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A gunman opened fire at U.S. Congressmen and others who were gathered at a practice this morning for the Congressional Baseball Game. House Majority Whip Steve Scalise and at least four others were reportedly injured. The gunman, who has been identified by unnamed sources as James T. Hodgkinson III, was taken to a local hospital where he died from his injuries:
A gunman unleashed a barrage of gunfire Wednesday at a park in Alexandria, Va., as Republican members of Congress held a morning baseball practice, wounding at least five people, including House Majority Whip Steve Scalise (La.).
The suspected gunman is James T. Hodgkinson III, 66, from Illinois, according to multiple law enforcement sources. President Trump announced that the gunman, who was wounded in a shootout with officers, has died at an area hospital.
The wounded also included two Capitol Police officers and a congressional aide, according to one law enforcement official and witness accounts.
Congressman Scalise was shot in the hip and is in stable condition.
Hodgkinson's motive may have already been identified by the media:
A Facebook page belonging to a person with the same name includes pictures of Democratic presidential candidate, Bernie Sanders, and rhetoric against President Trump, including a post that reads: "Trump is a Traitor. Trump Has Destroyed Our Democracy. It's Time to Destroy Trump & Co."
Charles Orear, 50, a restaurant manager from St. Louis, said in an interview Wednesday that he became friendly with Hodgkinson during their work together in Iowa on Sanders's campaign. Orear said Hodgkinson was a passionate progressive and showed no signs of violence or malice toward others.
Also at LA Times, Reuters, The Atlantic, The Hill, and CNN.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Soylentbob on Wednesday June 14 2017, @04:40PM
... about the second amendment [time.com] in context of his political opponents.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Lagg on Wednesday June 14 2017, @04:42PM (11 children)
This guy has basically ensured that propaganda is going to win out for the foreseeable future by providing the boogeymen that Trump's cultists were just hoping came along. I sure can't wait to see where the march to third world goes next while we promptly blame existing third world countries. Or other fanatics in our own.
http://lagg.me [lagg.me] 🗿
(Score: 5, Insightful) by jcross on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:25PM (10 children)
What I want to know is why he's being called a "gunman". The rule seems to be that non-muslim white guys who shoot people are "gunmen", non-muslim black or latino guys are "gang members", and all others are "terrorists". Gunman has a bit of a Wild West ring to it, surprisingly neutral in connotation.
(Score: 2) by Snow on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:39PM
You answered your own question.
(Score: 0, Troll) by jmorris on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:39PM (8 children)
Easy, a Bernie Bro simply can't be a terrorist. It would destroy the Narrative. He can't even be officially declared an Assassin, which would be the word most appropriate to what he did. It really is that simple, the Progs control the commanding heights of the culture and have the power to decree these things so they do. So this was not a political assassination attempt, it was not terrorism, the guy's connections to Bernie Sanders will be briefly mentioned in the mainstream news accounts and then memory holed in all future reporting and the motive will be unstated. There is absolutely no "toxic culture of hate" this could be connected to. He was simply a 'crazy' person who went off purely at random.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:14PM (6 children)
You have it backwards, if they wanted to downplay the sanders part they would have only mentioned his anti-trump posts. There is the crazy they'reallouttogetme stuff I was expecting.
(Score: 2) by jmorris on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:29PM (5 children)
Didn't I say it would be reported initially as the frenzy to update posts is in full swing. But watch as the Narrative is spun out of the Blue Checkmark Mafia in the next couple of hours. One in passing mention on the major evening newscasts and that will be one and only mention. It has to be in Lexis Nexus so when they are accused of rewriting the history they can point to it and truthfully say it was reported. They understand how to lie far better than most people have ever though about the topic because it is a religious duty for them. It is in how the Narrative will be spun about this event that the lie will be inserted, memory of the Bernie connection will be quietly excised. They might even have the balls to try to flip the script into a condemnation of Trump for 'creating a toxic political climate.'
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @09:25PM (4 children)
He says without any irony at all.
