Microsoft has been gradually making it harder to activate Windows (and other products) without an internet connection. Most recently, it started clamping down on local accounts that could bypass OOBE sign-in, and now we're seeing reports that another legacy method has been retired. Phone activation, where you could call Microsoft to activate Windows & Office, no longer works, as Ben Kleinberg demonstrates in a new YouTube video.
Now, it'd be reasonable to assume that something as archaic as calling to activate your license had probably been sunset long ago. However, you'll be surprised to learn that Microsoft still lists it as a viable method in its support docs. This is particularly important for people on older operating systems like Windows 7, who expect an offline alternative to Microsoft's now-online-only activation systems.
Moreover, this ordeal was necessary for Ben because he was using an OEM key that could not be activated directly within Windows 7, as the activation servers for that version are effectively dead. The video shows that calling the listed number plays an automated message saying "support for product activation has moved online."
After the call, he also received a text message containing a link to the modern Microsoft Product Activation Portal we know today. Upon visiting the site, Ben was required to sign in with a Microsoft account, which immediately defeated the purpose of activating the call.
Initially, he couldn't get the confirmation ID on his iPhone using Firefox, but switching to Safari on his laptop resolved the issue. This wasn't a device-specific problem, just a browser-related hiccup. Eventually, Ben acquired the numbers he needed, and both his copy of Windows 7 and Office 2010 were successfully activated.
The video concludes on a bittersweet note, highlighting that call activation is effectively dead. However, users can still access the portal on a computer or phone to complete the process. Ironically, the entire reason for calling Microsoft in the first place was that Ben couldn't activate Windows 7 from within the OS, but now that a website exists, there's no need to call anyway.
Unfortunately, a Microsoft account is required, which Ben complained about and mirrors the concern many users have, even in the latest Windows 11 builds today.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by RS3 on Saturday January 10, @02:19PM (9 children)
I'm still running 7, no problems at all. I've tried but hate 10 for home (far too much "stuff" including huge updates). Of course have 10 and 11 at work.
Most of my computers are Dell and the Windows 7 install media is Dell OEM and seems to fully activate itself offline. Maybe it eventually connects and activates, but I'm not aware of anything happening, and I monitor network activity (NetSpeedMonitor, doesn't work on 10 or 11).
(Score: 2) by mrpg on Saturday January 10, @04:01PM (8 children)
Some laptops have the product key on a chip inside so it automatically activates.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Saturday January 10, @04:13PM
Yeah, I never looked into it. I assumed it was something in BIOS, some kind of encrypted key or something.
All of my Dell desktops self-activate Win7 too.
XP too. Pretty sure Win8.1 too, as I messed with it a bit years ago and I'm pretty sure I've always done offline installs as a rule.
(Score: 3, Informative) by VLM on Saturday January 10, @06:11PM (1 child)
Possibly you're talking about:
https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server/get-started/automatic-vm-activation [microsoft.com]
I run Proxmox and to avoid imperial legal entanglements AFAIK Proxmox still does not support this so other than remembering it exists I abandoned that path.
Could be multiple schemes over the years so you might not have been thinking about AVMA.
Something I wonder about "secret" undocumented stuff like AVMA is how much of a security hole it is. Usually the more "secret" the code the lower the quality. I'm sure its perfectly safe and totally bug free (LOL)
I have no idea how it works. Its interesting to think about how it could work, and the likely security holes resulting.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 11, @01:17AM
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 11, @02:15AM (4 children)
My Thinkstation shipped with Win7, but will not activate it. However, it self-activates Win10 just fine. I am now confused.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by mrpg on Sunday January 11, @03:28AM (3 children)
You have Windows 7 OEM license embedded in BIOS/SLIC table (shipped with Win7) and free Windows 10 upgrade eligibility (Microsoft's 2015-2016 program) but Win7 activation servers are offline so Win10 reads the Win7 OEM key and auto-activates.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 11, @04:52AM (2 children)
Are you saying even an embedded Win7 key needs to speak to the departed activation servers? Because Win10 on that system self-activated with neither an existing Win7 install nor internet access.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 2) by mrpg on Sunday January 11, @03:12PM (1 child)
Hmmm, Lenovo pushed BIOS updates adding Win10 keys to existing machines to facilitate corporate upgrades. If on linux, try:
sudo strings /sys/firmware/acpi/tables/MSDM
You should see two entries.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 11, @04:26PM
Thanks, when I have it up and running again I'll try that. Might be the case, since it has a Win10-era BIOS update. (Tho PCLinuxOS on one of the Dells tells me "No such file.") It mostly runs Fedora, but has a stack of drives bearing other OSs. Right now it's down with a dead PSU that I haven't got around to replacing.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 4, Informative) by chucky on Saturday January 10, @02:22PM (2 children)
If you don’t like Microsoft conditions, switch. There are alternatives.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 10, @02:48PM
... or pray they don't change them further.
