from the fortunes-declining-like-many-other-americans dept.
AlterNet reports
Donald Trump has dropped 92 places in the Forbes list of wealthiest Americans, with the magazine putting his wealth at $3.1bn, down from $3.7bn last year.
[...] Forbes ranked the first billionaire president as the 248th wealthiest person in America. The year before, he was ranked 156th.
As a candidate, Trump said his net worth was more than $10bn, but Forbes pegged that figure at $4.5bn in September 2015. By Forbes' estimates, Trump's wealth has fallen 31% in two years.
According to Forbes' story:
It was another record year for the wealthiest people in America, as the price of admission to the country's most exclusive club jumped nearly 18% to $2 billion. Even at these new heights, entrepreneurs are breaking into the ranks for the first time as they mint fortunes in everything from telecom to booze to fishing. There were 22 newcomers, 14 of whom are self-made entrepreneurs. Among the most notable: Arizona iced tea cofounder Don Vultaggio; Netflix cofounder Reed Hastings; Tito Beveridge, the creator of Tito's Handmade Vodka; Chuck Bundrant, whose Trident Seafoods sells his fish to places like McDonald's and Burger King; and Rocco Commisso, founder of cable TV and broadband firm Mediacom and owner of the New York Cosmos, a soccer club based in Brooklyn.
The most notable loser was President Donald Trump, whose fortune fell $600 million to $3.1 billion. A tough New York real estate market, particularly for retail locations; a costly lawsuit and an expensive presidential campaign all contributed to the declining fortune of the 45th president.
If you prefer, you can just go straight to the list [Edit - that requires JS from www.forbes.com and i.forbesimg.com, JS-phobes can get just the raw numbers here -- FP].
In November, some thought that having a successful businessman at the helm would cure USA's ills. I wonder if this will increase the incidence of buyer's remorse among voters.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by choose another one on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:24PM (14 children)
"having a successful businessman at the helm would cure USA's ills"
Leaving aside from the debate around whether Trump actually is a successful businessman or not, what is undeniable is that he has achieved what he has by using bankruptcy when his ideas or execution have been bad.
Countries do far worse in bankruptcy than companies, no one can buy a bankrupt country, intact or split into parts, no one can say "well, without the debt and with a little capital injection, this looks like a good business", no one injects capital into bankrupt countries. It can take generations for countries to emerge from bankruptcy.
If I was looking for a businessman to manage a country, I'd say a history of getting it right every time is much much better qualification than a history of mistakes followed by bankruptcy, even if the latter lead to arguably better returns in the end.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:59PM (3 children)
Just curious smart ass, what's your place?
Yeah, the debate has ended.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:57PM (2 children)
Kim Kardashian outranks us all by that metric. Should she be president next?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @07:47PM (1 child)
No, but there is no debate about what a great business woman she is, is there?
(Score: 2) by bob_super on Thursday October 19 2017, @08:41PM
Why not? The threshold for president has been dropped so low that I don't see how she could possibly not qualify. It'd be nice to not be called a sexist when you point out the woman in charge got there because of her ass.
"Vote for me, I'm not hiding anything!" There's a precedent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:02PM
Stop saying I went bankrupt. Out of hundreds of deals -- hundreds -- on four occasions, I've taken advantage of the laws of this country, like other people. What I've done is I've used, BRILLIANTLY, the laws of the country. I used the law four times and made a tremendous thing. And not personally, just corporate. And if you look at people like myself that are at the highest levels of business, they use the chapter law -- many of them have done it, many times. The difference is, when somebody else uses those laws, nobody writes about it. Virtually every person that you read about on the front page of the business sections, they've used the law. When I use it, it's like, "Oh, Trump, Trump, Trump." These lenders aren't babies. These are total killers. These are not the nice, sweet little people. The fact is, I built a net worth of more than $10 billion. I have a great, great company. I'm running a business for myself, for my company, for my employees, and for my family. I employ thousands of people. And I'm very proud of the job I did. Don't forget. Somebody has to understand debt. I'm the king of debt. I had the good sense, and I've gotten a lot of credit in the financial pages. If things don't work out, I renegotiate. I had the good sense to leave Atlantic City. I left Atlantic City before it totally cratered. And I made a lot of money in Atlantic City, and I’m very proud of it. I never went bankrupt but like many great business people have used the laws to corporate advantage -- smart! I'm in business. I did a very good job.
