While Canadians flocked to purchase gas-powered vehicles over the summer, electric vehicle sales continued to nosedive, according to new data from Statistics Canada:
Electric vehicle sales dropped 35.2 per cent in June compared to last year. Zero-emission vehicles comprised only 7.9 per cent of total new motor vehicles sold that month, with 14,090 entering the market.
Meanwhile, 177,313 new motor vehicles were sold in Canada in June, up 6.2 per cent from June 2024.
"In dollar terms, sales increased 3.1 per cent during the same period. In June 2025, there were more new motor vehicles sold in every province compared with the same period in 2024," reads the Statistics Canada data.
"Sales of new passenger cars increased 19.5 per cent in June 2025, marking the first gain in this subsector since November 2024. In June 2025, sales of new trucks (+4.3 per cent) were also higher than one year earlier."
Despite dwindling sales, the Carney government remains committed to its electric vehicle mandate of having 60 per cent of all vehicles sold be ZEVs by 2030 and 100 per cent by 2035, banning all motor vehicle sales.
Previously:
- Automobile Sales, Including EVs and Hybrids, Surge in 2024
- Mazda: Americans Want Cheap Gas Cars
- The EV Graveyard
- South Korean EV Battery Makers Reporting Big Losses as EV Demand Slows
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Battery maker LG Energy Solution's second-quarter profit dropped 58% year-on-year to 195.3 billion won ($141m), the company said on Monday (8 July), as demand for electric vehicles (EVs) slows:
The South Korean-based battery company also saw its revenue drop 30% to 6.2 trillion won ($4.4bn).
The company also faces increased competition from its Chinese rivals, which has weakened its share of the market.
Car manufacturers have been calling for battery companies to create cheaper cells to lower EV prices, which has applied pressure to companies like LG Energy.
This led to LG Energy's chief technology officer, Kim Je-Young, stating that the company would commercialise dry-coating technology by 2028, a technology which makes battery manufacturing cheaper and more efficient.
Battery maker SK On declares 'emergency' as EV sales disappoint. Supplier to Ford and Volkswagen may have to be rescued by its South Korean parent as losses mount:
A leading South Korean producer of electric vehicle batteries has declared itself in crisis as its customers struggle with disappointing EV sales in Europe and the US.
SK On, the world's fourth-largest EV battery maker behind Chinese giants CATL and BYD and South Korean rival LG Energy Solution, has recorded losses for 10 consecutive quarters since being spun off by its parent company in 2021. Its net debt has increased more than fivefold, from Won2.9tn ($2.1bn) to Won15.6tn over the same period, as western EV sales have fallen far short of its expectations.
With losses snowballing, chief executive Lee Seok-hee announced a series of cost-cutting and working practice measures last Monday, describing them as a state of "emergency management".
[...] SK On has made a series of aggressive investments in the US and Europe in recent years, betting on a widely predicted boom in demand for EVs. However, it has since announced extended lay-offs for workers at its plant in the US state of Georgia and delayed launching a second plant in Kentucky, a joint venture with its principal US customer Ford.
Previously:
- LG Energy Solution to Spend $3 Billion to Expand EV Battery Production in South Korea
- Honda and LG are Investing $3.5 Billion in New Ohio Battery Factory
- Ford Motor Company is Planning a Big EV Future
Last week, the House approved a resolution to block the Biden administration's emissions rule that would require more than half of the automobiles sold in the new-car market to be electric by 2032. The 215 representatives who voted for the bill, including eight Democrats, are far more in tune with most of the country than the White House:
Nationwide, the inventory of unsold EVs had grown by nearly 350% over the first half of 2024, creating "a 92-day supply — roughly three months' worth of EVs, and nearly twice the industry average," says Axios, which is 54 days for gasoline-powered vehicles.
Ford, which lost nearly $73,000 on each EV it sold in the second quarter of 2023, continues to yield to reality, now ditching its plans to build a large electric SUV. This "course change," says Just the News, "comes amid lower-than-expected demand for electric vehicles."
[...] "Based on where the market is and where the customer is, we will pivot and adjust and make those tough decisions," said John Lawler, Ford's chief financial officer.
[...] "Of the U.S. consumers planning on purchasing a new vehicle in the next 24 months, only 34% intend to purchase an EV, down 14% from 48% in the 2023," says Ernst & Young's Mobility Consumer Index, "a global survey of almost 20,000 consumers from 28 countries."
The story is much the same in Britain. EVs "are losing value at an 'unsustainable' rate as a slowdown in consumer demand sends used car prices tumbling," the Telegraph reported last week. Meanwhile in France, "the EU's second largest market for battery electric vehicles behind Germany," deliveries have fallen by a third.
Germans are likewise losing interest, as the country has "suffered a 'spectacular' drop in electric car sales as the European Union faces growing calls to delay its net zero vehicle targets," the Telegraph said in a separate story.
Related:
- Stellantis Lays Off Thousands of Workers after Pocketing Hundreds of Millions in EV Subsidies
- VW Turns on Germany as China Targets Europe's EV Blunders
- South Korean EV Battery Makers Reporting Big Losses as EV Demand Slows
- Tesla Lays Off 'More Than 10%' of its Global Workforce
- Why are All the EVs so Expensive?
The company's CEO claims that affordable and reliable vehicles with combustion engines are a priority for US buyers:
Mazda is late to the electrification party. The MX-30 is far from being the roaring success the Japanese automaker had hoped it would be. It was axed from the United States at the end of the 2023 model year due to poor sales. The range-extending version with a rotary engine is only offered in certain markets, and the US is not on the list. In addition, the EZ-6 electric sedan isn't coming here either. However, the situation isn't all that bad.
