on top, nothing of which is or needs to be perfect by itself.

      --
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:32PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @07:32PM (#1160435)

      Dear SN,

      You lost me at "vaccine resistant COVIDS (Score: 5, Insightful) -- by Runaway1956 (2926) ".

      Good luck clearing out the infestation.

      Ciao baby!

      • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:00PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:00PM (#1160463)

        That appears to be an admission that you are incapable of arguing your position against some dumb old senile fool. We probably won't miss you.

  • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:17PM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:17PM (#1160085)

    Yeah, and this is upstart's 49,995th

    The other five are takyon's AMD stories

    • (Score: 4, Touché) by takyon on Monday July 26 2021, @06:18PM (1 child)

      by takyon (881) <takyonNO@SPAMsoylentnews.org> on Monday July 26 2021, @06:18PM (#1160088) Journal

      ^This is the 1 millionth dumb AC comment.

      --
      [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:14PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:14PM (#1160140)

        does that make it 160,088 smart comments overall, averaging 3.2 smart comments per submission?

    • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:26PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:26PM (#1160144)

      If we had accepted aristarchus submissions, this milestone would have been reached long ago! Just saying.

      --aristarchus

      • (Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:40PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @08:40PM (#1160151)

        If we had accepted aristarchus submissions, this milestone would have been reached long ago!

        Unfortunately aristarchus submissions are so deficient in quality that not even the BDSM community will accept them.

  • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:26PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:26PM (#1160095)

    "England’s Covid Unlocking is Threat to World, Say 1,200 Scientists"

    Jeeze - if 1,200 scientists say it's true then it must be true....
    (Pro Tip - it's just as easy to buy scientists as it is to buy politicians. It's even easier to pull "facts" out of your arses).

    Stay scared of your own shadows, weaklings!

    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:20PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @07:20PM (#1160120)

      The anti-intellectualism is strong with this one.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:22PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:22PM (#1160187)

        Chanting "Science!!!" at top of your voice does not magically make you an intellectual.

        • (Score: 2) by kazzie on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:13AM

          by kazzie (5309) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:13AM (#1160574)

          But it could get you employed at Aperture Science!

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Barenflimski on Monday July 26 2021, @06:29PM (14 children)

    by Barenflimski (6836) on Monday July 26 2021, @06:29PM (#1160097)

    How long does everyone scream "COVID Variants! Lockdown!"?? We will have variants for the rest of time. Its fairly clear that thinking one is going to vaccinate the entire planet every time one needs a booster is not happening now, nor ever.

    It seems that it is time to get to a more nuanced strategy. I have zero interest in "the public good" if you've got me locked in a cage for the rest of my life. I'll take my chances being vaxxed and living out my days until whenever my time is up. I'd rather die amongst friends than alone in my house.

    How about this.... We set aside Tuesday and Saturday mornings for those that are, or think they are so immune-compromised that even us vaccinated folks are an issue. On Tuesday and Thursday mornings, us (98% or more of the population) pond scum can "lockdown" while that subset gets to feel safe and normal for four hours.

    Honestly, how dare I think about anything nuanced and different? Clearly I'm a troll.

    • (Score: 0, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:34PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @06:34PM (#1160101)

      " I'll take my chances being vaxxed and living out my days until whenever my time is up. I'd rather die amongst friends than alone in my house."

      what a fucking slave. just be around friends and family anyways. be a fucking man.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Monday July 26 2021, @08:02PM (4 children)

      by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Monday July 26 2021, @08:02PM (#1160136)

      One that I like is a Harvard epidemiologist's idea to saturate the country with rapid antigen test kits, so many that people can test themselves at home twice a week. That way an infected person will have spent at most a few days around others before finding out and isolating. Not a cure, but a risk reduction. The case for it is made at https://www.rapidtests.org/. [rapidtests.org]

      Do enough risk reductions, masking and testing and tracing and vaccination and whatnot, and eventually you can push the virus into decline. They add up (well, they multiply, but you know what I mean).

