Ad-block developers fear end is near for their extensions:
Seven months from now, assuming all goes as planned, Google Chrome will drop support for its legacy extension platform, known as Manifest v2 (Mv2). This is significant if you use a browser extension to, for instance, filter out certain kinds of content and safeguard your privacy.
Google's Chrome Web Store is supposed to stop accepting Mv2 extension submissions sometime this month. As of January 2023, Chrome will stop running extensions created using Mv2, with limited exceptions for enterprise versions of Chrome operating under corporate policy. And by June 2023, even enterprise versions of Chrome will prevent Mv2 extensions from running.
The anticipated result will be fewer extensions and less innovation, according to several extension developers.
Browser extensions such as Ghostery Privacy Ad Blocker, uBlock Origin, and Privacy Badger, along with scripting extensions including TamperMonkey, which are each designed to block adverts and other content and/or protect one's privacy online, are expected to function less effectively, if they can even make the transition from Mv2 to the new approach: Manifest v3.
"If you asked me if we can have a Manifest v3 version of Privacy Badger, my answer is yes, we can and we will," said Alexei Miagkov, senior staff technologist at the Electronic Frontier Foundation, in a phone interview with The Register. "But the problem is more insidious. It's that Manifest v3 caps the certain capabilities of extensions and cuts off innovation potential."
Google argues otherwise and maintains its platform renovation will meet developers' needs, including those making tools for content blocking and privacy. The internet titan, which declined to comment on the record, maintains that Mv3 aims to improve privacy by limiting extensions' access to sensitive data and that it has been working with extension developers to balance their needs with those of users.
Google points to past endorsements, such as remarks provided by Sofia Lindberg, tech lead of ad amelioration biz Eyeo, which makes Adblock Plus. "We've been very pleased with the close collaboration established between Google's Chrome Extensions Team and our own engineering team to ensure that ad-blocking extensions will still be available after Manifest v3 takes effect."
[...] Google began work on Manifest v3, the successor to Mv2, in late 2018, ostensibly to make extensions more secure, performant, and private. The company's extension platform renovation was necessary – because extension security problems were rampant – and immediately controversial. An ad company making security claims that, coincidentally, hinder user-deployed content and privacy defenses looks like self-interest.
And Mv3 remains the subject of ongoing debate as the extension platform capabilities and APIs continue to be hammered out. But it has been adopted, with some caveats, by other browser makers, including Apple and Mozilla. Makers of Chromium-based browsers inherit Mv3 and Microsoft has already endorsed the new spec.
Others building atop Chromium like Brave, Opera, and Vivaldi have indicated interest in continuing to support Mv2, though it's unclear whether that will be practical beyond June of next year. If Google removes the Mv2 code from Chromium, maintaining the code in a separate Chromium fork may prove to be too much trouble.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Opportunist on Friday June 10 2022, @11:14AM (27 children)
Browsing the internet without adblockers doesn't work. If a broswer doesn't support adblocking plugins that actually block ads instead of pretending and instead redirecting me to their favorite ads, I have no use for that browser.
If Chrome really comes without adblocking ability in the future, the fear for the end should be for Chrome, not the adblocker devs.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @11:36AM (9 children)
Hopefully. But Firefox supports ad blocking on Android, and Chrome doesn't. Yet Firefox has something like 0.5% market share.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:28PM (5 children)
Yeah. Most people stick with the defaults. Google is going to get away with this because they already won. Chrome is the standard, it seems impossible to dethrone. I would love to be wrong.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:35PM (4 children)
IE once confidently occupied that throne too.
(Score: 2) by unauthorized on Friday June 10 2022, @01:19PM (2 children)
Yes, they were dethroned by the world's most popular search engine shilling their browser. I doubt they're going to shill Firefox or Brave.
(Score: 3, Informative) by maxwell demon on Friday June 10 2022, @02:14PM
They were already losing big to Firefox when Chrome came.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Friday June 10 2022, @03:33PM
I hate to break it to you but Brave is Chrome. I stay religiously away from Brave for that reason alone.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @03:26PM
So did Netscape.
(Score: 2) by Opportunist on Friday June 10 2022, @12:43PM (2 children)
Who wants to visit websites on a stamp-sized screen?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:48PM (1 child)
People who don't want to drag a full-size computer around with them all day?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by captain normal on Friday June 10 2022, @01:49PM
If you feel you have to be online 24/7 you have other problems besides blocking on screen ads.
When life isn't going right, go left.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by inertnet on Friday June 10 2022, @12:00PM (2 children)
Adblockers are essential and the creators deserve much gratitude, browsing is absolutely unbearable without these extensions. My kids seem to be able to ignore ads, but I don't have that ability. I hope and expect adblockers to be able to upgrade to this new standard, else I'll just have to spend my time away from large parts of the internet.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @04:29PM (1 child)
Your kids aren't ignoring ads. They are being indoctrinated before your very eyes.
