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The Awful Reign of the Red Delicious:
In the 1870s, Jesse Hiatt, an Iowa farmer, discovered a mutant seedling in his orchard of Yellow Bellflower trees. He chopped it down, but the next season, it sprang back through the dirt. He chopped it down again. It sprang back again. "If thee must grow," he told the intrepid sprout, "thee may."
A decade later, Hiatt's tree bore its first fruit. The apples were elongated globes with red-and-gold striped skin, crisp flesh, and a five-pointed calyx. In 1893, when Stark Brothers' Nursery of Louisiana, Missouri, held a contest to find a replacement for the Ben Davis—then the most widely planted apple in the country, strapping and good-looking but bland—Hiatt submitted his new variety, which he called the Hawkeye. "My, that's delicious," Clarence Stark, the company's president, reportedly said after his first bite.
[...] With its hardy rootstocks and juicy, curvaceous fruit, the Red Delicious quickly became a favorite of growers and consumers from coast to coast—and as its commercial success grew, so did its distance from Hiatt's Hawkeye. In 1923, a New Jersey orchardist wrote to the Starks to report that one limb of a tree he had purchased from the nursery was producing crimson apples while those on the other limbs remained green. A chance genetic mutation that made the apples redden earlier had also given them a deeper, more uniform color, and customers were lining up for a taste. Paul Stark, one of Clarence's sons, travelled up from Missouri and laid down $6,000 for the limb.
[...] Then in the 1990s, new varieties that American growers had originally developed for overseas markets—including the Gala and the Fuji—began to edge into the domestic market. Shoppers had been "eating with their eyes and not their mouths," Burford said. And now their taste buds had been awakened. A sudden shift in consumer preferences, paired with growing competition from orchards in China, took the industry by surprise. Between 1997 and 2000, U.S. apple growers lost nearly $800 million in surplus crop. They had "made the apples redder and redder, and prettier and prettier, and they just about bred themselves out of existence," a marketing director for one Northwestern fruit company told The New York Times, shortly after President Bill Clinton approved the largest bailout in the history of the apple industry.
Since then, Red Delicious production has declined by 40 percent. While the apple is still by far the most common in the U.S.—growers produced 54 million bushels of Red Delicious in 2011, compared to just 33 million bushels of its closest competitor, the Gala—the industry is adjusting to a changing market. Todd Fryhover told me that new quality controls like ethylene inhibitors have helped ensure that apples arrive fresh and crisp in the supermarket, but he also acknowledged that tastes have shifted. Exports of Washington's Red Delicious yield have hovered around 48 percent in recent years. This year, Fryhover recommends that 60 to 65 percent of the apples be shipped abroad. "You can't keep producing the same thing all the time and ignore what people are asking for," he told me.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Saturday February 13 2021, @11:28AM (28 children)
This seems to be a trend in all American food that has been going for a while. Good thing - my experience of American food, even in "good quality" stores and restaurants, has not been a strong one. And I'm a Brit!
(Score: 2) by Revek on Saturday February 13 2021, @11:38AM (15 children)
A brit you say. Is that a statement that the bar started low? My daughter said it was weird going to the store in the UK. In the US there are dozens of chips brands over there its just a few. She said it was pretty much the same with everything.
This page was generated by a Swarm of Roaming Elephants
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:12PM (9 children)
And they're ALL better than the shitty chips you get in America. Prawn motherfucking Cocktail, bitches. Worcestershire Sauce. You can't even SAY that.
(Score: 2) by Subsentient on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:23PM (8 children)
You know, I must admit that despite it all, I take some pride as an American that we have the tastiest, unhealthiest, most epic cornucopia of foods anywhere on Earth. If I ever moved elsewhere, I'd genuinely miss our food. So many delicious ways to clog my arteries and diabeetus out.
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." -Jiddu Krishnamurti
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:54PM (7 children)
British food is epically unhealthy.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:04PM (6 children)
Jesus, people! You're talking about the master race that conquered I mean civilized the world and all you can do is bitch about the food. No wonder we are losing to the Islamic terrorists, and women, and teh gays.