The defender of "right to oppress people we don't like" can't wrap his brain around the need to prevent states from violating human rights.
Like it or not federalism won, so now we have reached the point where federalism is going too far on some things. We need to more strictly codify the limits of federal power, but revisiting the states vs. federal debate is not gonna happen without another civil war.
(Score: 2) by KGIII on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:23AM (3 children)
I dunno... It might happen, it'd help if people don't cheer on the shooting.
I am a lefty McLefty person, who lefted as far as a lefty could left, while remaining mostly sane. I also spent eight years enlisted in the Marines. I'm not gonna try to fool ya, combat is scary shit. It's also really loud, but I digress.
So, call me a hippie, call me a coward, but please stop shooting each other. K?
Look at the vitriol in this thread. The vast majority of it is coming from people who are on my side of the political spectrum. It is strange to see otherwise intelligent people blame others for their misconduct.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @03:58AM (2 children)
You've hammered on your lefty nature a bit much. Yes a few users are letting their anger guide them, but honestly you are sounding a bit preachy. Liberals are humans too and even the democrat presidents have been pushing authoritarian policies. Trump's campaign really blew the lid off the latent racism and liberals have come under massive attack. I would be more worried if people weren't getting really pissed off. You've got a good message about not letting hatred rule your actions, but that is about it.
You said you aren't nonviolent so you should be understanding of when people have been pushed over the edge. Want to prevent more violence? I'm not quite sure how, but being preachy about people venting on a forum is definitely not going to help. Perhaps addressing their feelings, help people work through them and come to the conclusion on their own that violence is not the answer.
(Score: 2) by KGIII on Thursday June 15 2017, @02:34PM (1 child)
You don't need my permission to hate. You can do that on your own.
I do hope that folks are aware that violence is nothing like they show in the movies.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @07:12PM
Good point, not many people are really aware. You still seemed to miss my point though, good job mr. highroad.
(Score: 2) by jcross on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:02PM
You may be right, but the issue seems to be bigger than this. I see some headlines that called Dylann Roof a gunman as well. Then there's the term "shooter" which seems to imply something else again. It actually should be pretty simple to quantify this in a semi-automated way by scanning headlines for shootings and seeing whether there's a bias by publication or by perpetrator characteristics.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @04:44PM (41 children)
I have personally participated in the inflamed rhetoric that fostered an environment where extreme violence is seen by people on the edge as a legitimate solution to the political problems presented by today's right wing.
But you know what? Upon sincere reflection, I don't feel bad about it. I recognize the individual moral culpability of saying "yeah, our country would benefit from dead conservatives" prior to someone trying to make dead conservatives. I thought for sure, that if this happened I'd be forced to rethink my positions. And I did, but didn't change my mind afterwards. And I still pretty much think the pseudo-fascist, ethnonationalist edge that has taken over conservative movement of the united states gradually over the last 30 years needs to be excised like a cancer. And that political violence is an inevitable consequence of that edge, because people will want to fight back.
So I see how shitty it was to believe, but not nearly as shitty as people who'd kill hundreds of thousands of Americans for fucking tax breaks, and try to institute a religious test for immigration. I don't like the position I'm taking, but I like the alternatives I can see even less.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:02PM (9 children)
I have personally participated in the inflamed rhetoric that fostered an environment where extreme violence is seen by people on the edge as a legitimate solution to the political problems presented by today's left wing.
But you know what? Upon sincere reflection, I don't feel bad about it. I recognize the individual moral culpability of saying "yeah, our country would benefit from dead liberals" prior to someone trying to make dead liberals. I thought for sure, that if this happened I'd be forced to rethink my positions. And I did, but didn't change my mind afterwards. And I still pretty much think the pseudo-communist, crony-capitalist edge that has taken over the progressive movement of the united states gradually over the last 30 years needs to be excised like a cancer. And that political violence is an inevitable consequence of that edge, because people will want to fight back.
