Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

Meta

Log In

Log In

Create Account  |  Retrieve Password


posted by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @02:45PM   Printer-friendly [Skip to comment(s)]

The proposal to enforce AC posting for logged in members only on the main page was promulgated to all staff and members of the board 7 days ago. Thank you to all those who contributed to the earlier discussions and clearly expressed their own views, suggestions and potential enhancements. All are being studied for implementation, if feasible, when staffing and resources permit.

There has been unanimous agreement from all responses received in favour of the proposed restriction. However, it was also apparent that there was a wish that this will be only until other alternative methods of restricting spamming, abuse and other disruptions to discussions can be identified and implemented. This is unlikely to be achievable in the short to medium term; other sites are struggling unsuccessfully with the same problem. The long-term aim remains to include AC posting in all discussions if at all possible

Therefore, beginning immediately, all AC posting on the main site will be limited to registered members who have logged in to their account. We regret that this leaves a number of AC community members unable to contribute as they once did, but anonymity remains a personal choice.

This will not affect discussions in journals which will have no limits and will be open to all.

If there is a demand for it, I will look at alternative methods of publishing a small number of stories each day into a journal.

On a more positive note, there is evidence that because of the recent restrictions on AC posting a significant number of existing accounts have returned and are commenting in the discussions. The quality of discussions (i.e. signal-to-noise ratio) is significantly better than it was several weeks ago. Although we have lost overall numbers of comments, the value of many of those lost comments appears to have been quite low. There has also been a noticeable improvement in moderations being awarded with more positive moderations being given when compared to negative ones. It is too early yet to draw any firm conclusions from other site statistics.

janrinok

This discussion was created by janrinok (52) for logged-in users only, but now has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(1)
  • (Score: 5, Informative) by NotSanguine on Tuesday July 26, @02:58PM (7 children)

    I thought I'd fr0sty p1ss this thread with some advice for folks who can't/don't wish to have *any* trace of their personage/location recorded in SN's database.

    I previously posted this information here [soylentnews.org]:

    1. Create a throwaway email address (Protonmail, spamdecoy, etc.), presumably through TOR and/or a VPN;
    2. Register an account using that throwaway email address, and confirm the address (again via TOR and/or a VPN);
    3. Connect to SN via TOR and/or a VPN;

    Now, no one can track you even if you're logged in.

    --
    No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
    • (Score: 2) by Freeman on Tuesday July 26, @03:43PM (3 children)

      by Freeman (732) on Tuesday July 26, @03:43PM (#1263010) Journal

      This is still less than ideal and leads to putting all of your eggs into one basket.

      I.E. Messages by X user could still be found, if X user is compromised. Or do post by X user as an AC not get attached to said user? I.E. When you click on the user profile and see recent messages.

      --
      Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
      • (Score: 3, Informative) by NotSanguine on Tuesday July 26, @03:58PM (2 children)

        This is still less than ideal and leads to putting all of your eggs into one basket.

        I.E. Messages by X user could still be found, if X user is compromised. Or do post by X user as an AC not get attached to said user? I.E. When you click on the user profile and see recent messages.

        IIUC (perhaps an admin can chime in here), AC posts are recorded under UID=1, not the UID of the logged in user.

        As an example, I'll out myself and say that there's an AC post of mine in this very thread. If you check my posting history, that comment is *not* in that history.

        So no, that's not correct.

        I'd add that if your posts on SN could result in negative legal, social or personal consequences, whether they're AC or not, you probably shouldn't be posting here at all. Or anywhere else for that matter, since motivated folks would just compromise your device(s) and then all bets are off.

        That said, as long as you use TOR and/or a VPN, there should be no issue -- unless you live in a jurisdiction that might put you in jail for your speech (state level actor -- in which case, you're pretty well screwed anyway) or a competent and dedicated adversary (unlikely here on SN -- I'll leave the determination WRT to "competent" and "dedicated" for users here to the reader) who wants to do you harm.

        If either of the above are the case, I'd be sad to see you go, but you need to protect yourself.

        --
        No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
        • (Score: 4, Informative) by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @05:32PM (1 child)

          by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @05:32PM (#1263037) Journal

          The database knows who is logged in, and which comments they make. How it displays that information is not the same as not knowing who is responsible for which action.

          • (Score: 3, Funny) by coolgopher on Wednesday July 27, @03:37AM

            by coolgopher (1157) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @03:37AM (#1263139)

            Wait, my AC shit posts are still attributable to me? 😱😱😱

    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Wednesday July 27, @02:54PM (2 children)

      by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @02:54PM (#1263225) Homepage Journal

      4. ??? Never use a browser that logs all of your activity like Internet Explorer did (still does, if you use an old OS). Be certain that when you flush your cache, everything is flushed!! I would presume that Edge still logs everything into perpetuity, because Microsoft.

