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An estimated 541,000 people aged between 15 and 39 in Japan avoid social contact and shut themselves in their homes, according to a government survey released Wednesday [JS required].
The figure compares with the previous Cabinet Office survey in 2010 that found an estimated 696,000 such people — known as hikikomori — across the country. Despite the decline, the latest survey does not give an overall picture of the full extent of the phenomenon as it did not include those aged 40 or older.
But the survey does highlight a trend in which people who have withdrawn from society have done so for longer periods, as those who have shut themselves in their homes for at least seven years accounted for about 35 percent of the total.
It also showed the number of such recluses between the ages of 35 and 39 has doubled, according to the survey.
The article mentions there is a nonprofit formed to help hikikomori re-integrate with society. Wikipedia names NPO lila as one.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:15PM
Five incurable recluses out of a thousand is not what I would call an excessive figure.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by quintessence on Friday September 09 2016, @09:43PM
For Japan's culture (high social context, high group identity) it's troubling, especially for people who are in the prime of their life.
What isn't detailed in the story is reasons often given (disenchanted with social obligations, the mating dance, and work culture) for the withdraw. In many respects it mirrors those in the same age group in the US (although they have become more vocal in their dissatisfaction).
Could be cultural ennui, could be just how this generation defines their coming of age, but it's still kinda sad people don't feel there is a place for them in society, or don't have the wherewithal to create their own.
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:56PM
don't have the wherewithal to create their own
JAPAN NEEDS UBER LIKE RIGHT NOW BRO
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Ethanol-fueled on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:29AM
The younger folks here in America believe that society should bend to their whims, rather than vise-versa. The problem that creates is that it makes all of them too picky and particular for their own good, but instilling in them the quality of annoyingly digging themselves deeper and deeper into the holes they are already buried in.
The first lesson American youth need to learn is that life is one giant goddamn compromise and that unicorns don't exist. Once they get over their panic attacks and schizophrenic breakdowns resulting that cold, hard realization, then they can emerge from their preschool-themed safe-spaces stronger people.
The Japanese Hikkos, in contrast, drop out from the start - they see what a self-destructive monster their culture is know right away that it's bad news. They are smart enough not to try to bend it to their whims because their media and academic institutions aren't infested with Jewish fifth-columnists filling their media with lies and their heads with false hope.
Sheesh, what do you think they are, sadomasochists?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:43AM
The IT folks here in America face the same hopeless future as the hikkis in Japan. No job unless H1B. Might as well drop out of society and crawl under the bed and not come out until the time comes to Make America Great Again! Trump! Trump! Trump!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:51AM
vise-versa
What is this? Some new versatile shop holding device? Or did you mean "vice-versa"? Usually USian military types just say "vice" for some reason, leaving off the "versa", which makes no sense. But I guess ol' Eth gets his vice elsewhere. Or could it be that he first became a hikikomori because he couldn't spell. Words, couldn't spell words. Or tell them apart. Words.
(Score: 2) by quintessence on Saturday September 10 2016, @03:21AM
It is the nature of youth to look at the current order and want something different. Most of social movements come from kids as they are the only ones with the energy to pursue them.
What is concerning about the Hikkos is that the are withdrawing to themselves instead of forming their own clique to weather the ride. Even if they can't change the dominate culture, they could create a little room to do more than just get by.
American youth are maybe too spoiled, but then again conditions usually don't improve until the expectations rise. It's just questionable if their wants are really an improvement.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @05:00AM
Got out into the job world, found out our parents lied to us about hard work paying off, steady work with a future being there for the taking, etc.
I've got friends in the tech industry today, most of them have not had nearly the opportunities my dad had coming straight out of *JUNIOR* college 30 years ago, even those with a BA/BS or above. I have other friends who went from military to dead end minimum wage jobs (half dozen or so over the years), and only one who did something greater (civilian contractor for his MOS after getting terminated on a medical discharge.) The only people I have met who have been economically successful in the current America are generally doing so by being civilly or criminally negligent in the operation of their businesses, be it underpaying their employees, ignoring OSHA regulations, unreported income, cooking their books, or through other less savory means. Outside of some people in web design, niche IT, or programming/scripting jobs that are unlikely to outsource, very few people I know or have met are living both honestly and legally day to day without economic hardship.
