from the I-looked-again-and-still-can't-see-it dept.
Average healthy adult doesn't really get much benefit, Med School professor says:
Are you among the one in three Americans who gulps down a multivitamin every morning, probably with a sip of water? The truth about this popular habit may be hard to swallow.
"Most people would be better off just drinking a full glass of water and skipping the vitamin," says Pieter Cohen, an associate professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School and an internist at Harvard-affiliated Cambridge Health Alliance. In addition to saving money, you'll have the satisfaction of not succumbing to misleading marketing schemes.
That's because for the average American adult, a daily multivitamin doesn't provide any meaningful health benefit, as noted recently by the US Preventive Services Task Force (USPSTF). Their review, which analyzed 84 studies involving nearly 700,000 people, found little or no evidence that taking vitamin and mineral supplements helps prevent cancer and cardiovascular disease that can lead to heart attacks and stroke, nor do they help prevent an early death.
"We have good evidence that for the vast majority of people, taking multivitamins won't help you," says Cohen, an expert in dietary supplement research and regulation.
[...] Surveys suggest people take vitamins to stay healthy, feel more energetic, or gain peace of mind, according to an editorial that accompanied the USPSTF review. These beliefs stem from a powerful narrative about vitamins being healthy and natural that dates back nearly a century.
"This narrative appeals to many groups in our population, including people who are progressive vegetarians and also to conservatives who are suspicious about science and think that doctors are up to no good," says Cohen.
See also: Study Finds No Benefit to Taking Multivitamins and Some Other Supplements
Related Stories
Most popular vitamin and mineral supplements provide no health benefit, study finds
The most commonly consumed vitamin and mineral supplements provide no consistent health benefit or harm, suggests a new study led by researchers at St. Michael's Hospital and the University of Toronto.
Published today in the Journal of the American College of Cardiology, the systematic review of existing data and single randomized control trials published in English from January 2012 to October 2017 found that multivitamins, vitamin D, calcium and vitamin C -- the most common supplements -- showed no advantage or added risk in the prevention of cardiovascular disease, heart attack, stroke or premature death. Generally, vitamin and mineral supplements are taken to add to nutrients that are found in food.
"We were surprised to find so few positive effects of the most common supplements that people consume," said Dr. David Jenkins*, the study's lead author. "Our review found that if you want to use multivitamins, vitamin D, calcium or vitamin C, it does no harm -- but there is no apparent advantage either."
The study found folic acid alone and B-vitamins with folic acid may reduce cardiovascular disease and stroke. Meanwhile, niacin and antioxidants showed a very small effect that might signify an increased risk of death from any cause.
What about people who would otherwise eat an incredibly nutrient-deficient diet (e.g. junk food, rice, bread, pasta, french fries, hot dogs, etc.)?
Supplemental Vitamins and Minerals for CVD Prevention and Treatment (DOI: 10.1016/j.jacc.2018.04.020) (DX)
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @09:23PM (5 children)
> "Most people would be better off just drinking a full glass of water and skipping the vitamin,"
That's what I do, first thing nearly every morning. Then, a bit later, a banana (or half if the bananas are running large) to keep leg cramps at bay (potassium). It's another way of getting vitamins, you see...
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @09:35PM (4 children)
What do you do with the other half of the banana?
(Score: 3, Funny) by Gaaark on Monday August 15 2022, @09:53PM
Sexy, sexy things.
Keeps the hornyness at bay.
;)
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @09:55PM (2 children)
I cut cleanly through the skin when cutting off the bottom half of a banana (the other half stays with the bunch). Cover the open end with a bit of saran (plastic cling wrap). Then eat the other half the next morning, it keeps fine.
You don't even need to cover the end if it's just a day, but the exposed end might turn brown and go squishy...so cut off a thin slice if you don't like the looks of that bit.
(Score: 4, Funny) by lentilla on Tuesday August 16 2022, @02:37AM (1 child)
Heretic! Only ever cut the top half of the banana!