      --
      Your private safe room in the back of your mind? Trump pooped in it.
      • (Score: 3, Informative) by NotSanguine on Wednesday July 27, @07:50PM (1 child)

        4. ??? Never use a browser that logs all of your activity like Internet Explorer did (still does, if you use an old OS). Be certain that when you flush your cache, everything is flushed!! I would presume that Edge still logs everything into perpetuity, because Microsoft.

        Not a bad idea at all.

        Another way to help with that is to use firefox containers [mozilla.org] and only use SN within a single container -- which should keep other sites/spying scumbags from any SN info.

        Also not a bad idea to use something like Cookie Autodelete [mozilla.org] as well, which will delete all cookies related to a particular tab when that tab is closed.

        --
        No, no, you're not thinking; you're just being logical. --Niels Bohr
        • (Score: 2) by acid andy on Thursday July 28, @07:17PM

          by acid andy (1683) on Thursday July 28, @07:17PM (#1263467) Homepage Journal

          Thanks for the tip about containers. I've been wanting that functionality for a long time.

          --
          Master of the science of the art of the science of art.
  • (Score: 5, Funny) by c0lo on Tuesday July 26, @03:17PM (29 children)

    by c0lo (156) on Tuesday July 26, @03:17PM (#1263007) Journal

    Maybe it's just me, but with

    The quality of discussions (i.e. signal-to-noise ratio) is significantly better than it was several weeks ago.

    half of the fun is gone. Now, you will need to make everything possible to keep Runaway1956 around, we need to have someone to bash and the one better be a high quality asshole to justify the bashing (large grin).

    --
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @03:36PM (15 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @03:36PM (#1263009)

      half of the fun is gone. Now, you will need to make everything possible to keep Runaway1956 around, we need to have someone to bash and the one better be a high quality asshole to justify the bashing (large grin).

      But Runaway1956 happily posts the stuff* he does under his account (I suppose he could be posting AC too), but the change described in TFS won't prevent him from posting AC as well.

      *I use that word as I'm trying not to be an asshole. So. How'm I doing? (with no apologies to Ed Koch [wikipedia.org] and his gigantic ego)

      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Tuesday July 26, @05:34PM (14 children)

        by c0lo (156) on Tuesday July 26, @05:34PM (#1263039) Journal

        True, but Runaway alone can't be as effective an asshole to compensate for the many other (expletive)wits who only posted as pure AC.

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Mykl on Tuesday July 26, @10:00PM (13 children)

          by Mykl (1112) on Tuesday July 26, @10:00PM (#1263087)

          I know people like to dump on Runaway, but imagine how boring the place would be if everyone agreed on everything. Besides, there are _some_ things that I agree with him on. I'm willing to take each separate argument on its own merits.

          I can't think of any time I've ever agreed with Ethanol_Fueled, but it's still good to have a difference of opinion here to stimulate debate, and the odd flame war.

          • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @10:30PM (1 child)

            by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @10:30PM (#1263096)

            Ethanol-fueled was never as coherent as most trolls. Even when he posted something worthy of consideration, he would make sure to derail the conversation and devalue his own point by throwing in a non sequitur attack on a random minority group. It was so odd to see something that clearly had some rational thought and reasoning put into it, then witness the inevitable train wreck of irrational hate in the last sentence of the post.
            All he'd have to do is stop typing and some of his posts would have been half decent, but it's as if he simply couldn't resist putting in the finishing touch of bigotry.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @04:55PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @04:55PM (#1263449)

              That was his comic shtick though. For various values of "comic."

          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Immerman on Tuesday July 26, @10:39PM (9 children)

            by Immerman (3985) on Tuesday July 26, @10:39PM (#1263098)

            I doubt disagreement will ever go away.

            But there's a difference between quality disagreement and time-wasting shit posts.

            • (Score: 4, Funny) by c0lo on Tuesday July 26, @11:32PM (5 children)

              by c0lo (156) on Tuesday July 26, @11:32PM (#1263101) Journal

              But there's a difference between quality disagreement and time-wasting shit posts.

              Agreed. The latter may be funny (large grin).

              --
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
              • (Score: 3, Touché) by Immerman on Wednesday July 27, @02:40AM (4 children)

                by Immerman (3985) on Wednesday July 27, @02:40AM (#1263126)

                I'd say the funny ones aren't time-wasters!