And then people ask why myself, or people like me prefer to shut ourselves away if we have the chance, rather than put ourselves into risking our health, livelihood, moral compass, etc by journeying into the job world and decide what scruples we will compromise in order to continue having a job, or to move into a job that actually pays well enough for us to pretend we will have a future.
That said, if they are cowering away in their rooms and not working on exit strategies for their future (whether suicide when the free lunch runs out, or a nest egg of virtual financial goods, or a suitable location and social network of like-minded individuals to integrate with) they will get no sympathy from me. Opportunities in the globalized world economy are decreasing rather than increasing and cost of ownership is only going up (be it vehicles, property, or rental/ownership of domiciles) and opportunities to pay them as they are due are only going to go down over time. What happens when all the money has been siphoned up, the economy is stagnant, and you've still got a yearly tax bill due to your government, or 'your land' will be taken? We are very close to the return of economic indentureship and most people cannot even contemplate how it will come to pass.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:01AM
Could just be that people suck.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Yog-Yogguth on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:51AM
It's weird that people are scared of or worried about people who would rather not have to pretend to like them and/or who thrive in their own solitary company or family etc. and/or who prefer to talk with people in sensible freedom-loving places like SoylentNews and/or who just want to be left alone doing their thing be it something silly or awesome :3
"Extroverts" just can't handle not being loved by everybody XD
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: 4, Informative) by stormwyrm on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:19AM
Numquam ponenda est pluralitas sine necessitate.
(Score: 2) by Yog-Yogguth on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:59AM
I would guess there are more abortions in Japan in a year or a few years than there are "hikkomori".
2006 anime movie plot spoiler [anidb.net].
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:07AM
It seems not. [wikipedia.org] 2007 statistics has only about 256,000, and there has been a downward trend from there.
(Score: 2) by Yog-Yogguth on Saturday September 10 2016, @09:55PM
Unless I'm being stupid (happens) that means it would only take a bit over two years to reach a number of new very young people as large as the number of recluses in the extremely hypothetical situation that there were no abortions (and without in any major way inconveniencing the women i.e. using currently non-existing high technology or supporting motherhood to an extent that they voluntarily choose not to use abortion).
It would still only take four years if half the abortions were voluntarily avoided and eight years if only a quarter of abortions were avoided, sixteen years if one in eight were avoided and so on.
First point is that the number of recluses is kind of insignificant (it might still be an actual problem to the extent that the recluse and their close ones think it is, but no need to panic over the numbers).
Second point would be that it these recluses are all that worrying it might make sense to for example create complete kindergarten coverage in Japan (which I've heard is lacking and which would be/is a huge problem for most mothers) to encourage fewer abortions and/or also other programs and/or also create technology to save those already conceived (even if that seems creepy).
Thank you for taking the effort to look up the number!
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Friday September 09 2016, @09:16PM
> those who have shut themselves in their homes for at least seven years accounted for about 35 percent of the total
That matches those who have retreated from reality since Jan 2009...
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:23PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaMzXdInBSA [youtube.com]
The sound of New York City
Isn't police sirens wailing
It's the sound of Wall Street tills
Whilst everyone is failing
Sometimes you feel expensive
Sometimes you feels so cheap
You can roam the streets a King
Whilst everyone's asleep
You can mime to any record
With a hairbrush or a spoon
But God help the singer out of tune
http://www.metrolyrics.com/the-sound-of-north-america-lyrics-beautiful-south.html [metrolyrics.com]
(Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Friday September 09 2016, @10:17PM
Retreated from reality?
When the reality is that we will live in a hellscape we call planet Earth, while destroying it and our future, at the same time we allow the few to brutally exploit us... yeah I kinda of understand. Even if you have managed to maintain a small semblance of a normal life, you're rewarded with people that have already retreated from reality into social media and their devices. I'm guessing one is more socially acceptable than the other, huh?