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Monday June 13 2022, @02:22PM
Which is why my kid doesn't get to browse the internet. Also, my kid gets 0 advertisements for the place they are allowed to go, because of ad-blockers. The next step in the war against advertising is a Pi-Hole, which I may just have to setup sometime. My kid also doesn't watch media that requires advertisements. In fact, we're about done with all streaming media. We choose what they get to watch, we preview the things they get to watch and limit the amount of time they get to watch things. They will only be a kid, once. They don't need to be a vegetable for the majority of their childhood and they certainly can develop their own bad habits later. Without us making sure they have bad habits to begin with.
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:21PM (10 children)
Can you give us some suggestions on WHICH browser to switch to?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:40PM (7 children)
If (the general) You could stop moaning about the UI: Firefox. You'll survive using it, you'll be all right and you'll be better off than using Chrom*.
Suck it up, the UI's not that bad. Firefox is not anymore horrible than other browsers (quite the opposite all things considered).
FF is not _ideal_ but it is perfectly suitable for the job and it is oodles better than anything Chrome-based.
If you keep bitchin' and moaning about the FF's UI as many have done for over 10 years now, there's always lynx.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by unauthorized on Friday June 10 2022, @01:33PM (5 children)
If you're going to use modern FF, at least use LibreWolf [librewolf.net] which is a rebranded Firefox that cuts out the tracking.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @04:30PM (4 children)
To kill the telemetry in Firefox, in a file named, "user.js" in the profile directory, add:
Yes, pretty ridiculous, and that was just telemetry/tracking. To turn disable all the BS anti-features that mozilla has been adding:
$ wc -l user.js
917 user.js
And, yet still a million times more privacy/user respecting than Chrome/chromium.
There is a mozilla bug tracker ticket where they are discussing getting rid of user.js in *all* platforms because of a bug/design flaw in *Windows* that makes the windows version of firefox stall on initial startup when checking for the existence of the user.js file. That would be the end of firefox for me.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @04:35PM (1 child)
Even if they got rid of user.js they'd probably still support the site wide configuration which is installed somewhere under /usr/lib or /etc ... check your distro.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @08:16PM
Thanks.
I have sort of a build system for firefox profiles, and use a diff profile for each type of use. E.g., a general default profile for general browsing that doesn't allow scripts or cookies, a banking/financial services sites profile that by default allows cookies and scripts, a shopping profile that allows, but deletes cookies on tab close, etc., These have a bunch of profile specific config in user.js and misc. other files, but share a large amount of common config. In addition, the "build system" customizes each profile per hardware specific features like diff font scaling for diff screen dpi on diff machines (I guess this machine specific config would still work with just one machine-wide config file).
It works well (although ffox has been pulling settings out of about:config and moving them into random sqlite and json files and such for a few years now, so it is sometimes a pita when LTS version changes to get everything working again). And, I recently gave up trying to keep my userchrome.css UI customizations working after each update.
(Score: 2) by Jiro on Friday June 10 2022, @10:20PM
Mine als has devtools.onboarding.telemetry.logged which also probably needs to be set to false.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @08:59AM
They already started to do this with the chrome/userChrome.css file.
The complaint was that checking for this file causes a 1 second delay, so checking for it is disabled unless you have a flag turned on. There are a lot of posts out there for fixing irritating problems that Firefox refuses to have an interface option to disable, such as the star Bookmark this Page icon in the urlbar, for which can only be disabled via userChrome.
It really does look like they don't care. Perhaps one day Firefox will adopt manifest v3 and just die.
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Friday June 10 2022, @02:23PM
If you're currently a Chrome user, you'll not complain about the UI. After all, the problem with Firefox's UI is that they made it too much like Chrome.
But then, my main complaint with current Firefox is the loss of the old extensions. Well, it seems that Chrome will suffer an even worse loss.
Anyway, I'll keep using Waterfox Classic as long as possible, with Firefox as backup for sites that don't work with Waterfox Classic, and Chromium as last resort alternative.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @03:58PM
Palemoon is my primary browser. It is a clone of Firefox.
Firefox is still a good backup for when sites don't work in Palemoon. There is also Librefox.
Icecat on mobile is awesome. Plugins for Firefox work.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @12:36AM
luakit
Unlike Midori, which has an interface that has somehow gotten even worse and less usable than the last time I tried, luakit has a sensible interface. Graphical display is not a mistake. The mouse and widget/form-based GUIs are, and hamburger menus just compound those problems. In fact, the hamburger menu approach seems to be reinventing the command line, poorly, as the "search" that configuration interfaces all seem to have these days.
I expect the worse Chromium and Firefox get, the more GTK+ WebKit browsers will emerge.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @10:08PM (2 children)
We already see websites made for Chrome first.
If Firefox supports ad-blocking and Chrome does not, expect this practice to continue, possibly to the extent that sites will intentionally break on Firefox.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @10:51AM (1 child)
Wait... hold on.. I think I have heard this before...
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @01:01AM
Embrace.
Extend. ← you are here
Extinguish.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Booga1 on Friday June 10 2022, @11:39AM (6 children)
As the article points out: Google is an advertising company now. Their software is going to be influenced by that. We all know advertising has an ever-increasing and limitless appetite for more intrusive ads. The only real way to avoid this is to switch browsers.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:21PM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:23PM
Which browser will you switch to?
