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In 1987, a man, a woman, and their daughter attended a Tchaikovsky concert at the Hollywood Bowl. The most notable thing about their outing, all these years later, is something that actually wasn't the least bit unusual: The two women waited in an interminably long line for the bathroom, while the man did not.
What separates their uncomfortable experience from those of innumerable others is that the man in their party was a California state senator. After witnessing just how long his family members had to wait, he introduced legislation to guarantee the state's women more toilets.
In the three decades since, dozens of cities and states have joined the cause of "potty parity," the somewhat trivializing nickname for the goal of giving men and women equal access to public toilets. These legislative efforts, along with changes to plumbing codes that altered the ratio of men's to women's toilets, have certainly helped imbalances in wait times, but they haven't come close to resolving them.
"It still remains a huge problem today, overall," says Kathryn Anthony, an architecture professor at the University of Illinois who has studied the issue for more than a decade. The issue persists for many reasons: the exigencies of real estate, the building codes that govern construction, and, of course, sexism.
Source: https://www.theatlantic.com/family/archive/2019/01/women-men-bathroom-lines-wait/580993/
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Captival on Sunday February 03 2019, @11:37PM (10 children)
And once again, 'equality' is rejected when the outcome isn't what the perpetual victims desire.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 03 2019, @11:48PM (2 children)
The end result will be longer lines for men rather than shorter for women, possibly by making bathrooms unisex.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 03 2019, @11:57PM (1 child)
Another possibility proposed in the article is "communal grooming".
(Score: 3, Funny) by Hyper on Monday February 04 2019, @08:48AM
Want this in a Heinlein book? In California even? And still the sexes stayed on their own side of the washroom?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:17AM (2 children)
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @02:32AM
You should have highlighted California.
(Score: 1) by Sulla on Monday February 04 2019, @09:13AM
Good point. As a man he should have continued to ignore the issue rather than impose his manhood by trying to tell women how things should be.
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 4, Touché) by driverless on Monday February 04 2019, @01:46AM
... and the fact that men can go for a leak without having to take an entire support group with them. That's probably the biggest factor.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:13AM
How is it equality that men wait 0 minutes and women wait 30 minutes?
Have you no mother, no sister, no girl friend, no daughter?
People like you make me sick.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @10:49AM
Well, this is the difference between equality and equity
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday February 04 2019, @07:10PM
I only see one person acting like a victim in this thread....
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 03 2019, @11:57PM (12 children)
Root cause: what makes women require more time in using the potty? Without addressing it, everything else is just workaround.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:06AM (4 children)
This was discovered in the 1980s according to TFA. It is because: "they have to enter a stall to pee, but also because they menstruate."
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:10AM (2 children)
Well, address that instead and solve the problem once and for all.
We're in the 21st century now, isn't that what CRISPR is all about?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:44AM (1 child)
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/12/16/boys-can-have-periods-schoolchildren-taught-latest-victory-transgender/ [telegraph.co.uk]
(Score: 1, Troll) by realDonaldTrump on Monday February 04 2019, @01:37AM
The Astrology, for so long we had 7 planets. The 6 above. And 1 below. Easy. Then they came up with, oh let's try 8 or 9. And it was too much. Nobody could remember them all. Especially not the children. Big problem for the children, they learned the 7. Then when it's time for the Quiz, "oh, what are the 9 Planets?" So many kids crying over that one. So many killing themselves. So the folks that decide said it's too much, they said "we go back to 8, for the kids' sake." We went back to 8, the kids are happy, right? WRONG! Because they learned about the girls and the boys. Where, you're either a boy or a girl. And you don't have to pick, the grown ups picked that one for you. Very simple. But now they're doing the girl, the boy, the girl to boy, the boy to girl, the in between. So many. And it's too many for the children. They learned the 2, now it's very complicated. Too much for their young & tiny Brains. To where, they don't know what restroom to go to. They're standing there, trying to hold it in. And maybe they can hold it in. Or maybe they can't. Bad situation. So I made it much simpler for them. I said, let them go by what they were born as. You're born a girl, you go to the Girls Room. Your born a boy, Boys Room. Very simple. Very easy. Life is full of so many questions. Like, who are my Parents? Am I a girl or a boy? Where was I born? When was my Birth Day? Or, do I have children? How many boys and how many girls? How old are they? Are they American, can they be President (legally)? And, what are their names? Don't worry, folks. A very special Document answers all our questions -- Birth Certificate. We love Birth Certificate!!!
