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posted by martyb on Friday August 23 2019, @06:17AM   Printer-friendly
from the tragedy-of-the-commons dept.

I was going to post this to a particular story, but thought this might generate more attention and discussion as a general submission.

Seriously, what is going on with all these troll mods? Just because you disagree with someone, thus earning a "disagree" mod, does not mean that person is a "troll." To steal a definition from Urban Dictionary:

An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

Just because you disagree with someone, does not mean they are trying to do the above. Be faster on the "disagree" and slower on the "troll." Under such abuse, it is hard to have a good discussion and, in itself, is trollish behavior by "generally disrupt[ing] normal on-topic discussion." Other than people disciplining themselves, a concerted effort to police such abuses, or making moderation logs public on the bottom of a comment where the score is shown now, I'm unsure of what to do about. As it stands, it is getting increasingly ridiculous to read what discussion is here on any topic remotely controversial, and is expanding outside of even those. It is starting to drive me away from the site, and I'm somewhat confident it is doing the same for others. I'd be interested to see what others think about the depth of the problem, if they even believe it even exists at all, and what solutions you all have for it.

[Ed note. This story is published exactly as received. First off, it bears repeating that complaining about moderations in the comments often leads (rightly) to an off-topic moderation. That is a contributing factor to my decision to run this story. Secondly, moderation is something that I on occasion have found I've fat-fingered and given a different moderation than expected. Thirdly, in the grand scheme of things, a comment's moderation is — relatively speaking — small potatoes. It is NOT a measure of your IQ or value as a human being. or standing in the community. Just accept that stuff happens and that as likely as not, someone will be along to moderate it the other way. Which is a good opportunity to say: PLEASE USE YOUR MOD POINTS! Lastly, if you think a comment was moderated in error, then send the CID (Comment ID) link e.g. "(#876543)" in an email to admin (at) soylentnews (dot) org. Keep in mind however that we are all volunteers here and there most likely will be a delay between when you send out an email and when we can get around to it. --martyb]

[Updated: 20190823_111312 UTC See comment from JR who far more precisely and eloquently expressed the idea I was attempting to. I concur with his assessment. If I want people to upmod a comment of mine that I believe was unfairly downmodded, then I need to be willing to upmod other's mis-modded comments. For perspective, so far this month, anywhere from ~150-~350 mod points were used in any given day. It bears repeating: use your mod points!]


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  • (Score: 2, Disagree) by exaeta on Saturday August 24 2019, @02:56AM (7 children)

    by exaeta (6957) on Saturday August 24 2019, @02:56AM (#884523) Homepage Journal
    If you mod a user troll, it gives them -2 karma. If that comment is later modded up to +2, they get the karma back, and you (the modder) get -4 karma instead. Would strongly discourage moderation abuse.
    --
    The Government is a Bird
    Starting Score:    1  point
    Moderation   0  
       Disagree=1, Total=1
    Extra 'Disagree' Modifier   0  
    Karma-Bonus Modifier   +1  

    Total Score:   2  
  • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday August 24 2019, @04:32AM (6 children)

    by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Saturday August 24 2019, @04:32AM (#884570) Homepage Journal

    Would also strongly discourage any downmodding as one man's Troll is another man's Funny.

    --
    My rights don't end where your fear begins.
    • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday August 28 2019, @01:17AM (5 children)

      by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Wednesday August 28 2019, @01:17AM (#886568) Journal

      They are orthogonal. I've seen some trolls that were hilarious and got me to laugh out loud in meatspace, *but they were still trolls.*

      Elsewhere, in AK's farewell journal, he brought up the fact that some posters have a habit of posting some halfway decent, relevant content, and then sprinkling it full of racism/anti-semitism/what-have-you, in the hopes that it'll get modded up. Same issue there. And as someone who's supposedly so invested in civil discourse (aaaaaaaaahahahahaha!) that my posts apparently give you a permanent case of the vapors, one would *think* that would have occurred to you.

      We know why it doesn't of course; you're another smirking hypocrite, another one who likes opponents that hold back and take the high road so you can take the low road.

      --
      I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
      • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Wednesday August 28 2019, @02:19AM (4 children)

        by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Wednesday August 28 2019, @02:19AM (#886596) Homepage Journal

        I've seen some trolls that were hilarious and got me to laugh out loud in meatspace, *but they were still trolls.*

        Yep, the standard for a downmod though (Overrated aside as it has a specifically different use) is "does this make for interesting conversation". That's the entire point of even having a moderation system. If something doesn't detract from having an interesting discussion, it doesn't need to go down. Interesting in the "that made me think" sense, mind, not in the "that's what I think too" sense. Sometimes a well formed bit of trolling is exactly what's needed to get an issue addressed that normally wouldn't be. Mostly not but that's the lumps you have to take when you get your troll on.

        --
        My rights don't end where your fear begins.
        • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Wednesday August 28 2019, @10:17PM (3 children)

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Wednesday August 28 2019, @10:17PM (#887007) Journal

          And I don't particularly find a couple of semi-insightful points buried in a mound of idiot, inflammatory trolling like solitary corn kernels in a huge steaming turd "interesting conversation." So downmods it is. Glad we cleared that up!

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
          • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday August 29 2019, @12:51AM (2 children)

            by The Mighty Buzzard (18) Subscriber Badge <themightybuzzard@proton.me> on Thursday August 29 2019, @12:51AM (#887078) Homepage Journal

            You're saying you only downmod things that detract from an on-topic conversation? You forget that I can see your mod history? You're not one of our more intellectually honest moderators, though you're not the worst by a damned sight.

            --
            My rights don't end where your fear begins.
            • (Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday August 29 2019, @01:22AM

              by aristarchus (2645) on Thursday August 29 2019, @01:22AM (#887093) Journal

              I find this an interesting concept:

              not one of our more intellectually honest moderators,

              I would be interested in subscribing to The Mighty Buzzard newsletter of Intellectual Honesty, please.

            • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday August 29 2019, @01:58PM

              by Azuma Hazuki (5086) on Thursday August 29 2019, @01:58PM (#887274) Journal

              I downmod things that are flat wrong too, no matter how "interesting" they might appear.

              See, you're committing the Fox News Fallacy, the idea that any two sides of an issue are equally valid and equally worth listening to. Fuck no the fuck they aren't, and I'm not going to fall for that smirking, sociopathic gambit. I know what's behind it:"Hurr hurr, they're so fucking goodie-two-shoes rule-bound, let's flood them with utter shit and accuse them of being hypocrites if they don't engage with perfect civility!"

              No. Fuck you, and fuck everyone who tries that, and fuck you a second time for thinking I and others can't see exactly what you're doing.

              --
              I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...