Why? Because Americans primarily want gas cars. Speaking with Automotive News, Mazda CEO Masahiro Moro said ICE has a long future in America. Even at the end of the decade, traditional gas cars and mild-hybrid models will make up about two-thirds of annual sales. Plug-in hybrids and EVs will represent the remaining third. In other words, most vehicles will still have a gas engine five years from now.
Mazda's head honcho primarily referred to entry-level models, specifically the 3 and CX-30. Moro believes EV growth in the US has slowed down in the last 18 months or so, adding the trend will likely continue in the foreseeable future. That buys the company more time to develop a lithium-ion battery entirely in-house. The goal is to have it ready for 2030 in plug-in hybrids and purely electric cars. Expect a much higher energy density and "very short" charging times. Interestingly, the engineers already have a "very advanced research base for solid-state batteries."
In the meantime, work is underway on a two-rotor gas engine that will serve as a generator.
Related:
Porsche AG on Friday dialled[sic] back plans for its electric vehicle rollout due to weaker demand, pressure in key market China and higher U.S. tariffs, causing the luxury sportscar maker and its parent Volkswagen to slash their 2025 profit outlooks:
The move highlights the challenges for one of the most well-known car brands, which has been squeezed by its two most important markets - China and the United States - over price declines and trade barriers.
Volkswagen, Europe's top carmaker, said it would take a 5.1 billion euro ($6 billion) hit from the far-reaching product overhaul, which delays some EV models in favour of hybrids and combustion engine cars, at its 75.4%-owned subsidiary.
The changes are a major shift for the Stuttgart-based maker of the iconic 911 model, and are expected to hit Porsche's operating profit by up to 1.8 billion euros this year, it said.
[...] Porsche said it would delay the launch of certain all-electric vehicles, adding that the new SUV above the Cayenne model would initially not be offered as an all-electric vehicle, but with combustion-engine and hybrid models.
Also at ZeroHedge.
Previously: Porsche's New Cayenne Will Charge Itself Like No Other EV
Related:
- Canadian EV Sales Collapse by 35% as Gas Car Purchases Surge
- Tesla Continues Slide As Musk Warns Of "Rough Quarters" Ahead
- Electric Truck-Maker Nikola Falls Into Bankruptcy Joining a Procession of Failed EV Startups
General Motors said on Oct. 14 that it will bear a $1.6 billion loss to scale back its electric vehicle (EV) operations, citing weaker expected demand following recent U.S. policy changes that ended federal EV tax credits and loosened emissions rules:
The Detroit-based automaker said its Audit Committee approved the loss on Oct. 7, covering the three months ended Sept. 30. The company noted that the loss is part of its plan to realign EV production and factory operations to better match customer demand.
The decision was made after the expiration of the $7,500 federal EV tax credit on Sept. 30, part of a broader policy rollback under President Donald Trump.
[...] "Following recent U.S. government policy changes, including the termination of certain consumer tax incentives for EV purchases and the reduction in the stringency of emissions regulations, we expect the adoption rate of EVs to slow," GM said in a filing.
[...] According to the filing, $1.2 billion of the loss is related to non-cash impairments, mostly write-downs of EV assets. The remaining $400 million will be paid in cash for contract cancellations and commercial settlements tied to EV investments.
The company said its review of EV manufacturing and battery component investments is ongoing.
Related:
- Canadian EV Sales Collapse by 35% as Gas Car Purchases Surge
- Tesla Continues Slide As Musk Warns Of "Rough Quarters" Ahead
- Electric Truck-Maker Nikola Falls Into Bankruptcy Joining a Procession of Failed EV Startups
See Also:
- EV Sales In Europe Keep Surging, With One Exception
- EVs Poised To Exceed Half Of Europe's New Car Sales Sooner Than Expected
- EV sales are surging in Europe, except for Tesla
Automobile Sales, Including EVs and Hybrids, Surge in 2024
EV Sales, Including Hybrids, Surge for Auto Giants Not Named Tesla:
General Motors and Ford Motor on Friday reported robust U.S. auto sales and electric-vehicle sales for the final quarter of 2024. GM more than doubled EV sales for the full year, while Tesla suffered a sales decline. GM stock edged higher on Friday, while Ford stock popped and Tesla jumped.
Toyota Motor posted declining U.S. new vehicle sales, but marked an EV sales milestone, including hybrid vehicles. Hyundai, which trades over the counter, and Honda Motor saw robust hybrid and EV sales, spearheading their overall sales growth.
GM, Ford report best annual U.S. sales since 2019 as auto recovery continues:
Sales of new vehicles in the U.S. continued to rise last year, rebounding from historical lows caused by the coronavirus pandemic and supply chain shortages during the past four years.
American legacy automakers General Motors and Ford Motor on Friday both reported their best annual U.S. new vehicle sales since 2019, led by growth of electrified vehicles such as all-electric and hybrid models.
Those results are in line with industrywide expectations for automakers. Market research firms expected U.S. automakers to report total sales of nearly 16 million vehicles in 2024, which would mark the industry's best year since selling roughly 17 million units in 2019.
[...] GM said sales were driven by increases in all four of its U.S. brands as well as a roughly 50% rise in sales of electric vehicles to more than 114,400 units.
Despite the notable jump in EV sales, the vehicles only made up 4.2% of the automaker's overall sales. GM estimated it achieved a 12% EV market share in the U.S. during the fourth quarter.
It was a similar trend at Ford, which reported a notable increase in sales of its "electrified" vehicles, including EVs and hybrids.
Mazda is Selling More Cars Than Ever—All Without an EV in Sight
However, EVs are not the focus of some auto manufacturers.
Mazda is defying industry trends with surging sales of its gas-powered SUVs. Can it keep the momentum going without a fully electric vehicle in its lineup?