See? Works both ways. :)
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:12PM (7 children)
"Durr, it works both ways says" the radical centrist.
"Both the nazis and the people who really don't want to live in a society run by nazis are exactly the same. " He said, very centeredly. "People who don't want to roll over and die for some of the worst scum ever created by a political system, really ought to reflect on what would happen if the people who already want to kill them for existing also wanted to kill them for opposing them"
Look, I get it. That question bothered me in January, 2016, but as I started seeing actual fucking neo-nazis popping up all over the place, being given completely undue weight in every fucking debate, I started to ask myself, "Where would I have gotten up and fought against the things I heard in 1930s Germany?" and didn't like the answers I saw.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:16PM (6 children)
OK, Che, see you on the barricades, right?
That's one deadly killer keyboard ya got there, Fidel.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:30PM (5 children)
Oh, so now in order to be manly, I've not gone far enough. I love that little bait and switch.
No, I don't actually want to maximize violence, but I've reached the point where I was more-than-willing to condone it for anyone attemtping to bring an end to liberal democracy in the name of protecting a fragile ego from entirely due criticism about bigotry. You guys get rid of your fucking goddamn nazi problem, and I'll go back to pretending you're decent human beings who are merely wrong about some things.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:21PM
The propaganda has intimately tied them together, their nazi problem is too widespread. The only solution is for the non-nazi conservatives to join the right-leaning liberals in a new party. Democrats and Republicans need to have their super majority swept out from under them. I have not identified as Democrat for a long time, it is too much of a burden being required to maintain certain beliefs in order to belong to a club.
(Score: 2) by Arik on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:41PM
So what you're saying is, punch an anti-fa?
Really I think you're just trying to be provocative.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:29PM
Not the greatest video but it certainly puts "muh white supremacist" [youtube.com] argument in context.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday June 14 2017, @11:46PM (1 child)
Our only nazi problem is from the left. Racist, sexist, anti-speech, authoritarian, violent... Yep, that spells fascist to me.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:03AM
OMG! I just never thought about it like that
You good sir have shown me the way. I go forth this evening a changed man and shall walk with my head held high. No more will I accept these socially pressured bonds! I am going to go dust off my neighbor's Trump sign, mow his lawn and get him a muffin basket to apologize for disagreeing with him. I'm going to donate money to Trump's 2020 campaign because truly I am now antifa.
Thank you Mighty Truth Bearer, please spread your message far and wide so others may learn from your wisdom.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by fido_dogstoyevsky on Wednesday June 14 2017, @10:49PM
Which would only make sense if the US today had a left.
It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:03PM
Here you go everyone, this is human nature at work. Violence begets violence, and everyone moves to the more extreme edges of their personal beliefs. I am a little shocked but I really shouldn't be surprised that Trump's rhetoric of hate has actually impacted those who oppose him as well.
It takes real effort to deal with these emotions. Self reflection and a conscious choice to avoid hatred is a real thing. You can let the hatred grow, relishing the emotional high of righteous anger, but that is exactly what got us where we are now. Conservatives have been played for decades, their anger stoked by masterful propaganda. You can already see the propaganda rolling now, the last two "liberal" attackers have been immediately correlated with Sanders. It is a two-for-one, no longer are conservatives the only ones who get truly violent and they are correlated with Sanders who would probably have a landslide victory in 2020. But now his name is being tied to terrorist attacks, so all the moderate conservatives will subconsciously recoil back to the right.
It is almost as if there is a concerted effort to stoke internal conflict to weaken the US. Uh oh, here comes the "C" word.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:09PM (3 children)
Well, that's exactly what we're seeing.
You're insane!
Terrorism is what will lead the fascist state that only currently exists in your fevered imagination. Is that what you want, all for the purpose of being able to morally justify your toxic position with your ego?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:33PM (2 children)
We are in the fascist state, it just hasn't reached critical levels. How we handle the upcoming civil unrest will decide whether we edge back towards our original values or into the gaping maw of fear and fascism that many would like to send us into.
