-- OriginalOwner_ writes:
Previously: Militia Occupies Federal Building in Oregon After Rancher Arson Convictions
Russia Today reports:
Ammon Bundy, the leader of the armed group occupying a federal wildlife refuge near Burns, Oregon, and four others have been arrested by law enforcement amid gunfire, according to the FBI.At 4:25 pm on [January 26], the FBI and Oregon State Police "began an enforcement action to bring into custody a number of individuals associated with the armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. During that arrest, there were shots fired", the Bureau said in a statement.The FBI said one person who was "a subject of a federal probable cause arrest is deceased". He said they are not releasing any information on the person "pending identification by the medical examiner's office".One person suffered non-life threatening injuries and was taken to a local hospital for treatment. He was arrested and is in custody.The arrested individuals include:- Ammon Edward Bundy, age 40, of Emmett, Idaho.- Ryan C. Bundy, age 43, of Bunkerville, Nevada.- Brian Cavalier, age 44, of Bunkerville, Nevada.- Shawna Cox, age 59, of Kanab, Utah.- Ryan Waylen Payne, age 32, of Anaconda, Montana.
Ammon Bundy, the leader of the armed group occupying a federal wildlife refuge near Burns, Oregon, and four others have been arrested by law enforcement amid gunfire, according to the FBI.
At 4:25 pm on [January 26], the FBI and Oregon State Police "began an enforcement action to bring into custody a number of individuals associated with the armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. During that arrest, there were shots fired", the Bureau said in a statement.
The FBI said one person who was "a subject of a federal probable cause arrest is deceased". He said they are not releasing any information on the person "pending identification by the medical examiner's office".
One person suffered non-life threatening injuries and was taken to a local hospital for treatment. He was arrested and is in custody.
The arrested individuals include:- Ammon Edward Bundy, age 40, of Emmett, Idaho.- Ryan C. Bundy, age 43, of Bunkerville, Nevada.- Brian Cavalier, age 44, of Bunkerville, Nevada.- Shawna Cox, age 59, of Kanab, Utah.- Ryan Waylen Payne, age 32, of Anaconda, Montana.
CNN, NYT, Washington Post, BBC, OregonLive.
Well, this is it for me. For this type of site, the spritual successor to pre-beta slashdot, to be fucking infested with political bullshit is a bridge too far. I'm outta here. Fuck you all for sticking around because you think Soylent is any better than slashdot because it's not. It's just more bullshit that I no longer need to waste my time on. It's worse than slashdot. If I wanted politically charged stories there are better (worse?) places to find them online. Sayonara it was fun while it lasted.
That's a shame. I've been here since the creation and even financially back the site.
I actually agree with you that things are becoming too politically charged, I'd appreciate it if people could set aside the gender/political/ideological stories. It really sucks when just about every comment you make gets you accused of being a woman hating conservative kkk supporting bigot. It serves no purpose and just turn into a mess of ACs taking potshots at each other, all name calling with no actual points.
I've actually been dipping back over to /. now and then recently. Even if the site is crap and they have more crap content, at least there's also more "non-crap" content to sift though.
That said it's our choice to click an article and our responsibility to submit better content if we don't like what's being posted.
Sorry to see you go.
I've said much the same thing on a couple occasions. But there is no getting around the heart of the matter, which you nailed:
I must say that the first point about politics is eternal. I remember the earliest days on the BBS'es and it was no different. On many topics, like Security vs. Freedom, there haven't even been any new points or insights that have been made. You could copy & paste arguments from 1990 into these forums today and you would not be able to tell the difference.
The only difference between then and now is the content that we, the members of the community, submit, and the moderation we accord each other to help sift the signal out of the noise. If we don't do that as community members, then we sink back into the eternal political mire of the BBS'es.
Have some mod points for a well stated summary ^_^
And what's up with the title? Why only mention the Bundys because there were a bunch of them arrested, or to be arrested? And when you only mention them, the second part sounds like one of the Bundys were killed.
Terrible article title to go with a terrible story for this site.
It's worse than slashdot.
You have not been back there in a few months I take it? SD is just as bad as it ever was. I think it is actually worse.
I agree though this is a political trash 'clicky bait' sort of thing. I can understand why you want out.
It is funny I click on SD and here to get a bit of tech news. The luddites come out in droves. I then head on over to reddit.com/r/programming and the posts are MUCH more balanced (which is sad considering it is reddit). If I want political trash I can head over to their front page. Unfortunately that site is *heavily* edited so many times the posts are not very interesting but kinda bland. Healthy skepticism is a good thing. But what I read on SD and here is beyond that. Take for example self driving cars. That is an 'OMG! *amazing*' accomplishment. However, it seems to be a major yawn to most people to the "it is not perfect so therefore everyone is going to DIE and steal your children's jobs!!!" on these two sites.