                • (Score: 4, Insightful) by c0lo on Wednesday July 27, @03:10AM (3 children)

                  by c0lo (156) on Wednesday July 27, @03:10AM (#1263134) Journal

                  I'd say the funny ones aren't time-wasters!

                  Be them as they may, it still shit-posting.
                  Because shit-posting involves a shift of perspective, most of the time divergent to the topic being discussed in a focused, "quality disagreement" way.
                  The "funny" arises when the shift is unexpected (and the consequences aren't repugnant)

                  --
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
                  • (Score: 2) by Immerman on Wednesday July 27, @02:26PM (1 child)

                    by Immerman (3985) on Wednesday July 27, @02:26PM (#1263218)

                    Oh certainly. But I'm retroactively revising the interpretation of my original comment to mean I object specifically to shit-posts that are time-wasting, rather than using "time-wasting" to describe all shit-posts. ;-)

                    • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Wednesday July 27, @06:39PM

                      by c0lo (156) on Wednesday July 27, @06:39PM (#1263302) Journal

                      Ah, shifting goal posts, such a relaxing and enjoyable pastime when exercised within the context of the flexible-like-shit English language (grin)

                      --
                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
                  • (Score: 2) by acid andy on Thursday July 28, @07:20PM

                    by acid andy (1683) on Thursday July 28, @07:20PM (#1263468) Homepage Journal

                    Because shit-posting involves a shift of perspective

                    Now say that twenty times as fast as you can, preferably after a few beers.

                    --
                    Master of the science of the art of the science of art.
            • (Score: 4, Funny) by deimtee on Wednesday July 27, @02:49AM (2 children)

              by deimtee (3272) on Wednesday July 27, @02:49AM (#1263131) Journal

              But there's a difference between quality disagreement and time-wasting shit posts.

              Of course. Disagreeing with my opponent is a quality post. Disagreeing with me is a time-wasting shit post.

              --
              No problem is insoluble, but at Ksp = 2.943×10−25 Mercury Sulphide comes close.
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 27, @03:22AM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 27, @03:22AM (#1263137)

                [Me] Disagreeing with my opponent is a quality post. [Others] Disagreeing with me is a time-wasting shit post.

                Iff this is the meaning you intended, congrats, you just time-wasting-shit-posted in an unfunny way.

                • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 27, @08:03AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 27, @08:03AM (#1263165)

                  Poe's Law [wikipedia.org] strikes again!

                  Boo-Yah!

          • (Score: 2) by Joe Desertrat on Friday July 29, @12:38AM

            by Joe Desertrat (2454) on Friday July 29, @12:38AM (#1263519)

            I know people like to dump on Runaway

            While he sometimes resorted to trolling of a sort, usually he is willing to engage in a discussion to try to defend his points.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @03:56PM (1 child)

      by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @03:56PM (#1263013) Journal

      How will it spoil your fun (equally large grin)? You can always post your topic in your journal and have whatever conversation you wish with everybody, including any ACs who insist on their anonymity.

      What those few ACs will not be able to do is to spoil discussions where that input is not wanted.

      The only difference is that the journals will not be filled with a series of topics each day to create discussions. And I have already stated:

      If there is a demand for it, I will look at alternative methods of publishing a small number of stories each day into a journal.

      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by c0lo on Wednesday July 27, @02:20AM

        by c0lo (156) on Wednesday July 27, @02:20AM (#1263120) Journal

        You can always post your topic in your journal

        In this context, the fun is not in posting, but in witnessing how deep the insanity of some poster go; pushing their buttons - whenever possible - only add to the fun.

        The fact they manage to survive fills me with unbounded optimism about the future of humanity and an immense gratefulness for the lenience of nature (large grin)

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Gaaark on Tuesday July 26, @04:06PM (1 child)

      by Gaaark (41) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @04:06PM (#1263018) Journal

      I like that it seems to be returning to the discussions we had at the start (lo, these many years ago, and get off muh lawn!).
      Proper discussion and mostly 'nice' conversations.

      I'd like to keep Runaway of old around and wish MDC was still here. I want, even, TMB of old to still be here. Too many members went toxic and i would have too if MDC hadn't been around once.
      Too many AC's and logged-ins became like that Denis Leary song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs [youtube.com]

      Let the fun begin! :)

      --
      --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
      • (Score: 2) by Kell on Thursday July 28, @03:03AM

        by Kell (292) on Thursday July 28, @03:03AM (#1263371)

        I feel ya. Soylent back in the heady days of Buck Feta was a breath of fresh air - like a terra nullis of opportunity. Nobody knew about SN who wasn't frustrated by the thing the green site had become. We were there because our axes needed sharpening and the grinding wheel was at hand. I hope we can return to that.