And when the country has too much debt, that's a different thing. You go back and you say, guess what, the economy crashed, I'm going to give you half. I think it could be a good time to borrow and pay off debt -- borrow and pay off debt -- borrow debt, make longer term debt. #MAGA 🇺🇸
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:06PM (2 children)
Most businesses fail. Most successful businessman have had multiple failures.
To avoid failure, there are two options. The first is to not try. We call these people "employees", not businessmen. The second is to be lucky. We call these people "inexperienced".
My ideal candidate has had both success and failure. The importance of success should be obvious; lots of success suggests that one can organize a group to get things done. The importance of failure is that it provides empathy and a healthy fear of screwing up. I want somebody who has had to admit to friends and family that their investment can not be paid back. I want somebody who has had to lay off people that they enjoy working with. That pain teaches a lesson.
(Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:37PM (1 child)
To avoid failure, there are two options. The first is to not try. We call these people "employees", not businessmen. The second is to be lucky. We call these people "inexperienced".
Third option: cash injection from rich Daddy.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @06:39PM
So what if Trump's dad supplied a small loan. You'd barely be able to open a decent restaurant, dentist office, or car repair shop with that.
Increasing that by a factor of about 1000 is not so easy. If you think it is, why are you not rich? Thinking smaller, starting from what middle class people may have: start with 100 thousand, get 100 million. Easy, huh? Why is it that the typical techie doesn't do that?
(Score: 2) by VLM on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:37PM (4 children)
Not really. Companies usually lose sovereignty and the investors lose it all. But countries? In the long run there's only two kinds of fiat currencies, those that have failed, and those that haven't failed yet. It usually turns out pretty well for the country.
Note the difference between the country as a state, and the obsolete definition of the country as the citizens. Nobody cares about the citizens anymore, not in a long time. Most govt policies for a long time across all cultures are "F the citizens as long as it benefits the state". Monarchies and dictatorships are somewhat better in that way (although worse in other unrelated areas, consider human rights for example). Possibly you might have a point that "not a big deal" WRT political rulers can suck pretty bad for main street citizens. Even there I donno if its all that bad.
I'm just saying the typical company is nearly mortally wounded at best by bankruptcy vs the typical country having a currency crisis is barely a blip on the radar compared to military invasion or refugee invasion or natural disasters or leftists.
Consider S. Korea's experience during the 90s Asian financial crisis which is pretty much a big "eh" then and totally ignorable "eh" today vs Radio Shack Inc's relatively unremarkable bankruptcy which was pretty much the end of their little corporate world.
Oh come on. You have it backwards, unless you're trying to write parody. Those are some high demand high yield bonds you're talking about.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:58PM
I'm impressed. This was a very subtle and impressive way to subconsciously impose your political opinion on the reader. The best part is that it is also literally true, but not carries a connotation far different than what you say.
To make it more clear, I could equally say, "there are only two types of men, those who have murdered somebody, and those who have not murdered somebody yet."
If you want to attack fiat currencies, please do so with actual facts in an honest debate, rather than clever wordplay.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by khallow on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:14PM
They care more now than they would 300 years ago.
That's a ridiculous assertion to make. Monarchies and dictatorships are notorious for treating their citizens like shit. You know who is actually better at treating their citizens well? Democracies, even democracies that don't work very well.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:58PM
Stop making me mod Hallow insightful, goddammit.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:14PM
So, the corporation may be mortally wounded, but its leadership often goes on to reform a new corporation trying the same failed scheme again.
Countries mostly have continuity of geographic boundaries and therefore citizens through a bankruptcy, but their governments are often outsted / heavily nerfed by bailout deals, and those ousted government officials from financially failing states don't land nearly as well as failed corporate leaders.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by rylyeh on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:48PM
Our 'best' political leaders have not been Billionaires.
But if we have to have a 'Captain of Industry' then how about Warren Buffett?
Oh yeah, he's to smart to run for a shit job like POTUS.
"a vast crenulate shell wherein rode the grey and awful form of primal Nodens, Lord of the Great Abyss."
