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posted by janrinok on Friday June 07, @09:58PM   Printer-friendly
from the but-not-in-a-good-way dept.

Video report in NYTimes, taken as text reporting by various outlets. E.g. The Telegraph

Introduction of high-speed Starlink turns some Brazilian tribesmen into 'lazy addicts' glued to their phones

The indigenous Marubo people, who for hundreds of years have existed in small huts along the Itui River in the Amazon, were connected to the billionaire's satellite network in September.

The community embraced the technology, marvelling at the life-saving ability to call for immediate help when grappling with venomous snake bites as well as being able to remain in contact with faraway relatives.

But, since a group of men arrived at the camp with antennas strapped to their backs to connect the remote tribe of 2,000 people to the internet, there have been some less desirable consequences.

Critics warn tribe members have become "lazy", reclining in hammocks all day glued to their phones to gossip on WhatsApp or chat to strangers on Instagram.

And there have already been reports of young men engaging in aggressive sexual behaviour after being exposed to pornography, Alfredo Marubo, leader of a Marubo association of villages, told The New York Times.

Young men brought up in a culture where kissing in public is seen as scandalous have been sharing explicit videos with one another in group chats, he said, adding: "We're worried young people are going to want to try it."
...
Kâipa Marubo, a father of three, said he was concerned about his children playing first-person shooter video games, fearing they might want to mimic the attacks.

Another leader, Enoque Marubo, 40, said the tribe has started limiting the hours members could access the internet because its introduction had "changed the routine so much that it was detrimental".

Members can browse the internet for two hours in the morning and five hours in the afternoon and all day on Sundays.

"In the village, if you don't hunt, fish and plant, you don't eat," Enoque said.

Enoque worked with Brazilian activist Flora Dutra to bring the internet to the tribe.

They contacted American philanthropist Allyson Reneau, who reportedly donated 20 Starlink units to the Marubo tribe.

See also :

Remote Amazon Tribe Finally Gets Internet, Gets Hooked on Porn and Social Media:

I wonder what ads they'll be shown based on their geolocation? Given how fast they learn, it shouldn't take long to figure out that content creation could be more lucrative than just consumption. Does Amazon deliver WebCams and lights in the Amazon forest, tho'?


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  • (Score: 2) by krishnoid on Friday June 07, @10:50PM (1 child)

    by krishnoid (1156) on Friday June 07, @10:50PM (#1359745)

    So they arrived at a camp with stuff strapped to their backs ... to meet a tribe that has electricity to recharge their phones? I'm guessing they have solar?

    • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:05AM

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:05AM (#1359754)

      >I'm guessing they have solar?

      Or hamster wheel driven generators...

      It's pretty remarkable how quickly cellular phone tech conquered the deepest corners of South America.

      --
      🌻🌻 [google.com]
  • (Score: 2) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Friday June 07, @11:37PM

    by Rosco P. Coltrane (4757) on Friday June 07, @11:37PM (#1359751)

    Young men brought up in a culture where kissing in public is seen as scandalous have been sharing explicit videos with one another in group chats

    So they a blowjob or engage in sodomy in public or something? It's still not kissing.

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @12:00AM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @12:00AM (#1359752)

    And there have already been reports of young men engaging in aggressive sexual behaviour after being exposed to pornography, Alfredo Marubo, leader of a Marubo association of villages, told The New York Times.

    Young men brought up in a culture where kissing in public is seen as scandalous have been sharing explicit videos with one another in group chats, he said, adding: "We're worried young people are going to want to try it."

    There we have it. Finally, the definition of "Aggressive Sexual Behavior": watching porn, and sharing what you watch with others who might be interested.

    In fact, I've been called sexually aggressive for *not* having sex with my girlfriend, because she was pissing me off.

    Just more to add to the list! (Whatever you're doing, or not doing, it's "Aggressive Sexual Behavior". Anything. It doesn't have to be sexual.)

    • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:06AM (1 child)

      by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:06AM (#1359755)

      Sex: the oldest weapon.

      --
      🌻🌻 [google.com]
    • (Score: 4, Funny) by SomeGuy on Saturday June 08, @01:42AM

      by SomeGuy (5632) on Saturday June 08, @01:42AM (#1359763)

      Just wait until they discover anime.

    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by pTamok on Saturday June 08, @12:41PM

      by pTamok (3042) on Saturday June 08, @12:41PM (#1359804)

      In fact, I've been called sexually aggressive for *not* having sex with my girlfriend, because she was pissing me off.

      A playwright called 'arry Stoffanees wrote a play on that topic [wikipedia.org].

  • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:02AM (20 children)

    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:02AM (#1359753)

    The article talks a lot about concerns of imitation, but no actual imitation so far.

    As a parent, I understand the sentiment, and we discourage FPS and open porn viewing for our children.

    The statisticians (aka liars) say there's no correlation between violent video games and real life violence... This will be an interesting data point.

    In the western world I believe there has been a correlation between widespread easy porn access (via Internet) and a decrease in violent crimes in general, sex crimes in particular... Again, 2000 people isolated in the jungle won't be proof of anything, but it will make an interesting data point, if we get accurate/truthful pre and post statistics reported...

    --
    🌻🌻 [google.com]
    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by DrkShadow on Saturday June 08, @12:42AM (19 children)

      by DrkShadow (1404) on Saturday June 08, @12:42AM (#1359760)

      In fact it will likely increase frustrations (already seen between those not hunting/planting), and will likely create other conflicts. This may escalate to violence, which will, of course, be blamed on games.

      It will likely decrease social integration and just make things more painful overall.

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @02:23AM (18 children)

        by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @02:23AM (#1359766)

        Thank you for your apparently baseless pontificating.

        The deed is done, the actual subsequent behavior data will be interesting but proof of nothing.

        By the way, speaking as a parent: parents know almost nothing about what results they will get from various parenting decisions... You guess the best you can and watch the splatter patterns as it all inevitably hits the fan of real life.

        --
        🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 3, Touché) by DrkShadow on Saturday June 08, @04:35AM (2 children)

          by DrkShadow (1404) on Saturday June 08, @04:35AM (#1359778)

          Baseless?

          "In fact it will likely increase frustrations"

          warn tribe members have become "lazy", reclining in hammocks all day glued to their phones to gossip on WhatsApp or chat to strangers on Instagram. [...] "In the village, if you don't hunt, fish and plant, you don't eat," Enoque said.

          "will likely create other conflicts."

          ---

          "This may escalate to violence,"

          -> how the rest of the world deals with things

          "which will, of course, be blamed on games." -> see, current attacks on games in 'Murrica.

          ---

          "It will likely decrease social integration"

          And there have already been reports of young men engaging in aggressive sexual behaviour after being exposed to pornography, [...]men brought up in a culture where kissing in public is seen as scandalous have been sharing explicit videos with one another in group chats,

          ---

          "and just make things more painful overall."
          I mean, just idle wonder, with no basis whatsoever.

          • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:27PM (1 child)

            by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:27PM (#1359798)

            Likely in fact is mostly meaningless.

            Early days TV sitcom: "what did we do before we all sat around like lumps watching the tube? We all sat around like lumps listening to the radio."

            Of course there will be an initial surge of fascination with the new entertainment. Some tribe members will get addicted and spend more time with the Internet than they should. There were other distractions that addicted some tribe members before the internet, before phones, and to go Reddit on this theme: before they discovered how to make lubricious hand cream. Maybe this new distraction will overwhelm their social order and the children will all leave to go live in the fantasy world they see on the screen - it has happened all over the world, starting with illustrations on paper delivered by sailing ships. It will be interesting to see how this tribe reacts to increased exposure to outside culture. My guess is that if they have remained relatively intact this long, they will continue to exist - possibly figuring out how to obtain some hard currency and order trinkets off Amazon (like the Pitcairn Islanders have done ever since cruise ships started visiting.)

            Nothing is in fact until it has happened.

            --
            🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 4, Interesting) by gnuman on Saturday June 08, @08:22AM (14 children)

          by gnuman (5013) on Saturday June 08, @08:22AM (#1359783)

          parents know almost nothing about what results they will get from various parenting decisions...

          Yes, the clueless ones don't. And most people are clueless hence the phrase "apple doesn't fall far from the tree" and "road to hell paved with good intentions".

          Psychology, it's a real thing. When you learn some things there, you learn what you learn and why. And when you learn how to nudge yourself to change your own behavioral traits, then you can progress into understand how your "lessons" are actually received by your own kids. But if your reaction to my post is just "fuck you , you don't know me", well, then that's a hint you are in the clueless group.

          • (Score: 4, Interesting) by PiMuNu on Saturday June 08, @09:03AM (8 children)

            by PiMuNu (3823) on Saturday June 08, @09:03AM (#1359786)

            > Psychology, it's a real thing

            It would be interesting to do a study on developmental outcomes of children of developmental psychologists. I.e. do psychologists do any better than the rest of us (I freely admit to being hopeless!)

            • (Score: 2) by acid andy on Saturday June 08, @11:26AM (5 children)

              by acid andy (1683) on Saturday June 08, @11:26AM (#1359794) Homepage Journal

              I would guess not. It is said that the cobbler and his children are the worst shod.

