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Headlines claim "Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer Kidnap Plot Busted By FBI". Virtually all stories include the claim that it was a "right wing extremist" group responsible.
The very first problem with the claims center on the FBI. The FBI has a history of entrapment-like "investigations", where simple minded fools without the means to accomplish their goals are offered said means by the FBI. The FBI invariably arrest some village idiots after said investigations, to make an example of them.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/dec/12/newburgh-four-fbi-entrapment-terror
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/peteraldhous/fbi-entrapment
A cursory glance at the early stories shows that the fools plotting to kidnap Whitmer had little idea what they were even talking about. Their talk of "200 men" and the need to purchase explosives directly from an FBI informant already makes the story smell of fish.
But, the "white supremacist" and "right wing" nonsense is being laid low, regardless of the village idiot's capabilities.
It turns out Brandon Caserta, one of anarchists who was arrested for plotting to kidnap Whitmer, actually hates President Trump and is on video calling Trump a “tyrant.”
And now there is evidence a second “rightwing” militia member attended at least one Black Lives Matter protest and was sympathetic to George Floyd and BLM protesters.
So we have not one, but TWO Antifa/BLM protesters involved in this "right wing" plot? Interesting, to say the least!
It turns out Brandon Caserta, one of anarchists who was arrested for plotting to kidnap Whitmer, actually hates President Trump and is on video calling Trump a “tyrant.”
“Trump is not your friend dude,” Caserta said.
He says Trump is “a tyrant” and calls President Trump an “enemy.”
The media, with the FBI being complicit, is playing the American public for a bunch of fools here. "Anarchist" do not equate to "right wing" or to "white supremacy".
I can grant that self proclaimed anarchists may have ulterior motives that they keep hidden until they have destroyed the existing government. Given that possibility, how did everyone jump to the conclusion that these particular anarchists are either "right wing" or "white supremacist"? Wouldn't it be just as easy to surmise that these fools are socialists, left wing militants, and/or communist activists?
Maybe, just maybe, these self proclaimed anarchists are really and truly anarchists? Maybe they don't care about left or right, maybe they don't care about black or white. All they want to see is government come tumbling down?
As usual, the public is being played. Mainstream Media has it's agenda, it has it's narrative, and that's all you're going to see when you tune in to "News at 11:00".
And, the FBI. That clown outfit is working hard to shed any credibility it may have. In the last election, the FBI worked hard to protect the D candidate, right up until the last days, then Comey turned on his mistress. Now, the FBI seems to be on track again, protecting the D narrative, and attacking the R, just before the election.
EDIT:
Credit to Magic Oddball's post here - https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=39975&page=1&cid=1062216#commentwrap
The BBC has a better rundown on the various groups that may (or may not) be involved here. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54470427
EDIT #2:
AC linked to this video below, it is well worth watching -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWN3FQGfkWw
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @04:04PM (16 children)
https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/local/2020/10/10/michigan-sheriff-spotted-at-rally-with-men-charged-in-scheme-to-kidnap-kill-governor/ [clickondetroit.com]
This story is vague about leanings but there were two brothers protesting the stay-at-home order.
The funniest outcome here would be that a bunch of left-wing and right-wing folks came together, sang kumbaya, and got nabbed by the FBI for some edgy chat logs that totally constitute a terroristic plan to kidnap the Guv'ner.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @11:47AM (13 children)
Read the Overstock CEOs story, FBI tries to blackmail and control all sides. Even when he made up a story about raping a Russian woman and plotting her murder he still got the go ahead if it would give them an excuse to spy on presidential candidates:
https://www.deepcapture.com/2020/10/finale-the-deep-states-hillary-clinton-bribery-blackmail-sting-the-maria-butina-rape-murder-gambit/ [deepcapture.com]
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:08PM (8 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:31PM (7 children)
It says dont read if you are easily offended by swearing and such. Seems thats an obstacle to you?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday October 11 2020, @05:32PM (6 children)
In other words, the typical drama of Tuesday on the internet. I notice that when you "disagree", you get sent to the SEC's website for some reason.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @06:18PM (5 children)
Ok, guess you prefer to not learn new information due to a polite popup apologizing for bad language used in the site.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @03:40AM (4 children)
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @12:49PM (3 children)
Can't learn to click past bullshit, eh? Looks like the whiner is you, who would rather stay ignorant than be taken in by a button
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @10:46PM (2 children)
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @11:09PM (1 child)
Thank you! You make me feel very sane
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @12:08AM
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:14PM (1 child)
Cool story bro.
I wonder if the author survived. Seems he didn't do a very good job of following the instructions the MIB gave him to forget about the whole thing. I loled when I got to the part about Michelle Obama.
WTF is it about powerful women that makes white boys lose their minds?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @05:32AM
He sold all his stock and moved to SE asia and is waiting to see if the corruption is cleaned up.
