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from the you-both-get-dirty-and-the-pig-likes-it dept.
McGruber writes:
"Following up on the Bil Nye and Ken Ham debate on Creationism, Creation Museum founder Ken Ham announced Thursday that a municipal bond offering has raised enough money to begin construction on the Ark Encounter project, estimated to cost about $73 million. Groundbreaking is planned for May and the ark is expected to be finished by the summer of 2016. Ham credits the high-profile evolution debate he had with "Science Guy" Bill Nye on Feb. 4 with boosting support for the project.
After learning that the project would move forward, Nye said he was 'heartbroken and sickened for the Commonwealth of Kentucky,' lamenting that the ark would eventually draw more attention to the beliefs of Ham's Young-earth Creationist ministry. 'Voters and taxpayers in Kentucky will eventually see that this is not in their best interest.' Nye hopes."
(Score: 5, Insightful) by LaminatorX on Saturday March 01 2014, @08:21AM
What blows my mind is that they're using municipal bonds for it. That seems like red letter state establishing religion.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by hemocyanin on Saturday March 01 2014, @09:06AM
That was my initial thought as well.
My second thought, as an atheist, is that this is a salient example as to why one should never try to use logic in an attempt to dislodge irrational belief. I mean, that should be self-evident -- just like no amount of rationality will convince a foilhatter that the government isn't using mind reading satellites. As an example, I once had a potential client come into my office, toss a tooth on my desk (and no, I'm not a dentist, IAAL), and say "look at that." I said "okaaay?" He said "you see that?" pointing to discoloration on the base of the tooth. I said "yes??" He said "That's the residue from the mind reading powder and I want you to do something about it." I most definitely did not engage in a rational discussion with him about plaque and how silly the notion of mind reading powder on his tooth was, because really, exactly where would that go? He would redefine my rational arguments into an attempt by a covert government agent, i.e. me (which I really am not), to trick him into thinking it was poor hygiene rather than what he knew it to be, specifically, mind reading powder. Needless to say, I didn't take the case and instead gently focused on getting him to leave.
Religionists are like this potential client -- but it is no use pointing that out. Now, I'm not saying atheists should be silent, it's just wiser to refuse to engage in this type of debate. It is better to be known as an atheist and leave it at that because those who come to their doubts about religion on their own, will find you, and there will be actual conversation. It may lead them to recommit to faith, or to abandon it -- it doesn't really matter -- what matters is that there will be an honest exchange of ideas. However, no such exchange is possible with those wholly committed to an irrational belief system, and any such exchange is just a waste of breath. Sometimes, as seen here, it ends up being more than a waste of breath and instead results in a mammoth waste of resources.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Ezber Bozmak on Saturday March 01 2014, @07:16PM
It is better to be known as an atheist and leave it at that because those who come to their doubts about religion on their own
I think what you wrote is an irrational belief rooted in confirmation bias. The problem here, as in much of life, is that there are no easy answers. Frequently there is no choice available that will have a perfect outcome. As you recognized, Nye's engagement with Ham was never going to change the minds of the fanatics. That option wasn't even on the table. But what was on the table was the potential to influence fence-sitters and anyone else who simply hadn't though very deeply about the issue because that's all the heard growing up. Mainly kids and teens who may be per-disposed to doubt and just need a means to make that doubt more concrete.
You know the saying, "Two steps forward, one step back?" People tend to say that in frustration, but that ignores the fact that the net is still one step forward. This bond issue is the "one step back" and the kids - who have no say in bond issues - are the two steps forward. You just won't see their impact for years.
Besides, who is to say that this ark bond won't turn into a boondoggle and end up getting Ken Ham drummed out of town? That he hasn't bit off more than he can chew? As the bible says, "pride comes before the fall."
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Thexalon on Saturday March 01 2014, @02:27PM
It is, but this is an area of the country where "not establishing a religion" means that they'll accept any path to accepting Jesus as your personal lord and savior. And they know they don't have a leg to stand on, but they'll talk about it in terms of bringing business and tourism to their city and try to get away with it that way. If the project gets shut down, Ken Ham and his crew will generate even more cash with their cries that those evil secularists in Washington are oppressing them (by making them follow the same rules as everyone else).
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by bill_mcgonigle on Tuesday March 04 2014, @05:04PM
Indeed. This seems like an awesome archeo-engineering undertaking and I'd buy tickets to see it. Yet I find the use of citizen bondage completely unacceptable.