Fuck being shut into a home. I'm "retreating from reality" as you put it, but that means the middle of fucking nowhere away from toxic societies that only seek to exploit me. By "shut in" you will mean that I no longer leave my valley for anything but supply runs, and I don't actually have to deal with people too much to do that. Ironically, they'll be helping because we're no longer interested in other people, just their likes and 140-character-or-less thought-snippets.
What would I be missing again? Just what are these hikiomori missing again?
That's right. We're missing society. Oh noes.......
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 2) by jelizondo on Friday September 09 2016, @10:28PM
Don’t hermits take a vow of silence? Or it does not apply to posting on Soylent?
Sorry for the sarcasm, but by posting you interact with society, you know the oppressing thing that gives you Internet, supplies and all other malaises…
Society is not perfect but it is perfectible. Reflect on it.
(Score: 2) by RamiK on Friday September 09 2016, @11:09PM
hellscape we call planet Earth
Dystopian fantasies.
Society is not perfect but it is perfectible.
Utopian pipe dreams.
There's nothing to perfect. There won't be an apocalypse. Leibniz nailed it on the head. This is all there is to it.
It doesn't matter what happens in the grander scheme of things. When the dust settles post your Utopian singularity \ Dystopian Doomsday: If people are still around, there going to be inequality, horrific crimes and general dissatisfaction. If not, there won't be anyone to tell me I was wrong.
Customer satisfaction is not guaranteed. Feel free to checkout at the door and ask for a refund.
compiling...
(Score: 2) by jelizondo on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:18AM
Perfectible [merriam-webster.com] means capable of improvement.
If you think it is not, you are deluded. Would you rather be a slave under the Greeks or Romans? A serf in Merrie Olde England? Would you rather live under the Inquisition? How about living under Stalin in Russia?
I did not say it is or could be perfect, I said it could be improved.
And what improvement means, I leave to reader as an exercise.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:37AM
> Perfectible means capable of improvement.
I've noticed a pattern among extremists. When confronted with words they don't know, they happily attribute a meaning that best fits whatever argument they are trying to make. I think it reflects a general correlation between being incurious and being utterly confident.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:54AM
The only times perfectible is legitimately used to mean improvable is in Rousseau translations and early American texts quoting or paraphrasing Rousseau.
Another colonial blunder.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @04:49AM
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/perfectible [merriam-webster.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by RamiK on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:30AM
You're probably right about me not wanting to be a Greek slave. Though, I'd probably have preferred being an Ancient Greek over my current circumstances... Let alone being a starving & oppressed North Korean \ diseased or a war-turned African...
Otherwise, civilization hasn't improved and can't improve. We're simply short changing the future and everyone else on the world by consuming more resources then we can afford.
Until someone figures out some zero-point energy magic, our society is nothing more then a broken exponential economic model heading straight into a finite physical reality.
So, until these "improvements" are actually proven over time, this is nothing short of a grand gamble of us staking everything we have to sustain a life style only a fraction of us is satisfied with. And likely non of our children can actually afford.
compiling...
(Score: 2, Interesting) by tftp on Saturday September 10 2016, @04:41AM
Don’t hermits take a vow of silence? Or it does not apply to posting on Soylent?
One can be a pretty isolated individual and still participate in /some/ social interactions.
The problem with hikikomori, as I can guess at this very moment, is simple. They do not want to interact with *this* society. They may want to live in some other society, though - perhaps, one that is entirely impossible, or possible but not present on this planet. Maybe they need only a handful of friends, who are similarly isolated.
Why wouldn't they want to live in the current society? Because they are too smart for their own good. They ask a very basic and still unresolved question: what is the purpose of life? Someone with a lower IQ will readily answer: to eat, to drink, and to $fornicate. Someone with a high IQ may think for a moment and then answer: there is no purpose. And if so, why bother?