Hes commenting on that blog post and here: https://mobile.twitter.com/PatrickByrne [twitter.com]
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @07:52AM (1 child)
I'm not sure what to say about your link. I got past the stupid disclaimer popup and started reading. You quickly run into a statement that if you want to understand the story, you have to read a list of other articles. And, that list of articles will only help you to understand the second half of an epic? Somehow, I fail to understand why the author can't make her point in a single rather long page. I scroll down, to find more disclaimers.
I dunno - this is feeling kinda creepy. We all read a lot of crazy crap on the internet, and this feels like it's going to dive into and out of crazy, repeatedly. An executive summary would be good. I'm just not diving into this mess to figure stuff out.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @01:41PM
Just look up Maria Butina and understand that Patrick Byrne was her boyfriend. So he was at the center of the entire russiagate thing. He says he was told by the FBI to befriend/seduce her.
(Score: 1, Troll) by DeathMonkey on Monday October 12 2020, @04:14PM (1 child)
If simply advocating for these murderous fuckwits was enough to get you rounded up by the FBI then Runaway would've been nabbed a while ago.
No, simply encouraging and defending rightwing terrorism is still protected speech as we can see by Runaway's continued propaganda.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @04:56PM
So the new orders from the DNC are to throw BLM and trump haters under the bus and call them right wing now?
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @04:17PM (5 children)
Anybody who uses The Gateway Pundit as a source IS a village idiot.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @04:28PM (4 children)
Yet they have the videos to back them up. Maybe you are secretely the village idiot?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @04:51PM (3 children)
Videos and audios can be doctored as you well know.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @05:08PM (1 child)
Anonymous Coward can also be doctored from Moscow or Beijing as you well know.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @05:25PM
Ok Runaway.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @07:04PM
Videos posted before the arrests? Totally deepfakes.
But we can totally trust F.I.B. They wouldn't lie or misrepresent the truth.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @04:43PM (1 child)
> "Anarchist" do not equate to "right wing" or to "white supremacy".
Minarchism is a perfectly acceptable position but never go full Ancap! Some anti-government types are right wing, but it's strange that this is what the press focus on when anarcho-communist Antifa get fashion spreads in the NYT.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @05:18PM
Tim Pool [youtube.com] just covered this.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @05:15PM
#FBI #NSA #CIA #USPS #FoundYalQaeda
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @06:24PM (8 children)
Half the country, following the Religion of the D, will eat it up and feel happy that they've already sent in their mail in ballots for Biden (and first woman president Harris!) before any uncomfortable, uncensorable facts may intrude before election day.
The other side really needs to get out the vote this year. Deep red flyover parts of states can make the difference in the presidential election. Even in a normal year, only maybe 5% pay attention and keep an open mind as the election approaches. And this year, with the shutdown of life in Democrat run states and a few others, frank and personal political discussions with acquaintances and colleagues are greatly hampered. Pretty much everyone is just getting their information from their chosen bubble.
IMO, the republicans have failed to plan ahead for the tech giants' censorship. Both parties are obviously moribund and morally bankrupt, but there is more money and assistance being showered upon the democrat side by interested groups.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @06:29PM (6 children)
They might need to do that to ensure Trump wins Iowa. Which says a lot about Trump's chances of getting reelected.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Saturday October 10 2020, @07:29PM (5 children)
There's going to be a more reliable poll in about 3 weeks now. Forget about all the faux polls published by one sycophant or another.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @09:02PM (3 children)
Hehe, yeah. I'm betting all those too afraid, lest they lose their job, to go on record that they prefer Trump finally come out when it counts.
I hope.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @03:31AM (2 children)
And then, in Trump's second dysentary, lose their jobs and die of Covid-19.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @08:30AM (1 child)
You know, there's a vast world of people under age 80 out there.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @11:50AM
If even one person dies of covid it is too much. If we need to test 7 billion people every day for $100 per test to stop one death we should do It.
But do not give anyone vitamin c or the fbi will raid your office.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday October 12 2020, @04:39PM
It keeps declaring the guy with the fewest votes the winner. That's not very reliable!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @11:05PM
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Saturday October 10 2020, @07:38PM (7 children)
Yeah, and Jeffrey Dahmer was vegan, and North Korea is a democratic republic...