(Score: 2) by EvilSS on Saturday February 13 2021, @08:22PM
Yea, and they did it in search of better cuisine that what they had at home!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @08:38PM (4 children)
A savage cuisine is the sign of a warrior society. Proof: French cuisine is world-renowned for its sophistication and refinement. They lose every war they enter. They are too soft. A society that eats bangers and mash for dinner, bloaters for breakfast, and star gazey pie for special occasions is not to be trifled with.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Saturday February 13 2021, @10:38PM (3 children)
To take the point further: haggis. F**k you all, Scots kick some serious ass.
And Norway. Mouldy fish is their idea of a treat. When was the last time Norway was invaded? Exactly!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @01:28PM (2 children)
Not to mention Black Pudding..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 15 2021, @12:54AM (1 child)
First. World. Problems.
Come back when the African's tell us what part of the animal THEY eat.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 16 2021, @06:41PM
Speaking as an african: whatever fits in the pot. And if we can cut it up, it will fit.
But we mostly avoid snakes, bees and honey badgers. Too much grief.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:22PM (3 children)
As an american going to London, the contrast between convenience stores/sandwich shops is intersting.
In the US, we have 7-11 and the like. Soda, Soda, Soda, Chips, snacks, candy. Coffee. And a few token bunches of bananas. If you're lucky, apples. Sandwich places might have a salad on the menu but it's predominantly something with meat
The the UK there was juice, wine, beer, and a smaller section with soda. Lots of vegetarian type foods. A tiny section w/ chips that was smaller IMO than the fruits & veggies.
I much prefer the UK convenience stores even with the higher prices. Good food isn't cheap.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:06PM (2 children)
You probably went to central London. There are no English people there, only tourists raving about Pret a Manger and the wonderful Italian food.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:20PM (1 child)
To be fair, the 1st time we were next to New Scotland Yard right in the center. The hotel's restaurant was a 4 star. But we did go up to Manchester and elsewhere. On another visit we stayed in Chiswick.
As far as Italian, I'm from Boston, my Father-in-Law is italian and 2 of his sisters owned resturants. One was visited by Billy Joel whenever he was in town.
We ate at a few italian/italian owned restaurants in London. A step above Olive Garden and the chain italian restaurants in the US to be sure, but... Meh.
I was impressed with the food at Hampton Court, Highclere Castle, the British Museum, Chiswick House, Kew Garden compared to food at Boston Museum of Science, New England Aquarium or most other food venues at those types of places in the US.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @10:42PM
"Boston Museum of Science". That place is so decrepit, everything is falling apart from dry rot. It is decades overdue for some remodeling. If the ghost village of Pripyat outside of Chernobyl has a science museum, I'm sure it looks like this.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Saturday February 13 2021, @10:40PM
I agree, UK doesn't have enough crisp brands. I think you are proving my point however.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:23PM (11 children)
Out of curiosity, what part of the USA are you in? Here (eastern Great Lakes) we have competing groceries with excellent tasting produce. It's true that there was an era of tasteless tomatoes and mealy apples, but that's mostly a distant memory now.
Here's another example, our local apple cider mills (sweet cider, not fermented) have a wide variety of apples to choose from and a few of them have a really good "cider master" who determines the mix. When I was a kid in the 60s, the cider was so good that we bought extra at the mill (pressed no more than a few hours before) and froze it quickly before it started to turn (ferment). Then there was a period where the health dep't. clamped down (must have been some bacterial contamination) and insisted on a preservative--at which point we mostly quit drinking sweet cider. Now, there is flash pasteurization which has minimal affect on the flavor and we're back to delicious sweet cider.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:13PM (7 children)
Fuck off, I don't believe you. When's the last time you had tomatoes ripen on the vine**?
You know? Those that bruise if you only look at them and go bad until the next day if you keep it on the shelf - those are an example of excellent tasting produce.
