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Verizon officials were contrite and apologetic during a California State Assembly committee hearing that was convened Friday to examine mobile Internet throttling experienced by firefighters during recent blazes. "We all make mistakes from time to time, the true measure of leadership is how soon we admit it, own it," Rudy Reyes told the Select Committee on Natural Disaster, Response, Recovery, and Rebuilding after reading from a statement that the company released hours earlier.
In that statement, Verizon said it would be introducing a "new plan" with truly unlimited data and "priority access" for first responders nationwide. "As of yesterday, we removed all speed cap restrictions for first responders on the West Coast and in Hawaii to support current firefighting and Hurricane Lane efforts," the company said. "Further, in the event of another disaster, Verizon will lift restrictions on public safety customers, providing full network access."
The executives spoke shortly after hearing from Santa Clara County Fire Chief Tony Bowden who said that his agency had experienced similar throttling in December 2017. The Santa Clara department had tried to address it with the Verizon accounts manager at the time.
See also: Verizon stops throttling more firefighters, plans unlimited data "with no caps"
California State Assembly plans hearing on Verizon throttling of firefighters' data
Previously on SN: Verizon Throttled Fire Department's "Unlimited" Data During California Wildfire
(Score: 3, Insightful) by bzipitidoo on Saturday August 25 2018, @06:38PM (5 children)
Not having emergency communication suddenly throttled is one big reason why network neutrality is a good idea. I realize this is more about data caps, and it might seem contrary to the thought that if anyone should have priority, it is emergency services. However, it is not always obvious how important a communication is. By assuring reasonable speed and quality for all communication, we make that problem moot.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @07:59PM (3 children)
In an emergency situation, cell networks get SWAMPED with traffic as everyone in the area calls out for help, and everyone who knows anyone in the area calls in for information.
I would much prefer it if the networks give priority access to emergency responders in such a situation. But that's not a very "neutral" thing to do.
(Score: 1) by Acabatag on Saturday August 25 2018, @09:54PM (1 child)
Indeed. If Net Neutrality were in force, the carriers would be prohibited from giving 'priority access' to certain users. Isn't that what NN is all about?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @10:26PM
No. NN is primarily about preventing carriers from preferring one service provider's traffic over another. Essentially, trying to prevent monopoly communication providers using their position as a gatekeeper to manipulate competition in the market for internet services.
Joe Bob paying more and getting a better service than Billy Bob is considered normal and acceptable. But when either of the Bobs try to access OurTube's service, and their carrier provides an inferior connection than to MyTube's services, that's when things start getting NN-questionable.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday August 27 2018, @06:08PM
It is available to cellular services to provide for voice calls. [fcc.gov] I mean very available. [dhs.gov]Very, very available. [verizon.com]
Though I'll acknowledge data services are different.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 26 2018, @07:48AM
Verizon: "Sorry. (that we got caught)."
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Saturday August 25 2018, @06:59PM (8 children)
If you aren't a douche, you never have to apologize for being a douche. Having data caps on ANY "unlimited" plan is a douche move. Build out the infrastructure, assholes! Build it out, and sell genuine "unlimited" data plans. You may offer less expensive plans, with caps. But that word "unlimited" should mean what it says.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @07:11PM
Or... If your (mobile data providers) plan is not really "unlimited", then don't call it "unlimited".
If it is "full speed for first 20 gig, then throttled to 56k" then just be honest and call it a 20G/56k plan.
Of course, "honesty" and "marketing" don't fit well together most days.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by RS3 on Saturday August 25 2018, @07:44PM (6 children)
I'm in a heavy Verizon area and I'm pretty sure they have much more infrastructure / capacity available. They just want you to pay more. You know, like crippleware- you pay and it works better but it's the same .exe.
I know this won't be popular with many here, but I think Internet usage is too important (becoming critical) and needs to be run more like a utility, not entertainment. But unlike most government-run things, it needs to be open to citizen watchdogs.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:17PM (4 children)
Absolutely.