Still wagging the dog...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @07:55PM (3 children)
Nope, the narrative collapse is that they represent "the right" when in reality they're anti-government extremists... like BLM and Antifa. Watch the Tim Pool video where he walks you through it.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @11:22PM (2 children)
Could we, perchance, agree that their plot to kidnap a sitting Governor is treasonous, regardless of their political motivation(s)?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @12:37AM
https://law.justia.com/codes/michigan/2012/chapter1/constitutionofmichiganof1963/constitution-i/articlei22/ [justia.com]
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @11:12PM
Depends how serious the plot was. We'll see if there was anything to these allegations.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Runaway1956 on Saturday October 10 2020, @08:30PM (2 children)
I can't say you're "wrong". The question is, which tail is wagging that dog? Walk behind that canine, and count the tails - he looks like Medusa from this angle.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Saturday October 10 2020, @09:12PM
There's only one, the coalition
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Saturday October 10 2020, @09:54PM
I'm guessing the tail in front [discovery.com].
(Score: 3, Informative) by c0lo on Saturday October 10 2020, @10:29PM (63 children)
DHS too thinks you're a fool, Runaway (and they're likely to be right given the sites you use to corrupt your brain, deep)
From the BBC link
Oh, no, those Brits have an agenda and a narrative. That can't be good for the American patriots, can it?
(grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Saturday October 10 2020, @11:08PM (62 children)
You seem to be intentionally overlooking the whole point. Dems, MSM, and various agencies of the government have a lot to gain, if they ascribe all "violence" and "terrorism" to the "extreme" right. After 4 months of rioting in Portland, few in government accepts that there actually is any rioting or violence happening. Thus, there is zero "threat" from the left. Pretend that anarchists are really right wing, and there you have it - the ONLY threat comes from the right wing.
If BLM/Antifa successfully bomb the Federal Building out of existence tonight, that will justify rounding up anyone and everyone associated with "right wing extremism".
You better double check your own credentials, or you may be facing a Julian Assange style extradition to the US.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @11:41PM (7 children)
Or, you are starting to get worried, you violence-advocating right-wing nut-job, Runaway1956 coward!!
There is no antifa, the Weatherman never left the '60's, Trotsky is dead, there is no credible violent left. Fox News and the increasingly fascisitic pretend president have a lot to gain by maintaining the fiction that the left is violenct. But it is all fake news, and you have been completely taken in by it, you complete Maroon! How are your plans to kidnap Sen. Cotton coming along?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 10 2020, @11:49PM
Don't get caught, ari. We'd miss you?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @12:41AM (5 children)
An idea didn't just shoot someone in the head in Denver.
(Score: 1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @03:34AM (4 children)
Security guard. Not antifa. Regular American Citizen, faced with Nazis in the street, rioting, force to use lethal force in self-defense. At least he didn't go there specifically to do that, with malice and aforethought, like that teenage Trump-supporting murderer.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:13AM (1 child)
Breaking news: shooter was security for the Press, allegedly a Pinkerton man. Seems the right is responsible for violence, and when called on it, they die. (Google the news yourself, you lazy obese Republican Trump supporter, Runaway! )
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @06:01AM
https://www.9news.com/article/news/crime/security-guard-held-denver-shooting-wasnt-licensed-officials-say/73-648ca0f2-cc71-4fa7-b145-cbd710b87f5f [9news.com]
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:25AM (1 child)
Matt Doloff, a former occupy activist hired by 9news [twimg.com] - charged with murder one. The gun was drawn before the victim raised the mace, thumb forward grip shows training, training teaches you to aim for the body. This was a politically motivated murder, it was not self-defense and the victim was not a "nazi".
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @11:15PM
Looks like you have some gaps in the argument. Aiming for the body and having the right grip, the alleged training, doesn't make something a politically motivated murder. And the victim had a weapon, right? And brandished it before getting shot, right?
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @01:53AM (53 children)
Because the "extraordinary" captures more attention than the "ordinary", thus the extreme polarization of the public discourse over the last 10-12 years in US.
Corollary: the smaller the guy that wants your eye and ear, the more outrageous it has to be in order to register on the background of this cacophony.
Consequence: in the desperate attempt to reconcile his cognitive dissonance, Runaway is taking hook, line and sinkers from the (gateway) nobodies; moreover, he switches them as frequently as possible to always have fresh reinforcements for his feeble mental constructs. Even worse, he thinks he can convince us this is a rational approach.
Just from curiosity: how do you think this non-sequitur is helping your "argument" or it's even relevant?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 2, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:02AM (52 children)
Is Julian Assange a terrorist?
Are you a terrorist?
If government(s) can railroad one innocent man, what makes you think it/they won't railroad another?
Don't forget that there are tons of video evidence proving that Kyle Rittenhouse is innocent of any wrongdoing. The DA doesn't care about innocence, he is pressing charges for political reasons.
Of course, you are safe. You empathize and sympathize with the US lib/dem/progressive bloc. Perfectly safe.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:15AM
Runaway1956, supporting yet another right-wing murdering coward. So sad, too bad. FBI has been notified about what you said about them, Runaway!
