Unruly passenger incidents rising again, FAA data shows:
FAA figures released Tuesday show more disruptions on commercial flights in the past week than any week in the past two and a half months.
The FAA says there were 128 new incidents reported by flight crews, bringing this year's total to 4,626 incidents. The new number is the highest weekly figure since the FAA started releasing weekly data on July 20.
About 72% of issues in the past week were over the federal transportation mask mandate, figures show.
[...] The agency has proposed more than $1 million in fines against unruly airline passengers this year.
One $45,000 fine announced in August was against a passenger accused of throwing his luggage at another passenger and, while lying on the aisle floor, "grabbing a flight attendant by the ankles and putting his head up her skirt."
Another passenger would not wear his face mask, the FAA, said, and "acted as though his hand was a gun and made a 'pew, pew' noise as if he was shooting a fellow passenger."
[...] Pekoske said 110 TSA officers have been assaulted this year.
Lots Of Talk About A Crackdown On America’s Air Rage Epidemic—But Not Enough Action:
Among the most egregious incidents: Last December, a Delta Air Lines passenger tried to open the cockpit door mid-flight and struck a flight attendant in the face before being restrained by crew members and a fellow passenger. On an Alaska Airlines flight in March, a Colorado man who refused to wear a face mask swatted at a flight attendant, then stood up and urinated in his seat area. In May, a Southwest Airlines passenger punched out a flight attendant’s teeth after being told to keep her seat belt fastened.
[...] The threat of four- and five-figure fines has not tamped down unruly behavior on planes. “Civil penalties alone are failing to deter criminal activity by airline passengers,” [...]
[...] The airline industry, meanwhile, says this is a job for the Department of Justice. “We believe that the United States Government is well equipped to prosecute unruly and disruptive onboard behavior,” [...]
What, if anything, should be done, or could improve the situation?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ealbers on Thursday October 07 2021, @11:01PM (14 children)
That will calm things down.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Thursday October 07 2021, @11:44PM (11 children)
Add some air marshalls and decoys [soylentnews.org]? Or just some signs in the boarding areas saying there are air marshalls selected to appear on flights, and the airline will start referring these as criminal concerns.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @12:48AM (8 children)
How about punishing flight attendants for antagonizing passengers on purpose.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:47AM
Coffee, Tea, Taser?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @05:05PM
There are two sides to every incident. It is always assumed that the passenger is the aggressor. The airline industry has no customer service, they appear to encouraged to escalate any interaction with passengers. They just can't wait to create an incident that gets on the news so they can make an example of someone who is just minding their own business just trying to get from here to there.
(Score: 2) by Tork on Friday October 08 2021, @08:18PM
Honestly if you're going to make up shit to blindly defend shitheaded behaviour at least try to be a little more plausible about it. Like maybe it's the vaccinated people acting crazy because at crusing altitude is higher than the range of 5G.... wait wtf am I telling obvious trolls how to be less obvious.
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 3, Interesting) by edIII on Friday October 08 2021, @08:45PM (4 children)
You mean by asking people to wear a mask during a pandemic to protect themselves and others? Amazing how that became synonymous with "I'm going to fuck your mother in the ass, and then give you the Dirty Sanchez".
Perhaps those that feel antagonized are simply wipped up by Fox News and the fallacies surrounding COVID and the civilized behavior of wearing a protective mask during a pandemic? Just Maybe?
For the record, I know what antagonized by the flight crew actually is. You don't have to handle it by causing a scene on a plane, but by simply speaking calmly to their supervisor at an appropriate time. What's the worst thing you have to deal with until then? Sitting down? I've had a single incident in a lifetime of flying. 99.99% of all my experience is with very nice and polite flight crews. I doubt that just suddenly changed, while we definitely see that overall customer behavior everywhere else has. Are restaurant employees all of the sudden antagonizing customers on purpose? Hair salons? Grocery Stores? Gas Stations? Walmarts?
A lot of these people I see on the videos just need to grow up and act like civilized human beings.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:56AM (3 children)
Immerman has some interesting figures here;
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=45369&page=1&cid=1185398#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
It may be extremely rare, but still be a significant problem if the overall rate of incidents is also rare. You said you have seen a single incident of staff behaving badly, how many instances of passengers causing incidents have you seen? It is the ratio that matters.
