Nebraska regulators approved an alternative route Monday for the proposed Keystone XL pipeline. It was the last major regulatory hurdle facing project operator TransCanada Corp., though opponents say another round of federal approval may now be needed.
The Nebraska Public Service Commission's ruling was on the Nebraska route TransCanada has proposed to complete the $8 billion, 1,179-mile (1,897-kilometer) pipeline to deliver oil from Alberta, Canada, to Texas Gulf Coast refineries. The proposed Keystone XL route would cross parts of Montana, South Dakota and most of Nebraska to Steele City, Nebraska.
The long-delayed project was rejected by President Barack Obama in 2015, citing concerns about carbon pollution. President Donald Trump revived it in March, approving a permit.
[...] The five-member Nebraska Public Service Commission was forbidden by law from factoring pipeline safety or the risk of spills into its decision because pipeline safety is a federal responsibility. So, it couldn't take into account a spill of 210,000 gallons (790,000 liters) of oil on the existing Keystone pipeline in South Dakota announced on Thursday.
Also at Alternative Keystone XL route gets approved in Nebraska
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:16AM (4 children)
Why not build a refinery in Canada?
(Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:27AM
We want jobs in the USA, not in Canada. If the snow-Mexicans want to Make Canada Great Again, they should elect Ted Cruz. He was even born in Canada. Sorry, we aren't sharing Trump, but I guess he might be available if you can wait another 7 years.
Pipelines would still be required anyway, for shipping the products to both the Pacific and the Atlantic. Given how many pipes the USA already has, going via the USA is relatively easy.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @04:21AM
The pollution laws are too strict. They're more flexible here in the USA.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by drussell on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:54AM (1 child)
Personally, I would love to see more refining capacity here in Alberta. That way we could make a greater share of the total value of the finished, refined products instead of shipping just the cheap crude oil and letting people elsewhere make all the money by adding value in the refining process...
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Goghit on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:42PM
Some of us on the coast would like to see more refining capacity in Alberta as well - there'd be less opposition to piping refined products to tankers out here than that unrefined dil-bit shit.
Unfortunately it's expensive to build and run refineries for bitumen and the Koch Bros want to get the chunk of Alberta tar sands they own to their refineries in the Gulf, so that's never going to happen. Personally, I'd like to see refineries in Alberta and the tar sand extraction operations run on nuclear heated steam. Bonus points if the reactor is sited over a geological fault somewhere close to Calgary so they can gain a better appreciation of how we feel about tankers out here.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:20AM (11 children)
The leak is marked by an 'X' on this map, and the section Trump approved is a red dashed line:
https://i.redd.it/vjo9y82bpgyz.jpg [i.redd.it]
Unmarked map:
http://www.keystone-xl.com/kxl-101/maps/ [keystone-xl.com]
Wikipedia about the pipeline:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Pipeline [wikipedia.org]
FWIW, this is about 4 train cars worth. Warren Buffett encouraged the protests because he makes lots of money shipping the oil via train, which is 5x more costly than pipelines. Trains derail and spill all the time.
Newer pipe, made with US steel, might be more reliable than pipes with old Chinese steel. It certainly beats trains.
(Score: 1, Offtopic) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:26AM (1 child)
This was proposed right about the same time that more than fifty people died in the fire that resulted from a derailment in Quebec.
The port commission, which used to run mostly on autopilot, has been the focus of politics in Vancouver the last little while. A developer is building a one billion mixed retail, restaurant and residential development right on the river, close to the port, but will stop building if that depot is approved, as the trains will run right next to his real estate.
A year or so ago an oil train derailed in a park right on the Columbia River. Accident inspectors found that the railway company was not maintaining the tracks to their own standards.
What I cannot fathom is why anyone thinks its a good idea to load that oil into barges in Vancouver, then sail it down the Columbia river.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:36AM
He might pause for a bit. He might slightly change plans. He won't stop; that is a threat made for political theater.