--
** I'll still have such for about next two weeks this season. From my veggie-patch at the back. After that, I'll go buy the sourish, thick skin and extra-firm flesh stuff the green-grocer carry. 'Cause, yeah, they'll need to last at least a week in the warehouses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:23PM (3 children)
They sell tomatoes still on the vine at some stores... Anyway, theres a hell of a lot more to produce than tomatoes.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:30PM (2 children)
Hmm. Isn't this a trick to sell unripened tomatoes that also redden in transit for a higher price?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday February 14 2021, @01:13AM
Also known as truss tomatoes.
Two fold:
1. playing tricks on the meaning of 'ripen on the vine'
2. they sell the vine too on the same price as the tomatoes. 3-5% by weight amounts to something in large quantity
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @01:23AM
Well, the tomatoes ARE all attached via several inches of vine, so if they were picked green and gas ripened at the destination, you COULD claim they were "vine ripened"...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:24PM (2 children)
When was the last time you bought apples? Most of the stores i go to have at least 10-20 different varieties. About the only thing i would use Red Delicious for is cooking. They would hold up very well in that use case. The others with a higher sugar content would burn faster. Apples have a pretty good shelf life of a couple of weeks before they go gross. So you can get a decent variety of them.
Getting 'fresh' tomatoes is about seasonality and region. You hit the farmers market around the end of the summer. Right now, being feburary, it would all be canned/stored stuff. Fruit is the same way. The idea I can have fresh XYZ fruit/veg year round is a semi new idea. They usually store them in HUGE containers and evacuate the oxygen out with nitrogen. Know your season to get 'the good stuff'. Being feburary this is *NOT* that season. Unless you happen to be lucky to live in a area of the country where they can grow year round (hint 95% of the country isnt).
Where I live there are at *least* 10 different competing grocery chains. Never mind the 'farmers market' ones. All the way from bargain basement dollar store stuff to high end 'i think i left my wallet in the store' stuff. Getting good affordable food out of that takes some work and knowing your season. Growing your own works to a point. But I personally live in an apartment. I only have so much room to grow anything at all. Much less feed me and my family for a year.
Also buying ingredients you need to consider your use case. If you are just going to mash then cook them up and throw them in with a bunch of spices and meats getting 'the good stuff' probably will not make much of a difference other than cost. If you are going to chop them up and put them in a nice salad or salsa you want to buy something that is a bit better as that will be the bigger taste. Then pick mushier or crispier depending on use case.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @08:02PM
c0lo is in Oz. We're just coming to the end of the most productive period of tomatoes, although if you have the bushes in a sheltered spot you can continue to get a few for another couple of months. The latest I have picked any was some small, thick-skinned spotty ones in June one year.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday February 14 2021, @06:54AM
Mid February, that is.
The idea that I can have fruit/veg ripen in storage year around is not new either, but it doesn't make the fruits/veg better.
Look, mate, I accept it - there cannot be economy of scale with really good quality fruit and veg, because seasons and only-that-much-shelf-life and whatnot. And since I accept it, it is not the point of my grumble.
My point is: do not try to sell me the idea those are "excellent tasting produce"** - at best is "as good as it gets given the circumstances, be happy if it's good enough".
And no, variety of choice on the market doesn't necessary equate quality.
---
** as in
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:15PM (2 children)
Until you eat a Cox's Orange Pippen off the tree, you haven't eaten an apple. And that's not even an AC cock joke.
(Score: 1) by pTamok on Sunday February 14 2021, @09:21PM (1 child)
That's a Cox's Orange Pippin [wikipedia.org], but spelling aside, yes, YES and thrice YESSSS!!!!
Where I live, I can't get hold of them. Once, in a supermarket, a random bag of discount apples happened to be them, but never again.