You may also want to consider another aspect. Traditional Asian religions are strong on contemplation and meditation. If there is any leakage of traditions from religion, all kinds of things are possible - even if the leakage is just a single phrase. Christianity does not suffer from complicated faith - the story of the Bible is pretty simple and requires no understanding; the believer is only required to obey. Buddhas and their preaching are somewhat different.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:34PM
Yeah it is kinda strange how President Biden is a reclusive leader who always speaks through his trained monkey Baba or Bobo or whatever its name is.
(Score: 2) by Yog-Yogguth on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:13AM
LOL! :)
Hilarious but no mod points to mark you +1 Funny (same as -1 Troll for Biden-Bobbo's fleshbots).
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:37PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Rbfgj4og-M [youtube.com]
I woke up late today,
actually I do that everyday.
Got no place to be seen, I'm not part of a scene,
I'm a gen-ious loser.
Keeping council with my own opinion,
president of the state that I'm in.
Should I just stay in bed? Should I live in my head?
Oh god, so many questions to ask.
Oh, you could call me lazy,
I think of it as taking my time.
'Couse I don't wanna do what I don't wanna do,
I'm a queen refusnik.
http://www.metrolyrics.com/real-late-starter-lyrics-nerina-pallot.html [metrolyrics.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by marknmel on Friday September 09 2016, @09:46PM
I wish I could be this. With my wife, and my dog - life would be grand.
However, making a living puts a crimp on that dream :-)
There is nothing that can't be solved with one more layer of indirection.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:50PM
Vote Green for Basic Income and never work again.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:45AM
Move to Alaska. Lots of people live that way there. They also get free money for living there. Don't know how much it is these days, though.
It is, however, quite cold for much of the year, and you probably need to work pretty hard trapping, fishing, and hunting to supplement your food supply. If your needs are simple you'd likely be quite happy. Also, you'll be looking forward to global warming rather than dreading it.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:06AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund#Annual_individual_payout [wikipedia.org]
Enjoy your $5.66 pocket change per day.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:06PM
If your rent is low, that might be 25% of what you need to survive day to day.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:07PM
Exactly. We're talking about a lifestyle that's quite different from an apartment dweller in Manhattan, for whom $2K/yr would pay maybe 60% of your rent for 1 month. But that different lifestyle could come with a higher score on the happiness index, depending on how adaptible you are. If you want to live in the middle of the taiga in Alaska and be able to walk out your door and have world-class French cuisine and pop into Micro Center to pick up components for a new gaming rig, then you're going to likely be unhappy because you can't have that cake and eat it, too.
But there may come a time in your life when the world-class French cuisine loses its appeal, and you realize the gaming rig puts you into multiplayer games with nothing but snarky 13-yr olds, and you think maybe there might be something terrifically appealing about solitude.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @09:54PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoUCyrg5Syo [youtube.com]
The monsters make me hide
Perhaps I'll eat myself alive
Internally
What is there left for me to be
I can't care for what's left me behind
And stare at light that makes me blind
These broken walls trap me inside
I'm isolated
http://www.lyricsmode.com/lyrics/c/chiasm/isolated.html [lyricsmode.com]
(Score: 2) by Username on Friday September 09 2016, @10:10PM
How can they afford to not leave their homes for seven years? Telecommuting? FFL dealer? Prostitution? Welfare? Not very many jobs I can think of that you can do from home.
(Score: 2) by Kunasou on Friday September 09 2016, @10:16PM
Having a family is great... They can maintain their son for years.
In my country (Spain) we're used to live with our parents at least until we're 25 or even 30 so it's not that weird.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:57PM
The degree of isolation varies. Some function in highly regimented or work from home jobs with little real interaction (call centers, offsite customer support, etc)
Many, maybe most, are supported by welfare type things or enabling family members. The shame these people feel is often contagious, and their families (and sometimes even localaties like whole towns) feel responsible somehow for the perceived failure, and support the behavior. It is not unlike some other "social" diseases like hoarding that are more common in the USA.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:54AM
There's a great Korean movie called Castaways on the Moon where the female half of the love story is a shut-in. She made her living from her blog about fashion, which was completely fabricated since she never left the closet she hid in. If you liked The Science of Sleep or The Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind you might enjoy it.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:57AM
Monetize a blog?! I'd rather die of shame.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @03:02PM
You too can earn $4000 per month from home!
