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posted by
NCommander
on Tuesday April 01 2014, @06:00PM
from the wonder-how-long-until-the-staff-gets-wiretapped dept.
from the wonder-how-long-until-the-staff-gets-wiretapped dept.
Cory Doctorow at bOing bOing reports Newly disclosed documents from the trove Edward Snowden provided to journalists reveal the existence of the Nymrod database that listed 122 world leaders, many from nations friendly to the USA, that were spied upon by the NSA. Included in the list is German Chancellor Angela Merkel, who was already known to have been wiretapped by the NSA thanks to an earlier disclosure. Nymrod's "Target Knowledge Database" combed through the NSA's pool of global intercepts to amass dossiers of private communications emails, faxes, calls and Internet traffic related to the leaders.
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Can anyone remember when the times were not hard, and money not scarce?
(Score: 2) by etherscythe on Tuesday April 01 2014, @10:43PM
Unsurprising is not the same as acceptable. MPAA or RIAA making another ridiculous claim of copyright damages is unsurprising - but definitely not acceptable.
Here's the thing: do we presume that only Americans have rights? It might seem that the Constitution was written specifically to give rights to Americans, but the way it's set up, "inalienable" rights refers to those rights naturally owned by all persons, and in spirit aught to refer to people in other countries, because the Constitution actually does not give rights - it merely honors what is already there, by its own definition. So the Fourth Amendment is really in trouble by this measure - because we're searching and violating the innate privacy rights of people all over the world, by our own rules; and not just any people, but the heads of state. You could make an argument that you don't expect Saudi Arabia to respect those rights globally, but we Americans really have little excuse, since we're attempting to claim the moral high ground as world police and such.
It's an egregious and fundamental failing and that's why it's important.
"Fake News: anything reported outside of my own personally chosen echo chamber"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 01 2014, @11:29PM
Your position sounds absurd. You are suggesting that the U.S. do no spying because it violates the privacy rights of people in other countries. Are you under the impression that the U.S. is the only government that spies on others? Or do you think the U.S. should be the only country that doesn't spy on others?
Do you honestly think the founders thought that spying on foreign nations is forbidden by the fourth amendment?
(Score: 1) by bill_mcgonigle on Wednesday April 02 2014, @04:50AM
Yes, that's what natural rights are about. Jefferson felt strongly about this, but he also did not support the Constitution nor did he do a great job following it.
If Jefferson can't get it right, pretty much nobody else has a hope of doing so.
(Score: 2) by etherscythe on Wednesday April 02 2014, @03:33PM
No, I'm suggesting that we have a problem with being hypocritical - our foundational documents suggest we aught not to be spying on anybody. Realistically, it's a very useful thing to do, getting a heads-up on events and circumstances affecting our interests; this is why it is done. But maybe we shouldn't trumpet to the world that we have the greatest aspirations and are the most morally upstanding folks, whilst simultaneously spying not only in violation of our own core principles but on the symbolic figureheads of other nations, which by extension is kind of like simultaneously violating the rights of every single citizen in that country.
If we want to be honest about our place in the world, maybe we should change our constitution to reflect it.
"Fake News: anything reported outside of my own personally chosen echo chamber"