For an example more familiar to soylentnews readers, we see similar nonsense all the time in telecom. An ISP claims that they will only upgrade if they get a monopoly. They threaten to stop building out fiber or cell towers or 4G if competition is allowed. When we cave, projects mysteriously take forever to complete and sometimes get cancelled. When we call their bluff, they upgrade. Typically there is a pause while we discuss regulatory changes, with lots of ads to let us know. After competition comes in, upgrades happen rapidly. For example, cities that got Google fiber usually got huge speed/price improvements from the company that just lost their monopoly.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:29AM (2 children)
Besides it's quite clearly the machinations of Philip Anschutz, who needs high volume cheap rail to ship his cheap beer.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:41AM (1 child)
I remembered it wrongly. Warren Buffett is the one. George Soros doesn't do 100% of the evil shit in the world, even if sometimes it feels that way. This time I verified the guilty party.
Also, I got to that other story late. Few people saw the info. It is natural to assume that the pipeline was approved by Trump, and I'm pretty sure this is intended by the writer.
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:13PM
I approved the Keystone XL, as I promised. I didn't approve the other one, the regular size Keystone. I guarantee, I would have approved it, I didn't get to approve that one. Nebraska had to approve the Keystone XL. I didn't say they approved it, the story doesn't say they approved it. But they approved it. It needed to happen and it happened, which is tremendous. Great job by Editor Mrpg putting that in! I promised Transcanada and the American people -- I always, always put the American people first -- I would approve the Keystone XL. And now it's going to get built. Terrific! #PromisesKept [twitter.com]
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:34AM (5 children)
[Citation needed]
To be specific, I'd like to see statistics on "spills resulted by derailed trains in spilled quantity and number of incidents/year".
---
just in case you wanna go there: "the burden of proving a claim shall always remain with the claimant".
This should be an amendment to the US constitution, if there isn't one already (grin)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by MostCynical on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:02AM (4 children)
Standard reply "google it yourself"
Turns out, Trains are an awful way to transport oil.. But so are all the other methods.
http://www.blackle.com/results/?q=train [blackle.com] crash oil spill per annum%20crash%20oil%20spill%20per%20annum#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=train%20crash%20oil%20spill%20per%20annum&gsc.page=1
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 1, Offtopic) by c0lo on Tuesday November 21 2017, @03:10AM (3 children)
Heh! You know that the result list is funny.
Better try lmgtfy.com [lmgtfy.com] next time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2, Offtopic) by MostCynical on Tuesday November 21 2017, @03:25AM (2 children)
Don't want to be accused of being passive-aggressive.
(lmgtfy doesn't work on my tablet's browser, anyway!)
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 2, Touché) by c0lo on Tuesday November 21 2017, @03:28AM (1 child)
Ah, Ok. Sorry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 4, Informative) by MostCynical on Tuesday November 21 2017, @04:34AM
turns out, there is no safe way to transport oil.
as with comments from second amendment 'supporters' here on SN and elsewhere, apparently there is an amount of damage (health, envronment, direct deaths) that is considered 'reasonable' and 'acceptable' in the name of capitalism/progress/first-world superiority/whatever.
It all comes down to cost vs risk (financial, reputational, getting-locked up).
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/peter-goelz/oil-by-rail-vs-pipelines-safety-records_b_4262327.html [huffingtonpost.ca]
https://thinkprogress.org/data-oil-trains-spill-more-often-but-pipelines-spill-bigger-9533009d4aba/ [thinkprogress.org]
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/are-pipelines-safer-than-railroads-for-carrying-oil/ [scientificamerican.com]
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2014/04/26/pick-your-poison-for-crude-pipeline-rail-truck-or-boat/ [forbes.com]
:-)
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 4, Disagree) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:22AM (14 children)
Or is that not a thing anymore.