(Score: 2) by Opportunist on Friday June 10 2022, @12:45PM
You forgot to mention why I should give a fuck what Google wants. They want to advertise. That's ok. I don't care what they want. And I'm still the one saying what tool I use to browse. Give me what I want or the only thing you hear from me is "NEXT!"
(Score: 5, Touché) by maxwell demon on Friday June 10 2022, @02:27PM (2 children)
Now? Google has been an advertising company at least since 2008 when they acquired DoubleClick.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Monday June 13 2022, @02:32PM (1 child)
Yep, that's about the time when Google started to become the Evil corporation they are now. While they do have some mention of the "don't be evil" motto, it's at the tail end of the preface of their code of conduct. Also, just looking at what they've become, it's kind of hard to argue that they aren't "being evil".
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 16 2022, @06:04AM
They literally cribbed the worst ideas from Snowcrash. Google Streetview/Earth and Google Glass (the CIA information gatherers had always on cellularly recording equipment like that too!)
Google was dystopian LARPing since the very beginning and anyone who doesn't realize it... Well some Germans/Chinese/Russians have had good Solutions for that.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:19PM (3 children)
Ad-block and Other Developers Fear End is Near for Their Extensions
with GOOGLE's Chrome Engine.
You forgot that little nugget at the end.
Regardless, this is not going to end well, an advertising company forcing the entire Internet into their control.
Where the fuck are the congress critters?
Are they not suppose to call a penalty here and protect us from the Borg?
We are all fucked.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Opportunist on Friday June 10 2022, @12:47PM (1 child)
Half of them are in the pockets of the ad companies, the other half doesn't even understand what the hell this is about, and the only reason they'd want to change this is because they want to get bought, too.
(Score: 5, Informative) by captain normal on Friday June 10 2022, @01:57PM
Right!...as has been said often to no avail, "we have the best congress (and executive and court systems) that money can buy".
When life isn't going right, go left.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @12:52AM
No we're not. It just means that there will be one internet, reduced to AOL keywords, saturated with advertising for the dumbfucks of the world to duckclick endlessly, and another one for people who can build things. Personally I think if Alphabet DBA Google completely breaks with HTML that's fine. Even when I was a burger flipper, I could have afforded a VPS. There has never been a smaller barrier to entry.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Friday June 10 2022, @12:35PM (12 children)
Depending on your router, you can do all your adblocking at the router. Copy/paste your block list into the appropriate box in the interface, and done. If your router doesn't or can't run Tomato or DD-WRT, maybe it's time to upgrade.
Why block ads on one browser, when you can block all the ads at the network level, blocking all the ads coming into your house or business? That fixes desktops, laptops, mobile devices, media boxes like Vizio televisions - everything. Of course, that does nothing for your mobile device once you leave the location where the router is.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @12:43PM (4 children)
Except if you VPN into that place where that router/gateway is.
One point of contention: routers can only filter so much. One thing they are not, is proxy servers.
A hosts-file is great and all but it gets to be a resource hog after a while when you have +50k entries in that file.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @05:32PM (3 children)
In case you DON'T KNOW how great hosts are? Take a peek https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252547#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
* :)
APK
P.S.=> Onwards & UPWARDS - bottom line here is, HOSTS FILES DO NOT EAT AS MUCH AS Ads/Trackers/Scripts OR what you are using in SLOWER + PROVEN LESS EFFICIENT (see links & tests I post on that much in the link above as proof vs. what you said) addons BY FAR in memory, cpu, messagepassing etc. (addons that per this article are soon to be useless OR SO CRIPPLED in say, the number of what they CAN block, limits set etc.)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @12:58AM (2 children)
It seems your big moment has finally arrived.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @12:33PM (1 child)
I've had those "big moments" AGES ago many times:
Windows NT Magazine April 1997 "BACK OFFICE PERFORMANCE" pg 61
(For SuperSpeed.com PAID CONTRACT (wrote SuperCache 40% performance boost) & SuperDisk finalist @ MS Tech Ed 2x in a row 2000-2002 HARDEST CATEGORY: SQLServer Performance Enhancement)
WINDOWS MAGAZINE 1997 "Top Freeware & Shareware of the Year" issue pg 210 #1 entry
PC-WELT FEB 1998 pg 84
WINDOWS MAGAZINE, WINTER 1998 pg 92 MUST HAVE WARE
PC-WELT FEB 1999 - pg 83
CHIP Magazine 7/99 - pg 100
GERMAN PC BOOK Data Becker "PC Aufrusten und Repairen" 2000
HOT SHAREWARE #46 issue pg. 54 2001
Paid for article @ PCPitstop in 2008 http://pcpitstop.com/news/winners.asp [pcpitstop.com]
UltraDefrag64 Process Priority Control credited by lead devs of it in the programs credits section.