(Score: 4, Funny) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:28PM (33 children)
Buyer's remorse among voters? They're talking about running Jamie Dimon for President. You couldn't possibly imagine a more worthless candidate than someone 10 times more entitled than Trump with zero experience dealing with anything as tangible as real estate.
I'd like to try a real engineer with improvisational aptitude. By the end of the first month 90% of the DC bureaucracy would be processed into soylent, and the infinite volumes of the American legal code reduced to a very small shellscript.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:44PM (11 children)
How about a scholar for president, is that good enough? dr. Jill Stein [wikipedia.org]
"This country is sick, and dr. Stein has the cure!"
Naah.. surely she's unqualified, because she lacks a willy :-/
About the soylent: I'd think she'd start by putting the lobbyists to a land-improving use. Make Our American Soil Great Again! ;-)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:07PM (4 children)
Is it homeopathic?
(Score: 3, Funny) by DannyB on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:22PM
Some people say homeopathy is completely useless. However it is effective for the treatment of dehydration. So homeopathy isn't completely useless, it is just an over priced way to obtain pure water.
To transfer files: right-click on file, pick Copy. Unplug mouse, plug mouse into other computer. Right-click, paste.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:38PM (1 child)
No it isn't homeopathic. Mike Pence wouldn't stand for that.
(Score: 2, Funny) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:07PM
I was joking. When I said @VP Pence wants to hang all the gays, I was joking. Of course I was being sarcastic, but not so sarcastic, to be honest.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:31PM
No. Did you miss the part where she's an MD and practiced medicine for quite a while? I suppose you'll reflexively vomit up some crap about vaccines and other truthy nonsense.
Somebody very much like her in my original timeline went into particle physics instead. That's divergence for you. That one's the PhD, not this one.
I think she makes a better particle physicist imho. Gate theory is a promising building block for unifying the quantum and relativistic realms. I'm certain when I return to 2042, she'll feel very glad that she didn't go into medicine or politics. The Dr. Stein in this timeline will be lucky to be a footnote somewhere.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:21PM (4 children)
She was the only one in the 2016 race who had an actual jobs program. [googleusercontent.com] (orig) [ontheissues.org]
...and when she was running for governor of Massachusetts and debated Mitt Romney, the Bopston Globe called her the only adult in the room. [google.com]
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:45PM (1 child)
And of course the media played up her weirder moments, like any human on earth wouldn't have some incredibly compromising moments in their life. Can't let a real person in the club, only those who have agreed to play the politics game.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:37PM
If only.
Here she is in 2012, all bundled up in a Wisconsin winter, joining Occupy protesters outside the state capitol. [worldwidehippies.com]
(O'Bummer never showed up.)
Days earlier, she had been on the picket line with striking teachers.
Before that, she had been at a pro-hemp festival in Oregon.
In August, she was arrested at a sit-in at a Philadelphia bank while protesting housing foreclosures.
In October, she was arrested in Texas at a pipeline protest.
That year, there were also several debates among 3rd party candidates.
My bet is that you didn't see any of that reported in Lamesteam Media.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:42PM (1 child)
She was the only one in the 2016 race who had an actual jobs program.
If those four bullet points count as a jobs program then Clinton had an even more robust jobs program [hillaryclinton.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @08:59PM
Training for jobs that don't exist is a typical Neoliberal scam.
Training is what you need AFTER there are jobs that can't be filled.
...meanwhile The Green New Deal includes
- building/expanding factories that produce solar panels, wind turbines, heat pumps, etc
- expand the USAian workforce needed to produce that GREEN stuff
- seal the cracks, add weatherstripping, add insulation, and improve windows in every building that doesn't meet 21st Century standards
- expand the USAian workforce needed to install that GREEN stuff
Not only does that have US using less energy, the GREEN energy that is used doesn't add to Global Warming.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2, Disagree) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:36PM
No a scholar is not good enough. They don't know how to design systems that actually do things. They're merely a different kind of useless wanker.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Ethanol-fueled on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:53PM (2 children)
Trump is going after the Jews. He's playing the Breitbart game where he claims to be pro-Israel but is really America-first. Pandering to the Jews is a necessity in American politics, unfortunately, but he's going after their establishments one-by-one -- Harvey Weinstein (and by extension the rest of Hollywood and even some large mainstream media outlets) is just the tip of the iceberg.