While many automakers are racing toward electrification, Mazda is proving that there's still room for gas-powered success. The Japanese automaker is set to break its U.S. sales record from 1986, with over 420,000 vehicles expected to be sold in 2024—a 16% increase from the previous year.
Mazda's president of North American operations, Tom Donnelly, credited the popularity of its compact crossovers and mid-size SUVs for this growth, with a target of 450,000 vehicles for 2025. "We're growing our business in what has largely been a stable industry," Donnelly said, talking about the consistent sales volume that Mazda has seen from its compacts and mid-size SUVs.
[...] What's driving Mazda's success? Mazda's lineup relies heavily on a few key models. The CX-5, a compact crossover manufactured in Japan, remains its best seller, despite being one of the oldest vehicles in its lineup. A redesign is expected within the next two years. The CX-30 subcompact hatchback and the Alabama-made CX-50 have also contributed significantly to the brand's recent surge.
[...] With overall US auto sales projected by Kelley Blue Book to rise just 2.3% in 2024, Mazda's performance is a standout. However, challenges remain. While Mazda charts new territory for its U.S. sales, it still lags behind competitors like Subaru, Kia and even Nissan, which has struggled with a host of its own problems in 2024.
Previously: Mazda: Americans Want Cheap Gas Cars
Electric vehicle demand is set to crash this month after tax credits vanish and buyers back away:
- J.D. Power predicts a 60% EV sales drop in October from September levels.
- Decline follows expiration of federal tax credits that boosted affordability.
- EVs will make up 5.2% of new sales, down from September's record 12.9%.
[...] The research firm, working with GlobalData, predicts 54,673 EV retail sales for October. If that figure holds, it represents a 43.1 percent decline compared with October 2024, when 96,085 electric vehicles were sold. That would also mean a slide in market share from 8.5 percent to just 5.2 percent.
[...] "The automotive industry is experiencing a significant recalibration in the electric vehicle segment," said J.D. Power data analyst Tyson Jominy. "The recent EV market correction underscores a critical lesson: Consumers prefer having access to a range of powertrain options."
Perhaps the wildest bit of this entire thing is that it could've been even worse for EVs. Many brands, including Hyundai, GM, and Tesla, rolled out different methods to ease the pain of losing the federal tax credit.
Previously:
- GM to Take $1.6 Billion Hit as It Scales Back Electric Vehicle Operations
- Porsche EV Roll-Out Delay Deals $6 Billion Hit to Parent Volkswagen
- Canadian EV Sales Collapse by 35% as Gas Car Purchases Surge
(Score: 2, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday August 26, @03:28PM (28 children)
Up until now, purchasing an EV has been little more than virtue signaling. The EV generally costs double, triple, and more what a traditional ICE powered car costs. And, with few exceptions, those EVs have been crippled on the highway, with limited range.
If Musk's Super Duper Aluminum batteries work out, then the price of EVs will become competitive with ICE powered vehicles, AND, EVs will acquire the range to compete with gas, diesel, methane/propane, or any other fossil fueled vehicle. In fact, EVs can probably sell for LESS THAN most gas powered vehicles, since aluminum is cheap, and there are few moving parts in an EV, making production of EVs very affordable. Best feature of all? You can apparently go from 0% charge to about 80% or 85% in about 20 minutes, unlike EVs currently on the road.
“Take me to the Brig. I want to see the “real Marines”. – Major General Chesty Puller, USMC
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ichthus on Tuesday August 26, @04:04PM (1 child)
So, buying a car that's among the quickest and highest performance for the price, and has the most advance technology available in any car is... virtue signaling?
*cough*2010 called. They want their FUD back.
(Score: 5, Funny) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @06:51PM
"Up until now, a horse and buggy owner purchasing a Model-T has been little more than virtue signaling." -- Runaway1956, August 1925
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 5, Informative) by epitaxial on Tuesday August 26, @04:28PM (5 children)
It's funny how Norway is able to adapt to EVs just fine. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cg52543v6rmo [bbc.com]
They seem to have plenty of cold weather and highways.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @06:57PM (4 children)
The EV shines in the winter! No standing there in well below freezing temperatures babysitting it while it fills with explosive carcinogens, just plug it into your house and go inside, and no waiting for a combustion engine to reach operating temperature to get heat, an EV has heat in the winter as fast as it has AC in the summer.
I understand in Norway and the rest of Europe there are plenty of public chargers, unlike our backwards, primitive banana republic (USA). We're so primitive we don't even have universal health care! And people expect us to have Modern cars?!?
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by aafcac on Wednesday August 27, @02:55AM (1 child)
Not entirely, depending upon the battery chemistry, they can really struggle when it gets cold out. Sure, you don't have to wait for it to start, but you'll often lose a bunch of your charge due to the temperature. Supposedly Sodium based batteries won't have that problem, but they're not in common use yet. They should be great, you'd be able to get sodium from desalination plants rather than having to work out how much you can return to the ocean without killing all the life in the area.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Thursday August 28, @01:01PM
Yes, my mileage drops by a mpk (miles per kilowatt hour) when the temperature is below freezing. Not a problem, and it gets well below freezing in the winter here, as well as the socialist Scandinavian countries where everybody drives electrics.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 3, Interesting) by BlueCoffee on Wednesday August 27, @08:31PM (1 child)
EV's are driveable in winter, but they certainly don't "shine". And by winter I don't mean winter in North Carolina which gets two days of snow, I'm talking about Minnesota or worse, Canada.
30% of of the battery is be used up just to heat the cab, defrost the mirrors and rear window, and warm up the battery nest. And the battery always has to be kept warm so the battery is always being used up.
Teslas have those stupid over engineered push-then-pull door handles that easily freeze when the temp is below 0C, and then you have to knuckle punch it to unstick it.