I've been very glad to see some recent pushback against the fascist policies, but violent crazies are likely to give the evil people all the justification they need to clamp down. I think conservatives are actually in a better position to stand against the fascists, so don't react in fear please! Instead react like freedom loving adults who are brave enough to stand up for what is right in the face of fascists trying to manipulate them.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @09:39PM (1 child)
I agree, however when the far-left even labels moderates as 'fascist' and better adjusted people don't call them out, then there is a serious problem.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @11:30PM
We gotta be there to call em' out. I'm a hermit but I'll speak up if I see some of this bullshit flying around.
We need thousands and thousands of public mediators. Perhaps a new branch to local police. They only carry non-lethal protection and they can mediate any public argument.
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:37PM (13 children)
Just as this incident achieves nothing positive, drone kills of DAESH leaders in the middle east solves nothing. There is always someone else waiting to step into the shoes of the dead person and followers now inflamed and more motivated to fight back.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:52PM (12 children)
Yeah, but the right wing has been "fighting back" against a harmless center-left as if they're a violent and fringy left for ages. They don't have any tactics left to uncork. I guess maybe they'll benefit from that same center-left falling all over itself to attack itself for being "too left" as if that's what caused the situation of hopelessness and sincere despair for America that provoked this.
Thing is, I don't think anyone who wants to oppose political violence is wrong to do so. I just think we've reached a point where political violence is an inevitability, and far less morally indefensible than it used to be, it makes sense to fight people who want to kill you.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:15PM (11 children)
Promotion of political violence (terrorism) is morally and intellectually indefensible in a non-authoritarian, democratic society. You are not living in Venezuela.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:19PM (8 children)
Eh, considering that I'm gerrymandered as fuck where I live, such that votes in my state have literally been the inverse of electoral results, might as well be.
You can pretend that republicans haven't been systemically dismantling democracy, among their many other authoritarian tendencies, but that is, at best, deluded.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:29PM (7 children)
It's the same for conservatives living in metropolitan areas. There's little difference between republicans and democrats when it comes to authoritarianism; only in the presentation. The left definitely has better PR. This is why, despite the unfavorable disparity in statist murder rates, you have streets full of communists yelling "nazi" at centrists.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:40PM (6 children)
No, fuck that. Republicans are at least slightly over-represented in like 95% of legislative bodies in this country, with only like Maryland and Illinois as notable inverses, which much smaller effect sizes.
The fact that there are districts where majorities exist is not the same as engineered systems where 50.5% of people in a state can vote for democrats, and 10 out of 13 seats go to republicans. This is why "both sides are bad" is so goddamn stupid. One side can be affirmatively dismantling democracy, and the other side can have a normal fucking electoral system, and partisan assholes will pretend that the former aren't authoritarian shitheads.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Arik on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:52PM (4 children)
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:25PM (1 child)
The stupid DNC primary thing makes no sense as a serious charge on even slightly sincere analysis.
Sanders would've won. Clinton was the single worst possible candidate the party could have put forward out of anyone alive recently holding national office. Clinton was the favorite of the party leadership. These are all true statements.
Everything after it is basically conspiracy bullshit. I don't know what you think was exposed in the emails, but the way you describe it to me, it reads like you think there was some kind of vote rigging or money-shifting that didn't happen.
And yes, as of 2016, pretty much all republicans are vile anti-democracy pieces of shit with no redeeming features to speak of. 20 years ago, they were mostly just obsessive partisans. 30 years ago, they were pretty close to decent politicians I'd have disagreed with.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:12AM
Decent politicians do not support the war on drugs. That's 'strike one, you're out' territory.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @08:27PM
we have seen the DNC emails that detail how they deliberately rendered Democracy a farce in their own most recent Presidential Primaries
In the last week, rank and file Donkeys as well as non-aligned Progressives have been pushing for a New Wave movement. [google.com]
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @01:14PM
Abuses of power are normal and should be expected.
The 2 party game is a massive distraction you fools. DFL = heavy smoking. GOP = arsenic. Both kill you.
