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Here's What Happens When You Send a NASCAR Stock Car to Le Mans

posted by hubie on Monday June 12, @06:34AM   Printer-friendly
from the fast-and-furious dept.
News

Freeman writes:

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/06/heres-what-happens-when-you-send-a-nascar-stock-car-to-le-mans/

When Le Mans renovated its facilities in 2012, it built 55 pit garages for regular entrants in its annual 24-hour race and one more for entrants that want to demonstrate something new (there are actually a total of 62 entrants this year, but the special one is still called Garage 56).

These have included the pint-size Nissan Deltawing in 2012 and the closely related electric Nissan ZEOD RC in 2014. In 2016, quadruple amputee Frédéric Sausset did something neither of those two Nissans could manage, finishing the race in a specially modified prototype with the SRT 41 team, which repeated the feat with a pair of paraplegic drivers in 2021. And there have been attempts to run a hydrogen-powered racer from Garage 56. But this year's entry is a bit different—and a little more familiar to Americans. It's a NASCAR stock car.

[...] While it will be racing on the same track at the same time as the other 61 cars in the race, the Garage 56 entry is in its own class, and it's there to entertain the fans and hopefully finish the race rather than fight for overall victory. The drivers appear to be having fun, too.

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  • (Score: 3, Funny) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Monday June 12, @06:55AM (1 child)

    by Rosco P. Coltrane (4757) on Monday June 12, @06:55AM (#1311078)

    the special one is still called Garage 56

    Nooo... The best special garage is Garage 54 [youtube.com]

  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by dalek on Monday June 12, @09:39AM (5 children)

    by dalek (15489) on Monday June 12, @09:39AM (#1311084) Journal

    Because I post a lot about NASCAR, I think I'm expected to comment on this story.

    NASCAR's NextGen car isn't as different from sports cars as previous generations with the additions of things like a sequential gearbox and an independent rear suspension. The NextGen car adopted a single lug nut, which is used by many other racing series. The wheels are larger than on the Gen 6 car, and that also means that the NextGen car has larger and more powerful brakes.

    Hendrick Motorsports definitely added some aero parts to the Garage 56 entry that you didn't see on their cars at Sonoma yesterday. It also had working lights, which are a necessity for night racing at circuits like Le Mans and Daytona. It also had carbon brakes, which I believe was done to make the brakes hold up over the 24 hours of racing. It was also about 500 pounds lighter. The car that ran at Le Mans wasn't quite the same car that was on track at Sonoma or will be on track in two weeks at Nashville.

    The top tier of sports car racing in the United States is sanctioned by IMSA. It wouldn't be all that difficult to add something like the Garage 56 car at Le Mans as a new class in IMSA. I'm guessing it wouldn't be especially hard for current NASCAR teams to field Garage 56-like entries in IMSA. Penske and Rick Ware Racing already compete in IMSA. It wouldn't surprise me if teams like Trackhouse and 23XI would also have interest. Outside of the Rolex 24, it would be really difficult for current Cup Series drivers to compete in IMSA due to the scheduling. But it could be run by a combination of former NASCAR drivers (like Jimmie Johnson) and successful drivers from other motorsports disciplines who want to try NASCAR (like Jenson Button). It might also be a way for young drivers, perhaps from the truck series, to get experience in Cup-like cars.

    I'm not saying this will happen, but I have some speculation online about it. If it did happen, it probably would be a good idea to only run part of the IMSA schedule. This is already normal for IMSA, where some races like the Rolex 24 have all the classes, but others like Long Beach only have some of the classes. I don't see any issues with running tracks like Daytona, Watkins Glen, Mosport, Road Atlanta, Indianapolis, and Road America. On the other hand, it might be a good idea to not have these cars trying to negotiate the hairpin at Long Beach. That might significantly add cautions to an already short race. Just saying.

    This may just be wild speculation, but I think the overall success of this car at Le Mans might result in it appearing again in IMSA.

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    EXTERMINATE

    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by dalek on Monday June 12, @10:17AM (3 children)

      by dalek (15489) on Monday June 12, @10:17AM (#1311085) Journal

      I saw this after posting my previous comment: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/08/sports/autoracing/nascar-le-mans-24-hours.html [nytimes.com]. Here are the relevant parts:

      “In the end, you’re going to see performance out of this car, at least based on what we learned in the simulator and what we learned at the tests, that this thing is a proper racecar, and I’m super pumped about seeing it in traffic, up against the GT cars to show what is really possible.”

      [John] Doonan said millions of dollars have been invested into the project, which would realize the objectives of introducing NASCAR to a wider audience and showcasing to the auto industry a car that debuted in the Cup Series last year.

      NASCAR, celebrating its 75th anniversary this year, introduced its next generation car last year, on which its Le Mans version is based. With the changes made to the Le Mans car, [Jimmie] Johnson said he was hoping it was “not a one and done” but was the start of a new era for NASCAR.

      “I would imagine there are ideas that can be pulled from this vehicle and potentially apply to NASCAR vehicles as they evolve,” he said. “Maybe we could start another series and run these, because it is a really cool, fun car.”

      John Doonan is the president of IMSA. Jimmie Johnson is a 7-time NASCAR Cup Series champion and one of the drivers of this car.

      I don't think a separate series makes sense, but as a class in IMSA races, it does. He seems to be suggesting that this could be a proving ground for new features that could make their way into the Cup Series. If that's the case, I bet you'd get massive participation from NASCAR teams.

