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Journal by khallow
Given how often libertarians are mentioned here, I thought this would be interesting. And maybe there's some people with a lot more insight into what's going on.
A few months back (May 29), the national leadership of the Libertarian Party (the "Big L" political party, not the "small l" belief system) was taken over by a group called the "Mises Caucus". While their platform seems to be a mundane version of a normal platform.
In recent days, there's several state level "rebellions" which seems to indicate that the schism between the old guard and them isn't going away any time soon.
For me, they do seem to tilt at absolutist windmills rather than do stuff they want done - which is a common libertarian flaw. And the implicit emphasis on Mises economics is a huge problem for me. Their stance against vaccination and supporting Trump's allegations of election fraud seem pretty shifty.
OTOH, the previous leadership didn't seem all that interested in libertarianism. Maybe this will shake things up in a useful way?
So what are peoples' takes on this?
A few months back (May 29), the national leadership of the Libertarian Party (the "Big L" political party, not the "small l" belief system) was taken over by a group called the "Mises Caucus". While their platform seems to be a mundane version of a normal platform.
In recent days, there's several state level "rebellions" which seems to indicate that the schism between the old guard and them isn't going away any time soon.
For me, they do seem to tilt at absolutist windmills rather than do stuff they want done - which is a common libertarian flaw. And the implicit emphasis on Mises economics is a huge problem for me. Their stance against vaccination and supporting Trump's allegations of election fraud seem pretty shifty.
OTOH, the previous leadership didn't seem all that interested in libertarianism. Maybe this will shake things up in a useful way?
So what are peoples' takes on this?
What's happening with the US Libertarian Party?
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The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Do not use if foil seal is broken.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 22 2022, @07:19PM (24 children)
That's because you're in denial of responsibility for your personal choices. Single voters are united, their (and your) unity is what's being reflected, and like most, you are just passing blame. You are responsible for your misfortunes
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday September 25 2022, @12:29AM (23 children)
Why don't you establish that first rather than just say it? What does responsibility mean here anyway?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday September 25 2022, @09:58PM (22 children)
You just need to accept the fact that you are a willing cog in the machine. Sometimes you need to be the wrench. That would be better than making excuses
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday September 25 2022, @11:27PM (21 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 26 2022, @05:53AM (20 children)
But you don't think for yourself. You just make excuses for the corruption you constantly reelect.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday September 26 2022, @09:55AM (19 children)
I keep hearing that, but then here's your argument:
No, I don't. That's your bullshit speaking. The obvious rebuttal here is that we know how elections work and they are obviously weak control mechanisms at best. It's profoundly stupid to expect to handle everything in society through them, and then inevitably, blame the voters for failing to have the degree of control over the system that elections won't give. It's a dysfunctional argument that has no place in rational discussion.
Instead, go with stuff that works. For example, the corporation - both for profit and non profit - is a decent group organizing system that gets used everywhere. The Libertarian Party itself is one such organization. The media site I referenced, reason.com is another. SoylentNews is a third.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 26 2022, @07:33PM (18 children)
If your effort to produce more excuses you conveniently ignore the pure animal psychology that drives you to follow the herd, and that with humans, it's a personal choice, even if it is subconscious and primal
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 26 2022, @07:35PM
That should be, "In your efforts..."
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday September 26 2022, @08:40PM (16 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 26 2022, @11:03PM (15 children)
Then you are free to stop any time. And of course you use the typo to distract attention... Perfectly natural. You "do like they do on the Discovery Channel"
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday September 27 2022, @12:04AM (14 children)
I'm not the one asserting stuff in the presence of counterevidence and just getting elections wrong.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 27 2022, @06:37AM (13 children)
You have no counterevidence, you only have party propaganda
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday September 27 2022, @10:48AM (12 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 27 2022, @10:14PM (11 children)
Again, you are saying nothing. Just making excuses
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday September 27 2022, @11:52PM (10 children)
At this point, you have yet to present even the slightest reason why we should care what you think of this thread. I certainly don't care about your meaningless insistence that facts and reasoning are somehow excuses and propaganda. That insistence just signals that you have nothing to say.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday September 28 2022, @05:36AM (9 children)
:-) You obviously care enough to write great volumes of text to "refute" what you claim is "nothing".