(Score: 3, Funny) by Phoenix666 on Monday February 04 2019, @07:57PM
Nonsense. The trouble is women are peeing wrong. They ought to train themselves to pee standing up and shake when they're done, the way men do.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:24AM (1 child)
Let's run a mental model for number 1:
Guy: unzips, flops it out, hoses down the trough, back in, zip up, (optional: thinks about washing his hands but there's a queue for the one remaining working hand dryer so decides not to), waits for someone to open the door so he doesn't have to touch the handle, clocks out
Chick: waits, opens door, looks at seat, cleans seat, takes down/up a bunch of interlocked articles of clothing, crouches over the seat (probably hovering in a horse stance as after spending 30 seconds trying to clean the seat gave up), may have to remove sanitary pads, sprays the bowl, pat dry off to avoid wet spot 'down below', possibly replaces sanitary pad, pulls clothing back into position, adjusts clothing back into place, does a quick private makeup and hair check with compact/mirror, checks phone for messages, final dress check to make sure no wet spot 'down below', flushes toilet, opens door, [at this point, the bottle neck is over, so anything following adds to latency, but doesn't affect overall throughput], washes hands, dries hands, one last check in full size mirror, clocks out
(Score: 4, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Monday February 04 2019, @06:45PM
That fact that getting the urine into the urinal successfully is completely optional also helps.
(Score: 2) by McGruber on Monday February 04 2019, @12:27AM (3 children)
Men will piss into an open trough. Women won't.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:37AM
Uh... Most women won't.
(Score: 3, Informative) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @01:09AM
We prefer trees or snow but those aren't practical indoors.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by wisnoskij on Monday February 04 2019, @02:55PM
I think everyone pisses in troughs in Japan when using traditional toilet facilities. Most likely the women's washroom still has long lines as the 20 minute makeup applications are what will take up the majority of the time anyway.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:00PM
I know this one! It's because of all the lesbian sex and trannies molesting babies in there.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday February 04 2019, @12:03AM (45 children)
1) We can't just unzip and have a whizz. If there is anything I envy men for it's the ability to take a piss standing up.
2) As an extension of 1), we have to clean more thoroughly. Men can just shake it a bit, or so I'm told. This is also why women use more TP on average, because we have to use it every time no matter what we did.
3) Sometimes we go in there just to take a few minutes to decompress.
4) If it's Shark Week, this is where you go to change a pad or a tampon, if you trust those.
5) Also, did you know Shark Week sometimes includes more water retention *and* more peeing? Or sometimes really bad gas?
Now you know, and knowing is half the battle!
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:15AM (1 child)
Sadly I'm not sure if the shit posters here are capable of the 2nd half.
"And once again, 'equality' is rejected when the outcome isn't what the perpetual victims desire."
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @11:03AM
Azuma Hazuki is a notorious feminazi shit poster here, Anon.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ShadowSystems on Monday February 04 2019, @12:24AM (13 children)
Azuma Hazuki, thank you for posting.
I had come to post that "Men can spend half their bathroom needs standing up at a wall & then walk away. Women spend *all* their bathroom needs sitting down & can't just walk away."
Now that I am blind & must use a stall every time (don't dare stand at a urinal, I can't see to aim), I too spend more time using the bathroom.
I think the problem would be eased if we turned ALL bathrooms into unisex with just lots of stalls & no urinals.
Any guy that simply peed all over the seat could be screamed at by the next person in line & promptly beaten to death by the women waiting in line.
If you only have the space to install two bathrooms in your building, instead of dividing them into one for each gender, you could make them both unisex, cater to everyone, & shorten the length of time *anyone* had to wait in line to relieve themselves.
Make restroom attendants mandatory again & give them a shocky stick, that way if you don't wash your hands afterwards you'll get a not-so-gentle reminder about sanitation.
And I'm not just saying that because I think I'd like to be given a REASON to smack the non-hand-washing morons with an electric cattle prod.
*Cackle*
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:29AM (10 children)
Why are you obsessed with washing hands afterwards? If anything your hands are getting your genitalia dirty, so people should wash their hands beforehand.