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @11:47PM
We'll never understand you top half-ers, intolerant bastards that you are(grin).
(Score: 4, Funny) by donkeyhotay on Monday August 15 2022, @09:43PM (14 children)
First thing, every morning, I drink 15 ounces of water...
Followed by another 15 ounces... and another...
Actually it's brown water...
Okay, it's coffee! I drink 15 ounces of coffee... followed by another 15 ounces... and another... and another...
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @10:03PM (6 children)
> 15 ounces
In any sensible world that would still be 16 ounces = 2 cups. Some bean counter thought they would be clever, reduced the portion while keeping the price the same. Meanwhile, marketing found some graphics that make the cup appear larger.
(Score: 5, Touché) by lentilla on Tuesday August 16 2022, @02:39AM (4 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @08:57AM (3 children)
The weirdest thing is that he measures out his drinks by weight.
(Score: 2) by KritonK on Tuesday August 16 2022, @10:37AM (1 child)
They are probably 15 fluid ounces [wikipedia.org], which is a measuere of volume.
(Score: 2) by HammeredGlass on Wednesday August 17 2022, @12:07AM
whoosh
(Score: 2) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:16PM
(sarcasm - it's already been pointed out that oz. are also a unit of volume)
How else are you going to know how much beverage you actually got? Volume changes with temperature, and nobody want to control for that.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:04PM
Literally!
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:21PM (6 children)
The problem with coffee is that it's a diuretic - it stimulates your body to purge water so that the more you drink the more dehydrated you become.
Well that and the fact that it's a highly addictive but socially acceptable mind-altering drug that, when chronically consumed in large quantities, has a negative effect on both physical and mental health.
(Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:08PM (5 children)
#1 is an old wives tail. Yes, it is a diuretic so you do pee more but guess what the vast majority of the coffee is made of!
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:31PM (4 children)
Water that mostly passes right through your system, because your body is in "purge excess water" mode.
Alcohol has a similar effect. Beer is almost entirely water, and yet drinking it all night is still likely to give you a hangover - a symptom, primarily, of severe dehydration.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @04:56PM (3 children)
Urine comes out of your blood, not your gut. So the water gets absorbed by your system before it can urinate it back out. A well hydrated system is the opposite of dehydration.
Drinking caffeine-containing beverages as part of a normal lifestyle doesn't cause fluid loss in excess of the volume ingested. While caffeinated drinks may have a mild diuretic effect — meaning that they may cause the need to urinate — they don't appear to increase the risk of dehydration. [mayoclinic.org]
No Evidence of Dehydration with Moderate Daily Coffee Intake: A Counterbalanced Cross-Over Study in a Free-Living Population [nih.gov]
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @06:32PM (2 children)
Yes, your blood is an intermediate step, but if your cells don't absorb it (for instance, because they're already busy shedding water under the influence of a diuretic), then it gets rapidly dumped into your urine to restore optimal blood balance.
Meanwhile, I really don't think a half-gallon plus of coffee fits in any reasonable definition of "moderate intake"
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @08:11PM (1 child)
I just provided links to the Mayo Clinic and the NIH to support my position.
If you have some evidence to present to support your hypothesis you should do so.
(Score: 1, Redundant) by HammeredGlass on Wednesday August 17 2022, @12:13AM
i don't know why you trust studies performed by Big Pharma, and probably paid for by Big Coffee???
(Score: 5, Insightful) by stack on Monday August 15 2022, @09:48PM (6 children)
"Their review, which analyzed 84 studies involving nearly 700,000 people, found little or no evidence that taking vitamin and mineral supplements helps prevent cancer and cardiovascular disease that can lead to heart attacks and stroke, nor do they help prevent an early death."
And what about for all the other many many reasons why people might take them?