Also, the driver cannot completely turn off the regenerative braking in icy conditions, and sometimes when it kicks in during icy conditions the front wheels lock up and you lose steering control. The traction control/ABS handles it, but it's really unnerving to have front wheels lock up like that when you are slowing down at an intersection with cars in front of you.
I don't think Telsa did any testing in winter driving conditions.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by mcgrew on Thursday August 28, @03:44AM
I see you're an auto mechanic. You have my sympathy for the loss of your industry.
by winter I don't mean winter in North Carolina which gets two days of snow
I'm talking about Illinois. Damned cold, far below freezing and plenty of snow and ice. Best winter car I ever drove, and again, since 1968, son.
Teslas have those stupid over engineered push-then-pull door handles...
Nazimobiles? Who cares? I drive a Hyundai.
Also, the driver cannot completely turn off the regenerative braking in icy conditions
...says someone who's never driven one! Braking is braking.
I don't think Telsa did any testing in winter driving conditions.
Why do you think "Tesla" when you hear "EV"? I understand winter driving conditions are as bad in South Korea as Illinois. Musk is a Nazi space alien from South Africa, what would he know about snow?
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 4, Insightful) by VLM on Tuesday August 26, @06:27PM (4 children)
Can try some numbers. Lets use the numbers from the official toyota website.
A Highlander starting MSRP is $40320 for 25 MPG. A Highlander Hybrid MSRP is $46820 for 35 MPG.
We will make the hilarious assumption that the vastly more complicated hybrid will cost $0 extra to maintain over the life of the car (LOL).
Average gas price is around $3.05 in my state. Varies from day to day, of course. Its still at the high end for the summer vacationers and the upcoming labor day travelers, so realistically its less, but OK we'll pick an intentionally high gas price in honor of inevitable inflation.
(46820 - 40320) = $6500 "hybrid tax". That $6500 will buy 2131 gallons of gas. The non-hybrid will drive 53275 miles on that gas. So I lose money for the first 53K then after 54K or so the hybrid will be cheaper (again, assuming zero dollar cost of hybrid maintenance)
In my state the average driver goes 15K/year so that's 3.5 years before the hybrid will pay for itself. More realistically I drive at most 10K/yr probably much less so it'll be 5+ years.
Another thing to keep in mind is both vehicles have a CVT and CVTs only last 80K, maybe 100K miles before intentionally self-destructing to increase sales. The car breaks even about half way thru the CVT lifespan (optimistically) So either way, we're only talking about "two thousand gallons" or about "six thousand bucks" either saved or not saved before the car meets the crusher, in the grand scheme of things, looking at the environmental damage of manufacturing a car, the hybrid savings is fairly irrelevant. What would be VASTLY more environmentally friendly would be banning CVTs so entire new cars don't have to be manufactured every 100K miles. Cars without CVTs can often go 200K+ and not making an entirely new car saves the environment a lot more than hybrid ever could.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Tuesday August 26, @06:37PM (2 children)
Also I assumed 0% interest rates. If you drive few enough miles, I am too lazy to make accurate calculations, but at some point I'd burn few enough gallons of gas that I could pay for it off the investment income (however small) of the $6500 price difference, if I pay cash for the car (thats what I usually do).
Lets say I invest my $6500 hybrid tax. My back of envelope estimate is I'd get somewhat less than 5000 miles of "free" gas to drive in my non-hybrid every year.
Honestly, I don't know if I drive the 15K supposed average for my state. I recall last summer seeing my "around town commuter car" roll over from 50K and here is is almost September and I'm at 54.?K so I may only go 6K this year in my commuter car. If you think about it, 6K/yr is still over 15 miles/day and I'm not even sure how I drive that much... I work at home, my gym's about 2-ish miles away, grocery store is a mile, church is like 3 miles? Even driving my kids around and doing "kid activities" with my kids I still can't account for my 6K.
Another novelty of living the suburban life is my 6K miles/yr lifestyle combined with Toyota's ONLY all EV car that supposedly goes 250 miles/charge means I'd only charge my car every other week. Which is about as often as I seem to go to the gas station with my gas car. I wish I could buy a nice commuter car with a 50 mile battery as that would be cheap and its all I need, but they wouldn't make enough profit so we can only buy incredibly expensive 250 mile batteries.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by fliptop on Tuesday August 26, @09:11PM (1 child)
Interesting you mentioned "hybrid tax" but didn't talk about the fuel tax (in my state about $0.50/gal). Has your state figured out how to tax EVs for the wear and tear on roads/bridges that have to be built and maintained?
What will the future price be? Even if they can equate a gallon of fuel to x amp-hours of use and charge the same per "gallon", will there be a firmware update for your smart meter that indicates when the EV is charging to calculate it?
Too many uncertainties for me.
Additionally, all EVs I've ever worked on have similar setups for suspension and steering as ICE so the maintenance is still there, and parts for them are expensive. I put front pads and rotors on a Prius last week and it had the same hydraulic caliper setup as every ICE vehicle I've ever worked on.
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Tuesday August 26, @09:22PM
Interesting theory: If road damage scales with some high polynomial exponent of vehicle weight, they can rely on electric taxes and property taxes. If you have enough property to have enough solr panels to run a large OTR truck 8+ hours per day for hundreds of miles, you are paying enough property tax to make up for the lack of gas tax LOL.
But no I was going for a first approximation where the environmental damage of building a car that uses a transmission design that self destructs in 100K miles is really bad if it'll take 50K miles just to break even on the more complicated powertrain.
I imagine to encourage repeated sales, EVs have to have self driving using hundreds of sensors designed to break/wear out at high expense after a couple years. The idea of a 50 year old golf cart is fine if you're a golf course but bad news if you're a car mfgr. They need to find a way to make the vehicle self destruct in a couple years to stay in business and that competes directly with the "Savings" from alternative drivetrains.