(Score: 4, Interesting) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @07:11AM (50 children)
The cost and risks for framing lots of people in US by the US govt increases exponentially with the number of people one tries to frame. Besides, I'm looking to your structure of power and I'm seeing Reps with the Senate and the POTUS and started to think "How's this a left-wing govt? (this letting aside that US'es left wing is center-right in most of the countries in this world).
When I add to this the CSIS'es [wikipedia.org] report [csis.org], it doesn't smell as framing.
(before whinging "Fake news", do yourself a favour and read the CSIS profile from Wikipedia).
I don't know your definition of wrong-doing, but with two unarmed people dead from his hands and the only one armed opponent wounded, "innocent" stretches the credibility.
But I'll refrain for any opinion on the innocence of that guy - maybe it was the wrong place wrong time case, there are courts to decide.
You could be too if you weren't all that hysterical polarized.
If, instead of looking for "how the fuck we got to this situation?" and try to correct it, you're just escalating the polarization, the things will get worse.
Personally, I can't escape the suspicion you actually want to get worse, but that's only a suspicion (formed over time, based on your behaviour on S/N).
---
There's nothing in that bloc I can sympathize with.
Except maybe Bernie Sanders - who, alone, doesn't make a block. On the political compass, I'm about halfway between him and the extreme left, and heck deeper in the libertarian direction than him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @08:03AM (37 children)
Regarding CSIS,
That, despite the obvious fact that white supremacists have not burned a city down in the past year. The anarchists mentioned have done so. Religious extremists? Can you point to a city that has been burnt by religious extremists? I simply can't remember one.
Let us remember that virtually every "think tank" is partisan, and they only invite the people who are likely to agree with their world view. And, yes, that goes for the few "think tanks" with views that are similar to my own.
Spoken like a truly sheltered person who has never seen a street fight. If a strange man approaches you with bare hands, and tells you that he is going to kill you, you had better suspect that he might be capable of killing you. If you stand there, and allow him to lay hands on you, then you have won your Darwin award. Rittenhouse was attacked in turn by one man who tried to wrestle his weapon away from him, then a man who smacked him from behind, then a man who attempted a flying kick to the head, then a man ARMED with a hefty blunt instrument, and finally by a man armed with a Glock. Five individuals who attacked a young man who was obviously armed. Darwin awards all around.
You really don't seem to understand the concept of "self defense". The law in Wisconsin recognizes self defense as a defense against any homicide charge. Kyle is going to walk free. It may take a year or more, but he will walk free. Not only will he walk free, but he will probably be given a free ride scholarship to a nice college, get a nice job after college, then go into politics. I would like to be around when he runs for president, but I'm getting a bit old for that.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @08:54AM (15 children)
Oh, gee, here's me, Runaway, and my mental image shows a yuuge discrepancy with the one presented by "a bipartisan think tank with scholars that represent varying points of view across the political spectrum". What am I to do, what am I to do?
I know, I'll double down and say the knowledge and experience of those scholars is as good as my ignorance (otherwise, my cognitive dissonance catches up with me and I must face how fucked up my system of values and thinking is).
Or maybe a person that saw a lot of street fights and learned how to keep cool.
Or maybe a person that learned a street fight isn't worth the effort/risk and avoid to be involved in one by conducting his activities at times and in places where there were little chances to end in one.
Maybe a person who, together with others like-minded [wikipedia.org], actually managed to topple a government without a fucking second amendment and without using guns, but still facing them?
Who knows, maybe all of the above?
Problem is, you just tabled a false dichotomy, there could be so many rational explanations for my position.
Who the fuck made him to place himself in that situation?
Do you think there was a rational justification for him being there?
Or maybe I'm understanding it better than you do; that's is still a possibility, isn't it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:02AM (14 children)
The kid was asked to assist in the legal defense of a business that had already been targeted by the progressive thugs. He was attacked for extinguishing a fire started by the progressive freak who shrieked "shoot me nigger".
Stop with the naive bullshit. You can't claim to have been a street warrior, and at the same time fail to understand that Rittenhouse was repeatedly attacked by a violent mob.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:19AM (13 children)
And this is a rational explanation for him being there?
If it is so compelling, why weren't you there, Runaway?
Guess what? I faced military telling us to back down or they'll shoot, military for whom disobeying orders was punishable beyond your imagination.
A single unarmed freak who was shouting? I'd laugh at your joke if it wouldn't be pathetic.
I don't claim such a thing. On the contrary, Runaway. I'm proud not to be a warrior, much less a street one.
Tell me, Runaway, is being a street warrior your wettest heroic dream?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:26AM (11 children)
You're still sounding dumb as hell. Kyle didn't have boot camp, advanced infantry training, or a sergeant standing behind him when he was a attacked. He didn't have 6 months of drill sergeants screaming in his face and worse. Kyle is a 17 year old kid, who performed in an exemplary manner, all things considered. Your stories of facing down an opposing military force may be in the same world Kyle was in, but it's not nearly an equal comparison.