        --
        Scientists ask questions. Engineers solve problems.
    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 26, @04:46PM (1 child)

      by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 26, @04:46PM (#1263024)

      Do you really miss some bozo's private vendetta against some user who apparently shat in the cornflakes of someone with an ego large enough to require its own zip code?

      • (Score: 4, Funny) by c0lo on Tuesday July 26, @05:28PM

        by c0lo (156) on Tuesday July 26, @05:28PM (#1263035) Journal

        Do you really miss some bozo's private vendetta against some user

        No, what made you think so?

        But I'll surely miss TMB's juggling regexes to keep the "D¡¢κ ȵɪ̈ggεr5" at bay without slowing S/N to a grinding halt.

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
    • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday July 26, @05:30PM (5 children)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Tuesday July 26, @05:30PM (#1263036) Journal

      Journals are still a free for all so I think that's a good compromise!

      • (Score: 5, Informative) by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @05:41PM (2 children)

        by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @05:41PM (#1263041) Journal

        This is exactly why I couldn't understand some of the arguments being made a few weeks ago.

        We haven't removed anything. The site is clearly divided into 2 areas where different rules apply. Anybody is free to choose which set of rules they wish to discuss topics under.

        Give a journal the same title as the front page story, link to the story itself, and then begin your discussion in a journal if you wish. Anybody can read the main page, but those that want to remain anonymous or like the type of discussion which is less regulated can discuss it under journal rules. The same people can create journals as they could before. Nobody has lost any of the site's moderation, breakthrough or filtering of friends and foes but, if they don't want it, they can simply ignore it.

        • (Score: 2) by kazzie on Wednesday July 27, @05:32AM (1 child)

          by kazzie (5309) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @05:32AM (#1263155)

          There is the difference that journals aren't as visible from the main page (with obvious benefits in the situation we've been responding to).

          From my personal experience, I've only interacted with journals a half-dozen times in the time I've been with the site. But that might just reflect what I'm looking for from this site.

          • (Score: 2) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @06:41AM

            by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @06:41AM (#1263162) Journal

            I am definitely in agreement with you on this. I enjoy a discussion which stays reasonably on-topic and often has insightful comments by people who know far more about the topic than I do. I enjoy a bit of humour, but I do not want to wade through off-topic, argumentative and usually unresolvable claims and counter claims. I am not concerned by usernames - I would welcome the inclusion of ACs if, as the majority do, they join in the discussions and are sometimes equally insightful or demonstrate an level of subject knowledge that I do not have. But the small proportion of ACs who have spoiled the site for the majority are driving many of our community away.

            Nevertheless, I can accept that perhaps not everybody views things the same way. The journals have provided a place where others can discuss matters that probably wouldn't make it to the front page but are still of interest to themselves and others. I can think of several journals that are well worth looking at from time to time - hubie, takyon and mcgrew spring to mind immediately. And yet there are others who relish the type of free-for-all that the journal discussions can generate. There are also those journals that I try to avoid unless we are asked to take some specific action or, rarely, it is something upon which I have a genuine view.

            Hopefully, things will settle down a little now and people will find on which side of the divide they wish to discuss each topic without being constrained to either one or the other. If not, then we will continue to lose valuable members of our community and that would be a very sad thing to see.

      • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Tuesday July 26, @05:44PM (1 child)

        by c0lo (156) on Tuesday July 26, @05:44PM (#1263042) Journal

        Journals are still a free for all so I think that's a good compromise!

        At the discretion of the user posting in her journal, to be more precise. At least that was the case when I last posted mine.

        Let's hope that some of the AC fuckwits would be enticed enough by journals to exhibit themselves, bashing only Runaway will become boring after a while. E.g. I developed a fondness towards the VitaminD/Zinc/Oxygen Therapy/Ivermectin/etc one.

        --
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
        • (Score: 4, Interesting) by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @07:17PM

          by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @07:17PM (#1263068) Journal

          I have a feeling that some of those who professed to always posting as AC actually did have an account. There have been very few accounts created recently, but quite a few accounts that hadn't been used for a while, sometimes 5 or 6 years, have suddenly come alive again and are contributing.

          Whether that is simply because the environment has changed or whether they have overcome their reluctance to log in I cannot say for sure. Either way - they are most welcome!