I miss Cox's Orange Pippins, and Egremont Russets [wikipedia.org], and being able to get proper Bramleys [wikipedia.org] for cooking, and the very occasional Granny Smith [wikipedia.org] when I want to give my salivary glands a workout and take a layer off my tooth enamel.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 15 2021, @01:15AM
And now you can get that by eating your wife's pussy.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @11:37AM (11 children)
The whole story is probably BS dreamt up by some fruit industry PR-man in the 1880's. Or maybe the author this this piece simply made it up now.
The media add these stories to sell the product. In this case, a PR campaign for/against an apply variety. The fruit industry does this every time it wants more profit by switching variety, utilizing media stories to strong-arm distributors and consumers both into accepting a lower quality or more expensive variety of apple or banana or whatever.
The first step to escaping the influence of propaganda is to be able to recognize it.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @12:44PM (9 children)
So do you have the slightest bit of actual evidence for anything you just said?
Do you even know what "evidence" is? Or is it just your feelz?
(Score: 4, Informative) by c0lo on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:19PM (3 children)
Ummm, I read TFA, found no citations - otherwise an interesting story.
If it comes to credibility, I believe is the claimant who should take the pain to support it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @01:55PM (2 children)
It's old news. 15 years ago there were many people alive who remembered the Red Delicious used to be better. Heck I remember it used to be better and so do others I've asked.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/04/AR2005080402194.html [washingtonpost.com]
Hardly anyone who has eaten other apples thinks it's delicious now.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday February 14 2021, @02:26PM (1 child)
Never had one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @04:26PM
https://nmfruitgrowers.wordpress.com/2010/11/03/apples-whatever-happened-to-my-red-delicious/ [wordpress.com]
https://thecounter.org/history-economics-red-delicious-apples/ [thecounter.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:17PM (3 children)
I heard it was thanks to the strong will and leadership of the Founders who fought for freedom and liberty to bring you red colored apples. For America!!
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:43PM (2 children)
I thought it was created by clever, oppressed workers whose stupid, labor-stealing employers never realized the secret communist message encoded in the REDDEST apple ever to sell around the world.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:09PM (1 child)
Well I heard it was a lone genius who knew a better apple was possible but NOBODY would listen. He also dabbled in architecture, solved Middle East peaces crises and re-imagined the entire Federal government. Before breakfast.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @12:17AM
Jared Kushner?
(Score: 2, Insightful) by khallow on Saturday February 13 2021, @10:17PM
Yes, the cool story, bro. The more boring the story, the more likely it is to be true. It's worth noting that another example of this are the fancy quotations attributed to the famous of those days. Unless you have a direct quote from something written or transcribed at the time (which still exists today, I might add), Abraham Lincoln and George Washington probably didn't say that.
But then again, maybe Pecos Bill really did straighten out the Rio Grande and Paul Bunyan really was 50 feet tall. It's not like I have the "slightest evidence" otherwise, right?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:37PM
Back then a apple breeding program consisted of finding an interesting apple growing somewhere and taking grafts of it. They didn't mix varieties to gets something new like today. With Apples the seeds won't grow the same as the parent. You'll get a different apple, probably a crab apple. Johnny Appleseed's selling of seedlings grown from seed instead of grafting produced a staggering new variety of apples. There were lots of new apples that didn't exist in in the old world
The Baldwin apple was discovered by someone eating an apple growing in some farmers field and letting people know. It became the standard New England apple until it was displaced by the Macintosh.
The guy that promoted the golden delicious famously put a cage around it with a lock to keep it safe.
From what I've read about other apple origins, the story sounds very similar.
There has always been propaganda. Discovering a new variety was worth money back.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Joe Desertrat on Saturday February 13 2021, @01:02PM (9 children)
When I was growing up red delicious apples were crisp, sweet and well, delicious. Sometime between then and now, something changed.
In part, it is because they don't store well. They used to come from local orchards straight to the market. Those orchards are mostly housing or commercial developments now, and the apples are grown in large commercial operations. This increases the handling and storage necessary.
They may also have been selectively (or genetically) modified in order to have thicker skins and store better.