APK
P.S.=> See my subject-line above & that VERY PARTIAL LIST above of only SOME of my "favorites" in those "big moments" over time I've had (beyond those of my professional career as a software engineer 1994-2008 until I retired)... apk
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @01:52PM
Oddly I neglected to note this too https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252718#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] from as far back as the year 2001... but I did in another reply on this page.
* :)
(Especially considering it's on the very topic of hosts files we're on now...)
APK
P.S.=> I also ported it from Windows to BSD variants (even MacOS but pointless there as since Monterey or slightly before that Apple CRIPPLED hosts files & doesn't allow easy text config file changes like nsswitch in Linux) & Linux too... apk
(Score: 5, Informative) by Opportunist on Friday June 10 2022, @12:50PM
Because ad companies get smarter, too. They now want to hear back from your browser that it got their ad crap and if they don't hear back from you, they inform the site they infect that you're not playing nice with them and if the website wants their money, they shouldn't play nice with you. So your browser plugin has to pretend to the ad that it actually pestered you with their bullshit to tell the website with the content you want that it should no longer hold it hostage.
In other words, blocking ads at router level isn't going to work for many pages. You need to have the browser do the supersecret handshake with the ad hijacker holding your content hostage and dupe it into thinking you were properly badgered with their advertising.
(Score: 5, Informative) by RamiK on Friday June 10 2022, @01:39PM (1 child)
Domain / DNS resolution level blocking only blocks unenforced image delivery. It can't do anything against javascript-based tracking and enforced delivery. For that, you need uBlock / TamperMonkey to filter out specific elements and injects snippets that circumvent redirections, trigger lazy image loading and turn back on the mouse scrolling.
compiling...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @05:29PM
Oh, really? Take a read & reply to my link here ONLY so we can keep all "objections" I am pretty sure I'll overcome to what I posted in this next link Ramik https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252547#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] JUST so we can keep it ALL IN 1 place, consistent!
See, as I truly DO "take on all comers" & they end up with EGG ON THEIR FACES on THIS VERY SUBJECT!
* :)
(So much for your +5 either sockpuppet by you UPMODDED or modded up by IMBECILES here... )
APK
P.S.=> That's right - I'm trying to "get your goat" to get YOU to see the error of your ways (or possiblyl having YOU show me something I overlooked which in the end, only makes me STRONGER but then again, that's what I'm out to do for MYSELF as well as YOURSELF too - we can all learn things & imo, IF YOU DON'T, EVERYDAY? it's a wasted day)... apk
(Score: 5, Informative) by stretch611 on Saturday June 11 2022, @12:27AM (2 children)
Just install a Pi-Hole [pi-hole.net].
All you need to do is point your router's DNS to use the Pi-Hole for the DNS ip address.
A pi-Hole will block all the scummy ad sites and tracking sites that you want (and has a comprehensive list of roughly 100,000 sites that gets updated weekly.)
While it was designed for use on a raspberry pi, it can be installed on multiple linux distros in a virtual machine. You can use it for your entire network, or just individual computers.
Now with 5 covid vaccine shots/boosters altering my DNA :P
(Score: 2) by Unixnut on Saturday June 11 2022, @10:29AM (1 child)
Yes, except they are now working to make widespread use of DNS over HTTPS [wikipedia.org], which renders the pi-hole (and any other control over DNS resolution) useless. Control starts and ends at the browser now, so that is where you have to fight this battle.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @05:34PM
DoH = EASY TO BEAT in FireFox @ least https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252547#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] & IF YOU TRUST IT? You don't realize how CENTRALIZED ANYTHING (be it CDN or DNS etc.) is - or how insecure (DNS & DNSSEC? Not widely used for example & TRACKING LOGGING in CDN or DNS too & more).
* Enjoy the read...
APK
P.S.=> It MAY give you something to think about... apk
(Score: 3, Informative) by jasassin on Monday June 13 2022, @03:23AM
THIS!
I have a Cudy X6 Wi-Fi 6 router that I installed their un/official (unsupported/voids warranty) OpenWRT image https://www.cudytech.com/openwrt_software_download [cudytech.com] (because the official firmware only installs signed firmware), then installed the stable Cudy X6 OpenWRT image created by julyworld (which includes Ad Block):
https://github.com/julyworlds/openwrt-cudy-x6-firmware/releases/download/2022.05.18-0515/openwrt-ramips-mt7621-cudy_x6-squashfs-sysupgrade.bin [github.com]
Changing WiFi password/ssid name for Wi-Fi 5ghz, disabled the radio1 [5ghz] so I had to reflash julyworlds and change the 5ghz name and password write down all the lines, click revert changes, and enter them on command line via ssh’ing into the router and not enter the two braindead lines that disable the radio1 (this might be fixed in a new snapshot [google cudy x6 firmware julyworld]).
Now when I watch Plex, Wu-Tang, VRV anime, etc. channels on my Roku only (once a blue moon) one out of ten adds play! Holy shit the amount of time I wasted on ads! This kicks ass!!! I’m watching Godzilla vs Mechazilla right now and haven’t seen an add half way through it… just a ball that spins like it thinks it’s loading adds for 15 seconds total and the movie resumes. It’s comical! If everyone knew about this they would shit their pants!
jasassin@gmail.com GPG Key ID: 0xE6462C68A9A3DB5A
(Score: 4, Interesting) by lvxferre on Friday June 10 2022, @01:48PM (1 child)
Advertisement blocking is a killer feature for any sort of browser and, contrariwise common belief, Chrome is not "too big to fail".