At previous job, during a work goof-off event (brought in food, let us just chat and hang out for the afternoon) someone challenged the "multivitamin deters sickness" statement. So the administrative assistant pulled the numbers over the last few years. Out of 30 people, the five that took daily multivitamins were ALWAYS at the top of the list for least sick days (we all had them, but we used fewer of them). And not just by a small margin either. It was a clear difference.
Now, two of them are big fitness buffs and take them in addition to other healthy nutrition so one could argue they were just healthier and less prone to sickness. The other two were "sit around and drink in our free time" guys. As for me, I've been prone to really bad headaches since I was a teen. Never found a cause or reason despite a lot of attempts. Then I started taking a cheap multivitamin after an injury (recommended by my doctor at the time) and the headaches have nearly disappeared. In every attempt to stop taking them (either on purpose or because there's a mass hysteria causing people to buy them in a stupid panic), the headaches have returned within a few days. At this point, I don't even care if they are absolutely nothing more then a placebo that costs a nickle a day - they are worth it. :-D
So yeah, if you think they are going to ward off cancer or cardiovascular disease or keep you alive longer - well, looks like evidence says otherwise. But maybe make an informed decision for your specific situation instead of sensational headlines. (I really loath medical sensational headlines - they are only getting worse.)
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Monday August 15 2022, @09:58PM
Yep: i always feel tired (just DRAINED!) and depressed unless i take multi-vitamins regularly.
If i take a vitamin in the morning, i can't sleep at night, so i take it at night just before bed.
I just feel better if i take them regularly, and i hate feeling exhausted and drained and mentally fatigued.
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @10:18PM
Arthritic toe that ached near constantly when I walked. For awhile I took Glucosamine capsules (might have been combined with another supplement, don't remember). Sort of helped, for awhile, not very convincing. Then saw a note somewhere that tart cherry was an age old remedy for this complaint.
Sure works for me, it must be 10 years or more that I have a few ounces (80-100 ml) of tart cherry juice every night before bed. Now I can walk for a mile or more with no pain. If I quit for a day, a few days later my toe aches for a day.
Like you, it's cheap so I really don't care if the effect is "real" or psychosomatic. The grocery store carries it, but it's a couple of bucks cheaper at Trader Joe's so I stock up when I go there (across town, only go by there once a month or so.)
A scientist friend with similar problem was skeptical, but tried eating dried tart cherries and now swears by them, he travels with them (eat like raisins).
Note: "tart cherry" is not the same as "cherry".
(Score: 3, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Monday August 15 2022, @11:57PM
The placebo effect is very very real, and stronger than many of the medications that are developed for Billions of dollars in R&D and put to clinical trials.
If taking a multivitamin gives you a placebo boost in your quality of life, then take it. Get one with extra B so you can see it working in your bright yellow urine.
As for other supplements, I feel real anti-inflammatory effects from dietary ginger - study that and find no measurable effect and I will gleefully ignore you.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:34PM
Yeah. I think a big problem with the studies claiming no impact, is they pretty much all assert that vitamin supplements have little to no impact for people eating a well-balanced diet.
That's great - but I can't remember the last person I met who actually ate a well-balanced diet on a regular basis. We're Americans - abysmally bad diets are practically a cultural treasure.
For my part it's vitamin D that I take most regularly in order to avoid calcium-based kidney stones. I passed one in college - I do NOT recommend it. Doc had no advice on avoiding them, but I got to thinking excess calcium in urine sounds like my body isn't absorbing it properly, which requires vitamin D. So for 20 years I've been taking D3 supplements, any time I stop for more than about a month I start pissing sand (the tiny kidney stones that can amalgamate into the great big bastard of a goats-head thorn that got me the first time)
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:10PM
I'm gonna go with the study that used a sample size of 700,000 over the one you conducted with a sample size of 30.....
(Score: 3, Insightful) by sjames on Tuesday August 16 2022, @04:07PM
That's the thing. The study looked at mortality rather than overall wellness. The multi-vitamins won't prolong your life according to the data, but it says nothing about how well you will be during that life.
It would be good to look at that scientifically but that'll have to be a different study.