              --
              Consumerism is poison.
              • (Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Saturday June 08, @12:30PM (3 children)

                by PiMuNu (3823) on Saturday June 08, @12:30PM (#1359801)

                Anecdotally that is my imagination, but there is a selection bias - if one only hears of the badly shod cobblers, one expects all cobblers to be badly shod. Hence the interest in actual data.

                • (Score: 1) by pTamok on Saturday June 08, @12:50PM (1 child)

                  by pTamok (3042) on Saturday June 08, @12:50PM (#1359808)

                  Anecdote is not data, but I know someone who is the son of a psychologist, and he exhibits the worst character traits of both parents. Also some of the better ones, but efforts to prevent the transmission of certain behaviours appear to have failed.
                  The psychologist is not a developmental psychologist. Perhaps that makes a difference.

                  I also knew (not in the biblical sense) the daughter of a vicar. The daughter was rather forward. The son of the vicar was a bit of a scallywag, too.

                  • (Score: 2) by quietus on Tuesday June 11, @05:27AM

                    by quietus (6328) on Tuesday June 11, @05:27AM (#1360119) Journal

                    No mod points, but ++ for usage of the word scallywag.

                • (Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @01:25PM

                  by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @01:25PM (#1359815)

                  There was the developmental psychologist who posited that anyone could be trained in any skill, proceeded to train his newborn daughters in chess and one became a grand master.

                  So, sure, it _can_ happen, and people do win the lottery (I went on a $1000 fuel cost fishing trip with a $14M winner on his $500k boat). Does it happen every time someone just "puts in the effort"? I say: obviously not.

                  Are the odds better if you try? Absolutely. But we can't have 8 billion world champions of the endeavors of their parents' choosing.

                  --
                  🌻🌻 [google.com]
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @12:46PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @12:46PM (#1359807)

                And don't forget about the blacksmith's mare.

            • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:46PM

              by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:46PM (#1359806)

              Most psychologists I have known are seeking (with very limited success) answers to why they themselves are so screwed up and unhappy. False fronts are the norm for them.

              They are like Shrek, they have layers that tend to make you cry as you peel them back.

              --
              🌻🌻 [google.com]
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @10:17PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 08, @10:17PM (#1359882)
              From what I see teachers seem to do better than psychologists at raising children.
          • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Saturday June 08, @12:41PM (4 children)

            by JoeMerchant (3937) on Saturday June 08, @12:41PM (#1359803)

            "then you can progress into understand how your "lessons" are actually received by your own kids."

            If you keep your kids locked in the basement their entire lives, I agree 100%.

            If you are attempting to teach them independent functioning in the real world full of clueless people, where they will hopefully live without you after your inevitable demise, that's where the splatter patterns get out of your control.

            There is a tension between helicoptering too much and too little, there are limited choices of who to entrust with your children when they aren't in your direction control.

            We have "outlier" children, now in their early 20s with profound autism. We know how to work with them. We typically agree near 100% with the PhD BCBAs who are in (very loose) supervisory roles over the people who work with our sons day to day when they are out of our sight. Those people on the other hand run 45 to 95% clueless and deaf to advice from us and the experts, and that's better than the world at large that our children will hopefully be living in for 40+ years after we are dead.

            --
            🌻🌻 [google.com]
            • (Score: 2) by gnuman on Sunday June 09, @12:00PM (3 children)

              by gnuman (5013) on Sunday June 09, @12:00PM (#1359929)

              There is a tension between helicoptering too much and too little, there are limited choices of who to entrust with your children when they aren't in your direction control.

              I agree. But this is not about helicoptering and raising enfantalized adults. It's about teaching your kids how to deal with external world without falling pray to their irrational fears and doubts. That is confidence. But to be able to teach this, you have to learn the same lessons and recognize your own failing and how to fix them.

              "Apple does not fall far from the tree" is the default-mode of teaching your kids. Your kids learn *by example*. Always. It's what you do, not what you say that matters most. For 15+ years, kids learn what is the "normal" household and what they should expect in their adulthood. They will then repeat that cycle, +- whatever corrections you have done and what corrections they are willing to make once they understand who they are themselves (that can be well into their 20s, 30s or later).

              We have "outlier" children, now in their early 20s with profound autism.

              Sorry to hear that and yes, that is different from my "normal" 3 year old. My advice is about knowing yourself and why we do what we do. Only then can we improve the lives of our kids, by example.

              • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Sunday June 09, @07:22PM (2 children)

                by JoeMerchant (3937) on Sunday June 09, @07:22PM (#1359959)

                I agree about teaching by example, absolutely.