(Score: 2) by edIII on Saturday October 09 2021, @10:11PM (2 children)
I have never seen a passenger cause an incident in my life.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 10 2021, @01:09PM (1 child)
So, low numbers, but unless you are being sarcastic, 100% of the incidents you have witnessed were caused by staff not passengers.
(Score: 2) by edIII on Monday October 11 2021, @06:35PM
Okay. That's a single incident out of many decades of air travel. A single data point in maybe nearly a hundred flights.
That doesn't lead me to believe in all of these videos we now see that the staff is at fault for directly provoking the situation. Especially, when I can hear the audio and it's about face masks. In these videos it's very easy to determine that the staff didn't cause it. Asking for a face mask to be worn is not causing the incident.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Nuke on Friday October 08 2021, @04:16PM (1 child)
Are they not referred as criminal concerns already?
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Friday October 08 2021, @11:51PM
You'd think so, but the last link in the summary says they *should be* criminal concerns. I should have said felonies.
Not a lot of consolation either way when the "airline industry" should consider it "their job" to provide a safe employee environment.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:36AM
Arm the teachers. No wait, that's a different matter. Arm the air hostesses.
(Score: 2) by driverless on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:05PM
Refuse boarding to anyone called Karen?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by weilawei on Thursday October 07 2021, @11:07PM (46 children)
For starters, what's the historical data look like? Is this new? Have we always done this? Did we do this in the 70s? 80s? 90s? 00s? 10s?
I don't necessarily know (yet) if it's a situation that actually demands changing. What percentage of person-flights is 4626 per year? Is that a small or a large problem? I suspect it's rather smaller of a problem than the out-of-context number makes it out to be.
In short, in the words of the Cosmic AC, "THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 07 2021, @11:10PM (23 children)
(Score: 5, Interesting) by HiThere on Friday October 08 2021, @12:32AM (12 children)
It's not clear that would work, though it should be tried. The problem is that quick retribution is more effective at changing behavior than severe retribution which is delayed.
So...stop the plane at the next available airport and remove them from the plane, with a fine and banning from flights as the immediate follow on (not delayed). Some of that could be done by the airline without waiting for court action. Just how long the ban should last I'm not sure, I lean towards at least 2 years, but the fact of the ban, and it's quick imposition is more important than the duration. (Of course, this invites abuse on the part of the airlines, so photographic evidence should be required and audio highly desirable. Inside an airplane that shouldn't be difficult.)
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Friday October 08 2021, @02:18AM
If you s/stop the plane at the next available airport and//; then you can also s/with a fine and banning .*//; . Probably wouldn't even need to worry with maintaining a ban list.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Phoenix666 on Friday October 08 2021, @03:51AM (10 children)
That sounds like an excellent plan if alienating huge swathes of your customer base and going out of business is your goal.
Travel volumes have collapsed thanks to the coronavirus. Airlines are hurting badly. As if that's not enough, mismanaging their remaining flights is killing off more business; I have multiple reports of peoples' flights being delayed, rescheduled, or cancelled, for days. So declaring war on those silly enough to continue to fly is guaranteed to destroy what remains.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by HiThere on Friday October 08 2021, @01:32PM
True, there's more than one component to the situation.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:32PM (2 children)
As someone who still has to fly, people like this are currently alienating most other passengers who just want to get from A to B. Getting these s**ts off the plane will make life much better for most of us who still have to fly.
Ban them on the spot, and let them figure out a different way to get whereever they are going when they get dropped off at the next airport. They can rent a car and drive, and then the poor babies (boo-hoo-hoo) won't have to wear a mask. Make these whining, entitled "victims" pay for all the crap they put everyone else through. Press criminal charges.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday October 08 2021, @06:13PM (1 child)
I just love how the masks=the devil people are the same people who will freak the fuck out if their precious eyes are ever exposed to 50% of human nipples.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday October 08 2021, @06:16PM
Banning a woman from feeding her baby in public: FREEDOM!!
Requiring people to not endanger their fellow travelers: SLAVERY!!