(Score: 5, Informative) by canopic jug on Saturday January 10, @03:11PM
If you don’t like Microsoft conditions, switch. There are alternatives.
The End of 10 [endof10.org] project gives a relevant overview of options for those willing to consider upgrading to GNU/Linux. It is focused on upgrading from Vista10 but similar benefits, perhaps in greater abundance, can be had by upgrading from Vista11.
That site has been translated to the following local languages to help with outreach with non-technical people:
Some of the more mainstream desktop-oriented distros have quite good localization.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Saturday January 10, @02:46PM (1 child)
No, not none. Just a little less. Does everyone have a current, compatible smartphone (the one in the story was not) or a second current, compatible, working computer?
Of course, the entire idea of phoning home is ridiculous to start with. You should be able to just install an OS from whatever media and have it fully loaded and ready to run with no strings attached. Yea, they want to make sure you paid for it, but there has to be another way.
People should be smashing down doors (and windows) at Microsoft demanding the ability to set up and log in with a local account. Logging in to ones own computer with a remote account under someone else's thumb is absolutely absurd.
The entire idea does seem to be to get everyone chained down to a Microsoft account. Has anyone else noticed that Windows 10 now sometimes throws up a screen literally demanding that you send your entire hard drive content to Microsoft's One Drive service? There is no "NO" button, only an "Opt out for now" button - well actually text that doesn't look like a button you can click on. That should be illegal.
(Score: 2) by Bentonite on Sunday January 11, @12:04PM
If you purchase any new computer or peripheral that could run, or could work with windows, you have paid for windows due to the Microsoft tax on units or driver development.
Microsoft of course expects to be paid again for windows and then paid again on an ongoing basis with several subscriptions.
I agree with the smashing the doors and windows down, but then proceeding to beg that microsoft agree to enslave you on slightly less bad terms is odd.
Smash the windows, install GNU/Linux-libre.
Unfortunately, making malicious features illegal and therefore making proprietary software illegal, is unlikely to put an end to proprietary software.
(Score: 5, Funny) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 10, @03:26PM (3 children)
I remember the day I finished installing Suse Linux. I got to the log-in screen, and was asked for an activation code. I got no activation code with my CD, so I went to another computer and started searching. It took about six hours to finally get the guy at Suse Linux to explain how to input that code into the rather obscure little box in the upper right corner of the screen. At least with Sabayon, the box was more centered, and I managed to put the activation code in without calling Sabayon support. But, Tiny Linux? What a bitch that was! It took me three DAYS to get it registered and activated! "Turn three times widdershins" she said, without explaining that widdershins means counterclockwise! How was I supposed to know? Don't get me started on Arch Linux, or worse, Dragonfly BSD!
I'm going to buy my defensive radar from Temu, just like Venezuela!
(Score: 2) by aafcac on Saturday January 10, @03:43PM (2 children)
If SUSE had an activation code, I might still be using them. When I tried it out years ago, I couldn't actually use it because I had a bluetooth keyboard and the distro didn't support logging in with a bluetooth keyboard. It did support bluetooth keyboards, just not for the purpose of logging in.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 10, @04:05PM (1 child)
In all seriousness, I found Suse more or less by accident. I purchased a 64 bit mainboard and GPU, with the intention of installing Windows XP 64 bit. It barfed repeatedly over drivers. I cared more about the 64-bit, than I cared about Windows. After a few searches, I learned that AMD and Suse were sharing information that wasn't being shared with other OSs and manufacturers. The only course of action was to download Suse, and install it. I mean, there was no working OS on the disk anyway, I wasn't sacrificing anything by trying. First attempt, Suse went all the way through installation, and I found myself at a Gnome log-in screen, easy-peasy.
