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BBC News has a follow-up article to the circular airport runway proposal:
Last month we published a video arguing the case for circular runways at airports, as part of a series called World Hacks. It took off and went viral. The video has had more than 36 million views on Facebook and generated heated debate on social media - including within the aviation community. Many people are sceptical about the concept.
So we decided to hand-pick some of the top concerns and put them straight to the man proposing the idea: Dutch engineer Henk Hesselink. This is what he had to say.
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Circular Runways: Engineer Defends His Proposal
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The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(1)
(1)
Have you ever noticed that the people who are always trying to tell you
`there's a time for work and a time for play' never find the time for play?
(Score: 2) by pgc on Saturday April 22 2017, @07:50PM (8 children)
What did he have to say?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @07:57PM (1 child)
RTFA!!!
(Score: 2) by bart9h on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:27PM
NEVAR!!1!!!!!!!
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Scruffy Beard 2 on Saturday April 22 2017, @07:59PM
Many of the concerns can be addressed with automation.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:09PM
I have no background in this sort of thing, but my superficial understanding is that he didn't have any good replies, he just said "we know this may be a problem and we're thinking about it". to be honest, i think he would have been better off staying silent, now i actually believe he's stupid (before i thought he was just being naive).
(Score: 4, Funny) by cafebabe on Saturday April 22 2017, @09:31PM
Well, it was a circular argument.
1702845791×2
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @11:53PM
To paraphrase:
If you're wondering how they'll land the planes
And other science facts,
Then repeat to yourself, "It's just a concept
I should really just relax"
But if you want actual excerpts:
Either we put a simple form of ILS on each direction of the runway, or we can install a movable ILS-system that will move around the runway, for example on a rail-track . It is a bit far-fetched, I know.
We have been thinking about building offices and parking spaces under the runway and the remaining heat could be transferred to the runway, but this is an idea that will need further exploration.
If someone one hundred years ago would have said that we would be transporting as many passengers in aircraft as we would in trains, people may have thought , "a steam engine would never fit in an aircraft made of wood and ropes".
(Score: 4, Informative) by gringer on Sunday April 23 2017, @03:23AM (1 child)
Ask me about Sequencing DNA in front of Linus Torvalds [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Sunday April 23 2017, @05:47AM
My question was what happens when a gust of wind puts you fifty or a hundred yards short or long (not a problem if your runway is straight), missing the sweet spot for your landing speed.
If he doesn't address that, he can take his round thing and go home.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:03PM
Fuck it, only "innovation" gets funding.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:05PM (1 child)
n/t
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @02:36AM
Wheeee [youtube.com]
(Score: 1, Informative) by DaTrueDave on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:16PM (1 child)
But we'll never know what he had to say, because there's nothing after "here's what he had to say."
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @08:24PM
TFA is a myth. Open your eyes, sheeple!
(Score: 3, Funny) by DBCubix on Saturday April 22 2017, @09:15PM (2 children)
He provided a circular argument of we need circular runways because we need circular runways.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday April 23 2017, @02:13AM
Isn't it better, though, than providing a circular runaway, '56 or not?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: -1, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @02:27AM
Mod parent up.
Fuck you and your kindergarten-level clickbaits.
(Score: 2) by butthurt on Saturday April 22 2017, @09:51PM
nothing about "constantly changing crosswind on landing"
/comments.pl?sid=18720&cid=486267#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 22 2017, @10:10PM (2 children)
His fishbowl runway appears to have a varying slope from flat in the center to steep at the outside.
That says that a plane, over a range of speeds would tend to move to a sweet spot where there is no side load on the landing gear.
Faster would ride higher on the circle, slower lower.
Not much else seemed practical to me.
When asked about ice, he said maybe build buildings under and use excess heat to melt the ice.
The above story about a sweet spot begs the question of side loads getting to the spot.
Also, if a self centering runway is needed, build a straight one which is lower along the center line.
He says it won't happen for a long time, citing an example from 100 years ago.
This makes his study perfect for collecting research funds, given that he won't ever be held accountable for his ideas.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @12:50AM (1 child)
This type of banked track is often called "parabolic" -- it is used for some automotive test tracks where the higher lanes (steeper banking) are for faster speeds. The ultimate is the vertical banked Mercedes-Benz test track in Stuttgart-Untertürkheim
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8EuMPV6gg0 [youtube.com] Interesting bit starts about 1:20. I wonder how this was built...
Would have to be *much* wider for aircraft! 3D renders in tfa show a 3km circle -- if this is lap length (circumference), then it is similar to some of the larger oval race tracks. But instead of double file starts (and restarts as used in NASCAR), this would be wide enough to start a half dozen or more cars side-by-side.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @01:24PM
The stated goal of his plan is to deal with crosswinds.
Given a steady wind, there are 2 points where the wind aligns with the tangent of the circle.
In one case, if you manage to touch down exactly at one point, as you roll, the crosswind component will grow to push you up the circle.
Landing at the other, will push you down the circle.
The growth in crosswind should be gradual, but definitely not a hold what you've got landing.
For the pilot, these seem like a very active, fly till wheels stop, project.
To some extent all landings are like this.
Some more than others due to winds, visibility, lack of friction, and probably other things.
The question is, does this strange plan add or remove things from the pilot's plate?
First glance would say that it adds a lot. (As in crazy nuts to talk about.)
I wonder how hard it would be to setup X-plane to try and see if this is the actual case for a manual landing?
(Score: 1) by Deeo Kain on Sunday April 23 2017, @05:55PM (1 child)
The only superior landing track design is the elliptic one.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @06:05PM
> elliptic??
What sort of ellipse -- a long skinny one or a nearly round one?
Another option -- rather than configuring runways in an "X" arrangement (two long runways crossing near the terminal buildings), you could make them in a big square or rectangle. At the corners, use the same sort of banked turn as the circular proposal in tfa -- but do all the landing and taking off on the straight bits. Just means that instead of getting to the end of the runway, you roll out around the corner after the high speed part of the landing. When taking off, you start accelerating on one of the cross wind straights, make the corner at some middle speed then take off into the wind as usual.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday April 23 2017, @08:32PM
It's easier to draw a somewhat straight line that passes within a thin rectangle than to draw a line which then becomes a curved path that's completely within a specific ring ( Annulus ).
Now draw that line with a plane holding 300 passengers, with turbulent winds blowing across the curved banked runway (think of how wonderful the winds will be as they blow across that circular banked runway).
This retard wants the pilot to turn accurately at the most difficult parts of a flight. Most pilots could manage Kai Tak Airport, doesn't mean it was a better design than other airports.