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from the however-could-they-do-investigations-before-cell-phones? dept.
The FBI Successfully Broke into a Gunman's iPhone, but Still Angry at Apple:
After months of trying, the FBI successfully broke into iPhones belonging to the gunman responsible for a deadly shooting at Pensacola Naval Air Station in December 2019, and it now claims he had associations with terrorist organization al-Qaeda. Investigators managed to do so without Apple's help, but Attorney General William Barr and FBI director Christopher Wray both voiced strong frustration with the iPhone maker at a press conference on Monday morning.
Both officials say that encryption on the gunman's devices severely hampered the investigation. "Thanks to the great work of the FBI — and no thanks to Apple — we were able to unlock Alshamrani's phones," said Barr, who lamented the months and "large sums of tax-payer dollars" it took to get into devices of Mohammed Saeed Alshamrani, who killed three US sailors and injured eight other people on December 6th.
Apple has said it provided investigators with iCloud data it had available for Alshamrani's account and other technical assistance, though it wasn't enough to bypass the encryption of Alshamrani's iPhones. So authorities spent many weeks trying to break in on their own.
[...] Throughout the recent debates on encryption policy, Apple has insisted that it's impossible to create a "backdoor" in the way that Barr describes since any such tool could fall into the wrong hands and dismantle the security of iPhones globally. The company has regularly handed over iCloud backup data where available, and according to a Reuters report from earlier this year, Apple abandoned plans to fully encrypt those backups due to FBI complaints. But it has steadfastly refused to compromise the local storage of iPhones. "Doing so would hurt only the well-meaning and law-abiding citizens who rely on companies like Apple to protect their data," CEO Tim Cook said in 2016.
[...] Attorney General Barr hasn't been swayed by Apple's arguments. "We are confident that technology companies are capable of building secure products that protect user information," he said today, "and at the same time, allow for law enforcement access when permitted by a judge — as Apple had done willingly for many years and others are still doing today."
[...] Apple responded to Barr and Wray on Monday afternoon. The company reiterated that there's "no such thing as a backdoor only for the good guys" and said "the American people do not have to choose between weakening encryption and effective investigations."
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @12:23PM (3 children)
Aw, did someone have to do the job they get paid obscene amounts of money for all by themselves and not get to destroy the security of millions of innocent people to have things handed to them on a silver platter? /sadfacey
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday May 19 2020, @05:24PM (1 child)
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Revek on Tuesday May 19 2020, @11:23PM
Nope its easier to be lazy and have it come to you. They don't really know how to investigate in this age of easy info. Their own hiring practices guarantee they will never have good IT savvy personnel. Too much hoover and not enough hippy.
This page was generated by a Swarm of Roaming Elephants
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @07:54PM
yeah, and let's not even get into the fact that if the US wasn't over their rooting around in other countries internal affairs (with bombs, no less), then this goat fucker might not have made it his life mission to kill americans. Fuck the FBI regardless. They whine anytime their job is more difficult then shooting mothers in the head while they hold their baby or spraying 10 year old boys in the back for having the guts to defend his dog that they just shot.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by DaTrueDave on Tuesday May 19 2020, @12:40PM (2 children)
“Thanks to the great work of the FBI — and no thanks to Apple — we were able to unlock Alshamrani’s phones,” said Barr.
This is exactly what Apple wants the FBI to say. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me to find out in a few years that there actually was an Apple backdoor or that Apple otherwise assisted ON THE CONDITION that the FBI publicly stated that Apple didn't assist.
I've got to say, the position on privacy has made me consider switching back from Android to iOS.
(Score: 5, Informative) by takyon on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:09PM
But then you have:
Zerodium Temporarily Stops Buying iOS Exploits Because there are Too Many [soylentnews.org]
Not that Android is necessarily better, since it has plenty of vulnerabilities and is a bigger target.
Get a flip phone.
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @07:59PM
The Bill of Rights in the U.S. Constitution was put in place because governments tend to get angry when citizens' privacy gets in the way.