OK, I figured out that 64-bit wasn't the end-all be-all final solution to all computing problems, but I was now rooted in Linux land!
I'm going to buy my defensive radar from Temu, just like Venezuela!
(Score: 2) by aafcac on Saturday January 10, @06:26PM
Don't get me wrong, I did kind of like it, but having to have a wired keyboard when Bluetooth ones were claimed to be supported wasn't a good look.
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 10, @03:55PM (1 child)
https://x.com/i/grok/share/fXAXwWb7W4ze8K3vVHU7yQPQL [x.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by VLM on Saturday January 10, @05:46PM
See thats the problem with LLM slop vs actual sysadmin experience.
If I had to do that I'd either forget entire about non-virtualized workloads or at least start with virtualized workloads and move into bare metal later.
1) I'd look into IDS techniques and technologies and treat anything except the base OS as an "infection" then remove (and document) one thing at a time until there's nothing left but the base
2) I'd look into filtering backup files of virtualized system. I don't need the equivalent of C:\config.sys so remove that from the backup, I guess I need to keep C:\My Pr0n\goatse.cx.jpg so transfer that, repeat until there's nothing left in the backup file.
IRL conversion projects never work like the LLM response. You're gonna have to run both in parallel and you're going to have to define an acceptable loss effort level which is not zero, so nobody is going to like it.
One big problem with conversion projects is people never follow best practices that make them possible. They insist, no demand, to store crap in weird locations or install software in bizarre directories then get real mad when someone or something doesn't read their crazed minds months or years later.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Undefined on Saturday January 10, @05:40PM (4 children)
I run Windows 10 on a laptop with no network access. Works great. I have no need for any new Windows software or a later version of Windows 10. I just sneakernet things back and forth as needed (which isn't much.)
Likewise maintain Windows 98 VMs without network access on my linux machines. There's some great abandonware on those VMs. Doing this — freezing a known working OS — also means that OS bitrot, a pernicious form of developer idiocy, is avoidable.
And for the Mac, I have a VM of Snow Leopard, which was the last Mac OS that didn't look like it had been designed by a one-eyed kindergarten anklebiter given nothing but pastel crayons. And again, I have lots of great software there that won't work on later Mac OS incarnations.
Even PPC stuff still runs under Snow Leopard, translated twice:
PPC ==> Intel ==> Arm
The key to happiness as far as I am concerned is studiously avoiding subscription software, cloud software, internet registered software and the like.
You get what you pay for. Except with software subscriptions and (re-)activation-required software. Then they get what you pay for.
It's long past the day when I trusted the Internet at large, Apple, or Microsoft in particular. Experience has thoroughly borne out my skepticism.
It may well be that none of the new OS versions from Microsoft or Apple will ever be worth running again. Linux, so far at least, seems to have avoided the vast majority of this kind of bitrot. Oh well. 😊 Linux it is!
I use a dedicated preprocessor to elaborate abbreviations.
Hover to reveal elaborations.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by canopic jug on Saturday January 10, @05:55PM (2 children)
That works great in the short term, but unless the software is made for GNU/Linux then at some point, when you have to buy new hardware, you'll be stuck with Vista12, Vista12, or whatever it is at the time. Without proper force from governing bodies and the economic or physical force they wield to back up the decisions, we all know that VistaN+1 will be geometrically worse.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Undefined on Saturday January 10, @09:34PM
Well... it's been working since... well, Windows98, right? All of this is running on modern hardware. Some of the machines are an M5 Mac, an i5 laptop, a slightly long in the tooth Mac M1 Studio Ultra and a slightly less toothy Studio M2. One old Intel laptop, but it's been fine and EBay could get it replaced in days — and of course everything is massively backed up. RAID NAS systems FTW, baby.
I really don't see a problem incoming for my situation. Of course, I'm old, so my window of worries, as it were, probably only extends perhaps 20 years out, presuming I'm luckier than the average old fart.
I've still got 100% functional and well provisioned Intel Mac Pros that are really long in the tooth and a fabulous old Intel core duo Macbook (2006) with a 17" inch display. Those are all running linux now. Apple, for all its software problems, really makes fabulous hardware. That laptop has the best display I've ever seen on a laptop. Had to replace the keyboard once, but I took a lesson when that happened and bought a couple of spares to future proof damage from my hammerhands.