If I had eight billion dollars, I'd sooner bet it on a single spin of the wheel in Vegas than blow it on a pipeline whose construction cost will never be repaid.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:23AM (8 children)
That's obviously why you aren't in charge of anything important. If the pipe didn't make somebody money, they wouldn't build it.
(Score: 2, Disagree) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:27AM (3 children)
I expect whoever is paying for that pipe thinks that Donal Trump will be elected to a second term.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 2) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:41PM (2 children)
In 2015 I said to the American people: I own over $250,000 in TransCanada Pipelines stock, but not over $500,000. The ticker symbol is TRP, I had to buy that one. You know I had to buy it, for the same reason you, I assume, own M.D.C. Holdings. And it's doing amazingly today (they both are). It's not amazing, the Nebraska thing is great news. For me, for you, for TransCanada, for M.D.C. Holdings, for 🇨🇦, for 🇺🇸. America First!
I ABSOLUTELY will be elected to a second term. That's a 100% certainty. Noah from the future said so. He's not a smart guy, to be perfectly honest he's a dummy. SEVERELY handicapped in the head. Mentally he's not all there. But he comes from the future so he knows things other people don't. I knew I would win in 2020. But some people doubted it. Just like they doubted I would win in 2016. Not any more. youtu.be/ag8E-p4v_24 [youtu.be] #TRUMP2020 [twitter.com] #WINNING [twitter.com]
(Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday November 21 2017, @11:06PM (1 child)
I've been stressing over a woman who may be married. Her ring isn't always there, and sometimes she wears it on her right hand.
You gave me a belly laugh. I needed that.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 3, Insightful) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday November 21 2017, @11:27PM
So you're gonna be worth a lot. You're telling me you've got a girlfriend, do you get a prenuptial agreement? You get married, and then for some reason over the next couple of years you get divorced and then she sues you for $10 billion and she hits the jackpot. In New York, she would get a big chunk of what you have. A prenup is an ugly instrument, but you'd better have one. If I didn't have mine, I would not own all these beautiful buildings. I'm notoriously cheap with these things, OK, because I think if she made $1 million, that would be very good. Vagina is expensive. But don't overspend. Always, always get the prenup. With women that's the biggest thing to remember.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Mykl on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:48AM (3 children)
Oh, it's making money for a lot of people:
What's not clear is whether the pipeline will, in the end, make any money for oil producers and distributors.
(Score: 0, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:44AM (2 children)
I wish we lived in a world where those four realized they could still make money without oil. Perhaps instead of paying for an oil pipeline, subsidize residential solar.
But no. We have to have oil. Because that helps keep people riled up and divided against each other.
(Score: 3, Informative) by drussell on Tuesday November 21 2017, @10:10AM (1 child)
You do realize that oil is used for many other things than just powering cars and electricity production, right?
Even if you go all "residential solar" for your power and you drive an electric car, we all still need oil for a bazillion other things. Production can be modified to produce, for example, less of the fractions used to produce gasoline but increase production of fractions used for other purposes.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday November 21 2017, @11:09PM
Just one word.
"Plastics".
Enough said.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Thexalon on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:49AM (3 children)
We don't and we do. Specifically, there's no shortage of crude oil in the ground, nor a shortage of drillers willing and able to extract said oil. What there is a shortage of is refining capacity, because among other things a lot of the refineries down in Texas have been wrecked by hurricanes.
There are basically 2 reasons the environmentalists are protesting pipelines:
1. All pipelines leak and spill sooner or later, and that does not good things to wherever it leaks or spills. These can and do screw up local water supplies, for instance (this is part of what the #noDAPL folks at Standing Rock were worried about). This usually turns into jockeying over where the pipeline's route actually goes.
2. Burning oil increases carbon dioxide. Carbon dioxide leads to increases in global average temperature. Therefor, the environmentally responsible thing to do is to leave that oil right in the ground, and making pipelines more expensive makes pumping that oil less cost-effective. This issue is far bigger than just oil, and this is what a lot of the KeystoneXL protesters are concerned about.