          We have only had 1 email from an account holder asking that his account be closed. We can usually do that very easily and ensure that there is no personal link to that individual left in their account or in our database. I cannot edit backups, but they get rotated fairly quickly so all trace should disappear.

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by inertnet on Tuesday July 26, @07:21PM

      by inertnet (4071) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @07:21PM (#1263069) Journal

      For me it's very hard to bash Runaway1956, because I was born in 1956 and as a toddler I used to run away all the time, to explore the great unknown.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by HammeredGlass on Tuesday July 26, @03:55PM (21 children)

    by HammeredGlass (12241) on Tuesday July 26, @03:55PM (#1263012)

    The are so few places left on the net to say what you will into the void

    I hope that AC posting returns in some manner soon.

    • (Score: 3, Informative) by janrinok on Tuesday July 26, @03:57PM

      by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @03:57PM (#1263014) Journal

      This will not affect discussions in journals which will have no limits [as long as it is legal!] and will be open to all.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Gaaark on Tuesday July 26, @04:08PM (7 children)

      by Gaaark (41) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @04:08PM (#1263019) Journal

      Too many AC's (Asshole Cunts) posted too much irrelevancy: just shit and toxicity. Do. not. miss. it.

      You should have been around at the beginning when proper discussions occurred. I. miss. that.

      --
      --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
      • (Score: 2) by canopic jug on Tuesday July 26, @04:19PM (1 child)

        by canopic jug (3949) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @04:19PM (#1263020) Journal

        The same astroturfers that caused trouble as ACs can still cause trouble, it's just that there is a slight barrier for them now.

        --
        Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
        • (Score: 3, Funny) by DannyB on Tuesday July 26, @05:35PM

          by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @05:35PM (#1263040) Journal

          Maybe a good solution would be to have a central government hosted registry of Anonymous Coward accounts.

          Bad mods would cause the government to DO SOMETHING!

          --
          You can not have fun on the weak days but you can on the weakened.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @06:35PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @06:35PM (#1263057)

        just shit and toxicity

        A precise mirror image of our politics in general, timing and everything. Let's thank the Clintons and the Trumps, since they're joined at the hips anyway, why not? It is their followers that did this

      • (Score: 4, Interesting) by dx3bydt3 on Tuesday July 26, @08:20PM (3 children)

        by dx3bydt3 (82) on Tuesday July 26, @08:20PM (#1263075)

        I agree things are looking more like the old days here again. I'll happily deal with the fact that there are fewer comments overall, when those comments we do get are ones worth reading and engaging with. I'm one of those who have rarely engaged in recent years, and I will endeavour to start doing so more, now that the atmosphere has improved. I was getting so discouraged with the quality of discourse, I was contemplating allowing my subscription to lapse. The only reason I hadn't done so already is that this site is one of the places I get to see viewpoints that differ from my own, held by people intelligent and articulate enough to be worth reflecting on.

        • (Score: 2) by Gaaark on Wednesday July 27, @01:09AM (2 children)

          by Gaaark (41) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @01:09AM (#1263110) Journal

          I DID let my subscription lapse because of all the shit:

          I, like you, may reconsider and renew now.

          --
          --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
          • (Score: 2) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @04:16AM (1 child)

            by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @04:16AM (#1263147) Journal

            And both I, and more importantly MDC, would appreciate it :-) However, we will be more than grateful if you just stick with us and continue to comment as you do.

            • (Score: 2) by Gaaark on Wednesday July 27, @01:37PM

              by Gaaark (41) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @01:37PM (#1263208) Journal

              Oh, i'll be here... now.

              This is a good choice, excepting that it eliminates those who cannot be but AC for whatever personal safety reasons they have. THAT'S too bad.

              Maybe today i'll subscribe... for MDC :)

              Some day, when i retire, maybe i'll start posting stories again! Someday. Just don't burn out, man. Keep calm and edit on!

              --
              --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 26, @04:48PM (4 children)

      by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 26, @04:48PM (#1263026)

      Quite frankly, I neither miss the racism nor the spam.

      In the end, either solution will cost SN users. If you disallow AC postings, you will use the people who will not, under any circumstances, create an account. If you allow it, you will eventually turn away people who don't want to wade through a swamp of spam and noise to sieve out an occasional nugget of information and move over to greener pastures (that have about the same stories, and about the same spam...).

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by cmdrklarg on Tuesday July 26, @06:59PM (3 children)

        by cmdrklarg (5048) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @06:59PM (#1263063)

        I will happily approve of the "cost" of turning away unrepentant trolls and spammers. The less I have to do with that nonsense the better.