Fascism is Italian and it stands for corporate governance heavy in authoritarianism -- we are already there NOW, we just haven't progressed to mirror past implementations... even if we to achieve the same level as historical examples or surpass them, our implementation will not look exactly the same. Racism is not an essential ingredient for example. The reason the GOP is usually worse is because corporatism is practically their religion. (Hell, just quoting most of Jesus gets you labeled a socialist.)
The DFL is less corrupted; however it is still corrupted. Both will try to game systems for power, but today it's a good cop vs bad cop with both parties functionally working towards the same ends. The DFL is the good cop; but still part of the problem. Now some fools think the GOP is the good cop; but other than showing how gullible they are-- it's really no different than two people fighting over which method of suicide is smarter....
(Score: 3, Informative) by bob_super on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:56PM
In the false equivalence category, the Dem side is not the one dismantling protections for the people, nature, and global agreements proudly in the pursuit of selfish profits.
I do have to applaud Kansas Republicans for noticing their ideology pushed to the extreme did put them in major trouble. May the Federal Republicans learn...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:05AM
So you agree that Trump should be impeached then? Cause that is his position. No take backsies once the videos are on the intertubes!
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:08AM
We live in an undemocratic authoritarian society, though. We have a two party system that causes many people to vote for the one they see as the lesser evil; not much democracy in that. We also have a society where the government conducts unconstitutional mass surveillance on the populace, hires thugs to violate people's rights at airports, allows police to get away with violating our rights, infringes upon our fundamental right to control our own bodies by disallowing us from ingesting certain substances, and where the government is fighting countless useless wars overseas. That's plenty authoritarian, even if there are even worse countries.
I don't support the violence, but we simply do not live in a non-authoritarian democratic society.
(Score: 2) by bradley13 on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:51PM (6 children)
"I still pretty much think the pseudo-fascist, ethnonationalist edge that has taken over conservative movement of the united states gradually over the last 30 years needs to be excised like a cancer."
Of course, the people you are talking about think that the self-righteous, hypocritical progressive edge that has taken over the liberal movement of the united states gradually over the last years needs to be excised like a cancer.
And those two views pretty much sum up the problem: Each side now regards the other as a group that can no longer be tolerated or lived with. It appears that most of the violence at the moment comes from the left, but that won't last. Pretty soon, both sides will be going at it. The left can ultimately call on the police forces and maybe parts of the military. The right has more guns, and knows how to use them. Civil war, anyone?
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:59PM (5 children)
No, the problem is definitely with the side loading themselves with white nationalists, not the "self-righteous" people who notice and condemn that. Your attitude is exactly why I view political violence as an increasing inevitability.
You need to learn the difference between "trying to improve society by recognizing problems" and "being self-righteous". Except you seem constitutionally incapable of it which is why we need less of you.
(Score: 4, Touché) by bradley13 on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:11PM (3 children)
The best way to improve society is my way, not your way, because I'm so much better and smarter than you. And if you get...hurt...along the way, well, that's just fine.
You think I'm speaking for the alt-right, when I'm actually just paraphrasing you. Or do you still not see the problem?
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:42PM (1 child)
"Don't you see, pointing out my massive failing that I refuse to do anything about is like saying you're better than me for no reason?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:57PM
First do no harm
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @08:42PM
It isn't "my way / your way", a lot of the issues are basic human rights issues. Freedom to exist issues. Factually verifiable issues that conservatives want to ignore.
Sorry bud, but conservatives have gone full retard and promote outlandish propaganda to justify their world view. There is only so much factually incorrect "but this is my choice / opinion" bullshit the world can take.
Conservatives do have some decent views, but as a group they are triggered emotional crazies denying facts. So yes, you get some arrogant "stop your bullshit" attitudes. The problems you see with liberals are simply not in the same ballpark as the problems conservatives have. Conservatives FEAR that liberals will do fascist things, but there are actual conservative types going around committing crimes and promoting racism / bigotry / xenophobia.
