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posted by takyon on Saturday October 14 2017, @12:49AM   Printer-friendly
from the proactive-data-recovery dept.

Last week, The Wall Street Journal dropped a bombshell when it reported that Russian government hackers located confidential National Security Agency material improperly stored on an employee's home computer with help from Kaspersky antivirus, which happened to be installed. On Tuesday, The New York Times and The Washington Post provided another shocker: the Russian hackers were caught in the act by spies from Israel, who were burrowed deep inside Kaspersky's corporate network around the time of the theft.

Ars Technica: How Kaspersky AV reportedly was caught helping Russian hackers steal NSA secrets

The New York Times: How Israel Caught Russian Hackers Scouring the World for U.S. Secrets

The Washington Post: Israel hacked Kaspersky, then tipped the NSA that its tools had been breached (archive)

Previously: Kaspersky Lab and Lax Contractor Blamed for Russian Acquisition of NSA Tools


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  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Saturday October 14 2017, @02:38AM (18 children)

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday October 14 2017, @02:38AM (#582149) Journal

    So, I'm a Cold War veteran. We were eyeball to eyeball with the Russ many times, from the Arctic to the mideast. We stared at each other over gunsights, on radar, in person with guns in our hands. "Russian" was almost synonymous with "boogeyman".

    But, today, what we are hearing from Washington is, "Oh, we KNOW the Russians are evil, because THEY DO THE SAME THINGS WE DO!!"

    FFS, people, it's well known that the NSA monitors just about everything digital in the United States, as well as around the world. Our government has it's thumb on the world's communications throat - right on the carotid artery of information. Nothing happens on the World Wide Spiderweb that those fat sucking spiders in Washington don't learn about.

    But, the Russians are evil, because they do the same thing.

    Someone is going to spout off, "But we're different because . . . "

    Well, go on, start convincing me. Work hard, and do a proper job of it. I'll do my best to be open minded here.

    Oh, wait. Some of you seriously believe that other AV software DOES NOT phone home? Oh, now that's hilarious.

    Anyway, back on point. Someone convince me that the US is somehow better than Russia, in regards to spying on everyone in the world. I'll spend the night at work, wondering who takes the challenge, and how good a job he/she is going to do. Until morning!

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  • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday October 14 2017, @02:49AM (1 child)

    by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Saturday October 14 2017, @02:49AM (#582152) Journal

    Remember how they used to tell us in school we're better than the Reds as a country because we don't do X Y and Z?

    --
    I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:35AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:35AM (#582171)

      Hint: I am now NOT living the life I want because doing so would compromise the reasons America was once great, and most importantly require voluntarily giving up my privacy for reasons far less than obtaining security clearance to enroll as part of the military industrial complex, which is just about the only reason one could sanely decide to forego their privacy.

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:01AM (6 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:01AM (#582159)

    Russia is our frenemy. Frequently they cause us trouble. Never mind if they are "evil" or not. A hurricane isn't evil, yet it can sure cause trouble.

    For the issue of how to deal with Russia, it really doesn't matter if "the US is somehow better than Russia" or not. It really doesn't matter if one country is more or less evil compared to the other. All it matters is that Russia can be a foe, and that this doesn't favor me.

    Yes, I'm going to fight for the home team. I damn well better. I live here. My kids live here. Our welfare is greatly impacted by the power of the USA relative to all other countries.

    That's it. That's the difference: "But we're different because THIS IS OUR HOME". Oh, perhaps there may be other reasons, but that is the one that counts.

    I'm not offended by Russians who hack us. They are fighting for their country, just as I fight for mine.

    Anybody unwilling to fight the Russians is undeserving to live in any country other than, obviously, Russia. People who don't support their country are dead weight at best.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Arik on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:07AM

      by Arik (4543) on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:07AM (#582161) Journal
      "Frequently they cause us trouble."

      This part appears to be not just false, but a blatant inversion of the truth.

      "Yes, I'm going to fight for the home team."

      Gul'dan thanks you.
      --
      If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Anal Pumpernickel on Saturday October 14 2017, @10:14AM (4 children)

      by Anal Pumpernickel (776) on Saturday October 14 2017, @10:14AM (#582233)

      I'd rather try to improve the country I live in, like by forcing the government to actually follow the highest law of the land. Right now, the US government is conducting unconstitutional democracy-destroying mass surveillance on the populace. Right now, we are fighting numerous unconstitutional (Congress did not declare them) and unjust (they are not wars of defense) wars overseas. The US government is violating people's freedoms by forbidding them from ingesting certain drugs, and it's violating the Constitution in numerous ways while doing so. Cops in the US often steal people's property and call it "asset forfeiture", in utter defiance of the Constitution. We increasingly resemble a police state as thuggish organizations like the TSA violate people's rights just so they can be allowed to board a plane, all in the name of safety. There are countless other issues impacting people's rights here, and this is all happening in the 'Give me liberty or give me death!' country. The US government is an enemy of (what is supposed to be) our constitutional form of government, and is a far greater threat to our freedoms than Russia could ever be.

      Keep in mind: You live in the US, so improving your government would also benefit you, your friends, and your family. Fighting Russia certainly is not the only way to do that, and it's definitely not sufficient and shouldn't even be the main priority.

      • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Saturday October 14 2017, @05:01PM (1 child)

        by DeathMonkey (1380) on Saturday October 14 2017, @05:01PM (#582332) Journal

        We have the ability to work on more than one thing at a time.

        • (Score: 2) by Anal Pumpernickel on Sunday October 15 2017, @01:15AM

          by Anal Pumpernickel (776) on Sunday October 15 2017, @01:15AM (#582465)

          I'm not even sure what to do about Russia. I have a better chance of changing my own government, and there are far greater benefits for doing so.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 15 2017, @06:38AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 15 2017, @06:38AM (#582565)

        It sounds like your objection to those things is that they are unconstitutional. We can amend the constitution.