All you need is a home computer!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:43AM
Saw it.
I watch a lot of new wave korean cinema.
Didn't really like it all that much.
Seemed like the writer was trying to make a larger metaphorical point, but it never really came through.
I did think the guy living on the island was just funny in its own right though.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:11PM
I thought it was a nice counterpoint to Oldboy and The Man from Nowhere (which I also enjoyed). I have been looking for another Korean anime like Wonderful Days/Sky Blue for a while, so any recs you might have would be appreciated.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:55PM
The Wikipedia article says that they are from middle-class or up and their parents take care of them. Lower income families are forced to kick their kids out.
There are also "parasite singles" that work for disposable income while their parents take care of everything else. This is supposed to be partially responsible for the increasing age at which people get married and lower birth rate.
(Score: 2) by captain normal on Friday September 09 2016, @11:19PM
Maybe they are all living in their Mom's basement hacking to code to conquer the world. Soon..."all your cloud belong to us!" We're doomed!
The Musk/Trump interview appears to have been hacked, but not a DDOS hack...more like A Distributed Denial of Reality.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @11:26PM
They're in prison hacking the warden's computer while daydreaming of being in mom's basement.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @11:41PM
Men don't get married because it is a bad deal.
In the past men married female children.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:28PM
Leaned something today. Phoenix is what they call "weebo".
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:38PM
TIL reddit is another site.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:51AM
Naw, not really. You could say I have Asian Fever (married to a Korean).
Now that I think about it, it would be kind of funny to have my kids bow to me and call me 'Otoh-sama.'
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @01:39AM
Know your slurs.
Its yellow fever for a white who likes asians.
And jungle fever for a white who likes blacks.
(Score: 2) by Yog-Yogguth on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:27AM
Just as long as you're aware that yellow fever [wikipedia.org] is an actual viral disease. 30000 die each year.
Walking around telling people you've got yellow fever will be misunderstood in most of the world :P
Bite harder Ouroboros, bite! tails.boum.org/ linux USB CD secure desktop IRC *crypt tor (not endorsements (XKeyScore))
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Saturday September 10 2016, @02:19PM
Yes, yes, and you might also call someone who's white but wants to be Asian, "egg." "Asian fever" is the more polite form of "yellow fever."
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @10:59PM
Ok, so how do they pay their bills?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @11:15PM
Daddy is a salaryman who was hired during the old days when salarymen got job security.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 09 2016, @11:36PM
No child brides, no lives.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:13AM
過労死
(Score: 2) by fishybell on Saturday September 10 2016, @04:05PM
TL;DR; [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:43AM
https://www.cs.duke.edu/brd/Music/Harmful/songlist/punk_solipsist.html [duke.edu]
Punk Solipsist, performed by Harmful if Swallowed
Music: Jim Davis
Lyrics: T. Zimmerman
No more talking no more drinking
No more fighting no more thinking
I'm a punk solipsist
None of you exist
Every gig's a solo every fuck's a wet dream
I'm a punk solipsist
None of you exist
......
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @12:54AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSfpSOBD30U [youtube.com]
Oh, it's just me, myself and I
Solo ride until I die
Cause I got me for life
(Got me for life, yeah)
Oh I don't need a hand to hold
Even when the night is cold
I got that fire in my soul
I don't need anything to get me through the night
Except the beat that's in my heart
Yeah, it's keeping me alive
(Keeps me alive)
I don't need anything to make me satisfied (you know)
Cause the music fills me good and it gets me every time
http://www.metrolyrics.com/me-myself-i-lyrics-g-eazy.html [metrolyrics.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @05:07PM
www.cs.duke.edu uses an invalid security certificate. The certificate is not trusted because the issuer certificate is unknown. The server might not be sending the appropriate intermediate certificates. An additional root certificate may need to be imported. Error code: SEC_ERROR_UNKNOWN_ISSUER
(Score: 2) by snufu on Saturday September 10 2016, @03:32AM
In Syria or Sudan?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 10 2016, @04:23AM
Dead.