Кўис когитас ессе, Беллум?
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Monday June 13 2022, @02:36PM
The problem is that while it's a "killer feature", there's a stupid number of people on cellphones. A lot of them, use it as their main web browser device and it's not easy to install your favorite browser with your favorite ad-blocker on a "smartphone". The issue isn't whether or not it's a killer feature, it's whether or not they think they can get away with exorcising the ad-blocker feature from the browser. Due to the fact that even among desktop users an ad-blocker isn't a standard feature. You have to install it separately. So, unless you know what you're doing or have a helpful friend/family member. You don't have an ad-blocker.
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
(Score: 3, Insightful) by owl on Friday June 10 2022, @03:20PM
Let's see. An advertising company (Google) creates a browser (Chrome) that they then subsequently neuter in its ability to block advertising in order to keep their ad revenues up. Yep, sounds about right.
Nothing surprising here at all, except maybe the revelation that possibly ad-blocking is becoming just mainstream enough for google's revenue to start feeling the pinch, and what we see from the advertising company is the commensurate reaction to that pinch in revenue.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @03:32PM (3 children)
Firefox, here they come.
Trouble is we might be in a race to the bottom. There are already ominous signs like the sponsor links on FF's start page. I went fee-for-service on e-mail a few years ago to avoid the ever-growing nightmare of ads and scripts. Might the browser be the next stop? Could the fee-for-product software business model come off life support and stomp "freemium" and ad-supported? Never say never.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10 2022, @04:28PM
Firefox already once adopted Chrome's limited extension design back when Quantum first appeared. Why think they wont do the same again?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by owl on Friday June 10 2022, @09:51PM
While a mass exodus to Firefox would be nice, don't bet on seeing one at the beginning.
The number of people who browse the web without any ad blocker is surprisingly larger than those of us here realize. Just read through HN threads watching for the comments about "those ad's were so distracting" from a HN post, and HN likely attracts a more technical crowd than average. If those more technical folks are not blocking ads, you know full well joe average is not.
What will more likely happen is the enthusiast users who do run ad blockers will gradually begin to shift away, slowly at first. But, the "average joe" user typically uses whatever his/her enthusiast friend recommends, so once the 'enthusiast' starts migrating to Firefox, the 'average joe's' will start seeing more recommendations to use Firefox, and then we might begin to see some change in the market-share percentage numbers. But, that change will be time delayed from the Manifest V3 cut over point by enough time that google will likely not realize that MV3 was possibly the driver.
(Score: 2) by cmdrklarg on Monday June 13 2022, @02:50PM
Some of us never stopped using Firefox. I developed an anti-ad attitude many years ago and have been seeking out ways to remove them from my life. Firefox has been a major part of that.
The world is full of kings and queens who blind your eyes and steal your dreams.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Friday June 10 2022, @07:45PM (2 children)
In a just world, ad blockers would be STANDARD on every single web browser.
But as we see, Google is an advertising company and they want to prevent people from having a safe eye-raping free experience.
I fully expect Firefox to be forced to follow.
And that also means that sites that block ad blockers will be considered "standard" now. What a fucked up backwards world we live in.
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Saturday June 11 2022, @12:45AM
What, you mean where the rich and powerful constantly implement new ways to become more rich and powerful? I can think of a few more colorful words for it than "backwards".
Hey, notice how bitter we're all becoming lately? It's not just our advancing years--the world really is that fucked.
If a cat has kittens, does a rat have rittens, a bat bittens and a mat mittens?
(Score: 2) by Common Joe on Monday June 13 2022, @04:09PM
In a just world, we wouldn't need ad blockers. But your points still stand.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 11 2022, @04:50PM (6 children)
See my subject-line above & in the end? I'll be RIGHT AS RAIN, as usual!
Custom hosts files gain me the following list of benefits (summary of where custom hosts files are extremely useful) INCLUDING my daily scanning of SECURITY SITES vs. KNOWN sources of threats in C2 servers of malwares of most all kinds & I DOUBT your ADBLOCKERS do THAT in their lists (well, UBlock MIGHT since it USES HOSTS FILES too but that's ONLY IF they fill their lists with that as I do, daily & I have nearly 10 MILLION of those now to date - hosts can & DO here @ least:
Protect you vs. known malicious sites/servers (beyond malicious adbanners: See 2-6 next)
Protect you vs. fastflux botnets + stop communications back to their C&C servers
Protect you vs. dynamic dns botnets + stop communications back to their C&C servers
Protect you vs. DGA/domain generation algorithm botnets + stop communications back to their C&C servers
Protect you vs. downed DNS servers (adds reliability)
Protect you vs. DNS redirect poisoned dns servers
Get you past a dns block list you may not agree with
Added "anonymity": Keeping you off dns request logs
Block trackers (both ads and dns request logs)
Block spam mail malicious payload link sources
Block phishing mail malicious payload link sources
Speed you up for websurfing by adblocking & also hardcoding favorite sites
Truly UNIVERSAL PROTECTION for ANY webbound program (e.g. - stand-alone email programs & since any OS, even on smartphones, has a BSD drived IP stack).