(Score: 2) by pkrasimirov on Tuesday May 19 2020, @12:58PM (9 children)
What's wrong with obtaining a search warrant from a court and then ask Apple?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:41PM
That is like asking a cake maker to give the FBI only the flour from the finished cake. The cake maker has no way to do that, and it would destroy the integrity of the cake.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Ethanol-fueled on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:41PM (2 children)
Because then Moshe in the FBI won't be able to funnel FBI money to Moshe's brother Mordechai, who happens to own an Israeli company specializing in iPhone exploits. On an unrelated note, both Moshe and Mordechai have a cousin who works for Apple designing security architecture.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @04:09PM (1 child)
Wow, you know the personal details of everyone! You must truly be a multicultural worldly traveler!
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Tuesday May 19 2020, @05:45PM
No, but these guys [techcrunch.com] are.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Tuesday May 19 2020, @02:10PM (1 child)
Who says they didn't or wouldn't?
So, the lesson for anyone who wants absolute privacy is do not use iCloud for your backups.
The narrative here is that Apple's security on their phones is so strong that Apple cannot crack it, no? Therefore they can't help. Therefore the government wants backdoors in the products by design. And Apple now has a lovely card to play: The government can still exploit phones, either by finesse or force. My guess is that they just kept throwing pin numbers at it modified by maybe having to ghost and restore the phone, or maybe he didn't have any kind of wipe options selected and they could just keep plugging away.
Anyway, it's not that Apple will not help, it's that they want a design by which they cannot help. Because that's what consumers want, and the government's interest in this would damage that.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by pkrasimirov on Tuesday May 19 2020, @03:31PM
Got it, thanks.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 19 2020, @02:42PM (1 child)
Nothing is wrong with it. But a search warrant does not make the impossible become possible.
If Apple doesn't have the decryption key, then what can Apple do?
Oh, they could design their products to be insecure such that Apple has the key. Fine. But then don't say it is secure.
What Barr claims:
Companies can design products to be secure. But they magically become insecure somehow when a judge signs a piece of paper.
FACT: either it is secure, or it is not. There is no try.
Would a Dyson sphere [soylentnews.org] actually work?
(Score: 2) by pkrasimirov on Tuesday May 19 2020, @03:32PM
Got it, thank you too.
(Score: 1) by SomeRandomGeek on Tuesday May 19 2020, @04:41PM
Apple was not in possession of the phone or the data on the phone. That made it hard for the FBI to get a search warrant against them.
So, the FBI calls up Apple and says ¨Hey, we need someone who can break into an iPhone. Can we borrow the people who design the security on your iPhone? Blah, blah, blah, civic duty.¨
I can´t think of a better way to get an entire security team to quit simultaneously than to tell them to crack their own systems on behalf of a government bureaucracy.
The real story is that when Apple said no, the FBI started whining to anyone who will listen about how they are entitled to unlimited free assistance.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:04PM (7 children)
People just have to design their own encryption the government can't control. Of course they will need a way to transmit such a signal without being detected and tracked. Eh, eternal cat and mouse
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by SomeGuy on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:29PM (5 children)
Or, I dunno, just don't put your shit on a stupid toy cell phone.
Of course, if the FBI used exploits, then who knows if they just planted whatever shit they wanted.
With the way things are going, better to just not own a cell phone. Eh, they would still plant a cell phone and nobody would ever believe that someone actually did not have one.
Hell, who am I kidding, they wouldn't even go to that much trouble:
FBI lawyer: "Your honer, we found all kinds of naughty bad evil stuff on the defendant's 1990s Unisonic 6434 desk phone"
Judge: "Guilty! Burn him at the stake! Then burn him again for not having the latest greatest smart phone!"