You can't equate possibilities with actualities.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @08:44AM
I'm white. You leftists are trying to genocide me by importing millions of muslims. Heck yeah I'll throw my lot in with the white nationalists. I like to survive. I have children and will have grandchildren, unlike the typical leftist, and I'd like them to survive too. I'm also not liking the fact that race means my kids need extra-high test scores to get into good colleges and the fact that race will keep them from many scholarships.
You started the hate. I'm not going to ignore it. Back down, and I will do likewise.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:43PM (4 children)
Dehumanization is a terrifying viscous circle indeed. Churchill was right about the future fascists, they do literally call themselves anti-fascists.
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Wednesday June 14 2017, @09:47PM (3 children)
You know that churchill quote was literally made up by fascists right? And not even that long ago?
No, I'm guessing you don't. If I had one thing to say to republicans to make me stop thinking they deserve violence it's this: stop believing unabashed neonazi propoganda as truth, while dismissing credible professional reporting as lies. If you did that, you could get rid of the fucking Nazi problem.
But again and again I see it from you people, literal neonazis are easier to believe than things that might, maybe, if you assume enough, be construed to be liberal.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @11:49PM (1 child)
As recently as 1937? [quoteinvestigator.com]
If you're seeing National Socialists everywhere, you're probably the one that needs to stop listening to propaganda.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @04:11AM
http://standuptohate.blogspot.com/p/winston-churchill-and-anti-fascist.html [blogspot.com]
So not Churchill, even by your quote investigator. The site I linked explains what is really going on. I look at the actions and the conservative politics are much more about anti-freedom and also where all the prop dictatorship talk is coming from. Liberals are not the fascist bogeymen, conservatives just can't stand being on the losing side of this cultural war. Bigotry is out, if they could just come to grips with that then they wouldn't get so much anger from the more extreme liberals.
Disingenuous conservative propaganda as usual, THEY'RE the fascists waaaaa.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @02:46AM
I would like you to link to one example of this. Go on, just one link. I dare you. I double-dog dare you.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:12PM (2 children)
What are they doing playing baseball in the morning? Don't they have actual jobs to go to and perform? Isn't this some kind of leisure activity that you can do in your own spare time? That said -- fucked up people, doing fucked up things -- news at 11.
So if you thought it was hard to get some actual face time with your politician before this probably just created another layer between you and them. More money for security to politicians -- two bodyguards isn't enough anymore, they'll be requiring their own SWAT-team and a personal sniper. As far as being a gun-control issue it might be trickier to predict the response -- had it been a white republican shooting black people it would have been easy, now it was some lefty cracker gunning down evil old white men so I'm sure we'll see a lot of comments about how they can blame themselves and this is the system they like. After all the gun-man was one of the "good guys" (TM) ...
Why do these crazy people so often have those weird double names and a numeral -- that makes them appear a lot more redneck-y then they probably are.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:20PM
Maybe I'm not catching the sarcasm but I left a Wikipedia link right there in the summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_Baseball_Game [wikipedia.org]
Now we could argue about whether this is a good use of their time, but do you really want to go there?
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:35PM
They were at baseball practice - practicing for the charity game linked by takyon - in the morning because it gets hot in the afternoon.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:30PM (1 child)
Echo chambers radicalize individuals. People surrounded just by 'friendly' voices begin to fall further and further out of touch with reality. This [heavy.com] article has some extensive details on the shooter. In general he was your typical groupthink individual. 'Trump is a traitor. We need to destroy him!' type stuff. If you look at, for instance, Reddit - there are countless thousands of people going down the exact same path.