No matter the reason, any red delicious apples I've been suckered into buying over the last few decades have been mealy, thick skinned (with a heavy coating of wax) and as a result poorly flavored.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by zoward on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:00PM (7 children)
This is true of a lot of fruits and vegetables. They've been modified (as you said, either selectively or genetically) to travel and store better, without concern for their taste. Tomatoes are the worst; the difference in taste between heirlooms and typical supermarket tomatoes is amazing. We grow them ourselves or get them at one of the local farm stands.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:15PM (4 children)
Tomatoes are picked while still green. That's the real problem most of the time.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:03PM (2 children)
That is common for a lot of fruit and veggies I believe, I gather they assume it will ripen in transport. Bananas seems to be another one, it's not uncommon to either find them green, partially green or for that matter spotty black in the store. It seems hard for them to actually get them yellow anymore. I gather it's transport issues tho.
That said back to the apples. Don't think they do Red Delicious here. Not that I care that much since I don't really like red apples. I prefer them green. Granny Smith is still nice, the only issue seems to be I can't eat to many of them without getting stomach issues. I guess they are a tad sour.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:10PM
Actually they gasses to get them "ripe"
Safeway has large gassing rooms in warehouses to to change the color to yellow for bananas. Same for Tomatoes.
The only fruit that I known that truly "ripens" after picking is avocados. As long as avocados remain on the tree, they are hard. They do not soften (aka ripen) until they are not longer connected.
Note: soft-ing is rotting. Just like we do not eat fresh meat normally. Cattle after being "dispatched", are clean and age for a few weeks to lower moister and give a more beefy flavor. This aging again is the rotting of meat, but in a controlled way to help breakdown the connective tissues too.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:47PM
In the US, we typically get 1 variety of anything. There are hundreds of types of banana, potato, tomato, corn, cabbages, apples and other produce. Our industrial system dictates they survive mechanical picking, shipping over distance, storage for a time, don't bruise, are the right size and look good at the market.
The most common potato is the Russet Burbank. It tends to get a brown spot if not grown just right. But it has the right starch content & size to be made into french fries. So it's the most common in the US. Other varieties are easier to grow but don't have the other 2 qualities.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @08:40PM
Actually, there are lots of uses for green tomatoes. It's just that letting them ripen after being picked isn't a good one.
(Score: 4, Informative) by c0lo on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:22PM
Letting aside the variety, the tomatoes on the shelf usually ripe in storage - at the quantity the farmers contract, they can't afford to pick them ripe from the vine, they'll spoil by the time they hit the shelf.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Wednesday February 24 2021, @08:58PM
Actually I think garlic is the worst. No matter how many cloves of garlic I put in my meals, it seems I can't approach the level of flavor I used to get with two or three cloves. It wasn't good for social occasions of course, but I miss the occasional meal designed for garlic that would leave you with that pleasant aftertaste...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @08:47PM
Growing conditions have a LOT of effect on the fruit's flavor.
Red delicious apples grown in the South are sweet and actually have some flavor. This is due to the hotter climate. The Red Delicious apples grown in Washington state, the biggest producer, grow in a cool climate. As a result, the fruit has less sugar and flavor.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by DaTrueDave on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:40PM (2 children)
If you haven't tried the new Cosmic Crisp apple, you should. Sweeter and crisper than a Honeycrisp. Pricey, but they say it'll last a year in the fridge.
Right now it's the best apple on the market. I read that the Washington apple industry has bet the bank on this variety, and it looks like they picked a winner.
Unlike the ol' Red Delicious, it's actually delicious. So buy Red Delicious for your kids to give to teachers, and Cosmic Crisps to eat.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:42PM
I haven't been able to find the Cosmic Crisp locally. The best apple variant I can get is the SnapDragon - and at least around me, it's cheaper than HoneyCrisps, too. I have three or four apples each day, which consistently prevents constipation for me.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:45PM
The Honey Crisp not sweet enough? Not crisp enough? What is this Cosmic Crisp, a Honey Crisp cranked to 11?
