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Journal by turgid
The Alt-Wrong have got themselves an Anti-Greta by the name of Naomi Seibt.
The 19-year-old German is a Climate Change Denier and Islamophobe. She is also apparently a member of and speaks to the far-right Alternative für Deutschland, an organisation associated with Brexit's very own Nigel Farage.
Apparently Seibt will be addressing the conservative CPAC this week in the USA along side Trump and Pence.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
No self-made man ever did such a good job that some woman didn't
want to make some alterations.
-- Kim Hubbard
(Score: 4, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday February 26 2020, @09:08PM (37 children)
Boy, they sure aren't afraid to immediately demonstrate that their bad faith criticisms of Greta were a bunch of bullshit!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 26 2020, @09:10PM (6 children)
Greta is a child. The other one is an adult.
(Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday February 26 2020, @09:33PM (3 children)
They can both buy beer where they're from. Neither can buy beer here.
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Thursday February 27 2020, @06:42AM (2 children)
I would say the important variable here is: when the alt-wrong anti-greta is criticized are people going to attempt to deflect it by saying it is wrong to criticize a child.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:48PM (1 child)
Criticize all you want just skip the ad-hominem bullshit.
If her science is wrong, criticize it with a scientific argument.
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:01PM
Indeed I agree but the topic was how much of a child they both appear to be. It seems to me that a good way to evaluate that is to look to see how many people defend the person based on them only being a child. That happens with Greta. I think it's really stupid to do that. If it happens with anti-greta it would be even more stupid.
(Score: 4, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 26 2020, @09:42PM
One is stupid and wrong, the other is a few years younger and smart.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:40PM
Physically or mentally?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 26 2020, @09:51PM (12 children)
Hypocrisy is not a thing to the sociopath and their supporters. They have the "morals" of an amoeba, or any inanimate object for that matter. Stop dwelling on it like an old lady. You need to find something else to attract their attention.
(Score: 4, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday February 26 2020, @10:03PM (11 children)
I'm not trying to attract THEIR attention!
Well, mostly.... I do love it when that 'DM is always wrong' guy starts whining like a little bitch when I cite my sources.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 26 2020, @10:32PM (8 children)
I'm not trying to attract THEIR attention!
Then WHOSE?! Your "cites" reveal nothing new and unexpected. You just keep repeating the same old shit we've all known since the 90s.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 26 2020, @11:45PM (7 children)
It is called speaking truth to power.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:37AM (2 children)
Yeah? And?
Power laughs in your face! And pees on your cornflakes! Whaddya gonna fuckin' do?!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:50PM (1 child)
Try learning for a change https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_truth_to_power [wikipedia.org]
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 28 2020, @04:41AM
Bla bla bla... what does it get them? Prison or death... You have to forcibly neutralize power! This being polite shit is for the birds. If speaking is all you can do, you have already lost. Your words are bullshit compared to the guns of the psychopath.
Read what Chomsky said in your link. Speaking "truth" to power is infinitely stupid when they already know it
Power is laughing at you right now. And they are right. They can point a finger, and, poof! Another AC bites the big one..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:08PM
We hear you, and we're coming for you.
The Petaybians
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:27PM (2 children)
Not them either.
Mostly, it's the folks who might otherwise get sucked in by the blatant lies and misinformation being spewed in places like this.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:14PM (1 child)
You really think anybody here is undecided? Now that's funny!
Besides, you only complain about one side's lies. Until you can lose the tribalism, and can understand why you lost so badly in 2010, resulting in today's predicament, you are full of it.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Thursday February 27 2020, @09:30PM
I'm making the attempt. I never said it's a success. But, it seems better than sitting on my ass and watching it happen.
I tackle the biggest problems first. When I get done with the people who lie about EVERYTHING I'll get to the folks that slightly exaggerate sometimes.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by barbara hudson on Wednesday February 26 2020, @10:34PM
Well, she does have an alt-right (lazy right) eye ... Bada-BOOM!
Let them continue to deny climate change - they'll be the first ones up against the wall.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @01:54AM
Keep eating those tide pods.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @06:13AM (10 children)
Speech of Greta [youtube.com]
Speech of Naomi [youtube.com]
Anti-greta doesn't make any sense. Greta relies on invoking her own emotion paired with emotional appeals, hyperbole, ad-hominem, and so on.