More screen "real estate" (no more ads appear onscreen eating up CPU, Memory, & other forms of I/O too - bonus!).
Custom hosts files work on ANY & ALL webbound apps (browser plugins do not).
Custom hosts files offer a better, faster, more efficient way, & safer way to surf the web
Hosts files do all of those things above & block ads (better than addons) more efficiently in cpu cycles + memory usage https://blog.mozilla.org/nnethercote/2014/05/14/adblock-pluss-effect-on-firefoxs-memory-usage/ [mozilla.org]
Hosts give you direct easy texteditor controlled data for all of the above
Faster & MORE EFFICIENT operation vs. browser plugins (which "layer on" ontop of slower Ring 3/RPL 3/usermode browsers increasing messagepassing overheads slowing them more & they're written in slower INTERPRETED languages (e.g. AdBlock = python/perl/javascript)- Whereas by way of comparison, the hosts file operates @ the Ring 0/RPL 0/Kernelmode of operation (far faster) as a filter for the IP stack itself, written in C & Assembly language (run directly @ Operating System startup w/ the IP stack, making browser/usermode advertiser owned 'solutions' like Ghostery + AdBlock, advertisers crippled http://techcrunch.com/2013/07/06/google-and-others-reportedly-pay-adblock-plus-to-show-you-ads-anyway/ [techcrunch.com] and ABP too http://finance.yahoo.com/news/google-microsoft-amazon-paying-adblock-115744964.html [yahoo.com] AND redundant)).
NOW as far as DNS over HTTPS which imo is what they use to DEFEAT hosts files (since there was NO OTHER REAL WAY on a standalone PC)?
You can STILL turn that off in FireFox in TRR settings here:
1] Type about:config in the location bar
2] Search for network.trr (TRR stands for Trusted Recursive Resolver – it is the DoH Endpoint used by Firefox.)
3] Change network.trr.mode to 2 to enable DoH. This will try and use DoH but will fallback to insecure DNS under some circumstances like captive portals. (Use mode 5 to disable DoH under all circumstances.)
On that last part? Poor attempt @ a SELL of SECURITY - DNS is MASSIVELY insecure, period. What they CAN do to help it isn't generally implemented for ALL DNS servers.
STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSES' MOUTHS @ Mozilla, here https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2018/06/01/improving-dns-privacy-in-firefox/ [mozilla.org]
(& you SHOULD - if you're concerned about SECURITY in terms of TRACKING etc.? That IS truly CENTRALIZED tracking because IF you THINK they're not logging access to their CDN's etc. (which IS how many VPN's even work)? You ARE wrong... & for browsers that WON'T ALLOW THAT? Well, fuck using them then - simple)
LASTLY - someone above said "but, But, BUT 'hosts eat resources'" Ok then - well, so does PILING ON 50 addons to do what hosts does BY ITSELF & yes, @ KERNEL LEVEL SPEED + FIRST via the API itself in GetHostByAddr iirc - though THAT is "nullified" nowadays by DNS over HTTPS for those that do NOT know the above - NOT FOR ME though, again, PER the above!
Next I'll probably hear "but, But, BUT large hosts SLOW YOU DOWN" - well, no, in the END they speed you up BY BLOCKING OUT ALL OF WHAT THEY DO ABOVE, buying back & EXCEEDING what ads/trackers etc. STEAL from you (including your electricity bill going up RUNNING THOSE SCRIPTS clientside vs. using ISAPI/NSAPI old school server side stuff - that's a HIDDEN one MOST tend to overlook mind you also). Parse time of hosts in KERNEL MODE is far less than USERMODE SLOW your browser + addons operate in (increasing messagepassing in BOTH as well as far as overheads) as they PROCESS SCRIPTS/ADS.