        28. Congress shall provide for mass surveillance upon the populace.

        29. The president may wage war upon any entity, without restriction, solely at his discretion.

        30. Drugs and their precursors, and the use or sale or manufacture thereof, may be prohibited by any branch of government of any state or of the union.

        31. The rights reserved to the people by this constitution are not so reserved anywhere within a facility which supports the operation of aircraft.

        There you go. Get those into the constitution, and your complaint is resolved.

        • (Score: 2) by Anal Pumpernickel on Monday October 16 2017, @12:57AM

          by Anal Pumpernickel (776) on Monday October 16 2017, @12:57AM (#582852)

          It sounds like your objection to those things is that they are unconstitutional.

          Wrong. They're also deeply unethical. I would be opposed to them no matter what.

  • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:42AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @03:42AM (#582173)

    The word "evil" was not used.

    Anyway, the denial and whataboutism towards Russian activities is getting fucking old.

  • (Score: 3, Informative) by jelizondo on Saturday October 14 2017, @04:35AM (7 children)

    by jelizondo (653) Subscriber Badge on Saturday October 14 2017, @04:35AM (#582179) Journal

    Let’s just talk about Puerto Rico. Is Russia treating Crimea the same as the U.S. is dealing with Puerto Rico? Let’s talk about Guam. Is Russia treating Crimea the same as the U.S. deals with Guam?

    I’m not against your point, I want whoever wants to go against it to explain to me how the U.S. is better than Russia when dealing with ‘acquired’ territories.

    Now, let’s review history. In the last two centuries, how many times has Russia attacked a European country? How many times it has been attacked by European countries? (N.B. Lithuania, Estonia, Crimea, etc. are NOT in the European continent, at least geographically talking; France and Germany are indeed European.)

    Now how many times has the U.S. attacked other american countries in the last two centuries?

    Based on recent history, please explain why we should worry about Russia attacking Germany or France and spend billions of dollars preventing it and not spend the money preventing the U.S. from attacking (in the past 50 years), Cuba, Panama, Grenada and Nicaragua.

    I don't support Putin but making him our greatest enemy is stupid. China will eat our lunch while we worry about the Russian bear, who happens to be as corrupt and sleazy as any American politician and fully supports capitalism.

    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @04:59AM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @04:59AM (#582188)

      Suppose that Russia had never bothered any other country. They didn't just rip two chunks off of Georgia, invade the Ukraine, violate Baltic borders both land and sea, or any of the other crap that they've been up to. Suppose they only swiped secrets from the USA.

      Suppose the the USA had been up to more mischief. Suppose we grabbed the rest of that large island we share with Canada. Suppose we drilled sideways under Mexico to steal their oil. Suppose we were counterfeiting Russian currency like mad. Suppose we rigged up Tokyo's phone switch to listen in on all calls.

      And...?

      All US citizens still need to support the US. It's a duty and obligation. It is self-beneficial, and it benefits future generations. The situation is every country for itself. Being a winner is better than being a loser. You fight for the home team, because the success of the home team greatly impacts your life.

      If you'd rather support some other country, go there, and give up your US citizenship. If you stay in the US and undermine the ability of the US to gain advantage over other countries, then you belong in front of a firing squad.

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @07:48AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @07:48AM (#582206)

        I have to disagree.

        I love my homeland, my country, the United States. There is nothing in my nature that says I have to love my government, or any administration in charge of that government. In fact - careful reading of our constitution, and the various papers and letters penned by our founding fathers warns us NOT to love our government. The whole constitution was designed to protect us - you, me, all of us - FROM government.

        Long story short, it would be unpatriotic if you failed to love the people. It is also unpatriotic to support the government without question.

        If the current government were to be dissolved, and replaced with something new and different, our country, our people would still be the same. All of that is what we should love and support, not some corrupt government.

      • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @12:14PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @12:14PM (#582252)

        Jokes on you, buddy. I'm not allowed to leave the state, let alone the country, because I refuse to follow the rules of your so-called "home team." Give me a plane ticket and right of passage I'd be gone. Fuck the USA. Flat out!

    • (Score: 2, Informative) by pTamok on Saturday October 14 2017, @09:19AM

      by pTamok (3042) on Saturday October 14 2017, @09:19AM (#582224)

      Geographically, a major part of the the dividing line between Europe and Asia is the Ural mountains.

      The conventional boundary [wikipedia.org] between Europe and Asia is

      along the Turkish Straits, the Caucasus and the Urals (historically also north of the Caucasus, along the Kuma–Manych Depression or along the Don River)

      Crimea and Baltic states have always been placed geographically in Europe.

    • (Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @09:26AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 14 2017, @09:26AM (#582226)

      > Lithuania, Estonia, Crimea, etc. are NOT in the European continent

      Alternative geography.

    • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Saturday October 14 2017, @05:02PM (1 child)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Saturday October 14 2017, @05:02PM (#582333) Journal

      Let’s just talk about Puerto Rico. Is Russia treating Crimea the same as the U.S. is dealing with Puerto Rico?

      When was the last time we invaded and occupied Puerto Rico?

      • (Score: 2) by jelizondo on Saturday October 14 2017, @10:53PM

        by jelizondo (653) Subscriber Badge on Saturday October 14 2017, @10:53PM (#582430) Journal

        On July 25, 1898, during the Spanish–American War, the U.S. invaded Puerto Rico [wikipedia.org]

        The Spanish had already granted autonomy to Puerto Rico when the U.S. decided it was valuable as a naval station and to get rid of the Spanish presence. No one asked if the puertoricans wanted to be 'liberated' from Spain to become second class citizens of the U.S.