      About two weeks ago, the 41 car for Stewart-Haas Racing got hit with a massive penalty for using a counterfeit part: https://www.cbssports.com/nascar/news/chase-briscoe-penalty-analysis-of-stewart-haas-racings-historically-large-penalty-for-counterfeit-parts/ [cbssports.com]. There are some spec parts for the NextGen car, meaning that teams have to buy them from a single supplier and aren't allowed to modify them. SHR went beyond modifying the parts (L1 penalty), manufactured their own part, put labels on it to make it appear genuine and get it through inspection, and they put it on at least the 41 car. It's a competitive advantage as long as you don't get busted for cheating, and teams will do almost anything to get such an advantage.

      If teams have a chance to try out and become familiar with new features in IMSA before they're added to the Cup Series cars, that's a legal way to get a competitive advantage. If nothing else, you're gathering data about how to setup the car with those features, and you can rely on that data when they become part of the Cup Series. If teams are willing to cheat and risk massive penalties like SHR did and several others who have incurred L1 penalties, do you really think they'll pass up the opportunity to get a legal advantage?

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      • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Thexalon on Monday June 12, @12:31PM (2 children)

        by Thexalon (636) on Monday June 12, @12:31PM (#1311095)

        About two weeks ago, the 41 car for Stewart-Haas Racing got hit with a massive penalty for using a counterfeit part. There are some spec parts for the NextGen car, meaning that teams have to buy them from a single supplier and aren't allowed to modify them. SHR went beyond modifying the parts (L1 penalty), manufactured their own part, put labels on it to make it appear genuine and get it through inspection, and they put it on at least the 41 car. It's a competitive advantage as long as you don't get busted for cheating, and teams will do almost anything to get such an advantage.

        An ex of mine, who was a huge Nascar fan and worked in the PR department of a truck team for a while, described the motto of "If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying" which is apparently pretty common among the crews. The whole "can I modify the car in a clever way to give me an advantage without being caught by the inspectors" is practically an entirely different sub-game within the game. Sometimes they get busted, sometimes they get away with it, but they're pretty much always trying.

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        The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.

        • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Tuesday June 13, @05:14PM (1 child)

          by Freeman (732) on Tuesday June 13, @05:14PM (#1311291) Journal

          For reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick [wikipedia.org]

          As with most successful racers, Yunick was a master of the grey area straddling the rules. Perhaps his most famous exploit was his #13 1966 Chevrolet Chevelle, driven by Curtis Turner. The car was so much faster than the competition during testing that they were certain that cheating was involved; some sort of aerodynamic enhancement was strongly suspected, but the car's profile seemed to be entirely stock, as the rules required. It was eventually discovered that Yunick had lowered and modified the roof and windows and raised the floor (to lower the body) of the production car. This car has many legends about it, and they were definitively debunked by the 2019 Dinner with Racers episode on Amazon Prime TV. Since then, NASCAR required each race car's roof, hood, and trunk to fit templates representing the production car's exact profile.

          Another Yunick improvisation was getting around the regulations specifying a maximum size for the fuel tank, by using 11-foot (3 meter) coils of 2-inch (5-centimeter) diameter tubing for the fuel line to add about 5 US gallons (18.9 liters) to the car's fuel capacity. Once, NASCAR officials came up with a list of nine items for Yunick to fix before the car would be allowed on the track. The suspicious NASCAR officials had removed the tank for inspection. Yunick started the car with no gas tank and said "Better make it ten,"[3] and drove it back to the pits. He used a basketball in the fuel tank which could be inflated when the car's fuel capacity was checked and deflated for the race.

          Yunick also used such innovations as offset chassis, raised floors, roof spoilers, nitrous oxide injection, and other modifications often within the letter of the rule book, if not the spirit. "All those other guys were cheatin' 10 times worse than us," Yunick wrote in his autobiography, "so it was just self-defense." Yunick's success was also due to his expertise in the aerodynamics of racing cars.

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          Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"

          • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Joe Desertrat on Thursday June 15, @01:25AM

            by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Thursday June 15, @01:25AM (#1311474)

            I was going to comment on the Yunick legend, but you beat me to it. Another legend I recall, perhaps not with 100% accuracy, is a driver (Foyt?) getting caught adding nitrous to the fuel mix because the tank hidden under the valve covers was accidentally left turned on and an inspector heard it hissing.

    • (Score: 4, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Monday June 12, @03:08PM

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday June 12, @03:08PM (#1311113)

      >it wouldn't be especially hard for current NASCAR teams to field Garage 56-like entries in IMSA

      I do see a problem for the business side of the equation: is there sufficient additional sponsorship income to support the cost of a single (or small number) of entrants. A one-off thing can be supported by somebody who just wants to do it, and LeMans has a semi-tradition of supporting that kind of thing. To run it as a more regular entrant in a lot of IMSA races; who's paying that bill? Will IMSA gain enough NASCAR viewers to prod the IMSA sponsors to support the campaigns? Wild speculation needs some wild speculators to try it out and see if the business case is there.

      (Insert Budweiser sales joke here.)

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      Україна досі не є частиною Росії Слава Україні🌻 https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/06/24/7408365/

  • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 12, @11:58AM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 12, @11:58AM (#1311092)

    The Next Gen car finished at Le Mans, after an hour(?) in the pits for a repair (transmission?)

    According to a couple of press reports, it was a fan favorite for a few reasons including:
      + the engine sound -- big V-8 vs. all sorts of more-efficient turbocharged engines and hybrids
      + a jack person in the pits -- others have built in air-jacks and lack that drama
      + just how much bigger it was than all the other Le Mans cars, the old name Le Monstre seems to have come back

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