(Score: 2, Informative) by fustakrakich on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:35PM
There's a way around everything. People will just speak in tongues. The racists do it all the time when they're on the TV running for office
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Tuesday May 19 2020, @02:13PM (2 children)
Don't put your shit anywhere outside your head is more like it. They let them build a circumstantial case that they'll likely win, because who is silly enough to not own a cell phone... You almost certainly exhibit other behaviors that a court can then take notice of, too.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday May 19 2020, @02:51PM
Not own a cell phone?! What are they trying to hide?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @05:22PM
Keeping it in your head may not work for much longer. Elon Musk is working on a tool.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday May 19 2020, @05:22PM
Once the authorities start fabricating evidence, it's game over. At that point, encryption and such is so that they can't automatically figure out who else to go after rather than protecting yourself from these tactics.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:40PM
After months of trying they won't admit it, but Mohammed Saeed Alshamrani's passcode was 9999, it just took law enforcement that long to work their way up from 1234.
Україна досі не є частиною Росії Слава Україні🌻 https://news.stanford.edu/2023/02/17/will-russia-ukraine-war-end
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:21PM
“and at the same time, allow for law enforcement access when permitted by a judge“
He’s revealed his total ignorance of how encryption works, or an expectation that others can adopt some doublethink that their data is magically secret sometimes but not the data of criminals being investigated.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:25PM (4 children)
Did they find anything of value on this phone?
(Score: 4, Funny) by SomeGuy on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:37PM
Yea, they found some terroristic cat pictures and an incriminating clip from Family Guy. They have yet to release information about the dick pics they found.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Ethanol-fueled on Tuesday May 19 2020, @01:39PM (1 child)
They found communications between the shooter and Al-Qaeda, which is a FBI/CIA/Mossad organization. So basically the FBI found evidence of their own agents egging the shooter on just like what happened in San Bernardino. Business as usual.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @04:57PM
You have an aversion to citations? Or just fresh air?
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Wednesday May 20 2020, @06:08PM
"Did they find," and, "did they say they found," are now sadly two separate questions which must be considered.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by DannyB on Tuesday May 19 2020, @02:38PM (2 children)
It's secure.
But becomes magically insecure when a judge signs a piece of paper.
Would a Dyson sphere [soylentnews.org] actually work?
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 19 2020, @03:27PM (1 child)
Does anybody trust Bill Barr?
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 19 2020, @06:45PM
The president might. On some days. You can never be quite sure. Not until he falls out of favor and is removed in the next purge. Then you'll know for sure.
Would a Dyson sphere [soylentnews.org] actually work?
(Score: 2) by Dr Spin on Tuesday May 19 2020, @04:38PM (2 children)
These large sums of tax-payer dollars
are nothing compared to the sums of dollars that will disappear from banks if encryption has bloody great holes in it.
If the government can get in, with or without pieces of paper, then pretty much everyone else will probably get in first.
Especially state-sponsored hackers in remote parts of the planet (remote, and in "on the Internet" - so almost
everyone except the Norks).
Warning: Opening your mouth may invalidate your brain!
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 19 2020, @04:53PM
But, you don't understand. Those pieces of paper are covered with MAGICAL runes. And, because all magicians work for the government (or get executed) we can be sure that no neophyte can possibly use those magical papers!
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by meustrus on Tuesday May 19 2020, @07:46PM
No no no, that's not how it works.
The banks, of course, will still get their strong encryption. They need it! How else will they protect ${RICH_PERSON}'s money? How else will they keep the IRS from tracing their Cayman Island deposits?
It's just our personal devices that need backdoors! Private citizens, as we all know, don't need freedom from tyranny. They need protection from each other!
If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
(Score: 2) by arslan on Wednesday May 20 2020, @12:54AM
Fake news: FBI Successfully Broke Into a Gunman’s iPhone, but Still Very Angry at Apple
Real news (or the Onion): Apple helped FBI break into iPhone, both will pretend it didn't happen for mutual benefit. FBI to push the "Enforcement agencies need back-door legislation" narrative and Apple to push the "We're here for our customers narrative".