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:08PM (2 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:08PM (#1160201)
        The rapid tests are shit and you would not want to bet your life on them. Get the shot.
        • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:42PM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @11:42PM (#1160210)

          The shots are shit and you would not want to bet your life on them.
          https://www.straitstimes.com/world/israel-sees-decline-in-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-rate-due-to-delta-variant [straitstimes.com]

          Take 2 grams of vitamin C a day whenever you feel the symptoms of a viral infection, and neither The Dread COVID nor the recently-forgotten flu nor any other cold virus will be able to more than inconvenience you. Worked every time for me and my family for a number of years. Yes, worked against COVID too.

          • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @05:58AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @05:58AM (#1160294)

            Hope no one listens to that ^ jackass and gets themselves killed!

      • (Score: 2) by kazzie on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:18AM

        by kazzie (5309) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 28 2021, @05:18AM (#1160576)

        UK Prime Minister Johnson also set his eyes on this goal, calling it a "Moonshot" operation last year.

        These rapid, "lateral flow" tests, have some downsides in their accuracy (false positives, false negatives), which means that any rapid positive needs to be backed-up by a confirmatory "proper" PCR test.

        I've heard them described as a good test to take before doing something you'd be doing anyway (heading off to work), but a bad test to use to decide whether you can do something optional (attend a crowded concert).

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by sjames on Monday July 26 2021, @08:36PM (7 children)

      by sjames (2882) on Monday July 26 2021, @08:36PM (#1160148) Journal

      If the COVIDiots would get their vaccine, we wouldn't need a lockdown.

      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:48PM (2 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @09:48PM (#1160170)

        If the COVIDiots would get their vaccine, we wouldn't need a lockdown.

        Would you bet your house on that empty promise?
        https://www.jewishpress.com/news/israel/government-israel/holiday-lockdown-looms-with-israels-climbing-covid-numbers/2021/07/15/ [jewishpress.com]

        A more realist solution: if the politicians and their pet propagandists would be held responsible for their lying promises and the damage they cause, the "pandemic" would fizzle in a week.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:10PM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:10PM (#1160181)

          I hope you get correctly diagnosed someday, please post a journal about it when you finally get the help you need.

          • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:32PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 26 2021, @10:32PM (#1160191)

            Isn't it pathetic how you guys try reenacting the USSR?
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_abuse_of_psychiatry_in_the_Soviet_Union [wikipedia.org]

            The Soviet leaders promised communism, of all things. Your leaders promise only lockdowns, taxes, and prohibitions. And everyone is expected to happily fall in line, yes?
            This farce is what happens when inbred morons elect more inbred morons to rule them.

      • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:19AM (3 children)

        by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:19AM (#1160219)

        The (over)simple formula for herd immunity is that the immune people have to outnumber the non-immune people by a factor of at least the virus's reproductive number.

        With a plausible estimate of delta's reproductive number around 6, with 100% of the population vaccinated we'd need the vaccines to be at least 83% effective at preventing transmission. That looks to be over-optimistic.

        But you're right, we might not need lockdowns. There are lots of other interventions: masks, UV-C, HEPA filters, contact tracing, saturation testing like South Korea did, and so on. On top of a mostly vaccinated population that might be enough.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:50AM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @12:50AM (#1160231)

          The vaccines reduce deaths, hospitalization and transmission. That is optimism. Covid-zero people are living in fantasy land.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:59PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 27 2021, @09:59PM (#1160482)

            A fantasy land where most of the pubs and restaurants have been open lmost of the time. And very popular they have been too. Sounds like quite a pleasurable fantasy to me, not a hardship at all.

        • (Score: 2) by sjames on Tuesday July 27 2021, @05:51PM

          by sjames (2882) on Tuesday July 27 2021, @05:51PM (#1160414) Journal

          Yes, there is no magic bullet, but it gets a lot worse when we have one hand tied behind our backs.

(1) 2