Go watch the videos again. And, stop being such an ass. I can forgive the idiots who have never been anywhere, or done anything. Watch the videos, and be proud of this kid who DID NOT start spraying bullets indiscriminately into a hostile mob. He handled himself well, and you know it. A couple years, and some more training, he can probably do anything you have ever done.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:22AM (10 children)
Perhaps the ear that hears is too old, but very likely the brain that does the listening is screwed up.
Boo-bloody-hoo.
And yet he got involved somehow in a situation where those were required. Not a sign of great wisdom, is it?
And, somehow, I'm requested to forget all of that and declare the stupid poor prick as innocent, even without any process in a court of justice taking place.
Aren't conservatives supposed to be the party of responsibility? Ah, yes, sorry. This all ended long ago, even before Trump made from the Republicans his bitches (I can shoot someone on the street and not lose a vote. So, ya know, do as I say or your party will be no more) followed by 'I don't take responsibility at all'.
Well, I did have a crazed sergeant screaming in my face to go home when me and the others were facing their guns; 'twas when we decided we had enough from the communist govt. He was armed, and so were the soldiers behind him.
The army service I compulsory "served" before? That taught me quite a few things about guns. Things like:
- two closely grouped AK-47 bullets hitting a 2 inches thick of reinforced concrete, 250m away, will let a hole big enough for the next one to pass through. Don't take your chances
- an AK-47 is a bad weapon to use for a suicide. Your mother won't recognize your face ('cause the top of your head will be missing) and your buddies may find a piece of your upper lip (with the mustache trimmed by the book), 5 meters away from the patch of fresh sand hiding your blood, two days after your depressive state pushed you into suicide.
Maybe you can imagine how this knowledge plays in a situation when you have those AK47 pointed at you not 20m farther from your face, maybe not.
Bottom line: if you want to play hero, be damn'd sure:
- you absolutely know what you are doing and
- that thing for which you are doing? Must absolutely worth it.
You must be totally convinced about it and be prepared to face whatever falls out from your actions.
That prick? In his "innocence" (under the "naivety" meaning), he killed 2 and wounded a third, he better be glad he's facing a court of justice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @11:09AM (9 children)
Yep. Those responsible for attacking Kyle met their just rewards, quite promptly. Sympathisers are attempting a miscarriage of justice with their charges.
Never was that close to an AK pointed at me. Does a Thompson qualify? I peered down the barrels of a couple of them for almost half an hour - 18 of them eyeball to eyeball with 7 of us. So, yeah, we have something of a shared experience there.
Maybe we can reach an agreement of sorts. I don't judge you and your experience with the communist government. Unless and until you research the laws in Wisconsin, and watch the videos frame by frame, you don't judge the Rittenhouse boy. He acted lawfully, throughout that little episode.
Been there, done that. And, that bottom line, just as you stated it, applies to Antifa/BLM/leftist/progressive/democrat just as it applied to you, to me, and to Rittenhouse. As I've stated before, if/when things are pushed past the tipping point, there ain't NO ONE going to like the price that will be paid.
So, one more time, I ask: Who is it that is burning down the cities? Who is it that is openly pushing the violence?
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @01:42PM (8 children)
Why the fuck would I want to do that? Even if I'd be an USian.
I'm not good for a big number of things, policing and administering justice included. This is why I pay taxes, so that other people that are good for these can have a living.
Pretty much the same I paid the landscaper to redo my front lawn, or the garbage collection guys that take it every Friday, or the halal butcher that prepares the lamb mince my mother likes (when nobody else offers lamb mince around).
And I offer to them, police, judges, landscaper, garbage man, butcher and all that, the same respect for the job they do well.
If everybody would honestly do what they are good for and honestly admit what their aren't best prepared to do, this world would be a much better place. Not gonna happen soon, but one is allowed to dream.
But reckless - he was not qualified to be there and nobody asked him to leave his home and be there.
And, because of it, he killed two persons. Lawful or not, that's for the court to judge. But, as sure as death and taxes, his act had an irrevocable result - one can't revive those two victims.
Business and homes? I'm seeing hundreds of people rebuilding them after the bushfire seasons in Australia. Yes, it's not easy, many may not be able to do it, but they can still go on with their life. Those two killed by that prick harboring the belief that he can solve everything if he'd only carry a gun? Those two are definitively dead.
So... why do you want to push it further?
Yes, it's not only you and yes, there is the other side pretty much doing the same. The question still remains: why are you pushing for it?
If you take your time a look at it, you are likely to see that other side has a lot more common with you than you have differences (fer fuck sake, you just discovered you have something in common. that you can resonate and understand it, with a guy born the other half of the world. What are the chances to have more differences with those that are living in the same country?)