Click bait works and the seven deadly sins is its fuel.
Yeah I've been skimming the last couple weeks and it seems like most of the decent posters left. Obviously they didn't all come here; maybe they just left?
Good title for a listicle. :)
Please reconsider leaving, and post content you want to see, and use your mod points to encourage more of what you want.
If you still want to go, thanks for participating, at least for a while.
Cool story bro, but none of that has been in the mission statement. Like, ever. They've said, almost from day one, that the intent isn't just tech and science, but also public interest.
Go enjoy your GNAA trolls, ads, and corporate sponsored videos.
"Public interest" is like Slashdot's "stuff that matters", which is a weaselly catch-all to justify retort's like yours. Are you willing to argue that we could regularly post stuff about what the Kardashians are up to, or sports analysis here? I'd wager that you'd say no, but these very easily fit into "public interest" because the public is very interested in this (and in fact, it wouldn't be welcome here because it is interesting to the general public, which means "Joe Sixpack", who we hold to be in great contempt). Here, "public interest" is what YOU think is worthy. You can't define it, but you know it when you see it.
And I think that goes to the heart of what he's saying.
Maybe I'm the odd man out, but I came here to get away from the spam, advertising and corporate influence, not questionably off-topic stories.
While I get what you're saying, in this case, I think it's a stretch to conflate news reports on armed insurrection in a developed country with sports or celebrity news.
This story aside, my point is that there is usually a retort or two, when push gets shove and someone questions why a certain story is posted to the site (here or at Slashdot), that goes "See, it says 'Stuff that Matters' right at the top of the page, and this is Stuff that Matters" or "This isn't a tech site." But those aren't answers, or if they are, they are slimy weaselly answers because tell me then, what kind of site is it? What's "important"? Not popular culture, unless it is Star Wars or Trek. A lot of the non-science and tech stories are pretty much the same anyway in their content. It all goes back to "I know it when I see it," which is not a very satisfying answer if you are out of phase with the echo chamber.
Yeah, that is the answer to this kind of comment. I really, really ought to write a macro to automatically point that out everytime, and every time I mean to, and then life moves on until the next occasion.
I guess you don't realize that isn't an answer to these kind of questions. Ok, it IS an answer, but it is an entirely disingenuous, dismissive, and all-around shitty answer that only serves to show that you really DON'T have a good answer to that question. It's the "because I said so" answer.
Sigh. Here we go again. Were you ever a Slashdot reader? Do you have any history on that site, or here, or are you too young or too recently arrived for that? I participated in Slashdot from the very beginning, which is where the "Stuff that Matters" topic we're talking about began. I swear this same gripe you are airing here cropped up at least once a week, every week, there, from that first moment. And the answer is always the same. There are things that happen that have nothing to do with tech or science, but about which geeks care and want to discuss anyway. Some of those things are world events, some are closer to home.
Here's a short list: Columbine, 9/11, and Rob Malda proposing to his girlfriend. Columbine had absolutely nothing to do with tech or science, but it was most definitely "Stuff that Matters." So many geeks are/have been bullied that it elicited a great deal of heartfelt discussion and was a very important moment in that community. 9/11 ought to be self-explanatory, but apparently not since folks like you keep throwing this same objection at absolutely everything that's not related to network protocols or somesuch. So 9/11 was big, tragic, and world-changing. Geeks, too, are interested in that sort of thing, being part of said world. Rob Malda (aka CmdrTaco, and if you don't know who that is go and Google it you whippersnapper) proposing to his girlfriend also had nothing to do with tech, but it was awesome and we were all glad he shared that moment with us. It was community-building.
In each of those cases, and many others, I appreciate the chance to discuss these matters with intelligent people who are not empty talking heads, like you get on any news channel or from any government source. Slashdot members were, and Soylent members are, often people who are part of the events as they are happening, or engineers or technicians who were directly involved with the stuff in question, and I have gotten so much valuable behind-the-scenes perspective that have left me feeling very well informed, indeed, for a large chunk of my adult life.
Got that? That's the answer. Stamp it on your hand so you can remember it next time. Now off with you and compose 5 submissions to the story queue that focus exclusively on math, computers, science, and tech as penance for your impertinence.
Yes, indeed I am a long long time Slashdot expat. What I hate is that what is considered "Stuff that Matters" is entirely arbitrary and cliquish. Man up and call it out for what it is and stop trying to make it sound like it is "general interest" because it isn't. And no, I didn't give a flying fuck about a public proposal and I found a number of other stories to simply be out of place there. Just because you got a warm and fuzzy, don't assume that everyone else did. For instance, a number of years ago there was a Nelson Mandela passing story at Slashdot. It was being covered by 99 percent of every outlet everywhere on the Net and over the air, with tons of retrospectives, reflections, and historical significance analyses. Yes he was a great man, but what's the geek angle there? The only retort there was "hey, this is Stuff that Matters."