        If a user is paranoid enough to never create an account under any circumstances then I'm not certain I want to hear from them either. If it's NOT paranoia then they have larger issues than not being able to post on this sleepy little website.

        --
        Answer now is don't give in; aim for a new tomorrow.
        • (Score: 5, Funny) by Opportunist on Tuesday July 26, @08:54PM

          by Opportunist (5545) on Tuesday July 26, @08:54PM (#1263079)

          I AM NOT PARANOID!

          Because if you are, THEY notice!

        • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Magic Oddball on Tuesday July 26, @09:22PM

          by Magic Oddball (3847) on Tuesday July 26, @09:22PM (#1263085) Journal

          Same feeling here, speaking as someone who has needed to keep her online & real-life identities totally separate in order to avoid being tracked down online by an abusive, obsessed dude I dated long ago.

          If the ACs were sharing sensitive governmental, corporate, military, or personal information that is so important that it would lead to a shadowy group hacking into SN's servers to find out which outwardly-anonymous logged-in user was responsible in order to unmask and persecute the person, then I'd understand some AC's refusal to create an account in order to post anonymously...but I've never actually seen an AC post anything of that nature, just the same kind of mundane comments the rest of us make.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Immerman on Wednesday July 27, @02:58AM

          by Immerman (3985) on Wednesday July 27, @02:58AM (#1263132)

          Yeah, the conversations have been a lot more enjoyable.

          I will say though that I suspect lazyness plays a roll - there are a LOT of times on other forums that I just pass through occasionally that I'd love to leave a comment, maybe offer some missing information in passing, but if they don't offer anonymous posting it's just not worth the effort of setting up an account.

          The "across-the-internet" identities from Google, Facebook, etc. are an interesting concept, but I'm dubious of the wisdom of voluntarily providing that much more information about you to such voracious data compiling corporations.

    • (Score: 3, Touché) by DannyB on Tuesday July 26, @05:26PM (6 children)

      by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @05:26PM (#1263034) Journal

      The are so few places left on the net to say what you will into the void

      There is still /dev/nul

      Which is roughly equivalent to posting to your journal.

      --
      You can not have fun on the weak days but you can on the weakened.
      • (Score: 4, Touché) by coolgopher on Wednesday July 27, @03:42AM (5 children)

        by coolgopher (1157) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @03:42AM (#1263140)

        There is still /dev/nul

        You're originally a Windows user, aren't you ;)

        • (Score: 5, Funny) by Gaaark on Wednesday July 27, @01:45PM

          by Gaaark (41) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @01:45PM (#1263209) Journal

          He posted correctly, it's just the second 'l' went prematurely into /dev/null. Better known as C: drive on Windows.

          --
          --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
        • (Score: 2) by DannyB on Wednesday July 27, @03:12PM (3 children)

          by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @03:12PM (#1263232) Journal

          You're originally a Windows user, aren't you ;)

          I use Windows at work. Where I am not responsible for maintaining it.

          I have personally never ever not once owned a Windows PC. (I've bought two Windows PCs at separate times many years ago which then immediately got Linux installed.)

          I was a long time classic Mac developer. Co-author of Timbuktu 1.0 and author of Timbuktu/Remote. I was a card carrying classic Mac fanboy. Until Jobs and OS X.

          At about that same time (June 1999) I got my first Linux machine and have never looked back.

          So please forgive the /dev/nul, I just typed it without thinking. It didn't mean anything.

          --
          You can not have fun on the weak days but you can on the weakened.
          • (Score: 2) by coolgopher on Thursday July 28, @12:52AM (2 children)

            by coolgopher (1157) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 28, @12:52AM (#1263357)

            Ah, sorry if my comment was interpreted as an attack - I was genuinely aiming for Funny, or a counter-post saying "takes one to know one!"

            I, sadly, have had more exposure exposure to Windows than one might consider ideal. Even if FreeBSD and by now Linux are my preferred choices, I still run Windows (for gaming) and a Mac laptop (for work - it makes an excellent "thin" client to SSH into real systems from).

            • (Score: 2) by DannyB on Thursday July 28, @02:12PM (1 child)

              by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 28, @02:12PM (#1263423) Journal

              No big deal. I just wanted to be clear that the /dev/nul with one "l" wasn't meant to be offensive as it could easily be perceived.

              --
              You can not have fun on the weak days but you can on the weakened.
              • (Score: 2) by coolgopher on Friday July 29, @12:29AM

                by coolgopher (1157) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 29, @12:29AM (#1263518)

                Eh, I was reaching for it with that one, and it fell flat. Definitely not on you :)

  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by PiMuNu on Tuesday July 26, @04:30PM

    by PiMuNu (3823) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @04:30PM (#1263022)

    The only (sane) choice, and a good decision.