Naomi literally says "Do not create an ideology out of what a young girl has to say on a topic, regardless of the side she's on." "Do not believe every word I say unconditionally.. do your research and form your opinion on the climate change situation and on any other political topic." And she says that in a mature, direct fashion.
---
An anti-Greta would be shredding crocodile tears and ranting and raving in an equal but opposite fashion of Greta. She does not do this. And indeed it remains stupid to listen to what a young girl has personally to say on such topics. But unlike Greta she tends to mention specific testable and, most importantly, *FALSIFIABLE* facts. For instance did the IPCC predict a third of a degree of global warming per decade from 1990? Have we had less, or more warming? Have we had more, or less, CO2 emissions than the IPCC was assuming for their models? If you're not aware of the answers here it's [Yes][Much Less][Much more].
If you'd actually stop to read the papers you site with headlines like 'Climate Models Have Been Really Accurate, Honestly!' you'll see that's only after they dramatically change the climate forcing assumptions. Climate forcing basically being how much human CO2 influences atmospheric CO2 levels. Turns out it's *way* less than we used to think, and there's no real reason to think we have it correct now either. We just keep changing the "constant" to fit observed reality which, invariably, has little to no connection to predicted reality.
But people don't personally look at these things, or even read the papers they site. They just rant and rave. And people like Greta fuel the hysteria by making claims we're in a mass extinction. It's very reckless and very dangerous. Charismatic speakers tickling people's emotions has a very checkered past, and one I think few people would ever support if they could somehow force themselves to have some degree of objective introspection.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @06:32AM (7 children)
You know, their illiteracy just outs them ever single time. It is almost as if a Republican Representative said that it "Besmirks" something, something. Misunderestimate. Going Rouge with the Refudiation. My Gawd, Republicans are dumb! Spelling, assholes, it is not just for bees!
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Thursday February 27 2020, @06:47AM (4 children)
That looks like an autocorrect to me. I've got plenty of liberal friends that don't carefully check what their phone is doing to their text input and send me stuff like that. I would not say they are dumb I would say they don't give a fuck and they know I'll understand the ambiguity.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:58PM (3 children)
There's your problem.
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:31PM (2 children)
No not really because they are along the lines of classical liberals not neo liberal. Why would I want to give up my friends just because of political leaning? I teach them things, they teach me things. They are wondering if there is anyone in the Democrat party they can vote for. I don't have to worry about party crap because I was never a Republican and became independent quite a while ago.
I don't see why you would want to cut anyone out of your life unless they were so toxic they injure you.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:52PM (1 child)
I'm a liberal with conservative and libertarian friends, it is very easy when people can agree to disagree and not be toxic towards one another.
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Friday February 28 2020, @07:10AM
Three nights ago on the local ham radio there was a conversation between a Vietnam Vet and a guy who proudly says that he had the Communist Party help him find a doctor that would file the paperwork so he could dodge the Vietname draft. They didn't even get close to trying to kill each other once. They didn't even raise their voices.
These kids from the Internet don't know what conflict is.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @07:05AM
извините аристаркыс, я не говорю по-английский
(Score: 2, Touché) by Runaway1956 on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:05PM
Mmmm-hmmmm . . . you realize that typos don't make you look especially literate?
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:19PM
Buuuuuut for all that...Greta happens to be right, and what's-her-face isn't :) And no amount of tone-trolling is going to change that. Facts don't care about your feelings, as it's been said.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday February 27 2020, @03:12PM
Mass hysteria is a thing. Look no further than the French Revolution.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday February 27 2020, @11:32AM (5 children)
But at the least, it demonstrates the ridiculous nature of the Thunberg phenomena. Now, we have anti-Gretas. What's next? Are we going to see rooms of world leaders sit placidly as they get barked at by a Boston Terrier named Muffy or its pitbull rival Anti-Muffy? Not that world leaders have anything better to do (and plenty worse), but hopefully, this escalation puts this whole circus back into the YouTube backwaters where it belongs.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 27 2020, @02:16PM (1 child)
The organic explanation is probably the most likely.
