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Back in December, we reported on the Trump administration's proposed changes to tip-pooling regulations that would allow employers to pocket servers' tips as long as the employees continue to make minimum wage. That's right: Employers could take servers' tips and just dole out the minimum wage. But wait, it gets worse!
Turns out, the Department Of Labor knew how crappy this would make life for restaurant employees. This Bloomberg Law article, citing sources within the agency, reveals that the Department Of Labor knowingly buried its own data that showed restaurant workers would lose billions of dollars in gratuities under the new proposal.
Source: https://thetakeout.com/proposed-tip-pooling-law-is-so-bad-for-workers-the-gove-1822664111
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Virindi on Tuesday February 06 2018, @03:30PM (17 children)
Why should it be illegal for an employer to have any tip policy they please?
Would implementing a "shared pool" system not cause good waitstaff to head to employers who do not have such a system, leaving the greedy owner with the worst employees?
If ensuring fair compensation only occurs because the government mandates it, then employees are already screwed. In that case, the root imbalance that gives the employers too much bargaining power is what should be addressed, rather than some piecemeal case by case regulation.
A better piecemeal idea (if you must) towards this might be mandatory notification. When you go into a restaurant, they would have to tell you that tips do not go to your waiter....since leading you to believe the waiter is getting the tip and then taking it is essentially fraudulent.
Honestly, this seems like it should be the case anyway. The 'free market' works best when people have information, so if you want the 'market' to help solve your problems you need to prevent people from gaming it by intentionally keeping their behavior hidden.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by nitehawk214 on Tuesday February 06 2018, @03:56PM (4 children)
Then the employer just fires anyone that taddles on them for stealing tips. Your invisible hand of the market only jacks off the owners while fisting the workers. (how's that for a free market analogy?)
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 1) by redneckmother on Tuesday February 06 2018, @04:27PM (2 children)
I loved the analogy. May I quote you?
Mas cerveza por favor.
(Score: 1) by nitehawk214 on Tuesday February 06 2018, @05:22PM (1 child)
Sure, but I can't possibly be the first person to think of it.
There are a lot of dirty minds on the internet.
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 1, Redundant) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday February 06 2018, @11:59PM
Please, say it isn't so! You made that up, didn't you? :^)
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(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @05:42PM
nobody said anything about taddling to some "authority". he said FREE! that means you leave like a free person would do, not whine to some Grand Overseer slug.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by sjames on Tuesday February 06 2018, @04:10PM (8 children)
Because a tip is something I choose to give to the waiter/waitress personally. I didn't give it to the restaurant, it's owner, or anyone else there. It is MY money to give or not to anyone I choose. If the person I want to tip isn't allowed to keep it, it will stay in my pocket or I'll give it to them under the table.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @06:19PM (1 child)
Correction: a tip is something you're socially pressured into giving to the waiter/waitress because people in your country are OK with the employer not paying the staff a living wage.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @11:02PM
Thank you for your opinion, Mr. Pink [youtube.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @07:32PM (5 children)
but at many places its not just the waitress that dips into that money--the bus boy, the cook, other waitstaff... all get a part of that.
there are places that the tip goes right to the waitperson, but many others divide that up among the people responsible to make the food get it to the table and ensure your needs are met when the wait person is waiting on other people, so you don't have to wait for the waiter--like for the person that often refills the water. there is no water waiter!
You are allowed to do as you want with the money, sure, but just remember it doesnt always get split up the way you might expect unless you specifically hand it to the wait person and say this is for them.
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Tuesday February 06 2018, @08:32PM (3 children)
I have never really understood this mentality.
I interact with the wait staff at a restaurant, but really, it's the kitchen staff that ensure my meal is tasty and not full of salmonella or other bacteria. It's the kitchen staff that are most important for my enjoyment of a meal.
Why tip the wait staff when the kitchen staff cooked a stellar meal?
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @10:00PM
The waitstaff are paid 3 dollars an hour and the kitchen staff 9? That's a damn good reason right there, jackhole.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 07 2018, @04:19AM (1 child)
Because all the others in the US get the 'full' minimum wage - wait staff don't.
(Score: 2) by NewNic on Thursday February 08 2018, @01:35AM
Where I live the wait staff get full minimum wage.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday February 07 2018, @12:06AM
Uhhhh - not in my experience. I grew up in Pennsylvania. Labor law, at that time, defined "cook" duties as being separate and distinct from any other duties in a restaurant. And, cooks made better than minimum wage, even in a fast food dump. In real restaurants, cooks were actually paid pretty well. Not great, but pretty well. Cooks never got any part of any tips - period. Bus staff? Mmmmm - wait staff often times considered it a promotion to get a bus job. Bus staff wasn't paid as well as a cook, naturally enough, but they were paid better than waiters/witresses. Restaurants without separate bus staff are bussed by the wait staff, of course.
I think it fair to say that if you intended a tip to go to the wait staff, you could safely leave that money on the table, and the waiter would get it. At least, up until the time that the IRS determined that the manager/owner should collect all the tips and share/tax them "equally".
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(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Tuesday February 06 2018, @04:18PM
Why should I not be able to give a gift without someone else stealing it?
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @04:58PM (1 child)
"Why should it be illegal for an employer to have any tip policy they please?"
Fine, so long as it is absolutely clear what that policy is and waiters are both allowed and required to explain the tipping policy when you sit down. Because I'm sure if people are told "Good evening sir, typically a tip of 20% is expected. Additionally the owner pockets all the tips and just pays us minimum wage." you'll see far fewer actual tips being left. Policies like that would normally never be advertised, and I wouldn't be surprised if owners would fire any waiter/waitress revealing it to customers.
I expect tips I do leave to be retained by the waiter or pooled among the staff. If the owner is stealing it (Let's not mince words. That's exactly what's happening.) then you had better believe I won't be bothering to leave a tip, and the owner would be lucky if I even step foot in the restaurant if any pressure whatsoever is made to give a tip in those situations.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 06 2018, @05:45PM
and that's called theft by fraud and is actually in the legitimate purview of government to prosecute.