That media and finance are going after him is totally no surprise, but he is standing his ground. I just hope that we will be able to read for certain that the Jews did Kennedy and 9/11.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:00PM (1 child)
I can't keep up. The other day you said we're supposed to hate Mexicans because they're bad and responsible for everything that's bad. Before that you said it was the Muslims. In between you've told us it's definitely libtards and SJW snowflakes, whatever and whoever those are. Who can we trust, Eth, who? Who is gonna save us from this white genocide you and VLM say we're in? Chuck Norris?
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1) by baldrick on Friday October 20 2017, @01:18PM
chuck norris does kungfu - communist for sure
... I obey the Laws of Physics
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:30PM (1 child)
Can't imagine a more worthless candidate? How about Mark Elliot Zuckerberg or Michael Richard Pence?
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:41PM
Those are also very worthless candidates. Personally i'd like to see Jamie Dimon torn to pieces by hyenas slightly more than your picks.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by VLM on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:56PM (9 children)
Hmm yeah maybe a former naval nuclear submarine engineering officer. I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
(for the sarcasm impaired, I've forgotten more history than most people know, so no karma whoring "well acktually you clearly don't know about former president Mr ...")
I think what went wrong with that former prez at a high level, was he was a superior human being. I am too, I know the experience. My first mgmt job about a quarter century ago I had trouble adjusting to the idea that I got the job because I was very good at my job because of who and what I was, so naturally I'd magically increase team production once I have a team to manage via osmosis or some damn thing, but the people I was in charge of were slackers I couldn't relate to very well, or to be honest, couldn't relate to them at all. Luckily I figured out "how to manage inferiors" in my 20s but the former president seems not to have figured that out, possibly, at all, ever, in his entire lifetime, much to the detriment of his performance. All the former prez failings seem to follow from that fundamental inability of his. Given a bunch of highly motivated hyper intelligent nuclear navy personnel he did pretty well... given a country of shitty 70s boomer hippies high on weed he was kinda lost; typical career academy officer, not worth much when LARPing as a drill sgt.
Something similar would happen with a typical engineer. The social dynamics of the university EE lab are not applicable to the real world. This is how we'd do it at MIT, works in a monoculture of 140+ IQ people, but not with multicultural 80 to 100 IQ people.
If you'd like an alternative viewpoint, a drill instructor as god emperor would be interesting to see. Absolute power corrupts humans absolutely, but drill sgts seem inhuman so they avoid that peculiar constraint of humans. Once in awhile you get one who has sex with the female trainees, or kills someone, but its remarkably rare compared to the NCO corps or especially compared to the general public.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:50PM (4 children)
Jimmy Carter's failing was not that he was not smart enough, but that he expected the rest of DC to follow his example of intelligent, moral collaboration. Of course that failed because DC is a wretched hive of scum and villainy.
An engineer who understood that and had the will to cleanse that place with fire would tower above any other American in history. They'd pile up granite higher than Mt. McKinley to carve a giant statue of him.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:48PM (1 child)
But to accomplish that such a president would have to vastly abuse their power and would likely destroy everything. How do you go from dictator / coup back to democracy?
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @07:57PM
Not necessarily. Under the system we have we'd need such a person taking office with a posse in Congress with sufficient discipline and skill to drive a decisive agenda. If that agenda aimed squarely at really taking down the status quo, it would be enormously popular and successful with the American people. Congress has a single-digit approval rating, so they're hanging by a thread as it is.
The model I have in mind is a technocrat like Bloomberg. I had bones to pick with the guy, but he was one of the more effective leaders I've seen in America in my lifetime. He managed to move the needle in a very entrenched, corrupt political culture in the country's largest city, and he did it with a relative lack of controversy (compare, for example, with Rudy Giuliani's time as mayor).
Short of a revolution, something like that is required to keep America from coming apart at the seams and breathe new life into this democracy.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Thursday October 19 2017, @07:13PM (1 child)
I don't think we're disagreeing very much.