I'm in an urban area in a big city, closeby a major university. My phone reception sucks, and total dropouts are frequent. When I called my phone company to bitch and moan, they acknowledged that there was a "problem" with that area and that they would be willing (for free) to install a repeater in my home, with the stipulation that it always be connected to my internet connection. I told them to go fuck themselves, and when I have to make an important call I drive a mile away and take that call in the parking lot of some randomly-chosen business.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Saturday August 25 2018, @09:00PM (2 children)
For years I held off on getting a cell phone for that very reason. I wasn't aware that Internet connected repeaters were available. I was thinking of buying an RF one.
Why don't you want an Internet-connected repeater?
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Sunday August 26 2018, @06:44AM (1 child)
Just a guess, as I had not heard of such either, but maybe because it would burn through your home service plan? I somehow doubt it would be for a single number only.
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Monday August 27 2018, @12:35AM
Too lazy to run the numbers, but generally digitized voice is not much load. They (AT&T, etc.) started doing it in the 1960s. Too lazy to look it up but I'm pretty sure they used a 64Kbit / second "pipe" for each voice line, so only 8KB / S data rate. Yes, it adds up but hopefully people don't talk 24/7!
I was thinking (assuming) the aforementioned repeater was an RF repeater but needed an Internet connection, and EF is worried it's spying on him, and I don't blame him.
That said there are lots of IP phone options- I know someone who bought a "Magic Jack" years ago and used it and liked it. I think he moved it to some kind of google IP virtual phone or something. There's good old Vonage, etc...
Again, I haven't done a ton of research but here's one and I don't see an Ethernet / Internet connection: https://www.ebay.com/itm/850-1900MHz-2G-3G-4G-Cell-Phone-Signal-Booster-Mobile-Repeater-Kit-AT-T-Verizon-/153052585429 [ebay.com]
I'm not sure if these pass GSM/CDMA/LTE data- some say "voice only". Maybe the one the EF's provider has does RF for voice, and Internet connection for data... at which point you'd use WiFi... More research needed...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 26 2018, @02:05AM
You're still sounding stupid.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @10:37PM
They just want you to pay more
I have been in the meetings. Yes. That is it.
When AT&T was charging 30 a month for unlimited they wanted to charge 50 a month for 10MB. Their reasoning? "Our network is better" Yes, they are that clueless.
The incumbents have already carved us up. 'net neutrality' is a farce the ISPs and the big site providers are playing us to make sure we do not properly fix the issue. Which is one of who owns the 'last mile' and who can connect to it. Solve that little gem and the whole issue goes away. Instead they want to insure they get 'free internet' and we pick up the tab on both ends.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by SomeGuy on Saturday August 25 2018, @07:44PM (4 children)
From the linked article:
"Verizon also said it "made a mistake in how we communicated with our customer about the terms of its plan." The fire department was using an "unlimited" plan that got throttled after 25GB of usage each month."
Yeeeeaaaa. A mistake. Sure. So that is what they are calling outright lies these days.
Just a thought though, somewhere along the line these agencies agreed to verizions terms, possibly knowing what they really offered buried in the fine print.
Most consumers have long since known that any claims of "unlimited" are absolute %100 bullshit. The very meaning of the word has been perverted to the point it should be changed in the dictionary.
un·lim·it·ed/ˌənˈlimidəd/
adjective
not limited or restricted in terms of number, quantity, or extent - up to 25GB.
It is good to see the government call these assholes out on it, but I'm sure it won't change anything except sign the agencies up for an even more expensive plan.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:57PM
We need to see more criminal investigations and penalties for this corporate game playing (LYING). I just wish I understood why the govt. doesn't crack down more.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by LoRdTAW on Saturday August 25 2018, @10:32PM (2 children)
Savvy customers know it's bullshit. Clueless people in purchasing don't know or don't care.
My take on this whole debacle? It's on the fire department's administration for not verifying what unlimited means. When you purchase something, you do your homework. You make sure what you are buying meets all of your specs and requirements. You also talk to the vendor and verify those needs and even have lawyers go over fine print if necessary.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday August 26 2018, @01:59AM (1 child)
Truth in advertising is an important part of a functional market. Which common English words do you suggest we check on next to see if the apparently English language advertising is actually English?