People are beginning to feel that violence is a reasonable way to resolve issues. A public figure posing with a decapitated head of the president? Dressing head to toe in black and physically assaulting random people is 'anti-fascism'? The vice president candidate saying literally that democrats need to fight back "in the streets." It's easy to pick on the left since the violence is becoming so visibly mainstream, but of course the right is also another powder keg just waiting to explode. Trump saying things like 'those second amendment guys can take care of this' probably was not referring to the polls. This isn't going stop until we stop segregating ourselves. And that's not going to stop until companies (Facebook, Twitter, etc) stop trying to force feed people everything they think they'll like. The business practice of surrounding people with only things the company thinks they'll like is leaving people living in realities that are simply not in touch with what is actually happening. And this also being further propagated by news and media organizations that are using race baiting, extremist political views, and other such things to generate clicks and make a buck.
Companies are ultimately lighting a fuse as a means to make a buck. And with what will undoubtedly be the global condemnation and calls for peace and cooperation after this - the media is going to be high fiving behind the scenes since this is going to be great news for at least a week. And then after it's dead, they'll be right back to race baiting, political baiting, and generally trying to excite emotion and incite reaction to make a buck. All the while facebook will be force feeding every conservative with news demonizing the increasingly radicalized left, and feeding every liberal with nonstop news about the republicans bringing this upon themselves. What could ever go wrong?
(Score: 2) by Geezer on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:51PM
What could go wrong? Nothing. Those self-same companies have bought and paid for the means to suppress any threat to their oligarchy. There are plenty of bread and circuses to go around, even if the occasional gladiator or praetorian guard gets killed.
We are so screwed.
(Score: 2, Funny) by realDonaldTrump on Wednesday June 14 2017, @05:45PM (2 children)
What that man wrote about me is disgraceful. Totally untrue. It's the message of hate the FAKE MSM has been working so hard to spread. Trying to stop me from making America great again. Folks, if I would have relied on the Fake News of CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS, Washington Post or @nytimes, I would have had ZERO chance of winning the White House. What Charles wrote is what they've been writing. Shameful lies! But today is my birthday and it's a time to celebrate. At the White House we have a beautiful chocolate cake.The most beautiful chocolate cake that you have ever seen. And I'm enjoying it a lot. And if you want to celebrate you can shoot, but shoot in the air so it doesn't hurt anyone. Straight up in the air. Not at Congressmen. Not at Republican Congressmen, I mean. U.S.A.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:11PM (1 child)
This is your moment, @realDonaldTrump. Shoot from the hip.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @09:38PM
There. FTFY.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by justinb_76 on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:37PM (7 children)
"was a passionate progressive and showed no signs of violence or malice"
uh-huh, I seem to hear that a lot - we go low when they go high! we're tolerant!
let's see, in addition to this morning's escapades, in the past week we've had a 'passionate progressive' "woman" in Harrisburg PA stab a police horse in the neck, and a 'tolerant' individual throw animal urine in Lauren Southern's face. And every time this happens, more and more normal folks are realizing that when people are willing to insult, vilify, intimidate and attack you over your beliefs and/or opinions, you are on the right side of history.
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:20PM (4 children)
... or your beliefs or opinions are an affront to what decent people can tolerate and they've been pushed across a line. It can go either way. I'm not saying that this guy was mentally stable, but people do have a limit, even decent people. As an example, if my government started pushing slavery or genocide , that might push me across *my* line, as an example.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @08:09PM (1 child)
Good grief man, get a hold of reality. A man with a rifle just attempted to murder as many random politicians as he could. His rationale is looking to be 'They're not on the political team I prefer.' This isn't some uprising against heinous crimes against society. People need to get out of their echo chambers - NOW. We live in a democracy. The way you effect change in a democracy is by working together. The way you empower an establishment that is sustained entirely on divide and conquer is by hating, let alone turning to acts of violence, against 'the other side.' Much like Bin Laden gave Bush the biggest gift he could have asked for, this man just gave the republican establishment the greatest gift they could have asked for. Get ready to see a push to criminalize 'radical' speech online. And what qualifies as radical? Well that'll be up to those in power to decide. I'm guessing in any way working as what could be seen as an apologist for a mass murder attempt would probably be pretty high on that list though. And there's no way this new power congress will grant itself could ever end being abused...