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:42PM (9 children)
There was an apple tree at the corner of my grandparent's cottage. That tree must have been 100 years old then. There were no branches that I could reach from the ground. I had to scramble up onto the tool shed, then reach up to the first branch. Got into trouble many times for climbing way up in that tree. I would inspect those apples all through the summer, and get a stomach ache from eating green apples too early. When ripe, the apples were a dull brick red, with little brown spots all over them. They were soft for apples, extremely sweet, and juicy as juicy can be. Those apples did not store well.
All of us kids would pig out on apples for as long as they lasted. The adults would gather all of them when they deemed the time to be right, and cook the apples into apple sauce and pie filling. A few apples would go into the root cellar, but they didn't last. In just a few short weeks, the apples would be bruised and mushy, and no one wanted to eat them anymore.
Sorry, I really don't know what kind of apples they were. Little Runaway never cared much about horticulture, never listened to the adults talking about the tree, or much of anything else related to gardening. I can tell you that you've never bought such an apple in the store, unless they were in a can of pie filling.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:01PM (1 child)
My parents built in the far suburbs on what had been a small commercial apple orchard--well past its productive years. Next to the house there were a couple of acres of apple trees with old varieties of apples. To our kid tastes they were all pretty sour/bitter, even when ripened on the tree--so we didn't eat very many. Instead we warmed up for winter snowball fights with apple wars between the neighborhood kids, using the rotting apples on the ground.
After a few years, things escalated and we found that a flexy apple branch would make a good "sling", for lack of a better word. Soft apples were speared on the end of the yard/meter long stick and an overhand swing with a flick would release the apple into a really long arc--excellent for long range bombardment (but terrible accuracy--luckily we never hurt anyone).
The property is still in the family 60+ years later and many of those trees survive. A couple of the taller ones were hit by lightning and split, but one of them (very sad looking) still produces apples!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:50PM
Those sour, bitter apples were grown to make cider. Lousy to eat. Eating apples don't make cider that well either.
(Score: 4, Informative) by c0lo on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:26PM (1 child)
FTFY.
As fixed now, it stands true for any age of your life, now included. (grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 0, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:23PM
Fuck off hater!
(Score: 4, Interesting) by istartedi on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:53PM (4 children)
A 100 year old apple tree is an amazing thing if true. I'm given to understand that few apple trees live that long.
I grew up in a development that was built in the early 1960s. The developers removed a lot of trees, and part of the finishing touches was to re-plant with apple trees. They were all the same variety--a green baking apple that was good for pies but a bit too tart for most people to want to eat raw. Pests loved them of course. I was quite disappointed when my folks replaced our apples with non-fruiting cherries in the late 70s. The 20 year old apple trees were already "old men", though. Perhaps aggressive treatment would have kept them going longer, but it was a suburb not an orchard.
There was a brief window of time where I would ask neighbors for a shopping-bag full of apples that they were happy to get rid of and not have to clean off their lawns. My mom would make a "sour cream" apple pie with some of them. I think there was a lot of sugar in it, LOL; not a health food for sure but so good.
Our next-door neighbor's apple lasted longer but I just checked on Google Street, and it's a bare spot now. I'd be amazed if any of the original developer-planted apples are still there.
Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:02PM (2 children)
I don't really know how old that tree was. I can tell you that it was the tallest, and the largest tree on grandparent's property. At a minimum, it was 25 feet tall, and the canopy spread at least 30 feet, the trunk seemed to be huge. Bearing in mind that I was a short little kid, it was more than twice as far around as I could reach with arms spread wide. In a lifetime since, I've seen very few apple trees as large, or larger, so I assume that it had to be pretty old.
A search for life expectancy of an apple tree gives varying answers - starting with "approximate expected productive life" of 20 to 40 years. You're probably right, in that a tree still bearing fruit was almost certainly less than 75 years old. ;^)
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:20PM
It generally comes down to the rootstock. If you're planting a fast return bulk orchard, you're probably planting a thousand or more trees per acre, dwarfing or super dwarf rootstock. They'll start bearing in five years or less, but they'll need support to stand up, and in 25 years they'll be toast.