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Nuke on Friday October 08 2021, @04:23PM (2 children)
Kicking louts off the plane would alienate "huge swathes" of passengers?? The only people alienated would be the louts.
I would say that not kicking them off is alienating the majority. From what I hear I prefer not to fly, and I'd be inclined to get off at the next airport myself if one of those louts is allowed to remain on board.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday October 08 2021, @06:45PM (1 child)
Except, you are only one delay from being a lout yourself.
People are losing it for a reason.
Maybe the answer is to have flights take off on time, and to treat passengers with dignity. I know, crazy talk, right?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @06:55PM
_-*Translation as follows*-_
"People are annoyed by the shittiness of airlines, please excuse their assaults upon employees and the endangerment of other passengers because we must care about their hurt little feelings. Please agree that white people are entitled to be criminal pricks in pursuit of their creature comforts."
*** end translation ***
(Score: 5, Interesting) by edIII on Friday October 08 2021, @08:56PM (2 children)
I don't fly already because of the TSA and the naked-porno-scanners becoming more forced. It certainly doesn't help that the odds of coming across some selfish ignorant anti-mask fucker is pretty good. Waiting until you hit ground only allows them to breathe pathogens into the common air for how long? These people need to understand they need to wear the mask 100% of the time, and if they don't follow instructions put them on the no-fly list until COVID is complete over.
Now if I knew the planes wouldn't even lift off without compliance, and that being caught without a mask meant being on the no-fly list, I just might actually feel comfortable flying.
That's why travel volumes have collapsed. Not because flight crews are mistreating people, but because it is DANGEROUS. I have clients/family/friends that have asked multiple times for me to come out and help them, even offering to pay for the flights, and my answer is an absolutely firm no.
It's not just planes either. It's anywhere people normally congregated. Who's responsible for this? The venue operators? Employees? NO. It's the people that refuse to wear a piece of cloth on their faces to help fight a pandemic that is killing people and causing rationing of care in hospitals.
I would rather have what remains destroyed, then get COVID on a flight because of some anti-masking mother fuckers. Fuck them. Fuck them with a saguaro cactus sideways. They are the reason I can't fly and won't see my family for at least another few years.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @03:59AM (1 child)
You are willingly getting into a metal tube packed like sardines with your fellow humans and you think the little piece of loose-fitting paper is going to protect you from breathing in the virus. No, you are relying on either your natural immune system or else a vaccination. The little paper is not doing shit. But, you can't be a man and accept that you badly want to travel and are willing to risk getting sick, so you tell yourself it's not really a risk if everyone wears the little paper. WISHFUL THINKING. Be honest with yourself and stop being a coward about it.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by edIII on Saturday October 09 2021, @10:08PM
Ahh, yes the testosterone filled idiots speak. It's always about being a man right? That's some ignorant bravado bullshit completely bereft of any sophisticated intelligence and reason.
It's not a little paper, and scientifically it makes a big fucking difference. Instead of your be-a-man argument, I'm going to respond with six layers of N99.9 (not N99.5) material with an active exhaust system using Ultraviolet-C light. Science mother fucker!
You lack any sophisticated understanding and rely on your "balls" and false courage. It's LESS or a risk of everyone is wearing the "piece of paper". That's just science and reason. If all of exhales from everybody passes through at least a N99.5 filter, then the number of pathogens put into the common area is vastly lower then without it. If that common area has vastly lower pathogens in it, then again, the odds of inhaling a pathogen through the same said material is vastly lower. Being overly simplistic it's like having a 1/5 chance of winning something versus the chances found in any common state lottery. It's probably orders or magnitude less risk.
So your manliness wants me to accept vastly higher risk because you're an asshole? No fuck you! :)
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 1, Troll) by oldeschool on Friday October 08 2021, @03:35AM (8 children)
arrested for what? definition of mandate: A judicial command, order, or precept, written or oral, from a court -- what court stated masks are to be worn on aircraft?
(Score: 3, Funny) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @05:44AM (5 children)
For most of them, it sounds like assault would be the preferred charge. Could always order them of the plane and charge them with trespassing if they don't vacate the plane.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @09:36AM (4 children)
Only if it happens before take-off. Otherwise, ordering them off the plane would be cruel and unusual punishment.