As an aside, most advocates of nutritional supplements don't seem to be making longevity claims anyway, just wellness claims.
Meanwhile, the RDA really should be called the minimum recommended daily allowance since it was determined by finding the smallest amount necessary to not get known deficiency diseases. So take the RDA and you won't get scurvy, rickets, anemia or beriberi, but that doesn't mean you'll be what anyone would call healthy.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 15 2022, @10:05PM (9 children)
What about the average unhealthy adult like me who is eating random trashy discount foods?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Username on Monday August 15 2022, @11:36PM (3 children)
That is exactly what vitamin supplements are for. Article completely ignores why they exist.
Personally I don't eat trash food, I drink protein shakes three times a day. It has everything the body needs to stay alive, and the source of my vitamin intake.
(Score: 2) by stretch611 on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:42AM
Are you sure that statement can stand on its own?
It makes me think of the baby food [youtu.be] that gets fed to robocop.
Now with 5 covid vaccine shots/boosters altering my DNA :P
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:12PM
A lot of that crappy food is already "fortified" to make it more "healthy." "Fortified" basically just means mixing in a multi-vitamin into the batter.
So those folks might not be deficient to start with either.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:34PM
And where's your fiber coming from?
Fiber is not used by your body directly, but it's extremely important for maintaining a healthy gut biome.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:24PM (4 children)
Yeah, my impression of the USA is the average US adult is unhealthy[1] and eating crap. Many even think the crap they eat is healthy e.g. breakfast cereals and "energy"/granola bars laden with sugar.
[1] https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-statistics/overweight-obesity [nih.gov]
So 73.1% are not of healthy weight. 73% > 50% therefore the average US adult is unhealthy. QED.
p.s. You could be overeating and still not getting enough of all your required micronutrients.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by openlyretro on Tuesday August 16 2022, @02:34PM (1 child)
Even people on a healthy diet can consume things that block nutrient uptake, like phytates in beans and nuts. Some vegetables have anti-nutrients in them, too. So people who are eating healthy don't always benefit from all the nutrients and vitamins they are putting in their system due to improper food prep or just eating a bunch of raw stuff because it seems "natural". Over the long term it can lead to chronic deficiencies, which is what happened to me while I was eating a vegan diet for several years and not paying attention to stuff like that.
(Score: 2) by HammeredGlass on Wednesday August 17 2022, @12:19AM
Soaking beans overnight, and getting a healthy dose of mineral-absorbing sponges like onions and garlic, as those foods increase the absorption of minerals like zinc and iron, will negate much of the negatives of phytates found in beans.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:16PM
I would definitely hesitate to correlate being overweight with vitamin deficiency.
As I mentioned already a lot of that processed food is fortified with vitamin supplements to make it more "healthy."
Additionally, while some green vegetable could probably help everybody they are not the ONLY source for a lot of vitamins. Someone who is already eating 4000 calories a day could probably pick up those extra few micrograms by eating more quantity of a low-vitamin food.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @05:57PM
Most of those terrible cereals have extra vitamins in them to make them seem more healthy:
They will definitely increase your weight via a crap ton of sugar but you will not be a vitamin deficient fatass.
List of fortified cereals [livestrong.com]
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday August 16 2022, @12:58AM (6 children)
If you ever meet a Porta-Potty or Sani-Can man, ask him about those vitamins. When they clean a Can, they find many daily vitamins lying in the bottom.
https://caltonnutrition.com/5-reasons-your-body-isnt-absorbing-vitamins/ [caltonnutrition.com]
Sadly, I have no idea which brands or formulations dissolve in a timely manner, and which just pass through the digestive system.
Personally, I try to get my vitamins and such in liqui-gel capsules. There is no question they are going to dissolve. Of course, it is best to get your vitamins and minerals in your diet.