If you're planting for the next generation, you're planting on a full size rootstock, and you won't get much in the first decade - but the tree should last a century, without needing much in the way of support, and a couple of hundred per acre is as much as you can fit.
Farmers like the shorter ones because of the faster turnaround, and because they're the right height for a team of pickers sitting on a trailer being dragged along by a tractor.
(Score: 3, Informative) by istartedi on Sunday February 14 2021, @07:48AM
I did a little more googling too, and yes Virginia, you can have a 100+ year old producing apple tree! The trees that developer planted were most likely the inexpensive fast turn-around orchard variety another poster described. I remember the bark on those trees welting up and peeling off, and I think that might be the "canker" this one article was talking about.
I can't complain about the developer too much. We lived in 3 different houses in that community, two of which I'm old enough to remember. They seemed like quality houses compared to today, and that's what matters.
Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @05:34AM
If you're ever in BC in the summer, check out the Broken Island Group. There's an abandoned orchard with 20-30 trees, which are 150-180 years old now iirc, of which most were planted but a few are natural from seed, and many still grow apples. Zero clue what kinds of apple, but at least some taste great.
The farmhouse and barn there gave been gone 50-100 years, and wasn't actively worked since iirc the 1870s.
Somehow they haven't fully overgrown either - maybe the rare tourists who tromp down the brush are enough.
(Score: 2) by bzipitidoo on Saturday February 13 2021, @02:49PM (2 children)
This new variety, Honeycrisp, has been pushed hard. I don't like them. Tastes like candy in a bad way, costs lots more, doesn't store as well or last as long. Much rather have Red Delicious than Honeycrisp. I definitely don't agree with calling the reign "awful", I like Gala and Fuji even better, yet Red Delicious is still very good. And much depends on how fresh an apple is.
Haven't seen Golden Delicious lately, seems Opal has displaced that variety.
(Score: 1) by lonehighway on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:52PM
Opal is a hybrid of Golden Delicious and Topaz. Opal is an excellent apple IMO.
(Score: 2) by legont on Sunday February 14 2021, @03:01PM
I like honey crisp the most. I don't buy them in supermarkets though, but on farms. Unfortunately the farm I usually go to pick up my own in the summer does not allow me to pick them up. It's the only exception on the farm so I guess they have a large market. The apple actually stores well but sensitive to even minor hits. If one works with them carefully, they are good till January in my experience.
"Wealth is the relentless enemy of understanding" - John Kenneth Galbraith.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:06PM (2 children)
Whatever the variety of whatever - be it apples, pears, avocados, bananas, tomatoes... you can bet on one thing: the varieties you find at the supermarket is tasteless. That's because the fruits and vegetables sold in supermarket are designed to withstand shipping and extend shelf life, not to be good. And in the case of tomatoes and bananas, it's just not about being good: most supermarket tomatoes are barely edible.
Try fresh fruits and veggies if you can: you'll immediately taste what you're missing on with supermarket varieties.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:16PM
> And in the case of tomatoes ... it's just not about being good: most supermarket tomatoes are barely edible.
Our good supermarket has "Flavor Bombs" brand cherry tomatoes. They come on the vine, from a greenhouse. Packed in a semi-rigid clear plastic box (like berries) which solves the problem of getting smashed in shipping (and we have curbside recycling for the plastic--so that isn't awful).
These have been consistently good for a few years, just finishing off a box now. They are nearly as good as the "Sweet 100" cherry tomatoes we grow in the summer and pick when ripe.
(Score: 2) by dwilson on Sunday February 14 2021, @12:28AM
Bullshit. You're painting yourself in to the same corner the bread snobs are in. "Oh, real bread is so amazing. Oh, if you used a bread maker you didn't make real bread, that's not real bread you should be ashamed."
