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from the it-could-be-used-to-make,-well,-anything! dept.
FedEx is refusing to ship Texas nonprofit Defense Distributed's computer controlled mill, the Ghost Gunner. The $1,500 tool can carve aluminum objects from digital designs, including AR-15 lower receivers from scratch or more quickly from legally obtainable "80 percent lowers".
When the machine was revealed last October, Defense Distributed's pre-orders sold out in 36 hours. But now FedEx tells WIRED it's too wary of the legal issues around homemade gunsmithing to ship the machine to customers. "This device is capable of manufacturing firearms, and potentially by private individuals," FedEx spokesperson Scott Fiedler wrote in a statement. "We are uncertain at this time whether this device is a regulated commodity by local, state or federal governments. As such, to ensure we comply with the applicable law and regulations, FedEx declined to ship this device until we know more about how it will be regulated."
But buying, selling, or using the Ghost Gunner isn't illegal, nor is owning an AR-15 without a serial number, says Adam Winkler, a law professor at UCLA and the author of Gunfight: The Battle over the Right to Bear Arms in America. "This is not that problematic," he says. "Federal law does not prohibit individuals from making their own firearms at home, and that includes AR-15s."
Defense Distributed's founder Cody Wilson argues that rather than a legal ambiguity, FedEx is instead facing up to the political gray area of enabling the sale of new, easily accessible tools that can make anything-including deadly weapons. "They're acting like this is legal when in fact it's the expression of a political preference," says Wilson. "The artifact that they're shipping is a CNC mill. There's nothing about it that is specifically related to firearms except the hocus pocus of the marketing." Wilson, whose radically libertarian group has pursued projects ranging from 3-D printed guns to untraceable cryptocurrency, says he chose to ship his Ghost Gunner machines with FedEx specifically because the company has a special NRA firearm industry membership. But when he told a local FedEx representative what he'd be shipping, he says the sales rep responded that he'd need to check with a superior. "This is no big deal, right? It's just a mill," Wilson says he told his FedEx contact. "You guys ship guns. You've shipped 3-D printers and mills, right? You'll ship a drill press, right? Same difference."
(Score: 5, Insightful) by ikanreed on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:06PM
From point to point within the United States of America, they do. Everything else they ship internationally, but much of the rest of the world doesn't view firearms as just another purchase.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Ethanol-fueled on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:13PM
The item in question is a CNC mill, not a goddamn gun.
Just wait until you order your 3-D printer looking forward to prototyping that new mouse design of yours only to be rejected shipment because the item you are ordering could very possibly used to make something that just may hurt somebody.
And before you brag that you're not in the U.S., our influence means that your country will handle such situations similarly if they don't already, and misguided inventors and other useful idiots who are in favor of gun control are now on the short-end of the shit-stick. Ain't poetic justice a bitch?
Freedom means that other people are free to do things you don't like, and as long as they're not fucking with you, you shouldn't give a shit what their hobbies are and what they do with them.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by dyingtolive on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:18PM
Makes me wonder if they're fine with shipping firearm quality metal ingots, lest someone on the other side have a shop with a mill already set up.
Don't blame me, I voted for moose wang!
(Score: 4, Informative) by VLM on Wednesday February 25 2015, @06:06PM
firearm quality metal ingot
Machinists would call that bar stock as its usually in long bars of various shapes.
Marketing people and total noobs call it "billet" which is a technical term for something entirely different yet still "sorta metal" related. Its a shibboleth indicating noob-ness and gullibility.
And fedex does get all bent out of shape about metal orders, there are quite a few rules about total mass and dimensions that they don't like.
I needed a big (expensive) slab of brass for a project once any they are not amused at something the shape of brick that weighs as much as a salt bag.
This is the only time I've ever heard of fedex caring about guns. I don't gunsmith but everyone who machines knows someone who gunsmiths, and I've never heard anything about barrel chamber reamers being forbidden and those tools are used specific on various firearms. I think its Brownells who rents stuff like that like old fashioned postal netflix for specialized firearm tools.
UPS certainly doesn't care about my machine tools or expendables or metal as long as various weight and length regs are respected.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday February 26 2015, @05:43AM
That's a good point. If Fedex doesn't want your business, give it to UPS.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 3, Touché) by ikanreed on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:19PM
I am in the US, just not an abject moron. Sorry for your problems.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by evk on Wednesday February 25 2015, @07:09PM
I do agree that it seems rather silly not to ship a CNC milling machine within USA. Since 1. It's not a weapon. 2. Weapons are more or less freely available in the country anyway.
However, gun control laws are a much more tricky question. It's the "as long as they're not fucking with you" part that mess things up. We are not living in our own isolated universes and your hobbies might cause problems for others in lots of ways, even if that's not your intention. So some things a society must regulate.
I agree that the world is currently heading in the wrong direction regarding freedom, but absolute freedom is simply not possible.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday February 26 2015, @03:44AM
... and as long as they're not fucking with you, you shouldn't give a shit...
That's an awfully big "as long as", isn't it?
(Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:43PM
"You guys ship guns"
No, they don't: per FedEx's Prohibited Items Policy [fedex.com]
Firearms 1.Carrier will transport and deliver firearms as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S., but only between: i.Licensed importers; licensed manufacturers; licensed dealers; licensed collectors; law enforcement agencies of the U.S. or any department or agency thereof; and law enforcement agencies of any state or any department, agency or political subdivisions thereof;
ii.Where not prohibited by local, state and federal law, from individuals to licensed importers, licensed manufacturers or licensed dealers (and return of same).
I'm guessing that standard has not been met...
(Score: 3, Touché) by ikanreed on Wednesday February 25 2015, @05:47PM
Oh, so I oversimplified. In the US, with proper permitting then.
I apologize, I suspected that, but didn't want to overstate my case.
(Score: 2, Funny) by AnonTechie on Wednesday February 25 2015, @07:58PM
You guys ship Microsoft Products. Aren't they way more harmful ??
Albert Einstein - "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
(Score: 3) by c0lo on Thursday February 26 2015, @04:05AM
Mmmm... I don't know.
Now, this quote is old enough (1992 [google.com]), but not that old as to discount the presence of Microsoft products on a computer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford