AMD: Windows 11 May Cause Performance Dips of Up to 15% on Ryzen CPUs
AMD: Windows 11 May Cause Performance Dips Of Up To 15% On Ryzen CPUs:
Wccftech reported a few days ago about known issues appearing after users have installed Microsoft's newest Windows 11 operating system—Oracle VirtualBox software and Cốc Cốc browser compatibility issues, as well as Intel networking issues. Today, AMD reported issues that their Windows 11 compatible AMD processors were having with performance while running certain applications after the new OS installation.
AMD urges users to stick with Windows 10 as a workaround, hotfix coming
[...] Known changes to performance affected areas such as
- Measured and functional L3 cache latency may increase by ~3X.
- UEFI CPPC2 ("preferred core") may not preferentially schedule threads on a processor's fastest core.
[...] To fix these issues, AMD and Microsoft have rolled out both updates to Windows 11, as well as software updates from AMD that will roll out over this month. Microsoft and AMD plan to update their separate knowledge bases with articles updating users with included version numbers and other information as they become available. AMD does state, that while these problems are happening, to continue to use a current supported version of Windows 10 instead of continuing utilizing Windows 11 until the problems have been actively concluded.
More details at AMD's Knowledge Base.
Intel Core i7-12700K 12 Core Alder Lake CPU-z Benchmark Leaks Out, Up to 45% Faster Than AMD Ryzen 7
Intel's Core i7-12700K Alder Lake CPU has been tested in the CPU-z benchmark and allegedly is up to 45% faster than the fastest 8 core CPUs based on Intel's Rocket Lake and AMD's Zen 3 processor lineups.
Intel Core i7-12700K Alder Lake 12 Core Up To 45% Faster Than Core i9-11900K & Ryzen 7 5800X In CPU-z Multi-Threaded Benchmark
The alleged CPU-z benchmark result has been tweeted by TUM_APISAK and shows the Intel Core i7-12700K scoring 800.2 points in the single-core and 9423.2 points in the multi-core benchmark tests. The Core i7-12700K is a 12 core chip but it should be positioned in the same price category as AMD Ryzen 7 5800X and Intel Core i7-11700K. Based on that, the performance improvement is huge for both single-core and multi-core tests.
In the single-core test, the Intel Core i7-12700K is around 17.3% faster than the Core i9-11900K, 24% faster than the Core i7-11700K, and 25% faster than the AMD Ryzen 7 5800X. In Multi-core tests, the Intel Core i7-12700K pushes on top with a 45% lead over the AMD Ryzen 7 5800X and Intel Core i9-11900K. Compared to its predecessor, the multi-core performance is improved by 50%. The CPU only loses to the AMD Ryzen 9 5900X which is a 12 core and 24 thread part and is around 2% faster than the Core i7-12700K.
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Intel published a developer guide confirming details of its upcoming Alder Lake processors.
Desktop "Alder Lake-S" processors will include up to 8 "Golden Cove" performance cores (P-cores), 8 "Gracemont" (Atom) efficiency cores (E-cores), and 32 graphics execution units (Gen 12.2 EUs). A smaller die will include only up to 6 P-cores and no E-cores, to be used in lower-end products such as a 6-core Intel Core i5-12400 or a quad-core i3.
Mobile "Alder Lake-P" processors will include up to 6 P-cores, 8 E-cores, and 96 graphics EUs. A smaller "ultra mobile" die will include up to 2 P-cores and 8 E-cores.
AVX-512 is physically present on Golden Cove cores, but disabled in Alder Lake.
The guide mainly focuses on software implementations for hybrid CPUs. It provides various optimization strategies for Alder Lake, including lack of optimization, a "Good Scenario", and the "Best Scenario". According to the document, lack of optimization will not mean that the CPU will be unable to distribute workloads for hybrid CPUs, which should be handled by ThreadDirector anyway, but some may be distributed to the wrong types of cores, should the scheduling algorithm not recognize the task.
In the "Good Scenario," Intel assumes that the application will be aware of the hybrid architecture. The primary tasks should target Performance cores, whereas non-essential and background threads with lower priority should target Effcieent cores.
Intel 12th Gen Core Alder Lake for Desktops: Top SKUs Only, Coming November 4th
The first things we'll go into are the new CPUs that Intel is announcing today: the overclockable models of Intel 12th Gen Core. As with previous launches, we have Core i9, Core i7, and Core i5, with the key highlights including new support for DDR5, PCIe Gen 5, new overclocking features, and a change in how Intel is promoting its Thermal Design Power (TDP).[*]
Each processor has a number of performance cores (P-cores) and efficiency cores (E-cores). The P-cores have SMT, whereas the E-cores do not, so we're dealing with non-standard numbers of total threads. Inside the system, the P-core threads, E-core threads, and SMT threads are categorized for performance and efficiency, which we'll get to later in the article. But with a new hybrid design also comes with new ways to showcase frequencies, and each set of cores will have its own base frequency and turbo frequency. The way power is marketed and used has also changed, designed to be clearer.
All processors will come with 16 lanes of PCIe 5.0 from the processor, and an additional 4 lanes of PCIe 4.0 for storage. Memory support is listed as both DDR5-4800 and DDR4-3200, although systems will only support one or the other, for a maximum of 128 GB. The K processors also feature 32 EUs of Intel's Xe-LP graphics, designated as UHD Graphics 770. Prices will start at $264 for the base Core i5 model, up to $589 for the top Core i9 model.
[*] This is the table:
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Revek on Saturday October 09 2021, @04:07AM (4 children)
Lets face it microshit has always been intels hand puppet.
This page was generated by a Swarm of Roaming Elephants
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday October 09 2021, @06:36AM (1 child)
I think it's more of a mutually masturbatory thing, than a hand puppet situation. My distastes for Intel and Microsoft have evolved side-by-side over the decades, for much the same reasons. They do scratch each other's backs, at the least.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by takyon on Saturday October 09 2021, @09:27AM
Accommodating Alder Lake was definitely one of the main goals of Windows 11, although Windows 10 should be able to run on it as well. I would chalk this up to incompetence, but I heard that AMD users were reporting the issue for three months. So gross incompetence.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Interesting) by theluggage on Saturday October 09 2021, @04:21PM (1 child)
Windows ain’t done ‘till
LotusAMD won’t run (it)....(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @05:53PM
That's what killed Cyrix. Microsoft disabled the CPU cache on Cyrix processors to cripple their performance.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by bradley13 on Saturday October 09 2021, @06:57AM
...it would be lovely if someone could prove it.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @08:03AM
Make 7-up yours.
(Score: 2) by Frosty Piss on Saturday October 09 2021, @08:23AM
I might run it in a VM, but I’m not buying into the Kool Aid.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Saturday October 09 2021, @08:55AM (14 children)
When Microsoft brings out a new OS, you can be sure of two things:
- x.0 version is a steaming shitpile of bugs
- You need a new computer. No technical reason other than Windows becomes more slower and more bloated at each new iteration - or if you like conspiracy theories, MS is in cahoots with hardware manufacturers and makes their software slower and incompatible with previous gen stuff to drum up sales. Although Occam razor probably applies here, and the slowness and compatibility issues can safely be attributed to MS' renowned technical expertise.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by deimtee on Saturday October 09 2021, @11:32AM
Doesn't need to be explicit cahoots. Most people who buy a new computer automatically buy the MS operating system on it. Force an upgrade to version N+1, that the current PC can't handle. The End-Luser goes to the shop and says "my computer is too slow". They sell him a new one, including a new license for Windows N+1 even though he already owns a license for Windows N. Ka-Ching.
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:17PM (7 children)
Windows 11 is a fucking joke.
A long, long, long time ago Microsoft could at least point to reasons why people should really want their new OSes. Even if many were bullshit and even undesirable, there was usually something under the hood that was some small improvement they could use as an excuse. Not any more. We have finally gotten to the point where their new hardware requirements are 100% artificial.
Meanwhile, Microsoft is dancing around about how "green" they are and how concerned they are about the environment, while making the entire planet throw out most of their existing computers and buying all new stuff.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Marand on Saturday October 09 2021, @03:50PM (6 children)
I've seen a persistent trend of people saying the best thing so far about Windows 11 is WSLg, which gives you seamless installation and use of Linux applications via WSL2. Adds the icons to the appropriate places, has audio and GPU acceleration support, etc. so that to the end-user it's largely identical to using a native Windows application. I'm not surprised by this at all; I experimented with it on some secondary hardware using the Win10 insider preview (before 11 hit it) and it was really well done, with just about everything but Vulkan-based 3d applications working as expected (OpenGL was fine). I basically turned Windows 10 into a Linux distribution (Microsoft GNU/Windows, lol) for a bit by just installing and running basically everything through WSLg instead of native on a lark before wiping the drive again.
So, it actually does have a pretty strong selling point over Windows 10, it's just kind of sad that it's "You can run Linux programs on it seamlessly!" and not really surprising that Microsoft isn't hyping that up much. :)
(Score: 2) by takyon on Sunday October 10 2021, @12:51AM (1 child)
Microsoft® Windows® Linux® was never a meme, it was always THE PLAN.
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?cid=706257&sid=26572#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?cid=760168&sid=28505#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?cid=780466&sid=29398#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?cid=854916&sid=32082#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?cid=1063616&sid=39971#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Marand on Sunday October 10 2021, @11:57PM
I've been saying for years that it looked like they were moving toward some kind of unification, even if only to have an escape hatch for if they ever decide to get out of dealing with the OS and kernel. I wouldn't even mind that, I don't think; I'd be more likely to pay for some kind of officially supported, wine-like Windows userland than I would to use Windows itself on bare metal, even for free.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday October 10 2021, @02:19AM (3 children)
If you run Windows 11 in a VM (you'll need a hacksaw to remove the compatibility check), you'll need to configure it to use WSL1. WSL2 won't run.
