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The Argumentum ad Verecundiam is the fallacy of appealing to authority. Specifically, appealing to an inappropriate authority, like people who sell duck calls, or sing and dance when considering national policy.
Actually, an appeal to authority is always problematic, since the reason we are appealing is that we do not know the truth of what we are asserting, but are basing our claim on the opinion of another. Now a proper appeal to an authority would be an appeal to a real authority, someone with knowledge of the truth of our thesis. But if we don't know enough to affirm our claim on our own, we also probably do not know enough to judge whether our "authority" is veridical, or a quack. So, if you can verify an authority, you don't need one. If you need an authority, you are operating on trust, and that trust could be misplaced.
This is why the fallacy is explicit in situations where the alleged "authority" obviously has no more expertise on the question than anyone else, but has stature in some other area. When a celebrity endorses something, this is a case of the ad verecundiam. When a reality TV actor runs for office based on mere name recognition, well, good luck with that.
At one point in history, the Greek Philosopher Aristotle was given the title "The Philosopher", especially by Doctor Angelicus. It was common to end arguments by citing The Philosopher, and adding, "Ipse Dixit", "he himself said so." Appeal to authority, and while Aristotle was no Runaway1956 of philosophers, perhaps this trusted a bit too much. Even Aristotle could be wrong.
This leads to our current problem with ad verecundiam fallacies. We do not have the same knowledge as the expert, but if we recognize there is such a thing as expertise and valuable knowledge that is difficult to obtain, we need to distinguish between actual experts and frauds. This is where the lay public has to rely on the body of experts, such that if the majority of experts agree that some individual is an expert, we can rely on that vouchsafing. This is why doctors, engineers, philosophers, and even lawyers, are trained, educated, and certified by members of their own profession. Anyone who hangs their own shingle, without such recognition, is suspect, like certain alleged eye-doctors in Kentucky.
Now with science, we also rely on professional recognition, though it is a bit more amorphous. Climate change is a area where the majority is clearly on one side. But of course, that still does not mean they could not be wrong, as the history of science teaches us about majority opinions, even among scientists. Of course, that is no reason to go the other way, and deny climate change. This is this going too far with being suspect of authorities, and that is our problem today. Runaway's opinion is as good as anyone's, as an opinion. As a truth, however, it leaves much to be desired. And then there is Dr. Fauci. You see where this is going.
Speaking of Fauci, and the self-licensed Kentuckian,
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the top US infectious diseases expert, on Tuesday defended his guidance to the federal government over how to respond to the Covid-19 outbreak, telling Sen. Rand Paul that "I have never made myself out to be the 'end-all'" and warning against "cavalier" thinking that children could be immune to the disease's effects.
One sign of a proper authority is humility. Non-cavalier.
We have a recent case, when on CNN, Peter Navarro, President Trump's anti-Sinic trade advisor, got into a fight about hydroxychloroquine. Transcript from MSN:
CNN’s Erin Burnett Gets in Bonkers Hydroxychloroquine Fight With Peter Navarro
CNN’s Erin Burnett and White House trade adviser Peter Navarro got in a wild fight over Dr. Anthony Fauci and hydroxychloroquine during their 12-minute interview Wednesday night.It started when Burnett brought up Fauci’s comments from Wednesday morning where the infectious disease doctor said he’s been getting death threats and needs security around his house after he’s become a target during the Covid-19 pandemic.
“Erin, this is just so unacceptable behavior. To me, it’s so un-American. What’s always puzzled me from the onset of this crisis is here we have are the Chinese communist virus effectively sending a virus over here — whether it was done by accident or on purpose, I don’t know — but they send it over here and kill over 150,000 Americans, cause trillions of dollars of damage. Instead of being angry at them, we’re angry at each other. I’ve never seen America—”
Gets better.
"Right, but you’re the one who wrote an op-ed that said Anthony Fauci has been wrong on everything we’ve talked about,” Burnett responded.
“But those are fair policy disputes,” Navarro shot back.
“How is that your lane and stimulus isn’t?” Burnett asked.
Yeah, how?
“Peter, first of all, you’re an economist, not a scientist,” Burnett said as the two talked over each other.
The two began to go back-and-forth over specific studies related to hydroxychloroquine and which doctors agree with them and why. Burnett said five peer reviewed studies show it not to be true, and Fauci and Dr. Deborah Birx don’t recommend taking it, which Navarro took issue to.
“You can’t do this,” Navarro said.