Last one of those I ran in to, I told: fuck straight off, ute osser. As for you, an explanation:
Tomatos and Bananas from the supermarket taste somewhat less than they should. Not a lot less. Not inedible. Not barely edible. 'somewhat'. If I'm hungry, I'll eat them and be thankful, because it's better than not having them.
That said, I'll prioritize the ones I grow myself. Just like I prefer the bread I bake myself. Baked in an oven, mixed in a breadmaker, because fuck that by-hand bullshit.
Jesus Mohammad, the fucking snobs will be the end of us. [xkcd.com]
- D
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:49PM (4 children)
Bananananananas! All the way, baby! (Although, there are big differences in them. Got some from Costco that are good: delicious and lasted a long time ripe. Others, not tasty, don't last long....)
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @03:57PM (2 children)
Slice them, freeze them in an ice cube tray so they don't lump together. Use to make smoothies.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:29PM (1 child)
Sprinkle with Vitamin C powder to make them not darken (oxidize.) Also a little sugar and vanilla for flavor.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:10PM
Serve with vodka.
(Score: 2) by nostyle on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:38PM
Bananas (i.e. the Cavendish monocultural type) tend to be way too sweet for my tastes, however if you take a bite of strawberry with each bite of banana, the sweet and tart balance perfectly. Alternatively, if you can find the Lady Finger variety, they have more natural tartness. Oh to be back in Hawaii!
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Is it just me, or are bananas are almost as musical as beans?
(Score: 2) by nostyle on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:48PM (3 children)
My preference is for tart apples. Growing up, it was the Winesap - yum. These days I always have a dozen Granny Smith in the fruit bowl.
I never understood what people liked about the Delicious ones - red or golden - except that they are loaded with sweetness, if you cotton to that sort of thing. Even so, I try one every so often to verify that they continue to be boring.
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So much variety! So little time!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @04:59PM (2 children)
The local farm has a few rows of Winesaps that I like. Otherwise my default apple purchase has been Granny Smith. I like tart, non-mealy apples.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:49PM (1 child)
Granny Smith is too hard and too sour. It is a cooking apple, made for pies and such.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @05:38AM
Granny Smiths today aren't what they were in the 90s. They're tart but much sweeter and less astringent now. Also larger and more inclined to yellow a bit.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:19PM (1 child)
And tastes like damp, moldy, old dishrags. Why-in-the-fsck is Red Delicious [NOT!] still being produced? They should at least change the name to "Red Yuck".
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @07:28PM
They are fairly good for cooking with. As the higher sugar content in the other varieties burn quicker. So you could get a recipe from you sweet old grandma that says to cook the pie for 20 mins at 325. You pull it out and burnt. Because your grandma forgot to put in the variety of apple and you bought that one you really like with more sugar in it. So it need to cook for less time. But because you cooked it for less time the crust is now not right...
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Subsentient on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:20PM (1 child)
Every time I get my hands on a red "delicious" and take a bite, I'm treated to a shockingly bitter, chewy skin, and a chalky and powdery fruit with a sickly-sweet taste.
It's a genuinely unpleasant experience.
We do often buy gala. They're pretty good. The ones I really love, however, are called "envy". They are the best apples I've ever had by far. They're well named.
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." -Jiddu Krishnamurti
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 13 2021, @05:30PM
Yes, TJ's Envy are good. Put the in the fridge - even better cold.
(Score: 2) by srobert on Saturday February 13 2021, @09:05PM (1 child)
Whenever, I look for apples at the grocery, I look for Jonathans. They usually don't have those so I then go for a Granny Smith or a McIntosh. If all they have is "red delicious", then I forget the apples and go look at the oranges.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2021, @05:42AM
I wish I could get jonathons or macintoshes or even jonagolds here. :(
(Score: 2) by Muad'Dave on Tuesday February 16 2021, @02:35PM
I have been smitten with the Ambrosia [stemilt.com] apple lately. Very good indeed. I also like Empire [stemilt.com] apples. My wife is a Gala fan.