(Score: 2) by Nuke on Friday October 08 2021, @04:25PM (1 child)
Ordering them off the plane during flight sound good, but planes will need to be fitted with airlocks first.
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @10:55PM
Just means lowering the planes altitude first and maybe getting the passengers to agree to the open door, which they are likely to do to get rid of the twit.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @10:59PM (1 child)
We're talking America, does anything qualify for cruel and unusual punishment? The other year when they were torturing people to death with a weird cocktail of drugs, the Supreme Court ruled it was fine, I beleive the reasoning being that in 1789 it would not be cruel and unusual punishment. As they didn't have airplanes in 1789, it should get a pass.
Here in Canada, things like 3 strike laws and minimum sentences can and have been struck down as cruel and unusual punishment.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @07:37AM
Cruelty is the whole point of the American justice system, if you ignore the slavery.
(Score: 2) by epitaxial on Friday October 08 2021, @11:25AM
Trespass. Just like any retail store.
(Score: 5, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Friday October 08 2021, @03:39PM
You are required by law to follow the instructions of the flight crew while on an airplane. [aviationpros.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:42PM
Meh, the government isn't willing to take the PR hit for actually doing that. That's why this is an issue in the first place, they're trying to avoid backlash by pushing the enforcement off on private parties instead of handling it themselves. There's huge penalties to the airlines if they don't enforce the mask mandates, so of course they're going to enforce them. They just don't have law enforcement powers, so they're limited in what they can do, and get more push-back because the people pushing back can't get arrested for it.
This is just another step up in increasing a really fucking dangerous and stupid trend, where the government leans on private companies to do things that the government isn't willing to do directly, because it is either a.) unwilling to do because of PR or b.) unable to do because of Constitutional restrictions.
Oh, and of course, then step in with more laws to fix the problem they created. It's amazing how far along we are into "the bureaucracy is expanding to meet the needs of the expanding bureaucracy" territory.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 07 2021, @11:17PM (6 children)
The only reason this is an issue is because it is being tolerated. Unruly people need to be removed without any hesitancy, and put on a 6 month "No-Fly" list on first offence, after that, regular felony disruption of an airline, minimum, and three strikes you're out! Treading lightly sets a horrible example.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @12:50AM (4 children)
Give them a parachute and kick them off the plane. Landing beforehand optional.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:35AM
i came here to say this, of course it would devolve to a disposable single use chute made out of the same stuff they use in the loo, that way the no-fly list does not keep growing, so airlines save on data storage costs too.
(Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:19AM (1 child)
Forget the parachute. A few of those and even hardcore Trump believing anti-vaxers would start behaving.
(Score: 2) by Tork on Friday October 08 2021, @08:21PM
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:47AM
Give them a voucher for a parachute, redeemable at the help desk, then kick them off the plane.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by ilsa on Friday October 08 2021, @12:46PM
Screw that. Permanent ban. They are adults, not children.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:39AM (8 children)
How about a short warning notice that comes up just before you pay for the online ticket--
Nose & mouth covering masks are required on this flight, failure to wear a mask (or otherwise fail to follow directions from the flight crew) will result in civil and/or criminal charges, as well as listing on a no-fly list for 6 months minimum. Customers may be video/audio recorded at any point past the gate.
[X] Agree (goes on to payment screen)
[ ] Disagree (screen will not advance, only reverse)
[ ] Special exemption request to be processed before the day of departure (goes to input form)
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday October 08 2021, @03:54AM (7 children)
You are right. Nobody should fly. Drive instead and see the country.
Vote with your feet and your dollars. If a mode of travel or a system demands obedience, don't support it by going along with it.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Mykl on Friday October 08 2021, @05:09AM
Sounds like a win-win
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @05:27AM
If only all the trash took itself out.
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @05:47AM (4 children)
Err, driving requires way more obedience then a mask mandate.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @11:19AM (3 children)
You mean you can't bring your own beverages with you in your car?
You must pass through an X-Ray scatter machine before entering your car?
You're not allowed to open the windows in your car?
You must check-in at your parking space 2 hours before your planned departure, then wait 1.5 hours before entering the vehicle?