(Score: 5, Touché) by crb3 on Monday February 04 2019, @01:40AM (2 children)
Unless you jet-spray your crotch every time after defecating, you have particles of shit spreading all through your underwear. Plus, if you piss at a standup urinal, you probably come away with a mist of splashback settled on your hands. That's what washing your hands gets rid of.
Don't believe me? Have a female friend sniff your hands for aromas after your bathroom break -- their noses work better than ours.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:21AM
the non-hand-washers make the office coffee and are big big hand shakers
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @03:33PM
Have you hard of Japan? They solved it by going "yep, auto-bidets for everybody."
(Score: 0, Troll) by realDonaldTrump on Monday February 04 2019, @01:49AM
There's the wash before. And there's the wash after. I do both. I wash my hands as often as possible because I feel cleansed. That makes me smart.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:54AM (5 children)
How did you get this far through life still believing this misconception? Didn't anyone ever tell you that fecal particles travel in your sweat onto your genitalia?
(Score: 0, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @04:12AM (4 children)
No, because my sweat isn't filled with poo particles... If it was it would smell like poo.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:18AM (3 children)
It does. Trust me.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:23AM (2 children)
You think everything smells like poo though.
(Score: 3, Touché) by arulatas on Monday February 04 2019, @03:45PM (1 child)
Well when they don't wash their hands and pick their nose... you can understand why.
----- 10 turns around
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday February 05 2019, @12:21AM
You lost track of who said what. Very easy when they're all Anonymous!!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @09:20AM
that would increase the wait time for everyone as men would now also take longer on average to take a piss
(Score: 2) by Arik on Monday February 04 2019, @11:11AM
There's no need to get rid of the urinals, leave them in and there are fewer people competing for the stalls.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:24AM (4 children)
Men who "just shake it a bit" have piss in their underwear. You can't clear the dregs with a shake, but a quick dab with a folded sheet of TP will.
But we already know that most men don't give a shit about not smelling like piss, because urinals are still a thing.
lol
"I KNOW there are 20 other women waiting in line to take a shit. I don't care. I'M DECOMPRESSING!"
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:00AM (3 children)
How your tighty whiteys must be soiled? Don't think I've owned light colored underware since I was a young child. There are different chemical compositions to male and female urine, male urine contains more calcium and black female pee contains less calcium than that of white females. Female animals scent to attract mates, males to repel reproductive competition. Whatever the chemical differences, male urine does not stain so indelibly as female urine. This isn't "sexism", it's biology. Shake that a bit!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:18AM
Concern about this keeps me awake at night. I asked online and someone finally came along and explained some things and I remember feeling at ease, but I apologize because I don’t remember the specifics. Hopefully someone comes along to explain it and do that same for you.
(Score: 5, Informative) by crb3 on Monday February 04 2019, @02:40AM (1 child)
>Men who "just shake it a bit" have piss in their underwear
As we get older, our plumbing loses its tautness and elasticity, and then, like a garden hose that dribbles a bit after the faucet's turned off, we've got a horizontal standpipe holding enough for a short racing-stripe down one pant-leg. The fix is to run a thumb or finger along underneath, inside or outside your pants, starting right from where the piping comes out of the prostate, to flatten the tubing and expel what's stored, before you put it away.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @08:33AM
No karma to give, but thanks for this. I’m reaching an age where the dribble-ness is getting annoying. Looking forward to trying this next time.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:26AM (3 children)
You could take a piss standing up. It was standard for women. This is why traditional women's clothing is open at the bottom.
Add underwear and pants though, and you've cast aside one of the advantages of being a woman.
BTW, aiming is possible. Practice in a tub. Put one finger to each side of the clitoris, then tug upward or to the side as required to aim.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:32AM (2 children)
Yep, my little sister taught herself to pee "like a boy" (aka while standing up) when we were young. They also have those little prosthetic dicks women can use to direct the stream and easily pee standing up with.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:14AM (1 child)
Yet men bitch about having to put the seat down. I presume there is a big overlap on that Venn diagram.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:03PM
I chose to overlook your Venn diagram. You're fired!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:27AM
You need to watch the movie "The Full Monty". A woman uses the urinal on a chicks only night at the local pub.
(Score: 5, Funny) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @01:12AM
S'truth. You gals got the less efficient plumbing. On the other hand us guys die earlier so you'll be able to take forever to piss on our graves.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Arik on Monday February 04 2019, @01:46AM (3 children)
I will take only a moment to remark on how odd it seems that it acknowledges biological differences can be determinative! There, done.
Now, having conceded there is some truth, I do think it's just a bit pat to write the whole thing off as biologically determined. I have particular difficulty believing this because I have lived in situations which proved to me that at least part of this is cultural.
"If there is anything I envy men for it's the ability to take a piss standing up."
Sure, our equipment is more designed for it, but if you spend much time in southern Europe (or other places, I am sure) you'll quickly find out that women do it all the time nonetheless. So it's not that you're not capable of it so much as you're not accustomed to it. This is cultural. Italian women squat over a hole in the floor, pull a napkin out of their pocket for a dab, and head back out on the dance floor without thinking about it.
"Sometimes we go in there just to take a few minutes to decompress."
And THIS is a big part of the reason for the problem right there. That's abuse of public accommodation really, but you're right, it's rampant. As a result of one selfish woman camping the john when she shouldn't be there, another woman is stuck waiting in line doing the peepee dance for ages. Second woman's husband/father is a state Senator, so soon you have more women's toilets. And more women taking even more time in them doing things other than what they're there for, so, wouldn't you know it? We need to spend even more money on more women's toilets.
And somewhere along the way we also lost the ability to call them 'toilets' - outside of the darkweb and soylent, of course. No, they're 'restrooms.' As if they were put there for us to rest in. Trust me, guys don't rest in toilets.
The Europeans, to their credit, faced this challenge quite practically. Instead of building more women-only facilities, they just made it all unisex. Works wonders. No one waits any longer than anyone else to get in - and no one really feels like it's an appropriate space to camp out and "decompress" while a line builds up outside the door either.
"Also, did you know Shark Week sometimes includes more water retention *and* more peeing? Or sometimes really bad gas?"
Sounds like a normal day to me.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @03:37AM
Only when women folk is around or you live somewhere the residents have delusions of grandeur, otherwise we call them the shitter.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday February 04 2019, @04:11AM
> I will take only a moment to remark on how odd it seems that it acknowledges biological differences can be determinative! There, done.
For fuck's sake, I am not and never have been [what the loonie right refers to as] a postmodernist, or one of those "everything is a social construct!!!11one" types. Let go of that strawman or you'll go up in the blaze when I torch it.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday February 04 2019, @06:51PM
I will take only a moment to remark on how odd it seems that it acknowledges biological differences can be determinative!
And also how zero SJW's are freaking out about it. It's almost like those folks you're so terribly frightened of aren't real.
(Score: 2, Funny) by nitehawk214 on Monday February 04 2019, @05:20AM
The other half of the battle is red lasers and blue lasers.
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Monday February 04 2019, @05:29AM
Won't ever be able to understand this - I'll put it down into the "forever mysteries in the women mind" column.
In all occasions I'm there (except the one I need to get rid of what feels as a barrel of beer,) any moment I'm in a toilet increases my tension.
I also don't get why they are called "rest rooms" - no likely that I'd ever take a nap close to the pissoir or while sitting on the toilet above some smelly faecals I just disposed of. Would you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Troll) by darkfeline on Monday February 04 2019, @06:09AM (2 children)
I understand you're biased toward defending your own sex, but the real reason is just that women feel entitled.
I have read multiple accounts that women can pee standing up (example https://www.yourtango.com/2016290905/womans-guide-pee-standing-up-like-man) [yourtango.com] There are also many products assisting women in peeing while standing, and having done some basic research reading reviews as if I were to buy one, there are quite a few highly rated products.
And there are female urinals that provide the same convenience as male urinals. The reason they aren't adopted are social. Women don't use them even if installed. They would rather wait in long lines for stalls.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_urinal [wikipedia.org]
So this problem is entirely self inflicted. Not by any single woman, but socially women would rather wait in long lines for a stall than use a urinal. So the solution is clearly to reduce facilities for men to accommodate the special needs of women.
> Sometimes we go in there just to take a few minutes to decompress.
It is hilarious and sad you can say that with a straight face. Because women are disrespectful in their use of public facilities, we should build more toilets for them? If a child steals candy from other children, we reward them with more candy?
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday February 04 2019, @06:54PM (1 child)
Such entitlement! I also feel entitled to NOT insert some prosthetic device up my pee hole in order to relieve myself.