But I can do it with a much lower word count. Anyway, you're wrong and I'm right. That says everything
(Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday September 28 2022, @11:32AM (8 children)
Now you have moved the goalposts from my alleged inability to think for myself. And what's the point of putting "refute" in quotes? In this entire discussion - journal and every comment in here - you are the only one to mention the word. So you aren't quote it nor even scare quoting it. This just illustrates your profound mental dysfunction.
Try doing it with zero word count next time. As to the latter claim, you have said nothing in support your claims here. That tells us who is more right. It's not the person claiming to "do it" with a lower word count and no rational argument.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday September 28 2022, @08:29PM (7 children)
Mother nature doesn't need my support. When you free your mind of the bankers servitude, you will will understand exactly. Up to now you just speak mumbo-jumbo
(Score: 1) by khallow on Wednesday September 28 2022, @10:54PM (6 children)
Your argument desperately needs a lot of support. There's a one word description of your sort of argument that has no basis in fact or reason: bullshit. No scare quotes either.
I saw that movie too - when I was eight. I've grown up since. I discovered that cool narratives like that get their asses whupped by facts - such as how elections actually work and people act. I think what's most annoying about your bullshit is that you have no example anywhere in the real world of an election or democracy working the way you stated in this thread that it should. But I suppose that's my fault too, right? My mental failwaves are corrupting elections all over the place and time.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday September 28 2022, @11:44PM (5 children)
Your denials are very amusing, but the rules are unbreakable, you are always responsible for the choices you make. Everybody else is responsible for their own too
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday September 29 2022, @12:02AM (4 children)
"Rules"? Care to describe that?
LOL, I guess you've never heard of externalities.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 29 2022, @09:48PM (3 children)
"externalities"
Ah yes, the new euphemism for excuse... Oh well, keep 'em coming, I guess. All you have is nothing but a bottomless pit of excuses
(Score: 1) by khallow on Friday September 30 2022, @12:09AM (2 children)
It must be a real chore to tell you anything you don't want to know/learn. If we look at the posts rather than just put the blinders on, externalities are the classic way someone dodges responsibility - by imposing cost on someone else.
Moving on, there's so much brain damage in your posts, I see, for example, that you conflate the collective choice of elections with the individual choice of a vote, speak in terms of "denials", "propaganda", and "excuses" completely abandoning good faith argument in the process, babble about "thinking for yourself" while demonstrating that you can't, bragging about a low word count when I point out the absence of rational argument, and constantly accusing me of voting for corruption when I don't.
My take is that you're just another clueless blowhard on the internet that heard some saying about elections when they were eight years old and have been forcing the world into that bizarre viewpoint ever since.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday September 30 2022, @04:46PM (1 child)
Always fun seeing someone argue with you till you get angry. Keep on with your fantasies I guess, capitalism has gone so far off the rails now literally threatening the survival of modern society. Sadly you're so caught up in the propaganda you have a million *ahem* externalities to point at as if reality hasn't become glaringly clear. Being a naive member of the current rightwing death cult is not a winning strategy.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday October 02 2022, @10:48AM
The greatest threat presently to modern society is Putin's nuclear force. It was built by a totalitarian government and since passed on to another authoritarian government. No capitalism involved - and no, state capitalism isn't capitalism.
Past that, we're doing pretty well with the best improvement in the human condition ever. That's the "going so far off the rails" of capitalism. I think we'd be challenged to find any other human tool with the success record of capitalism bad-mouthed as much.
I shouldn't be surprised that someone who can't get basic facts about elections right, fails in the same way with capitalism. Ignorance never is just one spot.
I'm not a member, naive or otherwise.