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Breaking News: Russia Seizes Power in Crimea

posted by LaminatorX on Saturday March 01 2014, @10:25PM   Printer-friendly
from the party-like-it's-1853 dept.
Calling it an invasion seems off, as their forces were already there. The Guardian has live updates at this page.

Are any Soylentils in or from the region? Do you have any insights to share?

 
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  • (Score: 3, Informative) by tftp on Sunday March 02 2014, @01:28AM

    by tftp (806) on Sunday March 02 2014, @01:28AM (#9323) Homepage

    I must confess that I haven't read anything that Putin said recently. I read other sources, those that are free to say what they want.

    Here is one link [livejournal.com]. The story is about one Yuri Mikhalchishin. Here is my translation of some of that text:

    "The main ideologist of "Freedom", Mikhalchishin, openly admits that he is a specialist in anti-system fascist movements of 1930's so that their activities can be studied and used in Ukraine", said Miroslava Berdnik.

    The subject of Mikhalchishin's dissertation is interesting: "The transformation of a political movement into a mass political party of the new type, as studied on NSDAP and PNF (comparative analysis.)" [...] The main ideologist of "Freedom" is a scientist of nazism. We are talking not just about history of nazism, but about practical creation of a political party by example of Hitler's and Mussolini's," said Berdnik.

    "In his magazine, in print and online ("Vatra",) Mikhalchishin writes that the future of Ukraine and of the world belongs to national-socialist revolution (fascist, if you call things by their names) and that "only new type of people, those who are not burdened by the past, are able to create the new future."

    Another link [www.rg.ru]:

    What will happen to Russian-speaking population who Bandera's followers who control Kiev call traitors? What future awaits Jews if power is seized by people who top the list of world's worst antisemites?

    "We will put on trial and punish everyone who did not support Maidan", - screams in revolutionary rage recently freed ex-PM Yulia Timoshenko. The leader of the party called "Freedom", Oleg Tyagnibok, claimed that the new Ukraine will get the Ministry of Nationality, and the country will create the status of "non-citizens" for Russian-speaking Ukrainians. Additionally, Tyagnibok, who pretends for a PM office, offered to make a law that outlaws the Russian language and assigns criminal penalties for its use."

    One more link [livejournal.com], quoting Tyagnibok:

    On the official forum of Tyagnibok the thread is called "Should we release Donbass and Crimea?" Quote: "In order to create truly Ukrainian Ukraine in cities of East and South, a mere lustration [wikipedia.org] will not suffice. We will have to reject parliamentarism, outlaw all political parties, nationalize all the industry, all media, forbid import of all literature from Russia, forbid printing of anything in Russian, even a textbook, completely replace all the government workers, ministry of education, all military (especially in the East,) physically destroy all Russian-speaking intelligentsia and all ukrainophobes - execute them quickly and without trial. The lists of ukrainophobes in their areas can be compiled by any member of "Freedom". Execute all members of anti-Ukrainian parties and organizations, not only pro-Russian but also pro-Romanian, pro-Hungarian, pro-Tatar.

    Now tell me that those guys are not devout followers of Adolf. All this is done on Twitter and Facebook and the Web, in Ukrainian, so most Western people have no access to those pearls of wisdom.

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  • (Score: 4, Informative) by Angry Jesus on Sunday March 02 2014, @01:51AM

    by Angry Jesus (182) on Sunday March 02 2014, @01:51AM (#9336)

    As far as I can tell, none of those are officially issued statements by "the leaders of Maidan" they are just people spouting off on a website.

    There will always be assholes willing to say outrageous things online (and off) and taking a failure to censor as an endorsement (especially in the middle of all the tumult and distraction of a revolution) does not seem reasonable.

    As for Mikhalchishin and Svoboda, seems like they've got problems but are far from the whole picture. [khpg.org]

    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by tftp on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:28AM

      by tftp (806) on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:28AM (#9353) Homepage

      As far as I can tell, none of those are officially issued statements by "the leaders of Maidan" they are just people spouting off on a website.