(Score: 2) by darkfeline on Tuesday February 05 2019, @06:28AM
It looks like you missed the half about female urinals. Sure, you may be entitled to "NOT insert some prosthetic device up my pee hole" (ignoring the fact that many FUDs (female urination devices) don't require pee hole insertion, just as you may be entitled to not use female urinals while complaining about long lines waiting for stalls. You sure as hell aren't entitled to not being judged for it though.
Join the SDF Public Access UNIX System today!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:20AM
Azuma, you rock...just have to tell you that.
(Score: 2) by choose another one on Monday February 04 2019, @10:24AM (1 child)
Can't or won't ? The physical plumbing doesn't seem to be the problem. I've seen people with vaginas pissing in "mens" urinals, I've seen them go and piss in the bushes just like people with dicks, and I've seen them squat and piss in the street. Writing your name in the snow would seems to be the only thing that's really a lot harder with a vagina.
The real issue is that _most_ people with vaginas, in the western world _don't_ do this _most_ of the time (the peeing in the street IME usually involves the person being very drunk), while _most_ people with dicks do. Some, a minority, can't - on either side there are medical conditions that may prevent - most _can_ but choose not to.
Oh and that "just shake it a bit" don't work so well as you get older and the prostate starts playing up, just so you know we ain't pissed down our leg or forgotten to shake it...
Since that seems to be the major part of the problem, maybe rather than more toilets we should be providing toilets + decompression room (chamber?) - be a f*** of a lot cheaper it fyou didn't have to equip them with all the plumbing.
Yup. Did you also know that once the "fun" of menopause kicks in it may not be only a week and may be every three weeks or less? Some things you don't need first hand experience but learn from those close to you (no not _that_ close get away I'm having a hot flush).
Did you know that drinking beer by the pint causes (a lot) more peeing? I can remember when it was scandalous for a girl to order a pint, and it's _still_ dangerous for a man to order a half (a significant fraction of the few times I've been physically threatened by strangers in my life, and I very rarely do it), so maybe that evens it up a bit...
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Monday February 04 2019, @11:32PM
Ask them to put it in a pint glass. Then no-one will know. Except the bartender of course, so if they're the ones threatening you, you're out of luck.
Master of the science of the art of the science of art.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:39PM
How woman stand up pee [duckduckgo.com] and woman stand up pee [google.com] photos and videos.
But with a little bit of practice those are not even necessary.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:32PM (1 child)
Talking to the cleaners in my work building I discovered that the main problem in the women's toilets was that they squat on the seat.
Yes. On the seat. So their ass doesn't have to touch the seat.
This causes several problems the first of which is that the toilet seats break.
The second is that the body fluids spray wider than they would compared to if the person's ass was on the seat closer to the bowl.
It's disgusting to clean up.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:35PM
There are a couple of ways to tell that you have Chinese or Indian people at work.
Looking at the state of the stalls is a dead giveaway.
It is gross cleaning up after people who can't or won't use a modern loo properly.
Signs do not help so what are we supposed to do?
(Score: 2) by OrugTor on Monday February 04 2019, @04:30PM (1 child)
Re 3), assuming that 'decompress' means regain sanity or similar, does the decompressing woman use a stall? Asking that made me think about women going into the bathroom with no intention to use a stall. Might a better bathroom design have the basins in a section with their own entrance. It would connect with the stalls section so going from basins to stalls would be stigmatized, or an emergency, honor system.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday February 04 2019, @06:06PM
I'm a multitasker, so if I'm in a stall it's because there *is* a big download of one sort or another in the queue. It does help to take a few moments afterwards to just relax and let time and space catch up with you, though.
This leads into a off-topic tangent about womens' "invisible labor." A good deal of us--not all, especially not if the younger Snapchat generation is in question here--push ourselves hard, but don't complain about it. And because we don't speak up (and we don't speak up because women who speak up are bitchy or complainers, as opposed to men, who are just shooting the shit when they do it...) most people don't recognize what kind of strain we're under. My mother was like this too, which is likely where I inherited it from. So 2 or 3 minutes to just not do anything aside from evacuate waste has a surprisingly disproportionate effect.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday February 04 2019, @08:11PM
More like can, but won't. I've seen women pee in men's urinals successfully, but it appeared a delicate balancing act to adopt a functional stance while not touching the fixture. Ingrained squeamishness, it seems.