Young girl sees people acting cultishly around another young girl in large part because she's a young girl. She has divergent views, decides to start expressing herself publicly. She gets some fans, and then of course special interests rapidly fawning over her.
(Score: 2) by GreatAuntAnesthesia on Thursday March 05 2020, @12:26PM
Nope. This "anti-Greta" has been quite deliberately cooked up by the fossil fuel industry, via the Heartland Institute.
She has been cynically manufactured by the oil industry like some hollow, auto-tuned commercial pop singer by a record company.
That would make Greta the self-made musician who worked her own way up from nothing on just her own talent, determination and resources.
Also, it says a lot about the alt-right in that about half the commentary about these two on the internet is right wingers comparing the physical attractiveness of the two girls- very often the same people who like to argue that Greta's words are worthless because she's "just a kid" are now gleefully sexualising both her and her right-wing counterpart. Keep it classy, alt-righters!
(Score: 2) by Knowledge Troll on Thursday February 27 2020, @04:17PM (2 children)
left> Hello, tech support? Are you there? Ah good - I have a world wide impending catastrophe do you have a 16 year old girl I can talk to about it? All of the adults can't handle this but I'm quite sure that the problem with the adults not being able to handle it is just that no one young enough yet has regurgitated the exact same info that's been regurgitated over and over again. I know for a fact that the adults are going to respect a person that just started balancing a checkbook.
right> Hello, tech support? Are you there? Ah good - I have a problem. There's a teenager going around saying stuff I don't like to hear. It's wrong to tug heart strings like that and young people don't know what they are talking about. Do you have a 19 year old there I can talk to about becoming our spokesperson?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday February 27 2020, @08:47PM
(Score: 2) by GreatAuntAnesthesia on Thursday March 05 2020, @12:48PM
- Hello, tech support? I seem to have a problem with my climate. It's heating up and up and I'm getting firestorms and tornadoes and massive species die offs and I can't seem to figure out what's going wrong.
-- Ah Mr Troll. Thanks for calling. Again. As we explained last time, yes, this is a known problem, with a known solution. You need to reduce global carbon emissions while simultaneously sequestering carbon at a massive scale.
- Well that's ridiculous. Why didn't anyone tell me this before?
-- We did tell you, Mr Troll. We told you last time you called. And the time before that, and the time before that. In fact, we've been saying this to you for about thirty years. If you'd implemented our solution when we first...
- But the problem just keeps getting worse!
-- Well, if you don't follow our advice then it will get worse. As we kept telling you. Have you been following our advice?
- What advice?
-- {sound of head banging on desk} I see... So Mr Troll, what would you like us to do for you today?
- Well, I seem to have a problem with my climate. It's heating up and up and I can't seem to see what's going wrong.
-- Riiiiight. Well, as we have previously explained, you need to reduce....
- I'd like to speak to your supervisor. Right away please, this is unacceptable.
-- {Sigh}. Of course Mr Troll, please hold...
... hold music...
-- Mr Troll, this is the supervisor. What seems to be the problem today?
- Well, I keep telling your support staff about my climate problem, and they don't seem to be able to fix my problem.
-- Yes Mr Troll, I am aware of the situation. The thing is, unless you follow the advice we give, you are going to...
- No no NO! I want to speak to your boss.
... hold music...
-- Good morning Mr Troll, this is the boss. What can we do for you today?
- I have to say, I am extremely disappointed with the service I am getting here. I have a problem and none of your staff is prepared to fix it!
-- Mr Troll, we have tried very hard to fix the problem, but I'm afraid it's just not possible without some effort on your part. We have explained again and again that...
- No, this isn't good enough. I want a solution!
-- Mr Troll, we have repeatedly offered you a perfectly good solution, and there is no other way of achieving what you want. We can't just...
- I want to speak to your boss!
-- But I am the boss. There's nobody else to appeal to.
- That's not good enough, put me through to someone else!
-- {Sigh} hold please...
... hold music...
-- Um, hello?
- Who is this?
-- Well, I'm just a random teenager. I don't even work here. A really stressed-looking guy in a suit just handed me the phone. Can I help you?