Still waiting for a solid ARM version of my preferred (Ubuntu) linux, though. Have a couple Mac Minis that are more than ready to upgrade. They're 100% ready for repuposing.
Well... so far, new hardware hasn't been a problem, and if that happens, I'm already well supplied with the good stuff. I am looking forward to an M5 Studio Ultra though. I run local LLM and generative imaging software and develop both as well as some off the beaten track ML stuff I have some hopes for, so I'm all about modern hardware for those things. So far, there's been zero threat to proper development tools. c++, c, make(s), python... all readily available. So... I feel pretty good about all this.
I do miss a proper version of Qt, but their subscription bullshit slammed that door.
I use a dedicated preprocessor to elaborate abbreviations.
Hover to reveal elaborations.
(Score: 2) by Undefined on Sunday January 11, @12:25PM
Unfortunately, in the USA at least, money is free speech. Because our congress and courts are corrupt as hell. Perhaps an edit to "shouldn't be" is called for here.
Spot on. With you 100%
I use a dedicated preprocessor to elaborate abbreviations.
Hover to reveal elaborations.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 11, @01:24AM
I run Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 on a laptop with network access. Works better - I don't need to sneakernet stuff till maybe 2032: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/products/windows-10-iot-enterprise-ltsc-2021 [microsoft.com]
I don't get stuff like Cortana or Windows Store though.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Saturday January 10, @06:00PM (2 children)
Oddly enough AFAIK this is not an anti-piracy thing.
Last time I checked the Mongolian Basket Weaving and Chinese Cartoon forum's /g/ friendly windows thread /fwt/, reportedly the changes were not causing any issue for those interested in, uh, alternative forms of windows activation.
Its possible they're honest in reports that MS really doesn't care about home/homelab users and "legacy big corporate" doesn't activate using voice phone calls etc so they just got rid of what isn't really used anymore.
I am unclear about how this affects the regular distros vs the IoT LTSC distros which seem to be a huge fixation among the "yo ho ho" microsoft users. did ya wipe your OEM desktop install and install LTSC yet? why not? everyone is doing it just like meth! hurry up! I mean I know personally that it works really well, and it seems like a better distro than the "real" distros, but ... Maybe its all an elaborate honey pot as I'm sure about 90% of IoT LTSC users now are um, not exactly real licensed corporate users of IoT LTSC.
For me, at home, I use windows for three things now: Gaming and Fing around (fun!), doing weird embedded hardware things using weird windows software (Quartus, can't decide if I love it or hate it, I guess 'tolerate' is the best adjective), and finally its 2026 but STILL sometimes the easiest/best way to make active directory changes is windows RSAT tools. Note I'm making changes in an AD hosted on Samba but /usr/bin/samba-tool is not the most cooperative way to F with active directory. I'm kind of surprised in 2026 no one has a nice Linux web based front end that looks like RSAT tools but the back end speaks samba-tools.
(Score: 3, Funny) by canopic jug on Saturday January 10, @06:07PM (1 child)
Warezmeisters running pirated Windows and other M$ products at home are, or at least used to be, a major lobby for said products at work. They'd talk their bosses into buy (and thus deploying) that utter crap just so they could take the installation media home and set it up in their home labs.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by VLM on Saturday January 10, @07:34PM
That is funny, although I like to think I'm operating legally under 17 usc 1201 (f) (2) interoperable software development
Active Directory is pretty cool if you can get past Microsoft's seemingly intentional attempt to preventing interoperation. You can roll your own not-AD but AD-alike using openldap, kerberos, and NFS, or a not-AD using Samba, which I have both used and sysadmined and its OK but there's nothing quite like AD out there in FOSS land. I don't mean a semi-interoperable clone but an application replacement concept. I ran AFS quite a lot around the turn of the century, AFS is really cool but its not AD.
Its an interesting idea to have a shared network database of inventory type data for users and machines along with a crypto key infrastructure and SSO but there's really nothing out there that isn't a clone of AD or a small component thats already in AD or noobs don't know AD was more or less based upon it (hey did you hear about this openldap thing? .... yeah)
Its like conceptually all development of that type of infrastructure stopped around 1990 which is too bad.