As for cleaning, again it's a change in approach. Men could, and probably should, use toilet paper after peeing, but they don't. Women could hold themselves in such a way and shake at the end the way men do, but they don't. Ingrained squeamishness.
Physically they could, but culturally they won't. In Vietnam everybody, men and women, does their business over holes in a platform standing on stilts off the river bank. In China women use roadside latrines that consist of squatting at the edge of a plank suspended across a cesspool; those lines move fast, faster even because of the stench.
Shark week is a different story.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:15AM
I'm not sure what exactly it is that takes women longer to use the bathroom - is it longer average time to finish urination/defecation? Dealing with menstruation means extra activities for women dealing with that, how much more time does that add? Can something be done to streamline these processes? Would adding bidets help, or a different style of toilet (asian style squatters? footrests for better posture?)? Is there a cultural issue here of socializing and other activities being done in the bathroom, slowing overall throughput?
Does mandating a certain ratio of toilets help anything? Like the Nashville stadium referenced - rather than substantially improving women's ability to access toilets, they simply reduced men's access, making everyone unhappy.
Gender-neutral bathrooms seem to be a good compromise, and probably simplify the plumbing and architectural decisions a little, but it is probably not helpful in the "large stadium" context, as at a certain point most toilets would be filled with the slowest users. Maybe a smaller urinal-only bathroom and larger stall-only gender-neutral bathroom? (Women /can/ use stalls with a small amount of practice or with the aid of tools, but I don't know that many would be comfortable doing so)
(Score: 4, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:16AM (5 children)
I'll just change the gender I identify as to the bathroom with the shortest line.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Moof123 on Monday February 04 2019, @05:00AM (4 children)
+1. Make all bathrooms unisex. I see dads bring their little girls in with them (no choice) and it is never an issue. Why should grown ass women not be allowed to come on in and out the often empty Men’s stalls to good use?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:51AM (2 children)
Make the walls taller and lower in stalls to reduce peaking, and make the stall "room" itself unisex. Then make the urinals in a diff room.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:43AM (1 child)
The short doors and big gaps are actually a code requirement. Fun fact is that the were originally put in to try to prevent junkies from shooting up in public bathrooms.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @10:56AM
American toilet cubicles are sooooo weird. Somehow all of Europe manages with privacy.
My favourite toilets I've seen are a block of completely separate rooms, each with a toilet, sink and dryer and a proper door. And they didn't take significantly more space than the equivalent number of cubicles and basins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:22PM
Around here they do. They just walk in behind you to get to the toilets.
I can't say that I care. It's just different plumbing.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @12:23AM (18 children)
Men pee standing up, they don't use cubicles, they don't menstruate and they don't fix makeup. Apparently though it's sexism stopping women squirting up a wall.
Know what is sexist - U-bends! I'm fairly regular but if it's delayed until late afternoon, there's no way one flush is enough. We're talking two or three flushes before it's even safe to flush wipes without causing a major blockage. Is the size of these U-bends some female denial of the amount of shit a 200-250lbs male produces each day? Is it sexist denial on the part of females or is it toxic masculinity to insist on widening the hole for effective penetration?
(Score: 4, Touché) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday February 04 2019, @12:31AM (4 children)
Ooh, a literal shitpost. How very clever.
I'm pretty sure plumbing was invented by men including said U-bend. Maybe lose some weight? Or mount the tank higher for increased water pressure, if you're allowed to modify your plumbing? Or, like, flush halfway through?
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:07AM (2 children)
Invented for women tho...
The voice of experience speaks - we always knew you were full of shit!
(Score: 1, Troll) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday February 04 2019, @01:26AM (1 child)
...really, dude? Do I trigger you THAT hard? Looks like it's time to flush you, too.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0, Troll) by NPC-131072 on Monday February 04 2019, @01:57AM
Yes, your biological essentialism knows no bounds and you even have a problem with me when I post AC and forego the trans issue. Imagine someone who was born male taking a crap in the female shithouse to fully understand the enormity of the problem being discussed. You can't! I've not always been trans and your seeming obsession reminds me of my ex [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday February 04 2019, @08:15PM
Toilets in China do not have U-bends. You want U-bends.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:06AM
You could always try a courtesy flush. Basically, pull the chain right as the noise cone of the falling turd is about to break the surface tension of the water. That log will slide right around the u-bend with the finesse of a well oiled naked women diving into a pool full of mineral oil.