Source: a few lost hours last night.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 10 2021, @06:17AM (1 child)
I use VBox and VMWare, on Linux. Both provide TPM, both can be optionally encrypted. And, no, I don't have a TPM chip on my machine, just an empty socket where one can be plugged in. In both cases, I've installed without any problems, then attacked the telemetry and other nonsense after installation.
I'm a little curious what virtualization you are using, and why you need a hacksaw.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday October 10 2021, @07:42AM
QEMU/KVM. It didn't like the host CPU on my virtual host and I didn't want to mess with setting up a fake TPM.
The hacksaw is a powershell script you can run on an existing Win10 install (or a clone of one).
(Score: 2) by Marand on Monday October 11 2021, @12:06AM
That's not entirely accurate. If you're able to enable nested virtualisation with your hardware and software, it's possible to enable Hyper-V in a Windows VM and run VMs inside your VM, which should make WSL2 work as expected as well. Enabling Hyper-V using nested virt is also how some people are hiding their GPU passthrough configurations from games that have VM-detecting anti-cheat, because they have special-case exceptions for Hyper-V due to its use by things like Docker and WSL2, and the presence of the Hyper-V hypervisor OS obscures the presence of virtualisation "below" it. Though it has a performance impact in some cases, so it's not a silver-bullet solution there.
Using nested virt can be something of a problem at present because there are issues with nested virt on some kernels, especially with Ryzen CPUs, which is why I haven't been able to do it myself. Can't boot the Windows VM at all with nested virt enabled due to my CPU and kernel. :(
Though if you're running Windows in a VM already, there's not much need for WSL2 anyway. I have a Windows 10 VM using GPU passthrough and I keep WSL1 installed in it for convenience, but for anything GUI-based I have the host OS right there waiting so I've had no use for WSL2/WSLg.
(Score: 2) by digitalaudiorock on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:57PM (4 children)
I really don't think most realize the insane extent to which this is true, and the same arguably with Mac OS.
I've been running Gentoo for decades now, and have always gone very minimalist (fluxbox and no bloated desktop environment etc). Back in January I built myself a new workstation with a AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core CPU, but before that I ran on an old Dell Dimension for 18 years, and it was still usable when I retired it...an x86 machine that wouldn't support Vista and older. I was using that for all my personal everyday stuff, plus a full blown LAMP development platform...no notable issues with any of that...and running openrc (NO systemd of course, with their bullshit parallel startup) it could boot to a graphical environment in about 40 seconds. Think about that.
Never mind disk space. With a ton of shit installed my / file system is using about 15 GB all in. What does a new, basically empty Windows install require now? Last I knew it was at least 60 GB of bullshit.
I'm still going minimalist on this killer new AMD machine by the way, and it's beyond awesome. I can compile new kernels in 1 minute 30 seconds.
(Score: 2) by digitalaudiorock on Saturday October 09 2021, @12:59PM
Correction: That kernel compile time was intended to say 1 minute 13 seconds.
(Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Saturday October 09 2021, @09:12PM (2 children)
I still can use my 13-year old ASUS netbook. 2G RAM, but I've replaced the hard drive with 1T with an SSD cache. Never got the original Windows moved onto the new hard drive (anybody know how?)
Mostly just works.
I take it with me when I travel, because my new (and faster and generally more pleasant) computer has used up its battery; whereas the netbook's battery still works fine. I use the new machine when I know I can plug in.
The only problem with the netbook is that the keyboard is slightly wonky -- occasional key bounce on the left; some keys in the bottom row need to be hammered hard to work.
(Score: 2) by Acabatag on Sunday October 10 2021, @02:37AM (1 child)
You might be able to find a replacement keyboard that is better. Even just by finding one on ebay. Keyboards are, or were, pretty easy to replace.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Sunday October 10 2021, @02:50AM
Another option would be to connect a USB or wireless keyboard and type on that. Not the greatest option for a tiny netbook, but it works. Smaller, folding keyboards for travel are available.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @10:02AM
operates like a mafia.. more like a mafia combined with scientology.
stupid fucks freely offering telemetry/key logging behavior without question and remember M$ has root!
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 09 2021, @01:01PM
Recently put together a new computer with all kinds of goody's. AMD Ryzen 7 5800X, Nvidia RTX 3080 Ti, Samsung 49" curved screen. (Yeah it's great!) When it came to the operating system I realized I can't use the same activation code on the new computer so I pop for a new one. Runs great. I like to play with Linux here and there so out of curiosity I pick up a new SSD and load it up with Debain 11. Load a driver for the RTX and lo and behold it all works. Flawlessly as a matter of fact. After reading about the new Steam deck and Proton I look at my multi terra byte Steam library and say what the hell I'll give it a shot. So I install Steam and load a few games. As a matter of fact the only one of my favorites that doesn't run is Space Engineers. (Looking at you Keen.) Too late to get my money back on Windows. Haven't even started it up in weeks. But yeah, for me I have no compelling reason to use it at all. So goodby to Windows and all its bugs.
(Score: 3, Informative) by PinkyGigglebrain on Saturday October 09 2021, @07:18PM
Wintel [wikipedia.org]
"Beware those who would deny you Knowledge, For in their hearts they dream themselves your Master."