Can't help but notice the cultural concept of the nerd was invented and pushed hard in the 70s possibly precisely to prevent someone capable of fixing things from rising to power and "draining the swamp", which might be seen as an endorsement of the theory, by the system.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @07:58PM
Well TPTB can't allow governance according to the data when the data is so damning, right? Because that's exactly the kind of governance a nerd/engineer/technocrat is wont to do.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:08PM (2 children)
I guess you are not superior when it comes to modesty. Somebody is channeling their inner Trump.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Thursday October 19 2017, @07:26PM (1 child)
I was pretty young in the Carter years, but what little I remember, and discussions after his term about him, imply he wasn't very modest about not being a crook, but I don't think that was his problem in being effective. Merely being himself with a little more modesty wouldn't have helped him.
In my case before I was in mgmt I was pretty successful and professional (at least at work) so I had roughly zilch experience with counseling / disciplining / fixing interpersonal problems at work. Who would act that stupid at work, I'd never do something that stupid as they can see, and shrug shoulders didn't work so well in low level mgmt. Rather than more humility about my better judgment, what worked more or less is some folks just need to be told how it is, a little stronger hand.
Now modesty was really a Clinton problem. I'm just a good ole boy to have a beer with, while everyone knows he's a bribe taking rapist. A little humility about being a dirtbag would have helped. Ms Clinton had a similar issue WRT I am a woman and its my time much like everyone gets out of the way of a 9-month pregnant woman because "its time" she thought the whole would would worship her presidential run merely because of her genitals, which ironically are not that rare or unusual being present in about half the population. Like trying to sell a pet rock to a skeptical population. Didn't work out so well, LOL, but a little humility might have helped her percentages a bit.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @08:03PM
"a little humility might have helped her percentages a bit."
I disagree. A soul and total personality transplant could not have fixed that trainwreck of a candidate. You'd have to send somebody back in a time machine and undertake some serious temporal engineering to try and encourage a more positive development of Hillary Clinton. But, honestly, probably not even then.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by pdfernhout on Friday October 20 2017, @01:56PM
You may find some of the books here on management of interest, especially Michael Lopp's "Managing Humans: Biting and Humorous Tales of a Software Engineering Manager" which goes into detail on why the transition from engineer to manager can be so rough:
https://github.com/pdfernhout/High-Performance-Organizations-Reading-List [github.com]
At least in technical firms (others may differ) it's not quite so much about becoming a drill sergeant as becoming a social connector and social problem solver -- which requires different skills and domain knowledge than solving engineering problems (even if there is some overlap about finding solutions to complex problems). You wouldn't expect an electrical engineer to immediately start solving complex problems in genetics, so why think an electrical engineer can suddenly solve complex problems in social relationships? Or why think most competent and happy EEs would ever be happier suddenly shifted to working on genetics in the way we often just expect engineers would see management as a step up?
That said, China has been mostly run by engineers recently:
https://www.computerworld.com/article/2518910/it-management/five-reasons-why-china-will-rule-tech.html [computerworld.com]
"In China, eight of the nine members of the Standing Committee of the Political Bureau, including the Chinese president, Hu Jintao, have engineering degrees; one has a degree in geology. Of the 15 U.S. cabinet members, six have law degrees. Only one cabinet member has a hard-science degree -- Secretary of Energy Steven Chu, who won the Nobel Prize in physics in 1997, has a doctorate in physics. President Barack Obama and Vice President Joe Biden have law degrees."
The biggest challenge of the 21st century: the irony of technologies of abundance used by scarcity-minded people.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:44PM (5 children)
Jamie Dimon? Man with less charisma than a damp, crumpled paper towel of questionable origin? And miraculously less scrupulous than one as well.
Sure run him!
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:52PM (4 children)
You dispute his obvious genius? His is a simple, powerful, and original plan: eliminate all taxes for rich people.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1) by redneckmother on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:33PM (2 children)
... and this is different from Donnie Jingles... how?
Mas cerveza por favor.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:50PM (1 child)
Dimon would spend less time publicly masturbating on Twitter. ...probably.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:07PM
Dimon would also probably try to sell tickets for it.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1) by pdfernhout on Friday October 20 2017, @02:01PM
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/10/11/republican-tax-cut-for-rich-economy-215696 [politico.com]
"A Zillionaire’s Solution: Tax the Rich and Save the Economy
The Republican tax plan is a scam that won’t create jobs, contrary to what Trump says.