(Score: 0, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:24AM (1 child)
Opinion fucking discarded.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:31AM
https://www.centerforfoodsafety.org/issues/311/ge-foods/about-ge-foods [centerforfoodsafety.org]
Did you say something about high fructose corn syrup?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by ChrisMaple on Tuesday August 16 2022, @03:31AM (3 children)
Most absorption of nutrients is in the intestines, and the transit time from mouth to excretion usually exceeds 1 day. The idea that if the pill doesn't fall apart in 20 minutes, then its nutrients won't be absorbed, is nonsense.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @04:47AM (2 children)
When I take multi-vitamins it makes my urine change color. EVERYTHING in my urine was extracted from my blood. IOW, it was clearly the multi-vitamins that made their way into my blood, was extracted out of my blood, and made its way into the urine. It's not a coincidence that my urine only changes color when I so happen to take multivitamins each and every time. That would be such a statistical unlikely thing to occur.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @05:47PM
Yeah but if you're seeing it in your urine that means your body is flushing out the excess meaning you are probably taking more than you need.
(Score: 2) by HammeredGlass on Wednesday August 17 2022, @12:23AM
The only thing you can prove might have transited your systems into your urine is color, which might not even be the result of any kind of food coloring.
(Score: 2) by legont on Tuesday August 16 2022, @05:01AM (1 child)
I try eating healthy and getting all the vitamins from food. I do take some when I think I am deficient such as D when there is not much light and C when I feel under weather. The last one helps in 2 out of 3 times I believe.
I was surprised recently. For a reason my doctor run all vitamins blood test on me and found I am deficient B12. How the fuck it's possible when I eat a seriously sized steak every week on Friday I asked. She said that's sometimes what body does when one is getting old and insisted I take B12 daily no matter what. So far I doubled steaks and still skipping the pill, but not sure any more if it's smart even though the test went back to normal.
"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
(Score: 3, Informative) by RamiK on Tuesday August 16 2022, @08:39AM
B12 is produced by gut microbes so it's possible a lot of them died after an antibiotics course.
Like, it's fairly common to develop some lactose intolerance from sweeteners (artificial or natural): https://www.researchgate.net/publication/331181722_Effects_of_Sweeteners_on_the_Gut_Microbiota_A_Review_of_Experimental_Studies_and_Clinical_Trials [researchgate.net]
Mind you, there's a lot of similar interactions with all sorts of naturally occurring or supplemented chemicals found in just regular (processed, GE or even unprocessed and organic) food. Like, B12 as a supplement is in and by itself, antimicrobial to some gut microbes. So, ironically, someone taking it to offset the side-effects from one imbalance would often end up creating another imbalance: https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fmicb.2018.02780/full [frontiersin.org]
Anyhow, there's thousands of guy microbes and all sorts of complex interactions that aren't known or modeled so doctors don't have procedures to handle this stuff other than telling you to take b12 and that they don't know what caused it.
compiling...
(Score: 1) by zion-fueled on Tuesday August 16 2022, @01:38PM
When I drink 5hr energies (mostly B vitamins) a few hours after my 200mg cup of coffee and feel energized it must be that 30mg of caffeine. When it lasts hours longer than the coffee it's all in my head.
I actually agree though that a non targeted multi vitamin will do nothing for the most part. Eat what you lack, for instance vitamin d3. Can you guess that that keeps me up too? Or how about magnesium puts me to sleep.
Everything is drugs. Not sure how this is supposed to prevent cancer or stop heart attacks any more than taking ibuprofen or popping a xanax would. Not what it's for.
(Score: 2) by richtopia on Tuesday August 16 2022, @02:34PM (1 child)
I have a jar of gummy multivitamins on my fridge. I don't eat them except when I'm stumbling through the kitchen on my way to bed and I eat a handful with all the water I can stomach. I still have a hangover, but I hope it improved that hangover.
(Score: 3, Informative) by HammeredGlass on Wednesday August 17 2022, @12:27AM
"handful"?????????
Dude! There are a number of common vitamins like A and E that are fat soluble and will build up to toxic levels quite quickly.