All of which doesn't matter, because both of the major political parties in the US have made it abundantly clear they will stomp on environmentalists and punch as many hippies as necessary to give the oil companies exactly what they want.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:54PM (2 children)
All of which doesn't matter, because both of the major political parties in the US have made it abundantly clear they will stomp on environmentalists and punch as many hippies as necessary to give the oil companies exactly what they want.
Your false equivalency gets so tiring.
One party blocked this very pipeline. The other allowed it.
That's not the same. In fact, most people would consider it to be the exact opposite.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:29PM
You look at the countries with the biggest oil production, the big three are Russia, Saudi Arabia, the United States 🇺🇸. And in the United States, look at the states with the biggest production, the big three are Texas, North Dakota and California. That's right, California, a blue state (we're working on that) and supposedly very green, has a HUGE oil industry. They drill in their cities, they do fracking, which they've been doing for a long time. Before anybody heard of it. They do what it takes to get that oil out. They have Crazy Jerry Brown, he's not so crazy. He knows the oil must flow. He goes to Bonn, he was just in Bonn holding a rally. So he's giving his speech and some alt-left protester, some so-called Indian or Native American, tries to shout him down, "keep it in the ground," this LOSER shouts. Meaning the oil. And Jerry Brown comes back with, "let's put you in the ground." I call him Crazy Jerry because he's crazy in a lot of ways. But he had a great answer, that was a very strong answer. I think maybe there's a little bit of Hitler in him. He's no Hitler but I think there's a little bit of the Hitler spirit in him. What is it about Germany and great speeches? Ivanka gave an amazing speech in Berlin. And everybody loves me in Warsaw. Which isn't in Germany, but it used to be.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Thexalon on Wednesday November 22 2017, @12:06AM
My experience is that the Republicans just do things like this, while the Democrats are generally two-faced about it. As in, the pattern from Democrats is talking up a great game while their actions show something very different.
For instance, with regards to the DAPL, the Obama administration did absolutely nothing. It's not like they didn't know that the police department and private security guards were unlawfully turning dogs on journalists and shooting at them with rubber bullets and firehoses - that stuff was first on Youtube and later on CNN. It's not like they couldn't have been saying something about it in their daily news briefings. It's not like they couldn't have sent US Marshals in to protect the protesters. It's not like they couldn't have sent medical aid to the protesters who were getting hit with flash grenades. And instead they were unwilling to actually do anything until the (illegal as it turns out) pipeline was fait accompli and acted like "Oh well, there was nothing we could do."
They aren't exactly equivalent, but the results aren't all that different either.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Whoever on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:38AM
That kind of thinking is probably why life has been hard for you.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by takyon on Tuesday November 21 2017, @12:26AM (8 children)
This is a business story. Ha ha...
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @03:43AM (7 children)
Well, yes, money does have to change hands before decisions are made.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @05:06AM (6 children)
Stop your useless whining and vote the bastards out [soylentnews.org].
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @05:55PM (5 children)
That's right! They should! Where's the problem?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @06:12PM (4 children)
Washington D.C., and inside your home, apparently, as there are still crooked politicians [soylentnews.org] breaking laws around that you haven't voted out yet.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @07:51PM (3 children)
Yeah well, it sorta works better if everybody chips in, doesn't it? And since it doesn't cost anything, the question is still, Where's the problem?. If you want answers you have to ask the people who vote for crooked politicians, wouldn't you agree?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @08:45PM (2 children)
So, your solutions require everyone (aka the majority of people) to act exactly as you do; for everyone to consider their time (spent on voting itself as well as researching candidates, ballot propositions, etc.) as worthless; and to extract answers from the "problem people who voted for crooked politicians", people who have zero willingness to give you any honest answers?
Do you see any problems with your approach?
