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Normally I don't like to talk about items that are going on in different US States than the one that I live in, but if something like this passes in Virginia I see no reason why it would not also pass in Oregon.
A BILL to amend and reenact §§ 16.1-77, 18.2-73, 18.2-74, 18.2-76, and 32.1-127 of the Code of Virginia, relating to abortions; eliminate certain requirements.
Link to the bill:
http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?191+ful+HB2491
I found the changes and how they could be applied very interesting.
Notwithstanding any of the provisions of § 18.2-71 and in addition to the provisions of § 18.2-72, it shall be lawful for any physician licensed by the Board of Medicine to practice medicine and surgery, to terminate or attempt to terminate a human pregnancy or aid or assist in the termination of a human pregnancy by performing an abortion or causing a miscarriage on any woman during the second trimester of pregnancy and prior to the third trimester of pregnancy provided such procedure is performed in a hospital licensed by the State Department of Health or operated by the Department of Behavioral Health and Developmental Services.
(b) 2. The physician and two consulting physicians certify certifies and so enter enters in the hospital record of the woman, that in their the physician's medical opinion, based upon their the physician's best clinical judgment, the continuation of the pregnancy is likely to result in the death of the woman or substantially and irremediably impair the mental or physical health of the woman.
(c) 3. Measures for life support for the product of such abortion or miscarriage must shall be available and utilized if there is any clearly visible evidence of viability.
21. Shall require that each hospital that is equipped to provide life-sustaining treatment shall develop a policy governing determination of the medical and ethical appropriateness of proposed medical care, which shall include (i) a process for obtaining a second opinion regarding the medical and ethical appropriateness of proposed medical care in cases in which a physician has determined proposed care to be medically or ethically inappropriate; (ii) provisions for review of the determination that proposed medical care is medically or ethically inappropriate by an interdisciplinary medical review committee and a determination by the interdisciplinary medical review committee regarding the medical and ethical appropriateness of the proposed health care; and (iii) requirements for a written explanation of the decision reached by the interdisciplinary medical review committee, which shall be included in the patient's medical record. Such policy shall ensure that the patient, his agent, or the person authorized to make medical decisions pursuant to § 54.1-2986 (a) are informed of the patient's right to obtain his medical record and to obtain an independent medical opinion and (b) afforded reasonable opportunity to participate in the medical review committee meeting. Nothing in such policy shall prevent the patient, his agent, or the person authorized to make medical decisions pursuant to § 54.1-2986 from obtaining legal counsel to represent the patient or from seeking other remedies available at law, including seeking court review, provided that the patient, his agent, or the person authorized to make medical decisions pursuant to § 54.1-2986, or legal counsel provides written notice to the chief executive officer of the hospital within 14 days of the date on which the physician's determination that proposed medical treatment is medically or ethically inappropriate is documented in the patient's medical record;
Some key portions from the legislation are above, I neglected to bring in the stricken language about women needing ultrasounds and similar requirements because I think that is a separate issue.
https://freebeacon.com/issues/virginia-dems-attempt-to-pass-bill-allowing-abortions-up-to-40-weeks/ includes a video from the legislative proceedings with questions being asked of the bills sponsor Delegate Kathy Tran.
During Democratic Delegate Kathy Tran's presentation of the bill on Tuesday, Majority Leader Todd Gilbert (R.) asked her about the full extent of the bill's leniency.
"How late in the third trimester could a physician perform an abortion if he indicated that it would impair the mental health of the woman?" Gilbert asked.
"Or physical health," Tran said.
"Okay," Gilbert replied. "I'm talking about the mental health."
"I mean, through the third trimester," Tran said. "The third trimester goes up to 40 weeks."
"Okay, but to the end of the third trimester?" Gilbert asked.
"Yup, I don't think we have a limit in the bill," Tran said.
"Where it's obvious that a woman is about to give birth, she has physical signs that she's about to give birth, would that still be a point at which she could request an abortion if she was so certified?" Gilbert asked. "She's dilating."
Tran replied that was a decision the woman and her doctor would have to make before choosing to have an abortion. Gilbert asked specifically if the measure would allow for abortion right before birth.
"My bill would allow that, yes," Tran said.
https://freebeacon.com/issues/virginia-dems-attempt-to-pass-bill-allowing-abortions-up-to-40-weeks/ has a video of Virginia Governor Ralph Northam being interviewed about the subject. The Governor says that if the woman so wanted an abortion and was certified
So in this particular example, if a mother is in labor I can tell you exactly what would happen. The infant would be delivered, the infant would be kept comfortable, the infant would be resuscitated if thats what the mother and the family desired, and then a discussion would ensue between the physicians and the mother.
How can there be any discussion about this after the baby is already born?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 31 2019, @01:09PM (15 children)
There is no right to reside in someone else's body to keep yourself alive, so even if the fetus/baby has human rights, it makes no difference. So, women should be able to terminate the pregnancy at any point and for any reason.