“I need to do this, Peter,” Burnett responded. “What you’re saying is irresponsible.”
Well, there it is. Appeal to actual authorities, like experts in medical science and the consensus of a discipline, rather than the opinion of a crackpot economist dismissed by his peers. Actually, that "economist, not a scientist" has to hurt: Economists for decades have been trying to hold themselves out as the "physicists of the social sciences." But Peter does the ad verecundiam, and very well, as fallacies go.
“All right, let me say this to you,” Navarro said before pausing. “I reach out to all your viewers. Scott Adams — you know Scott Adams, right? He’s the guy who wrote the Dilbert cartoon. He did a beautiful 10-minute video on Twitter, and the thesis of the video is that CNN might be killing thousands because of the way they’ve treated that. So, I would just ask — I’ll let Scott Adams’ video be my defense on this.”
Not a medical doctor, not a scientist, not really even an economist, but if you want proof, here is a cartoonist. And, it was the Chinese!
(Nota Bene: I am not suggesting that cartoonists are not authorities, on the contrary, they can be the only authorities on cartooning, as a discipline. But on malaria medications for a corona virus? That's just "demon sperm" talking. And speaking of medical authority, did you hear about the vaccine made with alien DNA? )
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday August 06 2020, @11:33PM (7 children)
He said he only looks orange because of the new lightbulbs everywhere so he wants to go back to the old ones:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXxacbUEeuA [youtube.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @02:28AM (6 children)
I thought it was CNN's post-processing of Trump video.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @04:38AM (5 children)
No one watches CNN though.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @05:12AM (4 children)
O'Reilly? Long planned vacation, you know. Cucker Tarlsen is next.
(Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @12:16PM (3 children)
Trump just lowered drug prices by 50-90% via executive order and big pharma is trying to have him killed like the guy working on it who beat himself to death a few years ago.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trump-ensuring-essential-medical-supplies-produced-united-states/ [whitehouse.gov]
https://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2018/11/death_of_hhs_official_daniel_b.html [cleveland.com]
https://mobile.twitter.com/josh_wingrove/status/1291464912057901056 [twitter.com]
Yet all you socialists hate him, that is how dumb you are.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 07 2020, @05:23PM (2 children)
You know damn well your drugs haven't gotten any cheaper. So why are you repeating these things that you know are false?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @06:14PM
In other news, Trump has issued an Executive Order stopping Anthropogenic Global Warming. Glad that is taken care of. For previous art, see King Canute [wikipedia.org] who ordered the tides to stop. Or, Xerxes [wikipedia.org], who had the ocean flogged and tossed shackles into the water. That'll teach the ocean to destroy his bridge!!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @10:43PM
I dont take any drugs, or think the government has any place in telling people which they should/could take or how much they should cost. But I doubt the effect on drug prices shows up after 2 days...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday August 06 2020, @11:37PM (2 children)
Every heuristic is a formal fallacy. There is nothing wrong with fallacies/heuristics used properly
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday August 06 2020, @11:49PM
You must be new here? Welcome to argumentum ad Aristarchus.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by aristarchus on Friday August 07 2020, @12:17AM
This is an informal fallacy. Shirley you know that. A formal fallacy is merely an invalid deductive inference. Relying on authority could be an appeal to majority opinion (argumentum ad populam) or a weak inductive argument (Converse Accident), or an argumentum ad ignorantiam. And I believe I did distinguish quite clearly between completely wacko appeals to celebrities or cartoonists, and more reasonable appeals to actual Brain surgeons or Rocket scientists [youtube.com].
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 07 2020, @12:35AM (10 children)
Will the hydroxy-stuff do any good on your asshole? Won't it keep the demon sperm out?
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by aristarchus on Friday August 07 2020, @12:46AM (3 children)
Cain't read the journal, eh, Runaway? Words too big? Concepts too difficult? Thank you for your contribution, and for providing a fitting illustration of exactly why you are the exampla gratia.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 07 2020, @12:56AM (2 children)
My favorite cartoon is right here on Soylent, posting under the name "Aristarchus".
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @01:09AM (1 child)
Awww pathetic boomer humor. I hear reddit has a group dedicated to your work!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @06:53AM
#okmillennial
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @01:44AM (5 children)
? Why do you say such weird shit? What the fuck is the matter with you? You having a stroke? I think you've been snorting that gunpowder
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 07 2020, @01:48AM (4 children)
It's called "mockery". People in public life say insane shit, so you run it through a blender, and feed it back. It isn't supposed to make any sense.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @01:58AM (1 child)
Um, you're not holding it right, Runaway1932! You need to direct the nozzle away from yourself.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 07 2020, @02:07AM
fekkin' Apple . . .