  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by GlennC on Tuesday July 26, @05:59PM

    by GlennC (3656) on Tuesday July 26, @05:59PM (#1263049)

    As I mentioned in a reply to The Big Discussion, I will stand by your decision.

    I'd rather have fewer people making useful contributions than a lot of useless spam and flame-bait.

    --
    Sorry folks...the world is bigger and more varied than you want it to be. Deal with it.
  • (Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @06:54PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 26, @06:54PM (#1263060)

    Shame on those that claim to support free speech then shit in the well when they don't get their way.
    Shame on those who not only can't move on, they won't let anyone else move on either.
    Shame on those who would rather destroy this site than build something of their own.

    This is why we can't have nice things...

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by crm114 on Tuesday July 26, @11:12PM

    by crm114 (8238) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday July 26, @11:12PM (#1263099)

    Subject says it all.

    This is a great community. Thank you.

  • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Wednesday July 27, @01:25AM (3 children)

    by mcgrew (701) <publish@mcgrewbooks.com> on Wednesday July 27, @01:25AM (#1263115) Homepage Journal

    Could you add something to journals that let you disallow ACs? Or do you already have it and I missed it?

    --
    Free Martian whores! [mcgrewbooks.com]
    • (Score: 4, Informative) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @03:59AM (2 children)

      by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @03:59AM (#1263143) Journal

      Only be rewriting the software - which as you know is currently a non-starter.

      But that would also defeat a major benefit of journals. They are meant to be unrestricted with access to everybody. The editors/admins CANNOT edit them, change them, or control them in anyway. They are the responsibility of whoever owns the journal, and we make this very clear. We often don't even look at them.

      I can understand why you ask. The best that we can do is to have you submit it as usual as /dev/random and hope that we can include it as that topic. We are currently trying to stretch the topics covered to include discussions that we have not had before but this site is not intended to be 'anything goes'.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @02:42AM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @02:42AM (#1263369)

        They are meant to be unrestricted with access to everybody.

        Umm... there used to be an option to disallow ACs from posting comments on a particular journal entry. And I believe you could also disallow "foes" or something like that too. Don't know why such options were done away with.

        Guessing that code went missing too....

  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Reziac on Wednesday July 27, @02:44AM (10 children)

    by Reziac (2489) on Wednesday July 27, @02:44AM (#1263129) Homepage

    Wondering if it's feasible to autocopy discussions into a generic AC-friendly journal (with its own account, named something obvious like "AC-friendly"), link from the main entry, and let ACs have their way with it. Anyone who cares could both find and comment totally AC, while those wishing to avoid the spam need not go there.

    Just trying to think of ways to equal-opportunity all discussions without succumbing to the spam disease.

    • (Score: 2) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @04:12AM (9 children)

      by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @04:12AM (#1263146) Journal

      into a generic AC-friendly journal (with its own account, named something obvious like "AC-friendly")

      I am not sure if you are being sarcastic or have genuinely missed it - but I did that and nobody was interested: https://soylentnews.org/~AC+Friendly/journal/ [soylentnews.org]

      I have also offered to restart this feature in TFS above:

      If there is a demand for it, I will look at alternative methods of publishing a small number of stories each day into a journal.

      It isn't at present automated - otherwise all the stories planned for the future come out together in a journal long before they are seen on the main page. The prime purpose of this site is the discussion resulting from the main page which will remain our priority - not the content of journals. However, it is possible to write an external script (i.e. not change the Perl code itself) to web scrape the front page periodically and copy/link the latest story into a journal if if is not already there.

      • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Wednesday July 27, @04:36AM (8 children)

        by Reziac (2489) on Wednesday July 27, @04:36AM (#1263150) Homepage

        Sorry, I'd forgot all about that! Zero comments? not exactly high demand. :(

        Ah well. It was worth a try! (And thanks for all the effort.)

        Yeah, something like an external scaper-script is what I had in mind. Set and forget.

        • (Score: 2) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @05:17AM (7 children)

          by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @05:17AM (#1263153) Journal

          We can always try it again - it might be more popular now that 1. the policy has been changed, and 2. people can perhaps see some benefit to having it.

          • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Wednesday July 27, @05:34AM

            by Reziac (2489) on Wednesday July 27, @05:34AM (#1263156) Homepage

            Yep. Worst thing that happens is nothing. :)

          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by deimtee on Wednesday July 27, @08:40AM (5 children)

            by deimtee (3272) on Wednesday July 27, @08:40AM (#1263171) Journal

            Pretty sure it still won't work. The purpose of those arseholes isn't to post their crap in their own sandbox, it's to crap in the pool everyone else is using.