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Wednesday June 14 2017, @08:39PM
The full quote from what I was responding to was
People have a line that when crossed will cause that sort of response. I'm not condoning or apologizing for murder. I'm saying that someone insulting you doesn't put you on the "right side of history". It may simply mean you've crossed the line of decency. I'm responding to the quote, not the original act or article.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @02:57AM (1 child)
You have zero right to take action against people based on your perception of their beliefs or opinions.
When they start taking objectionable actions blast away, but the right to think is inalienable.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @06:38AM
I do not condone the shootings, but politicians have done lots of real things that harm people.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:32PM
It really is frustrating seeing history repeat itself over and over and over. It's like people don't realize that damn near every 'evil' in the past was done in the name of some greater good. Reality isn't a Hollywood movie with some blatantly evil character independently engaged in villainy just for the sake of hurting people. People have reasons, and everybody thinks they're the good guy. But indeed, I think it's almost a rule that the group that starts normalizing violence first is invariably the one that history regards with condemnation. It's insane I'm seeing that even here with people saying things like they don't feel bad about this happening, even after previously stating things like the world would be better off with the victims of this attack gone. I wish they could see themselves in isolation without crowds of other idiots similarly normalizing violence making them fail to realize exactly how far away from 'good' that they've fallen.
You want to change things in this country? There are more than 250 million people [wikipedia.org] of voting age in this country. Trump won the election with fewer than 63 million votes. Clinton won the popular vote, but it was equally pathetic at fewer than 66 million. Combined, that leaves 121 million people that chose not to vote for either candidate. Change is easy if you can get even a tiny fraction of people outside the circle jerk to agree with you. But violence? What do you think that is going to achieve?
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Wednesday June 14 2017, @07:53PM
Why are you putting "woman" in quotes?
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @06:45PM (1 child)
That was predictable.
Probably the same partisan back-and-forth horseshit I've already read a hundred times here before.
Exactly what the global elites want you to be doing right now.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 14 2017, @11:43PM
Yup, but there is no way around human nature. We have to work through the divisive bullcrap, yell back and forth, work it out. Maybe we'll get tired and finally say "ugh ok, you're not that terrible. But THOSE fuckers are the real problem!" and we'll get money out of politics and finally get some real change that benefits the people.
I can dream right?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by GlennC on Wednesday June 14 2017, @10:18PM (1 child)
It's a shame that there weren't more shooters, and that they weren't going after EVERY congresscritter, "Democrat" or "Republican". They, along with the corrupt Presidential administration, all need to be taken out back and shot. I'd even suggest including the Clinton campaign's folks for good measure. Then the nation needs to split into at least 2-3 smaller independent nations.
But no, since the "GOP" was the target, we're stuck with the same bitter divisiveness we've been seeing for the last few Presidential administrations.
Face it, our grand experiment with representative democracy has failed.
Sorry folks...the world is bigger and more varied than you want it to be. Deal with it.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @07:14AM
It's not representative democracy that's the problem. It's districted first past the post that's the problem.
Imagine a state has 20 congressional representatives. Instead of breaking the state up into 20 little districts where you need to get a plurality of all votes, instead let the entire state vote for the parties or people they want in office. You get more than 10% of the vote, you get a seat - period. Suddenly people would actually be willing to vote for the candidates they actually want instead of the ones that they're convinced, by the media, that are 'electable.' You'd have libertarians, you'd have greens, you'd have representation. The problem with our system is not that it's a representative democracy, but that our representatives are not representative of the country in any way whatsoever. And this will never change under first past the post.
Imagine a state is evenly split 30% democrat, 25% republican, 20% green, 20% libertarian, 5% other. In our system if that state has 20 representatives you're going to get 20 democratic representatives. 30% of the support, 100% of the representation. That is... stupid. Who in the world could say the representation should be anything other than proportional to the overall support?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 15 2017, @12:10PM
Was he too couched and prodded ahead by the "security services"?
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
TERRORISM IS SECURITY