By [Billionaire VC] Nick Hanauer October 11, 2017"
The biggest challenge of the 21st century: the irony of technologies of abundance used by scarcity-minded people.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:38PM (8 children)
Trump gets into office, then loses a personal fortune.
All other recent presidents get into office, then somehow end up filthy rich. Hmmm. I wonder how?
It's pretty obvious which person became president in service to his country.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:11PM (2 children)
President Grant was broke and had cancer in his final days.
It was a race to see if he would complete his memoirs and have something for his family to live on or whether he would die first.
(He got it done. The dude was so popular[1] that it was a best seller.)
[1] ...despite having 2 of the most corrupt administrations in history.
Truman didn't have a pot to piss in when he left the Oval Office for the last time.
That was when Congress decided to give presidents a pension.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:53PM
Let's not determine "recent" by the standards of paleontology.
Starting with Carter probably makes sense. Certainly, anybody before World War II was in a very different America.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:20PM
This week it’s Donald J. Trump. I wonder, is it George Washington next week and is it Thomas Jefferson the week after? Is it James Madison and James Monroe the week after that? You know, you really do have to ask yourself, where does it stop? George Washington owned a grist mill. Thomas Jefferson owned a nail factory; James Madison and James Monroe had tobacco plantations. And nobody said, "oh, emoluments!" But now they have Donald J. Trump to kick around. No politician in history, and I say this with great surety, has been treated worse or more unfairly. I can't say a lot about it because they're suing me. A lot, a lot of lawsuits. But I'll tell you, it's very unfair. 🇺🇸
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @05:06PM (3 children)
Sounds more like a plan to cover up the money he finally paid back to Putin Co.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @06:44PM (2 children)
The FBI just released more about an investigation involving Russia and a bunch of uranium. Guess who is involved.
This is a few days old. CNN has avoided it entirely, as you'd expect.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:02PM (1 child)
Is this really another "but hillary!" post? She lost, get over it!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:24PM
Trump is your president.
Well, if not, you need to go home. Call ICE if you need transportation.
Until you accept Trump and get Hillary/Obama to butt out of politics (good luck with that), the "but hillary!" issues are 100% on topic.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @10:56PM
Really? He's serving our country? So when is he going to stop appointing establishment authoritarians like Jeff Sessions and swamp creatures like Goldman Sachs cronies into his administration? When is he going to get rid of (or at least speak vehemently against) the NSA's unconstitutional mass surveillance and the TSA? When is he going to stop exceeding the authority given to the president by the Constitution via all these executive orders? When is he going to pull us out of all the wars we're currently in, seeing as how not a single one of them is a war of defense (the only kind of justifiable war)? When is he going to take an actual stand against the drug war, which is largely unconstitutional? And no, 'But other presidents did it too!' is not a valid defense; they were all authoritarian scumbags as well, including Obama.
How retarded do you have to be to think that Trump is somehow serving the country?
(Score: 2) by looorg on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:39PM (3 children)
Did I just miss out on something obvious? He isn't allowed to be a businessman when he is president? So one would think his fortune would dwindle while in "public service" (or whatever you like to call it).
Personally I found this entry funny; "Tito's Handmade Vodka" ... compared to what? All the Vodka made by the feet of the robot overlords?
(Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:59PM (2 children)
Not true.
All presidents prior to Trump have put their holdings into a trust that they can't touch.
Trump didn't.
...but that's not illegal in itself.
The Emoluments Clause(s)[1] of the Constitution says that politicians can't take any additional income that wouldn't come if they weren't in office (gifts, bribes, foreigners renting rooms in your hotels to curry favor).
Trump has ignored this constitutional provision so many times that it ain't even funny.
That one is definitely going into the articles of impeachment.