Your car will only let you drive from city center to city center, then you must transfer to another mode of transportation to get to your destination?
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:19PM
Strawman. Driving has tons of requirements, laws, restrictions, etc
You have to pass a test and posses a valid drivers license
You have to have a registered (and often tested) vehicle
You have to have valid, paid for insurance on that vehicle
You have to obey speed limits
You have to wear a seat belt
You have to follow traffic rules
You cannot drink alcohol (maybe in ND/SD, but otherwise ;-)
etc, etc, etc
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @11:05PM (1 child)
You can be thrown in jail here for bringing your own alcoholic beverages in your car here. Non-alcoholic beverages are simply a big fine and points (higher insurance) with perhaps your vehicle impounded. Distracted driving is the charge, mostly aimed at having your cell phone handy but covering a lot of stuff from eating and drinking while driving to fiddling with the radio.
Your other examples are stupid considering the other laws covering driving.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @04:03AM
I don't live in your Nazi province, so those driving rules are not my problem.
I think I'll have an ice cold drink while I enjoy the drive, sold to me straight from the DRIVE THRU WINDOW.
(Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Friday October 08 2021, @02:46AM (1 child)
>in the words of the Cosmic AC, "THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."
All the other ACs said that. The Cosmic AC had something different.
(Score: 2) by weilawei on Friday October 08 2021, @03:35AM
(Score: 5, Informative) by Immerman on Friday October 08 2021, @02:57AM (3 children)
Don't just ask questions - google the data to answer them. We live in an unprecedented era where you have much of the collected knowledge of humanity at your fingertips - there's no longer any excuse for ignorance.
Here they say that the the FAA ATO provides service to 45,000 flights and 2.9 million passengers PER DAY: https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/by_the_numbers/ [faa.gov]
So 4626 instances per year translates to about... 0.00044% of passengers causing a problem. Or alternately having a problem on 0.028% of flights (1 in 3550, assuming no more than one problem passenger per flight) Pretty small fraction by the numbers.
On the other hand it's *huge* by historical context: https://www.faa.gov/data_research/passengers_cargo/unruly_passengers/ [faa.gov]
Says that since 1995 unruly passenger wandered between about 150 to 300 investigations per year, with the last 15 years being near 150 before suddenly skyrocketing in the last year or so. So unless they suddenly changed either their rules or reporting, that would suggest there is a *substantial* problem
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @05:37AM (1 child)
You are drastically underestimating general aviation, aerial work, rotorcraft, and cargo. That cuts quite a bit into your numbers of the number of flights affected.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @10:39PM
How is that a troll? ATC provides service to a lot more than just passenger CAT flights. For example, even a cursory glance at that page shows that 1/3 of the flights are cargo only and I'm pretty sure people aren't reported for any freakouts that occur on their corporate-owned jets, police helicopters, air ambulances, personal light aircraft, etc.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @04:43PM
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:10AM (8 children)
If you act like a twat, you should be banned from flying.
As far as im concerned, if you strike a member of the flight crew, thats a permanent seat on the no fly list. Hope you like busses.
Airlines need to start banning customers, and sharing these ban lists with each other.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:20AM
Sounds like airlines just need to better support their employees and press charges like anyone else would if someone assaulted them.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by ChrisMaple on Friday October 08 2021, @03:01AM (5 children)
Striking a member of the flight crew should result in mandatory jail time. No exceptions. Double time if a government employee.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @05:52AM (4 children)
Why would striking a government employee be worse then striking a stewardess doing her job? Seems to me that punching out anybodies teeth should result in quite a bit of prison, not jail, time
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @11:23AM (1 child)
I think you misread. The GP probably meant "double the sentence if the perpretator is a government employee".
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @11:08PM
Not how I took it but you might be right, in which case I agree.
(Score: 2) by Tork on Friday October 08 2021, @08:50PM (1 child)
I'm not sure that's what the intent of that statement was but if you don't mind me entertaining the question anyway: I think the mindset is that someone wearing a badge* is the least likely person to be a provocateur AND they're there to act as a mediator, so even in the most tense of situations you should know better than to assault them. Not sure if I agree or disagree with it but that's the way I understand it.
