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posted by cmn32480 on Friday February 12 2016, @04:34PM   Printer-friendly
from the oragami-it-ain't dept.

I've taken the liberty of setting up an official folding@home team for Soylent News. In case you aren't familiar with folding@home, it's a distributed computing project that simulates protein folding in an attempt to better understand diseases such as Alzheimer's and Huntington's.

There is more information on the project here, which explains it much better than I could.

Clients are available for Linux, OSX, and even Windows (if you swing that way), so come join our botnet!

That Other Site's team is ranked at 1817, so we've got some catching up to do.

On a personal note, my Dad carries the gene markers for Huntington's disease, and will eventually succumb to it. Research like this is very helpful for understanding, and hopefully developing treatments for it.

tl;dr Our Soylent News team ID is 230319


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  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by paulej72 on Friday February 12 2016, @05:10PM

    by paulej72 (58) on Friday February 12 2016, @05:10PM (#303308) Journal

    Could you imagine someone running a modified version of a theoretical open source version that returned shit data. And that version put up on a sharing site so that it became the dominant version people used. Research would be set back years.

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  • (Score: 2) by opinionated_science on Friday February 12 2016, @05:59PM

    by opinionated_science (4031) on Friday February 12 2016, @05:59PM (#303328)

    that's not how it works, because scientific software can be compared with multiple data sources.

    They exploit the fluffy "screensaver supercomputer" meme, to lower their research costs.

    Perhaps, the funding agencies should pro-rate their grants for all the free computer time they are getting?

    Pros:
    Raising the profile of the use of biophysics to solve complex clinical problems

    Cons:
    Not raising the actual intellectual level by keeping the "how" secret and focusing on the "how much time can YOU donate?".

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 12 2016, @07:26PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 12 2016, @07:26PM (#303355)

      Unfortunately in this case it is about 'cred'. So people would cheat with points. I have seen people cheat over less.

      Once the project is done they should release the source so it can be checked and replicated though.

      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 12 2016, @07:45PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 12 2016, @07:45PM (#303367)

        If people can "cheat" merely because they can see and modify the source code, either your software is poorly designed or having it be proprietary is not going to help one bit.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2016, @08:51PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 14 2016, @08:51PM (#304306)

          your software is poorly designed

          all software is poorly designed

          probably something to do with humans being involved in the process, or something

          there might be some 'hello world' implementation that could be considered well designed, but then it probably runs on an operating system that's poorly designed

  • (Score: 2) by Tork on Saturday February 13 2016, @05:25AM

    by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Saturday February 13 2016, @05:25AM (#303563)
    Isn't this sort of trolling one of the earliest problems OSS has created several solutions for? I'll be the first to tell you I don't think OSS is a one-size-fits all solution, but if what you say is true then we'd never be able to rely on Open Souce web browsers or mail clients or even operating systems.
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    • (Score: 2) by q.kontinuum on Saturday February 13 2016, @09:45AM

      by q.kontinuum (532) on Saturday February 13 2016, @09:45AM (#303617) Journal

      That's not entirely comparable. When I download a browser, I can trust a signature of the binary (or, when I build from source, the hashes of the git repository). The trust is based on the fact that some more or less high-profile people publish their keys and vouch for the software with their good names.

      In an interactive online project with thousands of anonymous participants, the situation is different. If the key is part of the OSS-package, it can be extracted and used to sign falsified data. If the key is generated for each user, there is no base to trust this signature since $evilperson can generate a signature just as valid.

      That said, the concept they seem to employ here is security by obscurity, which is usually discouraged. I still think the only solution is to have some other kind of verification for the data.

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      • (Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Saturday February 13 2016, @12:51PM

        by maxwell demon (1608) on Saturday February 13 2016, @12:51PM (#303656) Journal

        The software would still come from a central repository with the maintainers having tight control of what does or does not go into the code. They would certainly not distribute the keys any more than they are distributed for Linux.

        I certainly would hope they verify their data. After all, intentional tampering is not the only way the data could get corrupted. The typical way to do this is to send the same work package to several clients, and compare the results. But there may also be checks that are less computationally expensive than doing the complete calculation again. I didn't check what they actually calculate, but if, for example, the algorithm is an iteration converging to the correct solution, then running the iteration step just once should be sufficient to check whether the iteration really converged.

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        • (Score: 2) by q.kontinuum on Saturday February 13 2016, @02:41PM

          by q.kontinuum (532) on Saturday February 13 2016, @02:41PM (#303676) Journal

          The software would still come from a central repository with the maintainers having tight control of what does or does not go into the code.

          ... which is a valid argument when you want to protect the user. But not when you want to prevent the user to modify the SW in order to receive higher scores with questionable data.

          They would certainly not distribute the keys any more than they are distributed for Linux.

          That would be different key of course. The binary is signed by the SW distributor, the returned data might be signed or encrypted by the SW running on the users computer and would need another key for that as well.

          I certainly would hope they verify their data. After all, intentional tampering is not the only way the data could get corrupted.

          For that a hash sum should suffice.

          The typical way to do this is to send the same work package to several clients, and compare the results. But there may also be checks that are less computationally expensive than doing the complete calculation again. I didn't check what they actually calculate, but if, for example, the algorithm is an iteration converging to the correct solution, then running the iteration step just once should be sufficient to check whether the iteration really converged.

          Basically my point: Arguing to avoid tempering by keeping the source closed is arguing for security by obscurity, which is wrong. Nevertheless the situation is slightly different from the case where the user is the one being protected, and the arguments need to be refined.

          Nitpick: Checking convergence might not be enough, since the user could also just "optimize" his version by running less iterations. But if the algorithms contain operations with properties like e.g. Prime-factorization, as in operation is way more expensive than reverse operation, the check might be simple, safe and cheap.

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  • (Score: 2) by q.kontinuum on Saturday February 13 2016, @09:37AM

    by q.kontinuum (532) on Saturday February 13 2016, @09:37AM (#303615) Journal

    So the project implements security by obscurity?

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