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posted by hubie on Tuesday October 10 2023, @12:30AM   Printer-friendly
from the say-cheese dept.

What is a photography anyway?

"World's first AI art award ignites debate about what is photography."

The artists won the world's first artificial intelligence art award at the Ballarat International Foto Biennale with a life-like image of sisters cuddling an octopus, which was created using computer prompts, instead of a camera.

"Many people say my pictures make them uncomfortable ... When I explain that AI creates them as a kind of collage... many laugh, others are distressed and find them disgusting... "

https://www.smh.com.au/culture/art-and-design/world-s-first-ai-art-award-ignites-debate-about-what-is-photography-20231004-p5e9td.html


Original Submission

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Microsoft's AI text-to-image generator, Copilot Designer, appears to be heavily filtering outputs after a Microsoft engineer, Shane Jones, warned that Microsoft has ignored warnings that the tool randomly creates violent and sexual imagery, CNBC reported.

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Original Submission

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  • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday October 10 2023, @12:54AM

    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @12:54AM (#1328050)

    >many laugh, others are distressed and find them disgusting...

    That's a pretty good description of how people in general react to a lot of things called art.

    --
    🌻🌻 [google.com]
  • (Score: 2) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Tuesday October 10 2023, @01:38AM (1 child)

    by Rosco P. Coltrane (4757) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @01:38AM (#1328051)

    a way for the superrich to evade taxes.

  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 10 2023, @03:56AM (12 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 10 2023, @03:56AM (#1328059)
    I consider it Art. More than some person pooping into jars or throwing paint at walls.

    However I don't consider it photography.

    It may be photo realistic art or similar but saying it's photography is as wrong as saying it's a watercolor painting.
    • (Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:05AM

      by maxwell demon (1608) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:05AM (#1328065) Journal

      Full agreement. Otherwise one would have to consider photorealistic raytracing images as photography, too (they are even closer to actual photography since they actually use light rays, just simulated ones).

      --
      The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
    • (Score: 2) by zocalo on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:22AM (6 children)

      by zocalo (302) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:22AM (#1328068)
      Yeah, it's art as there's definitely a human creative process involved (and often quite a complex one), although I'm sure some would disagree, but definitely not photography in the same way that a "collage" (to use the artist's own example) is not a photograph, but an artworks potentially created using photographs. As always though, what is "art" and whether you'd want it on your wall or in your home/garden/whatever is a YMMV thing.

      Another factor to consider in people's responses to this kind of work though is that we're still deep in uncanny valley territory. Take the image in question. It looks like the woman on the left is sitting with her back pressed into the woman on the right, who would then have her right arm behind the back of the woman on the left. But where are the left shoulder and arm of the woman on the left? There's not enough room for them to be hidden by the octopus and the angle they are sitting seems like they would be inside the woman on the right. Unless they're conjoined (a possibility further emphasised by wearing the same top) there's something fundamentally off about most of these images, and I think a lot of people may be picking up on that without realising why.
      --
      UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
      • (Score: 1) by shrewdsheep on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:48AM (2 children)

        by shrewdsheep (5215) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @06:48AM (#1328074)

        Prompt: Triamese twins of two humans and an octopus.

        • (Score: 2, Funny) by khallow on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:07PM (1 child)

          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:07PM (#1328207) Journal

          Triamese twins of two humans and an octopus.

          They said it couldn't be done!

          But what do I do with them now?

          • (Score: 2) by looorg on Wednesday October 11 2023, @04:50PM

            by looorg (578) on Wednesday October 11 2023, @04:50PM (#1328391)

            I was expecting it to be more like 'The Dream of the Fisherman's Wife' when I read the text and had not seen the picture. I was disappointed. Also do NOT look that one up at work, very NSFW.

      • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:07PM

        by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:07PM (#1328193) Homepage Journal

        I'm a former art student. The only artist here is the guy who programmed the computer. It's no more "art" than those paintings by chimps and elephants.

        --
        mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
      • (Score: 2) by quietus on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:09PM (1 child)

        by quietus (6328) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:09PM (#1328210) Journal

        I'm thinking of Magritte, but is something being off not a fundamental requirement of (modern) art? Otherwise it would be pictography, no?

        • (Score: 2) by zocalo on Tuesday October 10 2023, @09:35PM

          by zocalo (302) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @09:35PM (#1328221)
          Sure, there's the whole movement of surrealism and similar for a start. I was referring more to the line about the pictures "making people uncomfortable" though. The photos have, at first glance, a very photographic quality, so I think at one level people are expecting them to be an accurate visual representation of something real and tangible, unlike surrealism where it's obviously not real. It's at a deeper, more subconcious level where I suspect people may be picking up on the fact that something is not quite right, but are not able to quite say what that is unless they take the time to conciously break down the flaws, e.g. the relative positioning of the two women in the image with the octopus or, in many cases of AI generated images, representations of human hands.
          --
          UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
    • (Score: 2) by Opportunist on Tuesday October 10 2023, @09:18AM (2 children)

      by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @09:18AM (#1328082)

      It serves no purpose, wastes resources and is generally useless?

      Yup, must be art.

    • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:05PM

      by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:05PM (#1328192) Homepage Journal

      phARTography, perhaps? How can it be a photograph when no camera was used? How does a computer write with light, which is what the word "photography" means? That's another thing I hate about this damned century, ignorance masquerading as knowledge. I blame former President Pinocchio, the "nobody knew" president, the man so damned dishonest he has 91 felony charges in four different jurisdictions and has already been ruled a fraudster twice, once recently about real estate and one a couple of years ago about "Trump University". If you plead guilty, you're fucking GUILTY!

      If computer-generated art is photography, Rembrandt and DaVinci were photographers.

      --
      mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Rich on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:51AM (1 child)

    by Rich (945) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @08:51AM (#1328081) Journal

    At what amount of AI involvement should an image be considered as AI generated. It's obvious when everything comes from a prompt. But what about an Image-to-Image process that is run over a real photo? Easy, you say, that's just hinting the AI like with a prompt. But now consider Samsung phones, which for some mysterious reason can produce a better image of the moon than their optics are able to... (cf. https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/11nzrb0/samsung_space_zoom_moon_shots_are_fake_and_here/ [reddit.com] )

    • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:10PM

      by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:10PM (#1328195) Homepage Journal

      Any AI at all, full stop, period. My paintings are airbrush and paintbrush generated. Sound stupid? So does AI generated "art".

      --
      mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by SomeRandomGeek on Tuesday October 10 2023, @03:19PM (1 child)

    by SomeRandomGeek (856) on Tuesday October 10 2023, @03:19PM (#1328136)

    As I was looking into AI for software development this year, I was struck by the importance of "Prompt Engineering." Basically, a human can coax some pretty amazing programming feats out of an AI, but the human needs to know what to ask for and how to ask. "Prompt Engineering" is becoming its own specialized and marketable skill set. This article is about the equivalent phenomenon in art. I suspect that within the next few years, prompt literacy will become an important skill in all kinds of fields. The world will be divided into those that can coax amazing things out of their AI and those who can't.

    • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:14PM

      by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Tuesday October 10 2023, @07:14PM (#1328196) Homepage Journal

      In Journey to Madness computers are programmed in standard interplanetary like everybody speaks. And there are no more professional sculptors, painters, writers, songwriters, or musicians, only amateurs. The computers generate all art.

      On the plus side, nobody has to work unless they want to.

      --
      mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
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