People like me ask this stuff because it is arbitrary and entirely up to the editors to decide what their favorite issues are. There's a fine line between that and the Wiki squatters. The arrogance in your answer in that you know what is appropriate and what isn't doesn't sit well with everyone, and you don't do yourself any favors by flippantly dismissing them away on account of your sheer brilliance. I am also an expat from kuro5hin from many many years ago and I saw the shithole that descended into when you lose your way. As a self-appointed keeper of the shrine, you should keep that in mind.
According to our last batch of stats, we reject only about 1/6 of submissions. Out of those, some portion are dupes or spambots.
You do the math. It's not just the editors that decide what gets on the site, it's the submitters. In fact, it's mainly the submitters.
This story is too political for you? All those shit-stirring stories from buzzard didn't make a dent but this one about an obscure group of dummies camping in the wilderness to support people who didn't even want their support is a problem? As current events stories goes this one is pretty damn blah. If that guy hadn't wanted to die (he literally said he preferred to die than be arrested [msnbc.com] on camera) this wouldn't even be a story.
There's another point to be made about stories like this. Most of the time they are irrelevant, but sometimes they are incredibly relevant and lead to huge things. Only, it's not easy to know that except in hindsight. If we only ever paid attention to official versions of which things matter, we'd miss the importance of a fruit vendor [washingtonpost.com] setting himself on fire or the assassination of a distant, unknown nobleman [wikipedia.org] by a student, or a traffic stop [wikipedia.org].
History-making events don't always arrive in the guise you expect.
There are literally billions of random irrelevant events every single day. The one time some random event is part of a major chain reaction doesn't justifying calling attention to every other irrelevant event.
The spark that lights the fire is no more important than any other spark. What is important are the combustible conditions that made it so a spark could ignite a forest fire. Stories like this are all about sparks with practically nothing about the context.
Tell that to the forest.
If that forest didn't want to catch fire, it should have kept hydrated.
The arab spring didn't happen because one street vendor suicided. It happened because the entire region had reached a breaking point. You want to look at the straw that broke the camel's back, I want to look at the camel because a straw is just a straw.
because a straw is just a straw
Until that straw falls in that place on that camel's back, it is. Then it's pivotal.
Lots of people have been saying for years that the Middle East is a powder keg. I remember that exact phrase used to describe the region in my first social studies textbook in grade school. But the state of being a powder keg doesn't mean a whole lot if you take the lit match out of the picture.
So, yes, one street vendor having committed suicide would not have touched off the Arab Spring without the long-pent up anger and frustration of millions of people suffering under autocratic regimes. But neither would that breaking point have been discovered or the wave of revolutions kicked off had that thing not happened at that place at that time.
In this case, it's as plausible against the backdrop of deep discontent, no, anger, at the direction of the country for confrontations with the government like this one to touch off something larger. The murder of Michael Brown has touched off something much larger, which we all must concede no matter where we stand on that question. The original Occupy Wall Street protest touched off something much larger, too.
I tried making that argument once and was told that I was relying on "lottery logic".
So you and phoenix both like to play the lottery.
How's that working out for ya?
You also fail to realize the difference in scope between someone else logging a potentially trivial (or not) event on a website, and someone betting personal finite resources in hopes it will provide disproportionately large payoff of the same type of resource, I see.
What? Buying a $2 lotto ticket consumes "personal finite resources" but the time consumed posting and discussing trivial events is not a finite personal resource? If anything the lotto ticket is the one with better odds - powerball has a 1 in 25 chance of hitting. [powerball.com]
Sounds like your sense of scope has been warped by butthurt.
Nope. You're still missing it.
Or you could submit other, technical stories. Anyone can. Copy & paste a couple representative paragraphs from the article, put in the link to the original article and title, and you're set. 2-3 minutes per once you get the hang of it.
There's a wiki, too, if you need more information, on best practices for submitting articles.
If you really cared about the quality and quantity of the stories on the front page, you'd chip in a couple minutes here & there to keep the pipeline full. Else, you're storming off to cause a scene.
Ah, the infamous Soylent Quitter.
You've made about a comment a month or less on science stories. You've submitted zero stories. Your last reference to your distaste was this cryptic and non-useful 4 word response [soylentnews.org].
But fuck us for wasting your time (on a site with a different mission statement). It's not like you can throw SoylentNews into an RSS live bookmark and avoid clicking on political stories. Or change your settings so that breaking news doesn't appear on your main page.
I even slotted this between two existing stories so that no story was delayed to make room for this news.
So, will you respond to these replies to your ragequit?
Some people have no respect.