      That's what German Jews told each other in 1930s ... The "official" documents on the Final Solution [wikipedia.org] were not discovered until 1947. Waiting for the official memo did no good then, and it will do no good now. The only memo one gets is in form of the arrest warrant.

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Angry Jesus on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:44AM

        by Angry Jesus (182) on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:44AM (#9360)

        I think that's a disingenuous argument. Given the number of people who will surely be killed in a conflict with Russia it seems out of proportion. You might as well argue that the existence of stormfront or the comments section on youtube or that of any american newspaper's website proves the US is secretly planning on conducting pogroms too.

        • (Score: 2, Interesting) by tftp on Sunday March 02 2014, @03:10AM

          by tftp (806) on Sunday March 02 2014, @03:10AM (#9370) Homepage

          Well, it's hard to predict the future. The best you can do is to look into history and learn from that. If someone tells you that your house is on fire, it's a pretty serious concern. You are not likely to debate the personality of the messenger, or to calculate the chances that he may be mistaken. You act immediately. The same applies to the danger of nazism. The problem is that this nationalist thinking is endemic in Western Ukraine. Bandera did not rise out of nowhere. He had followers then, and he has followers now. His portraits are on display in many cities, and many forums are filled with his ideology. Are the fears overblown? Let's hope so.

          With regard to "the number of people who will surely be killed in a conflict with Russia," my prediction is that nobody will be killed, and the whole conflict amounts to players placing their figures into cells into squares of a chess board. Chess figures don't shoot at each other, and don't get damaged. If a stronger figure shows up and makes a move, the defeated figure yields and steps away, to the outside of the board.

          The reason why I think this will be the case is simply because there is nothing to fight for. The territorial divide occurs, and has already occurred, in hearts and minds of the population. The troops can only follow that, as visible markers. There is nobody to shoot, and there is nothing to win if you do shoot. Can you think of any other scenario? If so, please provide your own scenario, with specifics of who exactly would be fighting on one side and on another. IMO, at this point the only fighting force in Ukraine is Maidan's armed groups. The Ukrainian army clearly distanced itself from politics, which seems to be a smart choice. The head of the army was kicked out as one of last political acts of Yanukovich. The police had been spat upon by Ukrainian government, so they won't fight for it either. Who then remains in Russian-speaking provinces who'd like to shoot?

          • (Score: 2) by Angry Jesus on Sunday March 02 2014, @09:30AM

            by Angry Jesus (182) on Sunday March 02 2014, @09:30AM (#9479)

            If someone tells you that your house is on fire, it's a pretty serious concern. You are not likely to debate the personality of the messenger, or to calculate the chances that he may be mistaken. You act immediately. The same applies to the danger of nazism.

            I think that analogy is just outright nuts. It's the kind of thing that betrays a point of view that is not susceptible to reason or logic.

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by WildWombat on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:55AM

        by WildWombat (1428) on Sunday March 02 2014, @02:55AM (#9364)

        "That's what German Jews told each other in 1930s ... The "official" documents on the Final Solution were not discovered until 1947. Waiting for the official memo did no good then, and it will do no good now. The only memo one gets is in form of the arrest warrant."

        I think its now official:

        tftp = Russia's Cold Fjord

        Cheers,
        -WW

        • (Score: 2) by M. Baranczak on Sunday March 02 2014, @03:02AM

          by M. Baranczak (1673) on Sunday March 02 2014, @03:02AM (#9365)

          Thank goodness! Soylent News is now complete.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 02 2014, @07:04AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 02 2014, @07:04AM (#9432)

          I couldn't disagree more, and I think we all know what an ad hominem [wikipedia.org] attack is.

  • (Score: 1) by tirefire on Sunday March 02 2014, @06:26AM

    by tirefire (3414) on Sunday March 02 2014, @06:26AM (#9421)

    ...execute them quickly and without trial. The lists of ukrainophobes in their areas can be compiled by any member of "Freedom"

    Oh shit, I always sided with Freedom in all of the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. games.

    But seriously, thanks a lot for the translations. This is a very interesting/horrifying situation.