How the fuck would I know? I'm not there to go ask them "Who are you?" and "Why are you burning the city?" (if the city was indeed burnt. Otherwise, substitute with the actual subject of burning).
May be just crazed persons, may be those disillusioned with what life in US has to offer to them, may be just feeble minds screwed up by the propaganda, may be radicals of all kind (from left, right, authoritarians, libertarians, religious, whatever kind you like**), may be heaps of others or all of them.
This gregarious monkey species we call humans are weird, things like mass hysteria [wikipedia.org] happened, happens and will happen.
** (even if I'd classify those radicals as "feeble minds" too. I mean, you have to be so to believe that the wonderful complexity of life can be amenable to just simple answers).
I have this pet theory mine, saying that the cultural value of "respect is something that one earns" is causing this brouhaha as an emergent behaviour. I feel that if you, as a society, would switch to "respect is given, can be only lost", the result would be a much balanced society.
In more "sociological terms", a society based on the competition will thrive if and only if enough resources are available. Otherwise, it will start cannibalizing itself, in a dog-eat-dog non-sustainable fashion (and that happened to US with the jobs flying abroad). Except that the cooperation (necessary to counterbalance competition) requires a certain amount of trust and respect, and these seems in short supply lately. Perhaps enough trust and respect to see "dog packs" emerging, but certainly not enough to see a balanced society.
I'm seeing this "hunger for conflict" quite a lot when it comes to USians.
Otherwise, honestly, I openly admit I don't know the answer to your question. And I reckon there are good chances you don't know either, you only have the illusion that you know it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @02:28PM (6 children)
I can help you know, and you can check it out.
The riots are a blend of BLM and Antifa. I put the lion's share of the blame on Antifa, rather than BLM. Over and over, it has been observed that BLM consists mostly of privileged white people. BLM, on the other hand, is mostly black people. In several places, where BLM is left to stand alone, they are indeed pretty damned peaceful - Richmond Va stands out. Other places, BLM doesn't even seem to be present. No, I can't "prove" that, but you just don't see black folk - it's all privileged white people. And, those "protest" sites are the most violent. And, no, I can't say that any of that is a hard rule. St. Louis has had some of the most violent riots over the past couple years, mostly black folk.
But, when I weigh all of the evidence I can find, BLM has legitimate bitches, and still stays peaceful a lot of the time. Antifa is there to instigate trouble. They're happy to burn down black neighborhoods - they don't actually care about the black people who live there.
Antifa may or may not care about black people, individually. But I don't think they really give a damn about blacks as a group. Those Anarchist symbols are as prevalent as BLM symbols in their riots.
Videos are ubiquitous at all the protests. You can compare them for yourself. Almost all white people? You'll see a lot of burning, looting, and other violence. Almost all black people? There's less of the burning, maybe some looting, and a lot less violence - outside of St. Louis and vicinity.
All of this tells me that Antifa is a political thing, who are exploiting the blacks, and using the blacks as scapegoats.
No, Antifa is not "just an idea". There is a lot of coordination between them - like the food truck that drove all the way from Portland to Kenosha, and was stopped trying to fill up gasoline cans for the rioters.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @02:30PM
Dammit - serious typo right at the beginning!!
should be
Over and over, it has been observed that Antifa consists mostly of privileged white people.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @04:05PM
An interesting possible pattern, which I don't have time to confirm or refute; though, I'd be inclined to substitute "using the black as scapegoats" with "using the blacks' protests as an opportunity to stage their action".
I imagine though "wearing black" is not such a hard way for a person of whatever political leaning to disguise oneself - after all, opportunistic mimicry goes as deep on evolution tree as some species of fishes [nature.com] and octopuses [wikipedia.org].
There are heaps of disenfranchised groups in US - remember the "Occupy... " actions in 2008-2010? Nothing got out of it because their diversity were too big to find a common political ground. It is not impossible that some of those groups to opportunistically see the BLM protest (and the chaos/discontent cause an inept political answer to lotsa-shit-happening) as a good ground to act.
Even more, on top of the "traditional" fringe groups, we may see some new ones in action. For example, a good amount of those middle-class suburbanite millennials (still matching the "privileged white people" image for the outside) find themselves with the unprivileged prospect of living with their parents well into their '30-ies and postponing the moment they can dare establishing a family on their own. With so much time in their hands, they may find that wanking all day long is no longer satisfying and get out to fuck someone just because hormones and very little other life experience (that Kye little prick may be a good candidate for the profile). May not be as organized as a bunch of traditional fringe lunatics with "a bone against tyranny to grind", but they could act as useful idiots and cannon fodder if/when it needs to be.