(Thus, per this article: Your addons will soon NOT WORK or will be SO CRIPPLED as in the case of browser addons for that purpose that they MIGHT AS WELL NOT WORK e.g. limiting HOW MANY ads/scripts/trackers you can block - NEW NEWS: Hosts block script sources too, that is what I use the ONLY addon I use in NoScript for - it shows me what to block in hosts too as far as scripts... but I still combine them for layered security)
APK
P.S.=> Prepping for nitpickers (go ahead - lol, I've BEEN thru that before & BLEW AWAY all comers so called "points" with FUCKING EASE) - & I would've posted this earlier BUT you've been TRYING (& failing) @ blocking my IP address SO it's gotten so I won't post here MUCH anymore here ON THIS SITE as it's a "wee bit of a PAIN IN THE ASS" to get around your BULLSHIT that way here in CENSORBEAMS (misspell intentional) @ least, well other than ONCE IN AWHILE being compelled to do so, & YES this time I am to give you something to THINK about like I did in this post about VAXINES (intentional misspell) https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=46034&page=1&cid=1197563#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] OR on how to optimize code https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=46096&page=2&cid=1198315#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] (PASCAL always HAS rocked vs. C etc. too) for which in BOTH cases you ALL UPRATED ME on to the max & yes, which I am TOTALLY correct about & PITY those who took it - same idea here - see my subject... apk
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @01:05AM (1 child)
No I won't. Somebody will just build a GTK+ webkit browser with integrated adblock.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @02:36PM
See my subject & https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252718#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] that I built LONG AGO to process hosts files (better than ANYTHING ELSE OUT THERE that does the same thing (mainly in that I wrote it in fastest HLL language there is for stringwork in Pascal which has NO REAL PEER in its stringwork speed & does that work SAFER (vs. C which has terrible buffer overflow potential on that note due to null-terminated strings it does) AND that it offers a false positive filter list you can easily populate yourself to avoid blocking sites you don't want blocked (such as the hardcoded to IP addresses @ the TOP of hosts it also creates that gets you to sites AS FAST AS POSSIBLE & DIRECTLY)).
THEN, you should see the GREAT MOVIE "The Natural" with Robert Redford (free on TUBI.TV) here https://tubitv.com/movies/625260/the-natural [tubitv.com]
APK
P.S.=> Why the latter? Well - I did what HE DID & BUILT ONE MYSELF as "I wanted it to be a very special bat" as Robert Redford days when he was asked by Wilford Brimley "Where'd you get this bat?" @ batting practice... apk
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @03:26AM (1 child)
You could write a webkit browser in pascal that pulls the latest APK hosts automatically and writes them to /etc/hosts: https://wiki.freepascal.org/Gtk+3 [freepascal.org]
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @12:44PM
Already done by "yours truly" as far back as 2001 in APK hosts file engine https://www.start64.com/index.php/64-bit-software/64bit-security/5851-apk-hosts-file-engine-10-32-64-bit [start64.com]
* :)
APK
P.S.=> I also ported it from Windows to BSD variants (even MacOS but pointless there as since Monterey or slightly before that Apple CRIPPLED hosts files & doesn't allow easy text config file changes like nsswitch in Linux) & Linux too... apk
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @04:00PM (1 child)
hey why do you write like an escaped Church of the SubGenius columnist/cultist preparing for Dobbs Day?
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday June 12 2022, @04:32PM
Why can't you prove anything I wrote here is wrong https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252547#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
?
* Could it be that I am SO CORRECT that you fools that trusted browser addons for adblocking are using are INFERIOR, SLOWER & INEFFICIENT vs. hosts files?
(Answer that You pitiful TROLLING loser you are HIDING behind UNIDENTIFIABLE anonymous AC... lol!)
APK
P.S.=> Answer = YES to the bolded question I put down above: YOU ARE PARALYZED BY FACTS I PUT OUT regarding hosts SUPERIORITY on MANY FRONTS above - You just prove it's IMPOSSIBLE to prove me wrong when I have actual tests shown in that link above proving it on addons being INFERIOR/INEFFICIENT as well as SLOWER in usermode addons vs. KERNELMODE hosts operations (in addition to the FACT you have to go to hosts & the IP Stack itself, FIRST, due to the GetHostByAddr API call that though they TRIED to shove you onto CENTRALLY MONITORED DoH/DNS over HTTPS bullshit that is easily countered by "yours truly" & MOZILLA network.trr.mode = 5 in FireFox )
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 13 2022, @06:25PM
See my subject-line above & in the end? I'll be RIGHT AS RAIN, as usual!
Custom hosts files gain me the following list of benefits (summary of where custom hosts files are extremely useful) INCLUDING my daily scanning of SECURITY SITES vs. KNOWN sources of threats in C2 servers of malwares of most all kinds & I DOUBT your ADBLOCKERS do THAT in their lists (well, UBlock MIGHT since it USES HOSTS FILES too but that's ONLY IF they fill their lists with that as I do, daily & I have nearly 10 MILLION of those now to date - hosts can & DO here @ least:
Protect you vs. known malicious sites/servers (beyond malicious adbanners: See 2-6 next)
Protect you vs. fastflux botnets + stop communications back to C&C servers
Protect you vs. dynamic dns botnets + stop communications back to C&C servers
Protect you vs. DGA/domain generation algorithm botnets + stop communications back to C&C servers
Protect you vs. downed DNS servers (adds reliability)
Protect you vs. DNS redirect poisoned dns servers
Get you past a dns block list you may not agree with
Added "anonymity": Keeping you off dns request logs
Block trackers (in ads/scripts/dns request logs)
Block spam mail malicious payload link sources
Block phishing mail malicious payload link sources
Speed you up for websurfing by adblocking & also hardcoding favorite sites
UNIVERSAL PROTECTION for ANY webbound program Custom hosts files work on ANY & ALL webbound apps (browser plugins do not).
More screen "real estate" (no more ads appear onscreen eating up CPU, Memory, & other forms of I/O too - bonus!).
Custom hosts files offer a better, faster, more efficient way, & safer way to surf the web
Hosts files do all of those things above & block ads (better than addons) more efficiently in cpu cycles + memory usage https://blog.mozilla.org/nnethercote/2014/05/14/adblock-pluss-effect-on-firefoxs-memory-usage/ [mozilla.org]
Hosts give you direct easy texteditor controlled data for all of the above
Faster & MORE EFFICIENT operation vs. browser plugins (which "layer on" ontop of slower Ring 3/RPL 3/usermode browsers increasing messagepassing overheads slowing them more & they're written in slower INTERPRETED languages (e.g. AdBlock = python/perl/javascript)- Whereas by way of comparison, the hosts file operates @ the Ring 0/RPL 0/Kernelmode of operation (far faster) as a filter for the IP stack itself, written in C & Assembly language (run directly @ Operating System startup w/ the IP stack, making browser/usermode advertiser owned 'solutions' like Ghostery + AdBlock, advertisers crippled http://techcrunch.com/2013/07/06/google-and-others-reportedly-pay-adblock-plus-to-show-you-ads-anyway/ [techcrunch.com] & ABP too http://finance.yahoo.com/news/google-microsoft-amazon-paying-adblock-115744964.html [yahoo.com] AND redundant)).
NOW as far as DNS over HTTPS which imo is what they use to DEFEAT hosts files (since there was NO OTHER REAL WAY on a standalone PC)?
You can STILL turn that off in FireFox in TRR settings here:
1] Type about:config in the location bar
2] Change network.trr.mode to 5 to disable DoH under all circumstances.
STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSES' MOUTHS @ Mozilla, here https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2018/06/01/improving-dns-privacy-in-firefox/ [mozilla.org]
On that last part?
Poor attempt @ a SELL of SECURITY - DNS is MASSIVELY insecure, period. What they CAN do to help it isn't generally implemented for ALL DNS servers in DNSSEC.
(& you SHOULD - if you're concerned about SECURITY in terms of TRACKING etc.? That IS truly CENTRALIZED tracking because IF you THINK they're not logging access to their CDN's etc. (which IS how many VPN's even work)? You ARE wrong... & for browsers that WON'T ALLOW THAT? Well, fuck using them then - simple)
LASTLY - someone above said "but, But, BUT 'hosts eat resources'"
Ok then - well, so does PILING ON 50 addons to do what hosts does BY ITSELF & yes, @ KERNEL LEVEL SPEED + FIRST via the API itself in GetHostByAddr iirc - though THAT is "nullified" nowadays by DNS over HTTPS for those that do NOT know the above - NOT FOR ME though, again, PER the above!
Next I'll probably hear "but, But, BUT large hosts SLOW YOU DOWN"!
WRONG: In the END they speed you up BY BLOCKING OUT ALL OF WHAT THEY DO ABOVE, buying back & EXCEEDING what ads/trackers etc. STEAL from you (including your electricity bill going up RUNNING THOSE SCRIPTS clientside vs. using ISAPI/NSAPI old school server side stuff - that's a HIDDEN one MOST tend to overlook mind you also). Parse time of hosts in KERNEL MODE is far less than USERMODE SLOW your browser + addons operate in (increasing messagepassing in BOTH as well as far as overheads) as they PROCESS SCRIPTS/ADS.
(Thus, per this article: Your addons will soon NOT WORK or will be SO CRIPPLED as in the case of browser addons for that purpose that they MIGHT AS WELL NOT WORK e.g. limiting HOW MANY ads/scripts/trackers you can block - NEW NEWS: Hosts block script sources too, that is what I use the ONLY addon I use in NoScript for - it shows me what to block in hosts too as far as scripts... but I still combine them for layered security)
APK
P.S.=> All you could do is MOD ME DOWN but not prove anything I said here or HERE NOW TOO wrong https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=49747&page=1&cid=1252547#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] so you could HIDE it from others (an entire weekend later once you hit your workplace ALTERNATE sockpuppet accounts you have no doubt since you ran dry of them using your HOME sockpuppet account instead, lol - too obvious).
Prepping for nitpickers (go ahead - lol, I've BEEN thru that before & BLEW AWAY all comers so called "points" with FUCKING EASE)
I also would've posted this earlier BUT you've been TRYING (& failing) @ blocking my IP address SO it's gotten so I won't post here MUCH anymore here ON THIS SITE as it's a "wee bit of a PAIN IN THE ASS" to get around your BULLSHIT that way here in CENSORBEAMS (misspell intentional) @ least, well other than ONCE IN AWHILE being compelled to do so, & YES this time I am to give you something to THINK about like I did in this post about VAXINES (intentional misspell) https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=46034&page=1&cid=1197563#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] OR on how to optimize code https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=46096&page=2&cid=1198315#commentwrap [soylentnews.org] in an entire series of exchanges & posts of mine there on the latter link (PASCAL always HAS rocked vs. C etc. too) for which in BOTH cases you ALL UPRATED ME on to the max & yes, which I am TOTALLY correct about & PITY those who took it - same idea here - see my subject... apk