            --
            No problem is insoluble, but at Ksp = 2.943×10−25 Mercury Sulphide comes close.
            • (Score: 2) by janrinok on Wednesday July 27, @09:09AM (3 children)

              by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday July 27, @09:09AM (#1263176) Journal

              Well they can still crap in somebody else's sandbox in the journals. The only problem will be that people might stop using journals but there is not a lot we can do about that.

              • (Score: 2) by coolgopher on Thursday July 28, @12:53AM (2 children)

                by coolgopher (1157) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 28, @12:53AM (#1263358)

                If it was to become an issue, it might be possible to allow journals to ban AC comments?

                • (Score: 5, Informative) by janrinok on Thursday July 28, @05:22AM (1 child)

                  by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Thursday July 28, @05:22AM (#1263379) Journal

                  It is possible now.

                  I have done this as both an editor (with specific system privileges, and as a 'standard' user). I would welcome somebody else doing this just to confirm my findings.

                  When you create a new journal entry - usually by clicking on 'journal' in the side navigation box and then by selecting 'write in journal' from your personal journal page - you are presented with am 'Edit Journal Entry' box. Usually you fill in the subject (title) and then the journal topic, and the next drop down menu item is 'Comments', along with a warning that you cannot disable comments once they have been enabled. There are 7 options presented to you, including the default 'Comments Disabled' which prevents anybody from making comments.

                  The remaining options allow you to chose everybody or specific groups of community members (your 'friends', 'no foes' etc) that you wish to allow to comment, and one option allows you to choose 'Only Logged In Users'. This latter option prevents ACs who are not currently logged in from making comments on that particular journal. It is precisely this option that we are using to to prevent some ACs from abusing the front page.

                  The options are functional but are also something of a heavy hammer because they cannot be fine tuned or used in combination. This is partly because all ACs share the same account - and an account can either be enabled or disabled. It isn't possible to select just 'some' ACs, hence the problem that we have also found ourselves with over recent weeks. However, going back to the early 2000s the problem of ACs and unwanted comments was known and the ability to prevent such comments was built into the system from the very beginning. This is NOT a new problem.

                  It is interesting that many of the built in capabilities of slashd/rehash are not being used by the community - and I will confess that almost every editor had 'forgotten' about this capability despite that menu being on every editing page of every story that reaches the front page, and that includes myself! I knew it could be done, but I simply couldn't remember how!

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 31, @03:48PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 31, @03:48PM (#1264081)
                    I personally think it's fine to reduce the number of people who are too stupid/ignorant/lazy to create user accounts from posting comments.

                    If they are that incapable we are likely to not be missing out much.

                    Some mention "repressive regimes" but if they are really living in a repressive regime they better have figured out such stuff and more if they want to post anything anyway.
            • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Thursday July 28, @12:47AM

              by Reziac (2489) on Thursday July 28, @12:47AM (#1263356) Homepage

              Sad but utterly true.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Dichzor on Wednesday July 27, @07:53AM (1 child)

    by Dichzor (4816) on Wednesday July 27, @07:53AM (#1263163)

    It sure made me dust off the account i made when this place was new... ehehehe.

    The problem with rotten brainwashed reddit zombie wingnuts hating on everything they can't imagine, from their pathetic cellphones; won't solve itself - mitigation is clearly necessary.

  • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @10:18PM (1 child)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 28, @10:18PM (#1263502)

    While we're having this meta discussion there's something I've been wondering since last year:
    Is it possible to post a journal anonymously? Late last year I had a wonderful realization that was a LONG fucking time coming and I really wanted to share my thoughts with you guys (still do) but I don't want to risk someone I know IRL reading it and recognizing my pseudonym.
    Is my only choice in that regard to just make a second account just for one journal entry?

    • (Score: 4, Informative) by janrinok on Friday July 29, @02:30AM

      by janrinok (52) Subscriber Badge on Friday July 29, @02:30AM (#1263546) Journal

      Journals belong to accounts, and the only account that cannot have one is AC. So I cannot see a way of creating a journal without a username being attached to it.

      You can always create a special account - as you yourself suggested. If you do that, can I ask please that you let us know so that we do not mistake it for a sock puppet? Any abuse of that account (moderation by it etc) will result in a ban. If I get some time (yeah, like that is likely! :-) ) this weekend I will look into the code.

(1)