(Score: 5, Informative) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @01:17AM (10 children)
As a former plumber allow me to inform you: It's never safe to flush wipes, shit-for-brains. The first tiny tree root that gets through the pipe you've guaranteed a major clog by flushing wipes.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @01:35AM (4 children)
So you went from blue collar to white by learning to code ;;;)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @02:33AM (2 children)
Dealing with shit was probably the ideal training for dealing with the same in a corporate office. At least the second one won't stain your collar brown.
(Score: 2) by RandomFactor on Monday February 04 2019, @02:49AM (1 child)
One of the sharper and more driven guys I ran into in IT was a machinist before he switched to IT. Some jobs motivate people.
В «Правде» нет известий, в «Известиях» нет правды
(Score: 2) by Rivenaleem on Tuesday February 05 2019, @03:05PM
Machinist to masochist. What an upgrade!
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @03:41AM
No, I'm still blue collar. Most jobs I bid still require carrying tools, even if they do include some ass sitting as well.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 1, Troll) by NPC-131072 on Monday February 04 2019, @02:20AM
Hello fren, I didn't know that. Post your address and I'll mail them to you for disposal.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @05:25AM
knucklehead, that's what they call TP in their country
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:52AM
You don't even need tree roots. The corroding insides of cast iron become rough and can be enough to catch what you flush down. Or you can have areas with insufficient pitch. Not to mention that most wet wipes are designed to absorb lipids and swell, which can lead to "fatbergs" and then the saponification due to the grease and alkaline environment leads to concrete-like masses in your pipes.
(Score: 2) by edIII on Monday February 04 2019, @08:34PM (1 child)
Except the ones that say they're okay to flush right?
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday February 05 2019, @12:22AM
It shouldn't come as a surprise when I tell you they're full of shit.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by choose another one on Monday February 04 2019, @10:44AM
Ain't the U-bend that's the problem.
I got me a Victorian house with original Victorian (we think) WC. Pull the chain (not lever) on that thing and about five gallons comes out of the wooden (lead lined) cistern down 6ft of big fat lead pipe, never needed more than one flush, but on the modern one upstairs a big dump often takes 3 or 4. The old WC still has a U-bend, still goes out through same 4in waste pipe.
The difference is between Victorian engineering focused on doing the ****ing job properly, once, and modern engineering focused on getting rid of a standard-sized eco-poo in the most efficient way and **** everyone who doesn't conform to average. Note that the Victorian engineering is also still working after 100+ yrs (at some point the cistern float has been replaced with a plastic one, but that is about it).
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Username on Monday February 04 2019, @01:28AM (1 child)
Where I work it's currently 95% men, 5% everyone else. There are currently at least two toilets per woman, and one toilet per 20 men depending on shift. How much more do they need? How long do they expect me to hold the poo in? Maybe unisex would be the way to go.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday February 04 2019, @03:48AM
Chicks in the US would never go for it. They generally got self esteem problems enough without having to blow vicious mud in the stall next to a hot guy at the club.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by NateMich on Monday February 04 2019, @02:56AM (2 children)
They will make things worse for men instead of better for women.
That would just make me want to avoid public restrooms even more than I do now. I already don't really care much for attending concerts or other crowded venues because of issues like this, but making it worse for me to have to take a piss isn't going to solve anything.
I take that back... It might solve it entirely, because I'll stay home and save my money.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 04 2019, @06:40AM
You can get psychological help for your tiny dick and shy bladder you know? It's OK little guy....Try some positive self talk, "wee wee go pee pee" say that out loud 5 times...I'm sure the dude in the stand-up urinal won't punch you in the face when you're done.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday February 04 2019, @08:21PM
That's alright. I hazard to say most men are comfortable peeing in the broom closet at a venue that chooses to not supply adequate facilities. Peeing in sinks, bottles, and in potted plants are additional options. I've been at Japanese enkais where the big shacho sauntered over to the fake tree in the corner to pass the bottle of XO he had. My Japanese co-workers chose those moments to take extraordinary interest in the ice sculpture center pieces.
Washington DC delenda est.