"Unlimited" has a meaning. Limited after 25GB isn't it.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Sunday August 26 2018, @02:09PM
No, I agree. It is bullshit. I hope this shines a brighter light on the bullshit lie that is unlimited. But lets be honest here, we've known that was bullshit for years. Someone should have done better research.
(Score: 2) by Whoever on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:11PM (2 children)
This is a clear case of gouging during an emergency.
The fire department were paying for a plan that presumably worked for them under normal conditions. This was an emergency and there was a sudden need for more monthly bandwidth. Verizon used this as an opportunity to charge more. That's pretty clearly price gouging.
Verizon should have responded by removing the throttling, then, when the emergency was over and the fire department wasn't in immediate need, negotiating for a price increase.
(Score: 2) by wonkey_monkey on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:42PM (1 child)
Verizon would have done this, automatically, to any customer under the same usage conditions. The fact that there were fires going on had no bearing on it. No-one decided to throttle because there was an emergency.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @10:40PM
The product codes applied to their account would have assured it. That is the way the system works. They are trying to do perfect price discrimination. Which is pay what you feel you can and get particular levels of service. When the reality is the network is *very* robust. They really do have one of the best ones. But they charge as if they have a couple of tin cans and some string between it and upgrading would cost a fortune. The 'dirty secret' is that is a sunk cost paid for 10+ years ago.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:26PM (1 child)
Outside of emergency, am sure te 20gb gets all used up dousing fires on pornhub and chillirecipies togo.com ;)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 25 2018, @09:11PM
Likely during the emergency too.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by crb3 on Saturday August 25 2018, @08:54PM (3 children)
"How much of your infrastructure was burnt down? Well, sorry, but we had a bad case of throttling -- those alerts must have been in the dropped packets. And, by the way, since that burn reduced your coverage so much, we've had to switch to ATT."
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Acabatag on Saturday August 25 2018, @10:03PM (2 children)
This whole story smells more and more like a hit-piece on Verizon.
I have never been a Verizon customer so I feel no rage at them for any reason.
The term 'Unlimited' with Internet access has always been dubious and subject to interpretation.
A lot of the raging on the topic in this thread is by people making the generic rant about 'Unlimited.' The marketing folk are never going to give up their distorted use of the word, but it just seems silly for us to rage about that fact.
(Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday August 26 2018, @02:01AM
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(Score: 2) by RS3 on Sunday August 26 2018, @02:26AM
Sorry, I don't mean to troll or flamebait, just expressing my personal experience with Verizon.
I am and have been a Verizon customer for an absurd number of years. They suck. Their reps are incredibly rude. It's exactly what you expect from a very profitable near monopoly. A few years ago I (finally) gave up my landline. They were raising the price at an insane rate, and an absolutely minimal useless landline cost more than an unlimited talk and good data cell phone plan. I'm in a very weak cell area or I'd have done it sooner. When I told them I was cancelling, they acted all sorry and wanted to know why and what they could do to keep me. I said you've raised the price too much and they said "we're charging the federally allowed amount". Yes, the amount you lobby for. Incredibly profitable company, which means I was paying more than the actual cost of the phone. In my humble opinion, if a company is a monopoly like power, phone, water, sewer, Internet, etc., it should be mandated to be non-profit with fully open accounting books.
And that's just the landline rant. I won't get started about how horrible they are as an ISP, both home and business.
And yes, I'll be switching to Comcast soon- currently the lesser of evils.
(Score: 2) by shortscreen on Sunday August 26 2018, @07:46AM (2 children)
What is the fire department doing with this mobile data? Would lack of connectivity hinder them from doing their job if there was a fire in an area with no service or a power outage? Or are they just using it to post videos on social media of shit burning?
(Score: 2) by martyb on Sunday August 26 2018, @09:47AM
Wit is intellect, dancing.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Magic Oddball on Sunday August 26 2018, @10:50AM
According to what I've read in the local paper, firefighting crews dealing with wildfires use live 'document-based' programs to keep track of the fire (where it has been, where it's going, factors affecting it), where different crews/resources are currently at, and to generally coordinate everything. It involves a heavy enough volume of data that the throttling rendered the software almost useless.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 26 2018, @10:04AM
It's "an limited" plan.