PLEASE! tell me you are kidding?
Even the Inuit don't fuck around with seal and polar bear livers, as they consume every last other bit of the animal that can be gnawed raw by human teeth, because of the high likelihood of getting toxic levels of Vitamin A.
(Score: 2, Informative) by brausch on Tuesday August 16 2022, @05:18PM (1 child)
I started taking one a couple of decades ago and it helped with a very specific problem that I (and three of my brothers also) have. My right eyelid would occasionally twitch ever so slightly. I couldn't identify any specific cause and just lived with it. I mentioned it to one of my brothers and he said he also had had the problem but it went away when he started taking a daily vitamin. I tried it and it worked for me as well. Not sure what particular ingredient helped and don't really care. I don't see any harm and in my case there was this one specific benefit.
I'm sure my daily diet is lacking in something but this is a simple fix for my problem.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday August 16 2022, @05:49PM
I take vitamin D because a blood test indicated I was low on vitamin D.
Now that you mention it though I used to have twitchy lid too but I can't even remember the last time it occurred!
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 16 2022, @09:45PM (1 child)
I grew up with my Mom giving me the good ol' Flinstone's chewable vitamins. Anybody else remember those?
So I naturally came in to adulthood figuring vitamins were good, and I'd get them once in a while but not that often because seriously who's got time and who thinks that much about health in their 20s?
So one day I heard that most OTC vitamins never got in to your system. That was the first crack in the armor. The study did say, however, that grocery store generics were good at getting the vitamins in. So I got me some grocery store generic multivitamins and started taking them once a day as recommended and sure enough, unlike the others, they actually did something: give me an upset stomach.
So I seriously reconsidered the whole *idea* of vitamin supplements, the incentives, and the common sense of it. I had ancestors who lived to good old ages at times when such things simply didn't exist. I figured as long as I cut out the binge drinking and other excesses, I'd probably be OK and here I am at 54 with only one health condition, and that condition?
It's gout, and it can be attributed partly to genetics, but also to the fact that those Flinstone vitamins came along with a meat based diet and access to sugary snacks, processed food, etc.
It cut way back on soda years before people were talking about taxing it, because I had the good fortune to realize that supersizing was going on and it was either "drink the whole thing so you don't waste it", or "stop drinking that". I think this was partly some kind of wisdom I had, and somewhat good luck. I still have fond memories of hiking the Appalachian trail with a 20 oz. soda and a bag of chips and/or jerky which is not healthy even if you do burn it off.
It's trail mix and water on hikes. Sugar is the devil I swear.
Just last year I realized the added sugar was sneaking up on me from bread and yogurt. I cut those out, and my abs came back. It's a huge up-hill battle; but I digress.
The modern diet in the West generally doesn't lack vitamins. If you eat processed food, it's fortified. If you don't eat processed food, and you eat a common-sense variety, you tend to get vitamins to the point where you won't come anywhere near a deficiency.
Would I never take vitamins? Of course not; but I'd only take them if an actual doctor told me I have a deficiency, and I don't. I just have damage from Western diet, and vitamins aren't going to fix it. I don't think they fully understand the mechanism; but gout is damage. I'm on uric-acid controlling medicine for life.
Thanks, industrial food.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 17 2022, @02:39AM
We're Flintstones kids, ten million strong . . . and growing.
Thank you for the interesting post. If you want to get your yogurt back, make your own. I got a sous vide immersion device a few years back when an in-law gave me an Amazon gift card for Christmas and I didn't know what to get. I don't do a lot of sous vide cooking, but I use it weekly to make yogurt. I buy milk, heat it to boiling (careful of boil-overs!), pour it in quart Mason jars, add a spoonful of yogurt (after the temp drops back down to around 100F), set the sous vide to about 111F, and let the jars go overnight. Perfect unsweetened yogurt in the morning, but I refrigerate it for a day before eating it. I can go into a bit more detail how I do it, but it is super easy.