In my infinite spare time it would be interesting to list the goals of AD, add to and cross out to arrive in 2026, and implement a blank sheet of paper replacement. Its also interesting to daydream about different implementation techs, like instead of LDAP which admittedly was pretty cool in 1985, why not a SQL, noSQL, or blockchain type database? Or a replacement for SSH crypto that doesn't even backward compatible support pre-quantum algos, like we're staring with ML-KEM as a requirement for v1, not ending with it as an option. Assuming you trust FIPS203. I don't know as you should or should not. "Everyone said" SIDH/SIKE was the bestest thing ever until they got super butthurt earlier this decade, whoopsie. It was like Diffie Helman but using some weird ass topology thing that turns out was fatally broken. Supposedly the tech itself is good the implementation and protocol was what broke.
Possibly infinite eternal churn in crypto means its an inherently bad idea to try to make a "new AD" because crypto will never stabilize, which is pessimistic but probably also true LOL.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Gaaark on Saturday January 10, @09:33PM
Reminds me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MyorWWRwHQ [youtube.com]
Just keep taking it from Microsoft, lusers.
"Do you expect me to stay with Microsoft products?"
"No, Mr. Luser. I expect you to die using our piece of shit inferior products that we keep fucking you with!"
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. I have always been here. ---Gaaark 2.0 --
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 11, @12:44AM (3 children)
I don't ever remember caring about that stuff for personal machines. Even if it had some license, I would bonk it with whatever DISM hacked version which ran well and didn't phone home. At work the machines are probably licensed, right?
I'm not gonna make a microsoft account. Even if I did, they'd immediately ban it and ask for a phone number. MS is not a serious company anymore in terms of OSs if you're not on an enterprise contract.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by canopic jug on Sunday January 11, @12:00PM (2 children)
Even if it had some license, I would bonk it with whatever DISM hacked version which ran well and didn't phone home. At work the machines are probably licensed, right?
See my earlier comment about Windows fanbois being all warezmeisters [soylentnews.org].
In that way, you're playing into one of their worst long term marketing strategies to your own disadvantage:
All that time you could have been using the original FOSS tools and maybe even helping those get better and work to push some of the bigger players (AutoCAD, Adobe Suite, tax software, Blizzard, etc) into supporting GNU/Linux. Regardless, promoting M$ products, even through illicit copies, hurts the market share of the better programs and systems and that hurts even you yourself.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Bentonite on Sunday January 11, @12:37PM
Btw, GNU/Linux long predates such term that attempt to be neutral between the freedom of free software and the corporate serving of "open source" (why be neutral - why not stand for freedom?).
It's a feature that such proprietary malware doesn't soil GNU/Linux.
As far as I can, Microsoft only managed to become commercially successful, as hobbyists were making many unauthorized copies of Microsoft BASIC, meaning that m$ BASIC became the most popular BASIC and computer manufacturers proceeded to license many copies from m$ (which was useful in the future, as Bill could tell IBM that he had an OS for them and then could afford to pay a large sum for a copy and full copyright power of a Dirty Operating System that would be MS-DOS).
Billy boy of course actually complained that the hobbyists didn't give him a payment for each copy in an "open letter to hobbyists", claiming that the computer time for development cost a fortune (in reality, he didn't pay for most of it - as it was mostly developed on a computer at a university that eventually revoked his and the co-developers access after realizing that he was developing proprietary software rather than a useful program - with only a small amount paid for a commercial time-sharing system to finalize the software).
I agree that using unauthorized copies of proprietary software promotes and acts as advertising for such software and therefore increases the harm, but Microsoft isn't even the most evil company (although you'll be hard pressed to find software as functionally defective).
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 11, @07:43PM
Instead the opposite happened. Windows has gotten mucho obnoxious. Similar to the movie studios, it's becoming an issue of not even wanting it for free.
Back in 1998, linux and other FOSS tools weren't all that viable. Most popular software required windows and the alternatives were half baked. Not the case today. Just a few proprietary holdouts remain. Far easier to use linux for daily driving than to hack at windows.
Most people are going to run what works rather than subjecting themselves to pain if they can help it. All that time I couldn't have been or I would have been. Not a masochist for ideals.
(Score: 2) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Sunday January 11, @11:10PM
Oh yeah... That garbage Microsoft OS that vaguely looks like Linux.