One on top of the other, I don't have enough info (and it seems neither you do) to say "It's Antifa and it's not an idea". It may well be different participants, with similar destructive behaviour and the same "clothing fashion" style, but different motivations. If this is the case, the entire thing will fizzle in as short a time as 3-4 months (mid winter is likely a better time for wanking than being outside). If it continues beyond that, there may be a problem - it may be indeed a small number of organizations (white supremacist not excluded) that are trying something. I just don't think labeling them "Antifa" now would makes the things easier - might create a false sense of security and let the possibly other interests the ground to manifest.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @01:25AM (3 children)
Stop the lies. Your riots come from political provocateurs, not your imaginary "left".
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @01:56AM (2 children)
You're stating the obvious with that comment. The question is more along the lines of "Who are the provocateurs, and who are the useful idiots?"
The useful idiots associated with Antifa are not precisely the same as those associated with BLM. I am somewhat inclined to empathize with the one, while I have only antipathy toward the other.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @03:19AM (1 child)
Oh please, you act like it makes a difference. The first, as a 501(c)(3), will not be into property destruction, the second is made up bullshit. The provocateur and beneficiary is the Party and the useful ijots are the people arguing over it. You're like a deer in headlights with this stuff. You have completely fallen into the trap, and your "antipathy" is a source of amusement
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @12:14AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:40PM
The word "victim" means an innocent person who has suffered. It is not a synonym for "loser".
Losing a fight doesn't turn an aggressor into a victim. That just makes the aggressor a loser.
The winner of a fight can be the victim. Kyle was both winner and victim. The other people were both loser and aggressor.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday October 12 2020, @10:55PM
What's irrational about the explanation? Sounds pretty rational to me.
Sounds like shooting you wasn't actually part of their orders. As to the "single unarmed freak" who was "shouting", it depends how hard he was trying to kill me. Self defense isn't ruled out just because someone is unarmed.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:53AM (2 children)
No US cities have been burned down. One drive-through fast food joint, a scorched courthouse, one or two cop cars. This is a blatant lie, spread by agitaters like Runaway here, and it is false, wrong, and not true. Take your law and order from your Impeached, infected, and soon to be indicted Presserdent, and shove it up your nasal cavity, to test for Covid-19.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:01AM (1 child)
In one picture alone, there is more damage than you describe. Scroll down and look at all the pictures.
https://thefederalist.com/2020/08/24/fires-burn-in-kenosha-wisconsin-after-rioters-set-church-and-car-lot-ablaze/ [thefederalist.com]
Huh - I don't recall any white supremacists burning down churches this year.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @12:16AM
No. I refuse to look at your cuck racist theory pron, Runaway. You will just have to keep doing it, by yourself.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Sunday October 11 2020, @03:40PM (16 children)
You are so damn naive! You believe anything your favorite rags will print...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @12:48AM (15 children)
On-the-scene live action video from multiple angles and viewpoints is far more convincing than any narrative published by left or right leaning rags. Before and after images of the smouldering city blocks are damned convincing.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0, Troll) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @01:15AM (14 children)
Yeah? So what? The videos by themselves do not show who hired them. The only way to answer that is to ask cui bono. And that would be presidente Trump and the Party's "law and order" shtick. You just choose to believe the mass media lies to support your man, no different than the democrat's Russia gag, pure distraction. Ah well, can't say I really expected any better, tribes be tribes
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @01:30AM
Troll
Hehehe... Today is trumpies day. Knock yerselves out, boys!
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @02:02AM (12 children)
You can post this https://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?noupdate=1&sid=39997&page=1&cid=1063397#commentwrap [soylentnews.org]
Then, you post the above, insinuating that Trump is in charge? So, in one breath, you can point out that there are shadowy figures behind the curtains, manipulating the useful idiots, then you point to one of the biggest and possibly the most useful idiot, and blame him for being the shadowy figure.
Whatever else, you have to admit that Trump isn't funding the protests. Trump has an important bit to play, but he's still a bit player, like Creepy Joe.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @03:23AM (11 children)
Trump isn't funding anything, he has no money. He is a mouthpiece. And there are no "shadowy figures". The Party operates right out in the open.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @04:20AM (10 children)
Fine, can you trace George Soros money?
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @12:46PM (9 children)
What about him? Who the hell cares? You're always distracted by bullshit tabloid press. We just have to vote these people out
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday October 12 2020, @01:14PM (8 children)
Bullshit. George Soros and his organizations sprinkle money all around this country to push whatever Soros' agenda is. He's not the only one of course, Bloomberg sent several millions to Florida convicts who needed to pay off fines before they could vote. But Soros has his organizations that are involved in EVERYTHING.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/aug/20/george-soros-funded-das-oversee-big-cities-skyrock/ [washingtontimes.com]
You can make some stupid claim that it's not real, it's just a conspiracy theory, blah blah blah. Tabloid press, yada yada yada. Whatever, the money moves around the country, and money talks when it arrives wherever it is sent. SOMEONE is manipulating stuff, almost in plain site.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/13/us/politics/george-soros-racial-justice-organizations.html [nytimes.com]
So, WTF do you think is going on?
https://www.forbes.com/profile/george-soros/#7a01b8bb2024 [forbes.com]
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @02:04PM (7 children)
So what? That's what rich people do with their money, buy influence. I think you're funny singling these particular people out, but then you wear your bias proudly. Carry on, sailor. Swab those decks! [youtu.be]. El Capitán Trump wants it spotless!