[1] It's important enough that they actually put it in there TWICE.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Thursday October 19 2017, @02:57PM
I've separated myself from my companies. I'm no longer running them. My sons, Donald Jr. and Eric, are running them. The Kingdom of Bahrain could hold a huge, huge party at Trump International Hotel in Washington to celebrate the anniversary of His Majesty King Hamad Bin Isa Al Khalifa’s accession to the throne, and I would be none the wiser. It's a mile away from the White House, but I would never know. The Republican Party could hold a fund raiser there in July, and I would never know. I call it a blind trust. Trust me, I'm totally, totally blind to it. 🇺🇸
(Score: 4, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:55PM
C'mon Dick Cheney blew that totally away by invading Iraq to enrich himself through fat contracts for Halliburton. If whe wasn't impeached and turned ovedr to the Hague to be tried for war crimes, no American president ever will be.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @12:47PM (7 children)
Pacifica Radio presenter Ian Masters has interviewed Pulitzer Prize winner, tax expert, and Trump biographer David Cay Johnston several times.
Earlier this month, Johnston came right out and called Trump a crook.
With all the illegal stuff that Trump has has done (tax cheating, in particular), Johnston is amazed that Trump isn't in prison.
14 MB MP3 [kpfk.org] available until mid-December.
Johnston is the 2nd guest at about the 22 minute mark.
(KPFK was in pledge drive mode, so the announced 3rd guest isn't in that recording.)
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:07PM (6 children)
Trump's taxes in some years are probably a bit embarrassing. It is legal to carry some business losses into other years for tax purposes, and he has almost certainly done so, resulting in no tax. On the other hand, there are years where he paid enough to buy an F-15 and training for several pilots. There is nothing illegal here. It's just... awkward.
Meanwhile, we have this:
http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/clinton-foundation-refiles-taxes-after-charges-it-ran-a-slush-fund/ [investors.com]
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/11/17/clinton-foundation-amends-four-years-tax-returns.html [foxnews.com]
Yep. That is 4 years of fraud ("mistakes" if you were born yesterday) that got caught.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @01:32PM (5 children)
There has been only 1 year of Trump's tax returns made available.
Interestingly, that was leaked to Johnston.
It shows that Trump did pay something that year.
It stands to reason that if the same was true for other years, those returns would have been made available.
Johnston, with his vast knowledge of tax law and the way it is abused, speculates that in the following years Trump clawed all of that back.
The audio has enough details to be interesting.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @03:23PM (4 children)
Our tax law is complicated. Any sane person or business will do their best to minimize the amount of tax that must be paid. Those who do this well are intelligent and effective... not that this should be possible.
Blame the law, not the people trying to pay as little as possible.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @04:51PM (3 children)
Blame the obvious con man, not his victims. If Trump had actually followed the law he wouldn't be so hesitant about releasing his taxes, or he is a massive liar and doesn't want anyone to see how much trouble his "business" is in. Take your pick, the man is still a walking talking turd. Also, since most of those tax cuts are lobbied for by businesses I have a hard time giving anyone a pass. Abuse a bad law and you're still a bad person. Same for every police department that used civil forfeiture, they are criminals that should be sent behind bars.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @06:51PM (2 children)
Trump claimed that he is audited ever year. If that is true, he must have paid (after audit, if not before) every penny required by law (plus interest and penalties if applicable). If you don't think he paid enough, the problem is the law, not Trump. I don't understand why people keep claiming that Trump somehow avoided following the law when he was audited.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @09:50PM (1 child)
You got the story wrong.
IRS can go back 7 years with an audit.
It appears that that is what they were doing in the Obama years.
As Johnston says in his interview, the way that real estate people do things, it's necessary to have -multiple- years of returns to determine strategies/violations.
...and, as Trump's 1 leaked tax return shows, there's nothing to prevent him from releasing ALL of his tax returns.
The reason he is not doing that, it seems obvious, is that there's stuff in those that shows him to be crooked.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 20 2017, @12:24AM
I misspoke.
There is no statute of limitations on tax fraud.
IRS can go back as far as they want with audits.
A general recommendation that I have heard is to save tax records for 7 years.
After that, they tend to lose interest in Joe Average.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1) by corey on Thursday October 19 2017, @08:32PM (1 child)
And the rich keep getting richer..
Need to convert them all to Buddhism, then they'll give all of it away to help others and keep just enough they need.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday October 19 2017, @10:20PM
then they'll give all of it away to help others
...or those dirtbags could simply be proper Christians--rather than just Sunday Christians.
.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]