(Score: 2) by aafcac on Wednesday August 27, @02:59AM
Around here gas costs roughly $5 a gallon, so probably a lot quicker here, plus you use practically no gas with a hybrid if you're stuck in traffic or you have the option to plug it in. Gas here is expensive, but electricity is usually some of the cheapest in the country due to the dams.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:30PM (11 children)
uh huh. except we all know why canada's not buying evs right now.
(Score: 3, Informative) by VLM on Tuesday August 26, @06:39PM (10 children)
Slow economic collapse due to population-replacement-level immigration? Life is pretty rough up there right now. A population under siege by its own government.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:46PM (4 children)
that's just desperate. why not blame dei while you're at it?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by ichthus on Tuesday August 26, @06:56PM (3 children)
*knock, knock* Hello. He IS blaming DEI, and he's not wrong.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:59PM (2 children)
(Score: 2, Insightful) by ichthus on Tuesday August 26, @09:08PM (1 child)
No. DEI is responsible for exactly what the OP's comment said: "Slow economic collapse due to population-replacement-level immigration"
Reading comprehension, lad.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @09:19PM
(Score: 3, Insightful) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @07:03PM (2 children)
I'd say Canada is under siege by MY government, not their own, like every other country. American business people and consumers aren't the only ones hurting from King Donnie's illegal import taxes.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 3, Informative) by Tork on Tuesday August 26, @07:50PM (1 child)
This is not 'troll'. Canada is boycotting the USA right now and, likely, hunkering down for the next 3 years. The CEO of one of those EV manufacturers not selling well up north said that Canada is 'not a real country' and sparked a petition to revoke his citizenship there. Mcgrew's comment is legit.
🏳️🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️🌈 - Give us ribbiti or make us croak! 🐸
(Score: 2, Insightful) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @09:25PM
My point exactly. It all started with a convicted criminal president who wants to steal Canada like Hitler stole Poland.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2, Insightful) by FuzzyTheBear on Tuesday August 26, @11:42PM (1 child)
I suggest you com4e visit us and stay for a while. You sound like an uninformed MAGA moron.
(Score: 2) by aafcac on Wednesday August 27, @03:01AM
This kind of reminds me of that Family Guy cutaway of Canadian bullies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSGoDP80Mnc [youtube.com]
(Score: 3, Informative) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @06:47PM
The EV generally costs double, triple, and more what a traditional ICE powered car costs.
Mine was $48k last year, a '24 Ioniq 6. Biggest, roomiest car I ever owned, including the '02 Concorde and the '74 Le Mans. EVs are generally in the ballpark with comparable Goldbergs (your Rube Goldberg insanely complicated transportation machine), but all they make is the insanely fast cars like the Mustang and the new Charger, or luxury cars like the boat I'm driving now. Which is the best car I've driven, let alone owned, since 1968.
Gasoline is four to five times as expensive as electricity and there's almost no maintenance needed. Not even brakes; the disk brakes are only used at under 5mph. No vibration (except the radio) and no gear shifting.
And if the car in front of you doesn't have a tail pipe, you're almost certain to be unable to outrun it. Your Rube Goldberg car is to mine what a buggy was to a Model-T. Don't knock it until you try it.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 4, Informative) by turgid on Tuesday August 26, @09:01PM (1 child)
The term "virtue signalling" is an alt-wrong dog-whistle. It's a rhetorical failure.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by ichthus on Tuesday August 26, @09:14PM
The term "dog-whistle" is a leftist figment. It's a rhetorical failure.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Sourcery42 on Tuesday August 26, @03:53PM (16 children)
The linked article just drops some statistics and spouts the typical far right talking points. I'm not at all familiar with the counter signal, but after this limited exposure, I suppose they're like the Fox News or Newsmax of Canada, eh? Before someone feels the need to attack me for liberal bias, I have two ICE cars and zero desire to replace either with an EV any time soon, and I think that ZEV 60% of sales by 2030 mandate they're whining about is batshit insane too.
Has anyone seen any meaningful analysis of the EV sales trend? That's what I really find interesting here. I get the impression that EV sales are booming in more developing economies, but stalling, or at least growth is, in more established markets. Certainly, some of that is infrastructure differences when you compare North America to China, for example. Could be we're through the Early Adopters in the mature markets and EVs are struggling to gain traction in the broader market, always a tough transition for any new entrant to an old market. Could be a natural consumer feedback loop driving concerns about range anxiety, resale value, service, quality, actual cost of ownership. Could lies, damn lies, and statistics to prop up a particular viewpoint. I actually RTFA, but you won't find any of that there.
(Score: 5, Informative) by datapharmer on Tuesday August 26, @04:20PM (3 children)
This says little about how Canadians feel about EVs and a lot more about them boycotting U.S. goods due to MAGA policies, and thus avoiding Musk’s Tesla which had been a significant percentage of EV sales prior to November but now is a negligible number. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/tesla-registrations-quebec-1.7547483 [www.cbc.ca]
Many other EVs are significantly more expensive than the Y or 3, so it likely shifted many of those buyers toward an ICE vehicle.
As someone with a Tesla in our household I can say I think it is a great car, but I totally get why someone wouldn’t want to buy one with Musk running the company. Politics aside the recklessness he’s shown repeatedly in public gives one pause about using any product he’s directly involved with and the self-driving nonsense is nothing but a distraction from the fact that almost nobody wants the ugly and poorly designed cybertruck (say for maybe a few rich people that long for their old Aztec).
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Sourcery42 on Tuesday August 26, @04:57PM
There it is. Who would have thought a figurehead acting like a literal Nazi could be bad for business?