Point out that abortions in the later stages of pregnancy are rare and overwhelmingly for medical reasons, but also don't forget that fundamental principle. Too many people use flimsy arguments against forced-birthers.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Friday February 01 2019, @07:41PM (14 children)
Strong agree.
However the abortion rulebook as we know it will probably change once artificial wombs enter the picture. Suddenly, people who want children will choose to use artificial wombs instead of carrying children themselves (in the case of women, or possibly someone with a uterus implant), or turning to a surrogate.
In that scenario, anyone going the natural route could probably continue to get an abortion at any time. Because surgery to remove the fetus and put it in an artificial womb would still pose a risk of infection/etc. to the mother.
But if the embryo is grown in an artificial womb from the start, then there is no reason to abort other than a medical issue affecting the fetus. Maybe you could get hit with a negligent homicide charge for accidentally pulling the plug or otherwise failing to maintain the artificial womb (loading the nutrient tank or whatever).
If it can be proven that an artificial womb results in less birth defects (due to weird hormone fluctuations, or unavoidable environmental poisons encountered by mothers), maybe it will be considered unethical to not use IVF + an artificial womb. Not to mention that abortions on a whim could be effectively banned.
I think all of this will go down within 20 years or so. Better start thinking about it now.
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(Score: 1) by Sulla on Friday February 01 2019, @10:17PM (13 children)
Best to start investing in companies making hormones to simulate pregnancy for the purpose of allowing breastfeeding. Either that or formula stock.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Saturday February 02 2019, @03:57AM
Hey, Sulla - it's far too late for me to look this up tonight - gotta go to work.
Vermont is supposed to be considering a bill that makes abortion a "god given right" or some such shit, "at any time, for any reason, by any means". No regulation of abortion at all, right up to the last day. I've not heard that they are considering post-partem abortion, but that may be in there too. But, the "god give right" nonsense is worthy of note. Woman demands, state supplies, end of story.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Saturday February 02 2019, @05:28PM (4 children)
Got it - it's "fundamental right".
https://christiannews.net/2019/02/01/vermont-bill-proclaims-fundamental-right-to-abortion-but-no-independent-rights-for-unborn/ [christiannews.net]
And, note the "troll" mod on my previous post.
PDF of the bill - https://legislature.vermont.gov/Documents/2020/Docs/BILLS/H-0057/H-0057%20As%20Introduced.pdf [vermont.gov]
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Sulla on Saturday February 02 2019, @11:34PM
Godless commies like rights to be given by man so they can be revoked. China calls them "western rights" so they can not give them to their own people. Thing with god given rights, regardless of if you believe in god, is that they cannot be revoked. This is what the commies hate the most, is that they cannot take away your right to life and liberty.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 2) by urza9814 on Monday February 04 2019, @06:04PM (2 children)
Seems perfectly reasonable to me...the alternative is to argue that a parasite has more right to your body than you do yourself. I really don't understand how such an absurd line of reasoning is still being debated in freakin' 2019...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @10:18PM (1 child)
Because its only a parasite when it comes to whether or not the mother wants it but not a choice when she and that parasite is murdered. Either its just one count of murder and the parasite is a parasite or its a kid and its two counts of murder. Can't have both.
(Score: 1) by Sulla on Thursday February 07 2019, @10:00PM
New York law resolved this, killing a pregnant woman at any stage of pregnancy is only one count of murder.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 2) by dry on Sunday February 03 2019, @05:19AM (6 children)
From what I was reading when the wife was pregnant, just lots of sucking is enough to trigger milk production, though probably not enough. This is even true with men.
(Score: 1) by Sulla on Sunday February 03 2019, @06:26PM (1 child)
Might be possible? With my twins my wife wasn't producing enough milk at first and neither boy was willing to latch long enough to get her to start producing even with all the pregnancy hormones. We ended up needing to use doner milk and formula.I guess though its a way to only get the fittest to survive. I dont know how normal this is, as they say everything bad that happens to women during/post pregnancy is normal to try and keep them from getting post-pardum depression.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 2) by dry on Sunday February 03 2019, @09:09PM
My wife started slow, I think it is normal. In her case, it didn't take long before she was waking up the boy to feed him. As she said, she now understands why the cows line up to be milked. Twins would be that more demanding, unless like my nieces, little itty things at birth.
(Score: 2) by takyon on Sunday February 03 2019, @06:33PM (3 children)
It's a good excuse to start sucking on nipples, at least.
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(Score: 2) by dry on Sunday February 03 2019, @09:52PM (2 children)
Who needs an excuse? OTOH, not being a milk person, I missed sucking on the nipple for that year or so.
(Score: 1) by Sulla on Monday February 04 2019, @10:22PM (1 child)
-1 Sad!
Thats a shame. I have been enjoying it to the fullest extent possible.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 2) by dry on Monday February 04 2019, @10:28PM
Each to their own.