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @02:09AM
You're not doing mockery. That's for sure. You're just saying stupid shit. Try to make it relate, eh?
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Friday August 07 2020, @03:33PM
'Just use fuzzy logic - the kind the fuzz use when they shoot an unarmed man who is running away with a taser they KNOW is inoperative because it's been discharged twice "because I feared for my life."
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: -1, Redundant) by fustakrakich on Friday August 07 2020, @01:27AM (1 child)
9661?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @04:09PM
Offtopic
:-) C'mon Ari, don't be such a spoil sport. Just roll with it and write about it in your novel.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @01:33AM (11 children)
Famous "economists" like Milton Keynes [stupid.news] and Karl Marx have proven "economists" are not scientists. John Maynard Keynes was a civil servant while Karl Marx was a political philosopher and terrible at that too. Not that this will ever stop our leftist friends drinking the
demon spermkool-aid.(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Friday August 07 2020, @02:13AM (1 child)
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @04:17PM
I consider myself on the left...
Yeah, and North Korea considers itself a democratic republic.
Any rational person outside your head will know you're not left!
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @02:50AM (8 children)
Milton Keynes (/kiːnz/) is a city.
The economist is John Maynard Keynes (/keɪnz/).
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Friday August 07 2020, @03:05AM (5 children)
Perhaps our "not even an economist" meant Milton Friedman, of the Chicago School, a neo-liberal (or conservative) economist who helped destroy America. Associated with the Austrian school, Ludwig von Mises and Friedrich Hayek, and others dear to khallow's heart. But the general point about not even being a scientist stands.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @06:55AM (1 child)
Any relation to Selma Hayek?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @01:18PM
Is that Selma Bouvier [wikipedia.org] or Salma Hayek [wikipedia.org]?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @10:55AM (2 children)
Now for the post-modernist assessment. If objective truth is a social construct, criticism of anybody and anything is mere perception and can only apply to oneself. Why are you trying to destroy America Ari?
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 08 2020, @01:30AM (1 child)
If you are going to mock something, it usually helps to understand what it is so things actually stick. Plus, Ari is a selfprofessed Greek, so I doubt he really cares about destroying America since the rest of the world seems to be in agreement that it is doing that just fine on its own.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 11 2020, @11:38AM
Not efficiently enough, though. Probably they like it not only painful but slow too.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 07 2020, @05:10PM (1 child)
He doesn't even know the guy's name but we should definitely trust his evaluation of the research!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @06:57PM
Don't think AOC [youtube.com] uses "he" as a pronoun you bigot!
(Score: 3, Funny) by barbara hudson on Friday August 07 2020, @02:09AM (3 children)
Haven't you seen the orange skull-hugger thing living on Trump's head? Occam's Razor. That the last four years of insanity is the result of a subtle alien invasion is the simplest explanation.
Ever see John Carpenter's "The Thing?" I was shocked, shocked I say, that it was actually a documentary.
Seriously, make a Claymation video with this as the plot and watch a "certain segment of the population " take it as gospel. Because there's far more than one sucker born every minute.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Friday August 07 2020, @02:17AM
Because there's far more than one sucker born every minute.
Hope so... Otherwise the US population will crash [reuters.com]
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by sjames on Friday August 07 2020, @03:12PM (1 child)
I think that thing is more akin to the thing that attached itself to Londo in Babylon 5. That would explain why Trump seems like he's been drinking heavily...
(Score: 2) by barbara hudson on Friday August 07 2020, @03:29PM
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 07 2020, @05:17PM (2 children)
I appreciated your introduction, thanks!
> the fallacy of appealing to authority
Yep, have always wondered about that.
Related?? In the mid-70s a friend had a bumper sticker on his car, "Question Authority" in 3"(75mm) letters. He was a good, calm driver, the car was in good shape, but he could never understand why he was always getting pulled over by the cops...
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Friday August 07 2020, @05:48PM
Perhaps they were helpfully wanting to answer his questions. That'll be it!
Master of the science of the art of the science of art.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 08 2020, @01:34AM
Everybody knows that "Question Authority" bumper stickers smell like marijuana and make it look like your vehicle lights are out.