* My comment only works in the badge-wearing context, my explanation probably isn't air-tight, the OP might have been referring to plain-clothes air marshals, I cannot address that at the moment.
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @11:12PM
I'm not sure if I agree that a badge wearer is least likely to be a provocateur but you do have a point. Still that is something the court can take into consideration at sentencing rather then having a hard coded law.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:52PM
Sure. They area free enterprise, and should be allowed to do what they want. If a person can be serviced a different way (even more expensive), then that is just the free market at work.
This I'm not sure I agree with. This sounds dangerously close to a blacklist, and there is a history of those being abused in the past. I'm thinking of the red scares in Hollywood, and that old line in movies where somebody annoys a powerful (and sometimes corrupt) local boss (sometimes connected to the mob), and gets told "you'll never work in this town again."
A one-strike-and-your-own policy is rarely good.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:27AM (6 children)
Trampled and failed by society, hanging on to the last shreds of dignity, they lash out at anyone trying to 'tell them what to do'
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @01:40AM
And that's just the cabin crew. Wait til you meet the pilot.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:23AM
Oh yeah....those poor republican anti-maskers. Think about their feelings.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @03:28AM (2 children)
wow
but to you every BLM protester was a thug, such entitlement and victim complexes from the personal responsibility crowd
do not trouble yourself, we also realize that with the situation reversed you would be howling for blood much worse than the couple of pro-death comments above
rightwingers are the biggest joke that we have to take seriously because they are also bathshit crazy murder loving cunts
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @11:02AM (1 child)
Why do you think the passengers involved in these incidents are all right wingers?
You truly do have your head up your ass if you think that.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @06:59PM
You can stop worrying that pretty little head, we all know that there are crazies on all sides, but right now the majority of issues involving wearing masks are with right wingers.
Shall I forward you some instructions on head dislodgement?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:36PM
"That's bullshit. You're a white suburban punk just like me."
(Score: -1, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @01:41AM (28 children)
Get off the passenger's asses, and clean up the airline industry. Start by getting rid of the TSA. Security theater might amuse some of you but it's all bullshit. Then, go after the airlines. Remind them, "The customer is always right!" Ohhhhhh, but there's a PANDEMIC!!! So what? It's not the airline's job to fight pandemics. Once again - it's necessary to quarantine, or it's not. We've chosen to not quarantine - get over yourselves with all the silly posturing. Kid (toddler, small child, teen, whatever) won't wear a mask? Cool - ignore him. An adult won't wear a mask? Again, ignore him. Remind him, maybe, that masks make people safer, then ignore him. It's just not that big a deal.
Damned sheep just keep taking shit from government, from corporations, and from any authority figure in sight.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:28AM (3 children)
Yep...what I said above. It's the poor republican that hates America and anyone not pure white. Careful there runny, your white sheet and peaked white pillow case is now out in the open.
(Score: 2, Flamebait) by ChrisMaple on Friday October 08 2021, @03:12AM (2 children)
If you cant' provide a reputable source of statistics for your claim that white Republicans are causing a disproportionate fraction of the airplane violence, STFU.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @02:50PM
It says so in the BIBLE, so you STFU, you commie Putin-patsy Republican. God, I miss the days when Republicans hated the Russians...
(Score: 2) by Tork on Friday October 08 2021, @08:25PM
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Friday October 08 2021, @02:46AM (2 children)
Or per The Forbes Article linked above, have the flight attendant's, you know, *union* renegotiate their contract terms to require better physical safeguards for the flight attendants.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @03:46AM (1 child)
Now you're on to something. How about every "seat" be surrounded by a metal cage? The stewardess locks you into your cage during boarding, and unlocks you after landing. What could possibly go wrong?
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Friday October 08 2021, @11:58PM
That's a great idea! Nobody would be able to ... oh wait, they'd probably not get cell phone/Wi-Fi reception that way. Then you'd *really* see air rage.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Immerman on Friday October 08 2021, @02:59AM
Actually the customer is usually wrong - a lot of merchants are simply willing to humor idiots in order to get their hands on those sweet, sweet dollars.