I've never had any interest in Tesla for a number of reasons. I haven't bought a Detroit designed shitbox for 25 years, and I'm happier for it. Outside of the Nissan Leaf, the Japanese automakers seem very reluctant bring EVs to North America. Toyota is content to double down on hybrids. There are starting to be more options like the Acura ZDX, Nissan Ariya, and Honda Prologue, but they're all big SUVs, that I also refuse to buy. Oh well, I'm not in the market either. I keep cars forever. I've only had my oldest for 5 years, so it probably has at least another 10 in it. Plenty of time to wait and see.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @07:20PM
Tesla isn't the only EV on the market!
almost nobody wants the ugly and poorly designed cybertruck
They sure love those butt-ugly Hummers, though! And those poorly designed pickups with HUGE cabs and teeny tiny beds.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 3, Interesting) by bzipitidoo on Wednesday August 27, @11:00AM
> Politics aside
But that's one of the biggest problems. Politicians and the media have politicized the heck out of this choice, and have done things that significantly change the calculations. For instance, a couple years ago, Texas added an additional annual fee of $200 on EVs only, on the idea that these vehicles aren't paying their fair share of highway maintenance costs, which is funded by a gas tax. I wanted personal experience with an EV, so I got a used Nissan Leaf. Had it for about 6 years. That political change was one of the factors behind my decision to get rid of the Leaf.
I'd say I learned quite a bit about EVs from owning one. They are wonderfully quiet and low maintenance. Ideal for short trips. (More on that in the next paragraph.) But they do have downsides. Firstly, you have to plan a bit more. You can't forget to put it on the charger the night before. If you do forget, and you don't find out it's low until you're rushing off to work the next morning, you're screwed. You will be late to work. Or you have to get a ride. Or, if you also have a gas burner, you'll have to use that. Whereas a gas car, you can forget to fill it up and not be late to work because you can zip into and out of a gas station in 10 minutes.
As to the short trips, the best way to use an electric car is to take no trips longer than its ROUND TRIP range. Do ALL your charging at home. Why? The public charging network is not reliable enough. Even the idea of recharging at your destination, while that avoids the worst waste of your time, of sitting around waiting for it to charge at a point along the journey, is still too chancy. Ahh, you're going to visit someone at their home that is at the limit of your one-way trip range, and think you're going to recharge by plugging into your host's wall outlet so you can get back home? Think more carefully about that. EVs pull so much juice that you will have to inform your host not to have any other electrical appliances on the same circuit, or it is likely to trip the circuit breaker. A refrigerator starting up is enough to do that. And if this is not noticed, those hours you thought you were getting charged up, you weren't. And now you're in the embarrassing position of having to impose on your host longer.
Another gotcha is the charging cable is most idiotically designed so that the cord is not long enough for that heavy brick to rest on the ground. It will be dangling from the outlet, and this weight is all too likely to slowly pull the plug out of the outlet. That's bad. Destroys outlets. When the connection weakens, the resistance goes up, and that causes heating. This heating can easily be great enough to melt and scorch the plastic of the wall outlet.
One other thing I learned is that tires can't take being powered by electric motors. Oh yeah, the Leaf felt wonderfully grippy and powerful. Heck, one time I needed that power. Was on the street during a storm, saw wind whipping the trees ahead back and forth harder and harder, then saw a huge tree branch just seemingly floating along in the air. It was a tornado. I stopped to look more carefully at the weather and wait for some debris to blow past in front of me, and when I saw that tornado, and saw it was coming straight at me from my right, I floored the Leaf and got the hell out of the tornado's path. But that is thankfully quite rare. The problem with that grippy power, is that's also the feel of that electric motor putting more stress on the tires than they can take. Can easily wear the tires out before they've reached 25% of their lifetime range. Once I realized that, and that the Leaf has this "eco mode" that is engaged by putting the gear shifter into drive twice, I used eco mode exclusively. No more premature wearing out of the tires.
Hypermiling techniques can really help increase an EV's range. I learned that what I read online is true. The difference in range from traveling at 30 mph vs 40 mph is significant. Driving slower is perhaps the #1 thing you can do, in any kind of car, to get more range. One of the frustrating things about the fact that going slower is a big fuel saver and range extender, is that much of this is another consequence of politics and marketing. You'd think the severe constraints of having such limited range would inspire manufacturers to pick that low hanging aerodynamic fruit they ignore. You'd be wrong. If the Leaf had aerodynamics like the Edison 2, the winner of the X Prize for a car that can get 100 mpg, then the difference in range between traveling at 30 mph and 40 mph wouldn't be so surprisingly big.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @07:16PM (10 children)
The trouble is wanton ignorance. The people who manufacture autos don't want you to know how much better they are! They don't want to sell you an EV! They don't want you to know that the piston drive train is an obsolete, over-complicated mess with thousands of moving parts to wear and break and need constant supervision (check your oil and coolant!) and maintenance.
It's a dealer to junkyard gravy train in maintenance costs. The only normal maintenance on an EV is wiper blades and fluid, and tires (or these strange things called "tyres" in Britain). Not even oil changes.
How much maintenance has your ceiling fan needed? Don't expect the manufacturers to tell you how much faster and roomier they are, or how much better the handling is thanks to all the weight on the bottom, or any of the other dozens of advantages over the obsolete Rube Goldberg tech.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by VLM on Tuesday August 26, @09:25PM (1 child)
Batteries...
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @09:44PM
Yes, forgot about the 12v battery. It probably only has four or five years, but at least it's under the hood and not under a fender like the '02 Concorde that took a trained mechanic forty five minutes to change. Dumbest design I've ever seen on anything.
I consider the main battery an unreplacable part, like when the rack and pinion went out on my '85 Chevy in 2006 I paid $500 for in 2003. The labor would probably cost as much as the battery, and I hear they're damned expensive. I'll find out if I don't trade it in before that.