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @12:18AM (6 children)
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday October 13 2020, @01:44AM (5 children)
:-) You on the "Soros" thing too?
I like my conspiracy theories better.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @05:14PM (4 children)
What's it to you, if I am? To be fair to Soros, he supports a number of organizations that oppose police brutality and militarization. That's a plus in my book.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday October 13 2020, @06:00PM (3 children)
It's nothing to me. The other guy is the one complaining about him and singling him out from all the others than launder their money through political campaigns to evade taxes.
Aside from that, your initial assertion where you jumped in is bullshit. Rich people do expect a rubber stamp from the politicians they support financially, whether it's Soros, Adelson, Koch, whoever.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @06:25PM (2 children)
Runaway mentioned two examples: Bloomberg paying off fines for Florida convicts and Soros pumping up his foundation. What politicians are getting bribed from that?
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday October 13 2020, @06:36PM (1 child)
For the DNC...
You can stop playing the dummy. These people expect a return on their "investments"
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday October 13 2020, @08:36PM
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Monday October 12 2020, @07:56PM
Although they did try!
‘Boogaloo Boys’ race-war extremists arrested ‘with molotov cocktails and bomb supplies’ at George Floyd rally in Vegas [the-sun.com]
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @08:10AM (11 children)
Oh yeah. Wait a minute. I believe that you have made mention that you served, albeit unwillingly, in an armed force in a Soviet state. I'm not buying your story. You know damned well that Kyle was attacked by TWO armed men, and the guy who did the flying kick was as dangerous as the guy with the blunt instrument. Stop trying to sound like a naive sheltered little dweeb. If you spent six months in uniform you know better than the shit you're spouting here.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:03AM (10 children)
Communist state, yes. I don't speak Russian, even though my parents were forced to learn it.
First, I'm not selling anything to you.
Second, I'm not surprised you double down and refuse to switch your perspective even if only temporarily and/or as an intellectual exercise.
Because if you were to do so, you'd be facing the risk of discovering you were idiotically stuck on a screwed mental image about this life and wasted so much of it (tick-tock, Runaway, the life ahead of you is much shorter than the one you left behind and this become worse by the day).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:32AM (9 children)
Oh, but yes, you are.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:55AM (5 children)
Runaway, no he is not. Shut up, Runaway. You have become tiresome. And dangerously delusional.
(Score: 1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:06AM (4 children)
Yes, I'm tiresome. So take your kiddy-diddling self to bed, Ari.
Abortion is the number one killed of children in the United States.
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @08:41PM (3 children)
Runaway strikes me as the kind of aged boomer who is like the old guy who used to come into the magazine store where I worked as a youngling, and buy the latest copy of True Detective and True Crimes. Creepy. A purient interest in murders, and even rapes and murders, where of course it REALLY happened!! Bet he has a secret stash of right-wing snuff films.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:18PM (2 children)
Sort of an "Archie Bunker" type.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @12:20AM (1 child)
Not really. Archie was just a regular working-class American Polack, confused by the capitalist Republican party, but not a sick bastard like Runaway. Runaway is more like the proprietor of the military surplus store in the movie, Falling Down.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 12 2020, @02:29AM
"Meathead" was the Polack, not Archie.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Sunday October 11 2020, @10:53AM (2 children)
Mate, I'm past the age where "You are, am not" is even remotely funny.
Go back to my comment that tells you how you are manipulated by your own co-nationals [soylentnews.org].
Then start reading the news for sources outside US to make your mind (bbc, afp, reuters, al jazeera, etc. News outlets that don't have a skin in your US crazy game). If there aren't enough details there, it is wise to abstain yourself from making your mind - you'll end by unmaking it instead. And, in the slang of those millennials, YOLO.
That being said, I'm out on this thread, I sincerely told you what I had to tell as a friend.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 11 2020, @09:38PM
Republicans don't understand sincerity because they've been gaslit for decades by Oreilly, Limbaugh, and other hypocritical assholes.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Monday October 12 2020, @04:03AM
You were witness to true idolatry in action, hero worship... calling the kid by his first name like he's a friend, being so oddly defensive. He identifies with him, wishes he could be him.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..