(Score: 4, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @03:20AM (2 children)
> won't wear a mask? Cool - ignore him
You are a moron.
Pathogens do not become harmless if you just pretend they are not there.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @03:47AM (1 child)
And, still, we mostly ignore you little ACs.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @11:55AM
And that is why you remain pathetically ignorant.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by khallow on Friday October 08 2021, @03:40AM (13 children)
So you acknowledge that businesses can mandate actions on the part of their passengers? Well, mask wearing is a mandated action. Don't fly if you don't like it.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @03:49AM (12 children)
WTF did you get that nonsense? Quarantines don't come from businesses. Quarantines are mandated by health departments and government. You know - REAL quarantines. Something similar to what those convicts in 'Straya have done, but maybe even stricter.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday October 08 2021, @04:56AM (11 children)
From what you wrote. When you mention quarantines in your false dilemma argument, you implicitly accepted that restrictions on freedom can be required to prevent the spread of disease.
Well, businesses can play that game too.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @06:32AM (10 children)
Jesus. Fucking. Christ.
Where in the FUCK did you get the idea that some random jackass can tell me what to do, just because he owns some property, or some equipment, or a store front? The only choices Random Business Owner has in the pandemic, is to close his business, or cater to the people who come in the front door. Owning a business doesn't make you some kind of god. Not even a demigod, despite what Bezos says.
(Score: 2, Informative) by khallow on Friday October 08 2021, @06:38AM
Because it's long been a standard exercise of freedom that random jackasses who happen to own businesses can establish rules, within reason, for people who choose to frequent their businesses. Here, airlines have a reasonable interest in preventing the spread of covid on their airlines. And well, mask wearing is part of the resulting strategy.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday October 08 2021, @07:04AM (2 children)
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @07:24AM (1 child)
That's loaded with goodies. "Within reason" - yes. Who determines "within reason"? Well the customers do!! And, "people who choose" to do business with them? Exactly.
Then, "people snap over this stuff."
Exactly.
Did I mention that owning a business doesn't turn you into a demigod? You don't become a little god even to your employees. Treat people decent, or be prepared for the torches and pitchforks. The natives are getting restless!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday October 08 2021, @11:53AM
Which, of course, is not true. But even if it were, why would one passenger's wish to not wear a mask outweigh another passenger's wish that they do? Air flight shouldn't only be for covid spreaders, right?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Opportunist on Friday October 08 2021, @08:25AM (5 children)
Because it is my store. My store, my rules. My property, my rules. You will follow them or you will continue your existence elsewhere, but not on my property where you are trespassing the exact moment you do not heed the rules that I require you to follow. If I require you to walk on your hands while on my property you will do so or you will not trespass on it.
Period.
(Score: 1, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Friday October 08 2021, @09:23AM (4 children)
That's understood. Do you also refuse to serve gays, blacks, midgets, and Muslims?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @09:54AM
If they don't walk on their hands, apparently yes. It's racist of you to suggest that the walking-on-hands requirement wouldn't apply equally to all patrons.
(Score: 2) by Opportunist on Friday October 08 2021, @11:33AM
If they're obnoxious pricks that are either bothersome or even harmful to other patrons, me or my property, yes.
Otherwise, why would I? Gay money is legal tender just like straight money.
(Score: 1) by nitehawk214 on Friday October 08 2021, @03:56PM
If they refuse to wear a mask, yea.
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 08 2021, @07:02PM
I just love when you think you're making some insightful point but only manage to show us all what a jackass you are. Keep crying little snowflake, the Mask Masters have agents surrounding your house this very minute! They also have a tracker on your car, so best take a bus to Tiajuana if you go on the run!
(Score: 5, Informative) by Mykl on Friday October 08 2021, @05:14AM (1 child)
You are aware that shutting a couple of hundred people into a cramped space with recirculated air results in a higher than average risk for COVID transmission, right?
(Score: 2) by number11 on Friday October 08 2021, @05:31PM
He doesn't care. He's the advocate for the disease spreaders.
(Score: 2) by dry on Friday October 08 2021, @05:59AM
The customer is not always right, at that, eliminating the worst customers can improve profits, as well as the well being of the employees, who hate dealing with that shit.