But the battery is basically the gasoline, electricity is so cheap. My car will go twenty miles on the electricity it takes to refine a gallon of gasoline. I don't see a difference on my electric bill.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by fliptop on Tuesday August 26, @09:31PM (7 children)
That's total BS. They all have steering, suspension and brakes, it's the same or very similar to what's been around for decades, it takes the most abuse from driving, and it needs repaired. Every vehicle needs regular alignments too, including EVs. Most vehicles need brakes before 80k miles at least once. Suspension and steering too before 120k. If you're keeping your EV until it dies and it gets to 200k you'll probably have repaired/changed parts at least twice and brakes 3 or 4 times. The same as every ICE vehicle out there.
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
(Score: 2) by pe1rxq on Tuesday August 26, @11:34PM (1 child)
My first EV is five years old now. The maintenance so far:
- At two years a replacement filter for the AC
- At two years: cleaning of the breaks. (Break pads themselves are just fine, just cleaning some dust from them)- At two years a replacement filter for the AC
- At four years a replacement filter for the AC
- At four years: cleaning of the breaks. (Break pads themselves are just fine, just cleaning some dust from them)
- At four years: callback for a piece of wiring in the steering column, a part also used in the non-EV versions.
- New set of tires (fun fact: it is really easy to accelerate to fast with an EV)
So after five years maintenance is virtually nothing. My experience might be just a single datapoint, but it is at least one more point than your imaginary bullshit.
(Score: 2) by fliptop on Wednesday August 27, @12:15AM
How many miles on it?
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
(Score: 2) by mcgrew on Wednesday August 27, @12:44AM (4 children)
They all have steering, suspension and brakes
I've been driving since 1968 and yes, there is shocks/struts. But I've had exactly one car with any kind of steering problem sans wheel alignment, and I try to stay out of potholes but I've had a few cars aligned.
But the braking is regenerative. Rather than converting kinetic energy to heat by use of friction, it reverses the motors, making generators out of them and converting the kinetic energy back into electricity. The drum brakes are only used at less than five miles an hour so are unlikely to need any maintenance.
Yes, I've had wheel alignments, rarely. Shocks and struts when I've owned a vehicle for longer than the seat stays comfortable. But almost all visits to the mechanic (who was me when I was poor) were for oil changes, points and plugs, water pumps, starters, and all the other zillion things needed to keep a Rube Goldberg machine with its complications and hassles running.
Pistons are a pain in the ass. I say good riddance to them.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2, Informative) by pTamok on Wednesday August 27, @08:44AM (3 children)
Brake maintenance on BEVs can be expensive, because the discs on disc brakes can rust due to lack of use and require replacement - precisely because regenerative braking is so good. This is why Volkswagen used drum brakes on its newer BEVs. Owners of some BEVs with disk brakes are advised to periodically do hard braking from motorway speeds to minimise this problem. With hard-enough braking, the regeneration system can't (or is possibly programmed not to) capture all the kinetic energy, so some has to be dissipated as heat in the brake components.
Note that the mechanical brakes need to be good enough to stop the vehicle within legally mandated limits if the regenerative braking fails.
BEV performance from a standing start is phenomenal. You need to be in a pretty exotic petrol-engined vehicle to be able to beat a run-of-the mill BEV from the lights. Exuberant use of this will reduce your tyre life. Considerably. (Pushbike users know that petrol-engined vehicles are lousy at accelerating from stationary.)
My (electric) fuel costs for a recent 275 mile trip were about USD 6.50
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 27, @10:21AM (2 children)
Which brand? How much kWh spent?
(Score: 1) by pTamok on Wednesday August 27, @02:35PM (1 child)
Car: MG MG 5
kWh: Roughly 100% -> 35% and 81% to 37%, which with the battery being roughly 55 kWh is about 60 kWh. Charging on slow chargers costs about 10 US cents per kWh.
Dry roads, warm, but not hot weather. 60 kWh for 275 miles is about 4.6 miles per kWh - uphill out, downhill back, mostly driving at 50 mph.
Wet roads, or sub-freezing temperatures give far worse fuel economy: winter doing the same trip gets me more like 3 miles per kWh.
(Score: 1) by pTamok on Wednesday August 27, @03:26PM
Just checked the car stats: for the past 2,608 miles it has done an average of 3.98 miles per kWh. That's summer driving.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by DadaDoofy on Tuesday August 26, @07:25PM
Here you go:
https://executivedigest.sapo.pt/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/Mobility-Consumer-Pulse-2024_Overview.pdf [executivedigest.sapo.pt]
https://drrichswier.com/2023/12/31/david-blackmon-the-one-simple-reason-electric-vehicles-are-doomed-to-fail/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=david-blackmon-the-one-simple-reason-electric-vehicles-are-doomed-to-fail [drrichswier.com]
https://www.westernjournal.com/hertz-selling-fleet-electric-vehicles-shifting-back-gas-cars/ [westernjournal.com]
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:17PM (13 children)
Have EVs solved the privacy issue yet? Where basically you are driving a rolling collection platform on wheels and you need proprietary apps that harvest your data to use a charger anywhere away from home?
I'm genuinely curious. I have a really simple petrol car that works fine and has readily available, still manufactured replacement parts 40 years later. When EVs solve the privacy issue, I'll hop on board.
(Score: 2) by epitaxial on Tuesday August 26, @06:36PM (3 children)
Nothing is preventing you from disconnecting the LTE antenna.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:47PM (1 child)
The LTE antenna? On my phone? When I'm trying to charge somewhere away from home and need to download a shady app to get the charger to work?
(Score: 3, Funny) by epitaxial on Wednesday August 27, @03:04PM
The car you dipshit.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Tuesday August 26, @11:20PM
Yet. I'd bet that will change soon, if it hasn't already.