                Just be ready, sometimes life works out like you plan, sometimes not.

                The parenting I respect the least is when children don't live up to their parents' expectations and the parents "disown" them.

                --
                🌻🌻 [google.com]
                • (Score: 2) by gnuman on Monday June 10, @09:56PM (1 child)

                  by gnuman (5013) on Monday June 10, @09:56PM (#1360084)

                  The parenting I respect the least is when children don't live up to their parents' expectations and the parents "disown" them.

                  Agreed. It's kind of a failure of the parenting and then blaming the kids for it. In life, you've got to roll with the punches that life gives you, or you'll end up very disappointed and unhappy.

                  I've been listening to this psychiatrist on youtube and his advice makes a lot of sense. Especially when it comes to alliance building with your children. Instead of making rules and consequences and imposing these, give the power to the kids to make pretty much same rules and consequences then you can "help" your children enforce these.

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-tiTTvkHpw&t=1179s [youtube.com]

                  Of course, for me it's a lot of theory that is yet-to-be-applied. Wish me luck in coming 2 decades :-)

                  • (Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday June 11, @02:41AM

                    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday June 11, @02:41AM (#1360109)

                    Definitely best of luck.

                    The best advice I can give is to stay engaged. Sometimes ignored children come out great, but the odds aren't as good for them as the kids whose parents stay involved.

                    --
                    🌻🌻 [google.com]
  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by ShovelOperator1 on Saturday June 08, @10:12AM

    by ShovelOperator1 (18058) on Saturday June 08, @10:12AM (#1359788)

    I remember when I started with the Internet, it was far from lazy activity. There were lots of things to discover and lots of things to create, it was more focused on creativity and sharing the ways to do it, usually in a form of web sites or FAQs. These times I learned a lot, and I shared a lot. I was one of many examples that with the resources found there, even someone totally not in the topic could start creating in the Internet.
    Around 2005, things started to fall apart. The activity of "surfing", communicating and curating has been replaced by the activity of a single service, like watching TV, and the knowledge sharing became more and more discouraged. The ISP's hosting disappeared, then the free and then cheap hosting, finally being minimized to a cardfile in some Ministry of Truth service. Finally, communicating between people became minimized to a kind of telephone information line-like communication, making communities fall apart.
    So the Internet is not to blame, the corporate plan designed to squeeze personal data and to limit the usage to consumption is.
    And... it is quite suspicious that now the "meritocracy" of these times is viewed assuming the inaccessibility of practical knowledge in the Internet as it is today.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by looorg on Saturday June 08, @10:19AM

    by looorg (578) on Saturday June 08, @10:19AM (#1359789)

    So they were the last control group and things went more or less as expected then when it was introduced to them.

  • (Score: 2) by sonamchauhan on Saturday June 08, @10:38AM

    by sonamchauhan (6546) on Saturday June 08, @10:38AM (#1359790)

    It hasn't turned out as good as it was cracked up to be, has it.

  • (Score: 3, Touché) by DadaDoofy on Sunday June 09, @03:03PM

    by DadaDoofy (23827) on Sunday June 09, @03:03PM (#1359941)

    Who determined it was necessary to ruin the last pocket of unspoiled humanity?

  • (Score: 2) by mrpg on Sunday June 09, @05:14PM

    by mrpg (5708) <mrpgNO@SPAMsoylentnews.org> on Sunday June 09, @05:14PM (#1359948) Homepage

    History has proved again and again that whenever mankind interferes with a less developed civilisation, no matter how well intentioned that interference may be, the results are invariably disastrous.

    Star Trek TNG: 1x22 - Symbiosis

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppykquyAUyY [youtube.com]

            As the rights of each sentient species to live in accordance with the normal cultural evolution is considered sacred, no Starfleet personnel may interfere with the normal and healthy development of alien life and culture.

            Such interference includes introducing superior knowledge, strength, or technology to a world whose society is incapable of handling such advantages wisely.

  • (Score: 2) by mrpg on Sunday June 09, @05:25PM

    by mrpg (5708) <mrpgNO@SPAMsoylentnews.org> on Sunday June 09, @05:25PM (#1359950) Homepage

    “Of the four Andaman tribal communities, we have seen that those in close contact with the outside world have suffered the most. They have declined demographically and culturally,” he told Down To Earth magazine in a recent interview.

    https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/travel/travel-news/creepy-antics-of-british-naval-officer-over-100-years-ago-had-a-profound-impact-on-lost-tribe/news-story/1d6b9e58f92a43f1232a5363c8899b1d?nk=fe2bbfc8cfc27896c45810f53ef8cb9e-1717953384 [adelaidenow.com.au]

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