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:22PM (1 child)
My approach is fine, it's your comprehension that is the problem, which was confirmed by your absurd questions. Toodles...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @09:53PM
You assert that the questions [soylentnews.org] are absurd. Describe, if you can, how they are absurd. I doubt you are able to.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by NewNic on Tuesday November 21 2017, @01:12AM
Since the route was changed at the last minute, this will be back in court again (possibly even Federal court now) with land owners claiming that they didn't get their due process.
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 4, Insightful) by edIII on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:16AM (14 children)
It's worthless then. They're literally saying that the commission is unable to review data of a critical nature to their decision. Let's just make the spills disappear because of legal technicalities. That's NOT HOW rational evidence based decisions work.
So if they admittedly failed to take into account the information, then the decisions themselves are void of any scientific and rational basis.
A 100% political decision, bereft of intelligence, and filled with avarice.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by fustakrakich on Tuesday November 21 2017, @04:13AM (13 children)
No use getting worked up about it. Simply ask, Cui bono, and decide where to go from there.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @05:03AM (12 children)
So, who profits?
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Wednesday November 22 2017, @09:45AM (11 children)
You tell me...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 22 2017, @10:44AM (10 children)
You said to ask the question, so answer it.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Wednesday November 22 2017, @09:30PM (9 children)
I did not say ask me. Besides, the question rhetorical simply because the the answer is self evident to anybody with even the most basic understanding of nature.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 23 2017, @01:17AM (8 children)
Gee, then it would seem to be really, really easy to just type out the answer to your own question instead of using transparent handwaving. Or did you just admit to not having "even the most basic understanding of nature"?
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday November 23 2017, @03:47AM (7 children)
Nah, feeding you obsession is more fun to watch... Have a good day...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 23 2017, @04:42AM (6 children)
If I needed to feed on your wit, I'd have died of starvation a long time ago.
We have quotebot output at the bottom of every page here at SN, and I daresay it understands more about its quotes' meanings and context than you do. Hilarious and telling that you couldn't even come up with the vaguest of hand-wavy answers to try to patch that collection of cracks holding together your facade of insight.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday November 23 2017, @05:15AM (5 children)
"quotebot".. is that what you use to post?
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 23 2017, @08:05AM (4 children)
You're fascinating, like an overgrown three-legged dung beetle. I have a very hard time imagining the circumstances that allow you to be alive, and whether those circumstances call for you to perform any sort of activities one might possibly call "work", as that would almost certainly involve the impossible conundrum of willing long-term exposure of you to an adult with an IQ of 90 or more.
Are you a professional panhandler? Got a selection of cardboard signs and store exits you rotate through?
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday November 23 2017, @03:10PM (3 children)
Oh, and now you're doing copy/pasta? I'm disappointed. Well, at least you're still about as funny as a fart joke. Consider that a complement, I like fart jokes, but some new material couldn't hurt. A different chatbot perhaps...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 23 2017, @05:10PM (2 children)
Maybe you suckered someone into marrying you when you were younger, attractive, and in a State which allowed you to divorce them and then get a big payday every few weeks for life?
There aren't that many scenarios I can come up with that involve you obtaining necessary life resources without also immediately driving away the source of said resources due to your transparent lying [soylentnews.org], constant projecting of your own character flaws onto others who do not have them, and your juxtaposing display of arrogance and ignorance [soylentnews.org] in profound quantities.
I'd like to believe they broke your mold after making you, but I recently had the misfortune of watching an interview with your kindred spirit, LaVar Ball. [youtube.com] (Ball, Cuomo, and Trump all suck as far as I'm concerned.)
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday November 23 2017, @05:56PM (1 child)
There aren't that many scenarios I can come up with...
But please! Don't stop trying. You really are quite the spectacle. And you bring tabloid press to life.
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 23 2017, @06:14PM
I don't suppose you'd break your untarnished record and actually provide a reference for one of your many incredible claims?
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 21 2017, @02:59PM
Am I the only one that read this and imagined a pipe going back and forth covering most the Nebraska?