(concept being that more and more there are things that will only work when connected to the 'net)
(Score: 5, Touché) by bussdriver on Tuesday August 26, @06:45PM (1 child)
Did you not read about onstar and how most modern cars sell you out or at least collect data to betray you in the future?
Your car insurance discount at the price of them tracking you will be eventually sold and used in ways you'll never be aware of. Already, those apps use google services for location which is a 3rd party that banks all your data for future mining and only willfully deletes what it has already analyzed into their data. (You could call it a form of compression of your data that turns it into THEIR data; in which AI is the easiest to create and obscure as opposed to previously manually created statistics on your behavior.)
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @06:59PM
OnStar? You mean Big Brother Star? That stuff came out 15 years after my vehicle rolled off the assembly line. My vehicle has outlived them all, and will outlast any GM product made in the past five years.
We can do what-about-isms all day.
Did you know your license plates are being scanned by the garbage trucks when they pick up your trash and that information is aggregated by insurance companies along with the condition of your yard and the upkeep of your other vehicles to determine your rate? This is also how the repo man finds vehicles. Or that doorbells are uploading facial recognition data from my morning run? I have very little control over that. I have no choice, really.
That doesn't mean that I'm going to bend over and just install Windows 11 on all my personal devices and let Google AI scan my shit and just be some gamer techbro who gets excited about new colors on the latest iPhone.
I pay my insurance without an app. I auto-pay. I don't have an insurance app.
I literally choose not to run Google Play services on my phone. I choose to run libre software where I can. I've been this way for 15 years.
Not being able to refuel my vehicle on a drive is a non-starter for me.
(Score: 0, Troll) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @07:24PM (6 children)
Nice troll, boy. The "privacy issue" has absolutely NOTHING to do with an auto's drive train.
Of course, since you're AC, maybe you're just ignorant?
BTW, EVs don't need replacement parts any more than a ceiling fan does.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 5, Insightful) by mhajicek on Tuesday August 26, @08:31PM (4 children)
Gas stations work without an app.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 4, Informative) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @09:31PM
So do the EV chargers I've used, one at Walmart and one at the Hyundai dealer. IMO requiring an app should be illegal. But all they know is that you stopped to charge there, your car is on camera at a gas station and if you pay at the pump the station and the credit card company both have your data.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by fliptop on Tuesday August 26, @09:35PM (2 children)
True, and most have an app that gives you $0.05 or more off a gallon.
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @10:16PM (1 child)
"True, and most have an app that gives you $0.05 or more off a gallon."
Almost as good as that $0.10 discount for using cash.
(Score: 2) by fliptop on Wednesday August 27, @12:22AM
FTFY
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 26, @09:18PM
> Of course, since you're AC, maybe you're just ignorant?
I'm a paying member of this site. Since the beginning. There is no GDPR in my country and we are in sort of a fascist technostate now. Maybe there is value among the comments of AC's.
Also, stop trying to "tech bro" me on EV's. You got spun up over nothing. I want an EV. But when I go places, I want to be able to charge my EV without an app. I don't want nor do I have a phone that can do those apps.
If an app is mandatory, then I want laws to protect the data that is collected.
I have a reliable vehicle that I can work on. I mostly bike places. It's a compromise.
(Score: 5, Informative) by DannyB on Tuesday August 26, @06:47PM (4 children)
At a family reunion a few years ago, I learned from a relative who works for one of the big oil companies that:
There simply will come a point where most people can not afford fossil fuels.
They were formed millions of years ago. We've extracted a lot, and continue to do so. What we've used is not coming back.
Conclusion: fossil fuels are going to eventually be too expensive for most people. Not this decade. Probably not next decade. However it is simply an inevitability. There's not an infinite supply of it. That is a simple fact.
Of course, some people don't believe in simple facts.
Also related but inconvenient, burning all that fossil fuel has changed the composition of the atmosphere. We keep getting more extreme weather, as someone once inconveniently predicted, yet people simply stick their fingers in their ears.
If your boy is chewing on electrical cords, then ground him until he conducts himself properly.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @07:28PM (2 children)
Why should they care? They don't give a rat's ass about the future, only their own wealth. The oil will outlast everyone alive today. Using it like we do may cause the underground oil to outlast civilization. The changing climate should by now be obvious to even the most stupid moron on the continent.
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by turgid on Tuesday August 26, @09:09PM (1 child)
If we could extend their lifespans to a couple of hundred years, we'd soon see their attitudes change.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 4, Touché) by mcgrew on Tuesday August 26, @09:34PM
Shortening them would be faster and might even save civilization! They would probably rather die than see their industry die, anyway. More humane than forcing a long life on 'em. Being old ain't for wimps!
We have a president who posted a fake video of himself shitting on America
(Score: 2) by turgid on Tuesday August 26, @09:06PM
Read all about it [exeterclimateforum.com].
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 5, Informative) by MostCynical on Tuesday August 26, @10:46PM
In Australia, Chinese EVs are out-selling Tesla.
BYD, Ola, Chery, etc etc
The anti-loonie backlash against Elon has hurt sales, but the cheaper Chinese alternatives have hurt more.
New Teslas have quite a different tail light treatment, so are easy to spot.
Many EV buyers have home solar, often with a battery.. so maximising use of "free" power.
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 2) by DadaDoofy on Wednesday August 27, @01:55PM
"Despite dwindling sales, the Carney government remains committed to its electric vehicle mandate of having 60 per cent of all vehicles sold be ZEVs by 2030 and 100 per cent by 2035, banning all motor vehicle sales."
This is a pipe dream if there ever was one, but maybe it explains why Canadians can't have nice things. It might also help to explain why 1 in 5 Albertans actually support succeeding from Canada to become the 51st state.