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posted by martyb on Thursday January 11, @02:02AM   Printer-friendly
from the no-comment dept.

The Trump administration has waived part of the punishment for five megabanks whose affiliates were convicted and fined for manipulating global interest rates. One of the Trump administration waivers was granted to Deutsche Bank — which is owed at least $130 million by President Donald Trump and his business empire, and has also been fined for its role in a Russian money laundering scheme.

The waivers were issued in a little-noticed announcement published in the Federal Register during the Christmas holiday week. They come less than two years after then-candidate Trump promised “I'm not going to let Wall Street get away with murder.”

http://www.ibtimes.com/g00/political-capital/trump-administration-waives-punishment-convicted-banks-including-deutsche-which


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  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Mykl on Thursday January 11, @02:28AM (42 children)

    by Mykl (1112) on Thursday January 11, @02:28AM (#620767)

    I'm ready to go all frothing-at-the-mouth, but thought I'd just check first: Is there a history of former presidents issuing these sorts of waivers?

    Just want to check whether my frothing-at-the-mouth should be directed at Presidents in general, or Trump in particular.

    • (Score: 5, Informative) by arslan on Thursday January 11, @02:34AM (21 children)

      by arslan (3462) on Thursday January 11, @02:34AM (#620770)

      This is an extension of Obama given those banks a 1 year waiver. A few of those have now been extended to 5 year, a few to 3 year.

      Besides that, this is a waiver on the savings/asset management part of those banks, not the securitize the hell out of everything under the sun and sell it as kool-aid part that caused the whole GFC bit and what we typically mean when we say "wall street".

      If my retire fund is at stake, i'd want it managed by the best, even if they're crooked and aggressive, as long as the returns are there, until the playing field is leveled, then we can talk ethics. So yea I'm be pretty happy for it to remain with those vampires and this waiver is actually a good thing.

      Of course all of those are barely mentioned and more than half of the article segues into Trump is evil, conflict of interest, blah blah blah.

      • (Score: 5, Touché) by bob_super on Thursday January 11, @02:45AM (4 children)

        by bob_super (1357) on Thursday January 11, @02:45AM (#620777)

        If my retire fund is at stake, i'd want it managed by the best, even if they're crooked and aggressive, as long as the returns are there, until the playing field is leveled, then we can talk ethics. So yea I'm be pretty happy for it to remain with those vampires and this waiver is actually a good thing.

        "Who cares how fucked up this all is, as long as I get my cut."

        • (Score: 3, Insightful) by shrewdsheep on Thursday January 11, @08:57AM

          by shrewdsheep (5215) on Thursday January 11, @08:57AM (#620851)

          Also, this attitude is stupid. The "crooked" and "aggressive" managers perform bad to worst and totally impassive index fonds beat them all.

        • (Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Thursday January 11, @03:53PM (1 child)

          by tangomargarine (667) on Thursday January 11, @03:53PM (#620950)

          The shorter, snappier version is "Fuck You Got Mine."

          --
          "Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
          • (Score: 2) by bob_super on Thursday January 11, @05:21PM

            by bob_super (1357) on Thursday January 11, @05:21PM (#620987)

            Thought about it, but it sounded like this case was ongoing, so "got mine" didn't quite fit.

        • (Score: 2) by edIII on Friday January 12, @02:09AM

          by edIII (791) Subscriber Badge on Friday January 12, @02:09AM (#621230)

          I'm reminded of the movie Hancock and the prison scene. I'm so frothing pissed that the elites get away with this shit, that I wan't to literally take Orange Anus' head and stick it up Obama's ass, and then stick Obama's head up his ass.

          Not new, and entirely a bipartisan affair of fucking over the American people.

      • (Score: 4, Interesting) by bobthecimmerian on Thursday January 11, @11:55AM (14 children)

        by bobthecimmerian (6834) on Thursday January 11, @11:55AM (#620899)

        Thanks for adding more context to the discussion.

        However, I think it's fair to ask whether Obama had financial ties to any of the banks that got waivers. If he did, then Trump's conflict of interest looks no less or more unethical than that of Obama. But if Obama didn't have any ties to those banks, then I think the conflict of interest point is still significant. At the very least, Trump should have shifted his financial assets or liabilities elsewhere before extending the waiver.

        I'm very politically liberal (in the American sense of the word), but the problem with shouting every time the president does anything is that people - even people on your own side - stop paying attention. If they hadn't said a damn thing about the Russia probe until the conclusions were announced, maybe they could have gotten enough voter support to start an impeachment. If they hadn't said a damn thing about his mental stability until he started playing with nuclear fire by trading teenage insults with Kim Jong-un, maybe they could have gotten enough voter support to start some kind of action over his sanity. Instead it's been Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia non-stop since before he took office to today and crazy, crazy, crazy, crazy since three weeks into his election campaign, and the voters are numb to it all.

        • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @05:37PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @05:37PM (#620994)

          No... Obama did not have any outstanding loans or financial interests in foreign banks. His assets were primarily invested in vanilla US treasury bonds during his presidency (and since afaik). It used to be a given that US presidents had no conflicting financial interests.

          This is why people started the constant whining even before Trump took office. Anyone familiar with the system could see these problems coming as soon as he refused to release his tax returns or put his assets in a blind trust. The time to listen to the experts has long passed. The only one who can hold Trump to anything at this point is a partisan Congress.

        • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @06:00PM (12 children)

          by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @06:00PM (#621002) Journal

          Well said. What's more, the Russia meme the Democrats have been brandishing is particularly ill-fitting. They were always softer on the Russians, in Soviet times, and afterward. So for them to suddenly turn around and paint the Russians as an existential threat to American democracy when they spent 60 years trying to understand them and feel their pain rings totally false. Of course I stated that in florid terms, but I do believe it's a big part of why that whole angle hasn't worked for them rhetorically; no one believes them, not even they.

          Stepping back and looking at the last two years from the 10,000 foot level, it's remarkable how tone deaf the Masters of the Universe have been. They have been throwing everything plus the kitchen sink at Donald Trump as the avatar of a populist backlash, and none of it has worked. The more they throw, the shriller they get, the less they are believed. They failed to stop his bid for the Republican nomination, by extravagantly funding more than a dozen opponents. They failed to stop him in the general election despite putting the fix in on every level they controlled.

          On the flip side, they're still shoveling our cash into their pockets. The tax bill and now this bank waiver prove their license to steal remains, undiminished. I am happy the Media and Hollywood have been kicked hard in the nuts, but Wall Street and the Masters of the Universe need to be kicked in the nuts until they don't have crotches anymore.

          --
          Washington DC delenda est.
          • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday January 11, @06:39PM (6 children)

            by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday January 11, @06:39PM (#621026) Journal

            Imagine that, invading a neighboring country and committing cyber attacks on our political process has soured a few people on Russia!

            It used to be that we changed our opinions based on new evidence/actions...

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:53PM (5 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:53PM (#621032)

              you've been brainwashed into a political weapon.

              • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday January 11, @07:22PM (4 children)

                by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday January 11, @07:22PM (#621049) Journal

                Nope, I just have a friend from Ukraine.

                • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @08:30PM (3 children)

                  by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @08:30PM (#621073) Journal

                  Ukrainians have a real bone to pick with the Russians. We don't. And for the Democrats to suddenly mount a Red Scare is, well, goofy. Imagine the Republican leadership suddenly declaring we should all become vegans, and to then beat the Democrats about the ears for eating meat. Nobody would take them seriously, believing it to be an elaborate practical joke.

                  --
                  Washington DC delenda est.
                  • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Thursday January 11, @08:32PM (1 child)

                    by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday January 11, @08:32PM (#621074) Journal

                    When a friend of yours mentions she's worried about her family because Russia just invader her hometown it tends to put one off a bit.

                    • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @08:59PM

                      by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @08:59PM (#621081) Journal

                      Sure. It's understandable.

                      It's also true that because a country is mean to somebody else that doesn't mean that we will or should treat them as bad guys for that reason. If we did, no country would have any friends for long. Should we stop being friends with Australia because of their appalling treatment of the Aborigines? If you were an Aborigine or had a friend who was, you'd probably say yes, but don't be surprised if the country as a whole didn't go along with you.

                      It also doesn't mean that country is bad or unredeemable. Turkey has been total bastards to the Kurds, and to the Armenians. But I gotta tell you, in my travels there I'd have to say in total honesty that between them it's a three-way tie for the nicest, gentlest, kindest people I have ever met in all my years. Seriously, they out-nice the Canadians, and that's near impossible.

                      In short, the way the Russians have been behaving toward the Ukrainians does not mean they are suddenly the existential threat to American democracy (my money for that title, as always, would be on the Deep State/1%/lizard people and their lackeys in the NSA, CIA, FBI, and Wall Street).

                      --
                      Washington DC delenda est.
                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @10:13PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @10:13PM (#621138)

                    You're in need of a crash course on geopolitics that a comment section can't really provide. The US (primarily) pushed for Ukrainian nuclear disarmament under the Budapest Memorandum to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons in 1994. One of the provisions of that agreement was that UN security council was to provide aid in the event that Ukraine's borders were threatened.

                    The US was diplomatically obligated to come to Ukraine's aid as soon as Russia started violating their sovereignty. Between all the confusion at the time and fear of Russia, we didn't. This avoided conflict in the short-term, but it's having a variety of ripple effects on our treaties and foreign relations that are all extremely troubling. The situation is startlingly reminiscent of various appeasement policies at the beginning of WWII.

          • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:39PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:39PM (#621027)

            Weird how openly invading a country supposedly protected under the non-proliferation treaty and mounting massive state-funded cyber campaigns against governments in most of the western world would turn Democrats against you?

            Must be a Hollywood conspiracy.

            • (Score: 1, Offtopic) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @08:47PM (1 child)

              by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @08:47PM (#621080) Journal

              Yet Obama and the Media were not screaming, "OMG! OMG! The Russians are coming!!!" when they summarily annexed the Crimea and went after Georgia or went into Ukraine.

              As for meddling in the elections of other countries, the Russians certainly believed the US and Europe meddled in Ukraine's in order to further isolate Russia. We know, thanks to Snowden, that the NSA and CIA do things like that, and have departments dedicated to them. We know for a fact, thanks to the Monaco Papers, that American companies and the government actively undermine democratic governments in Africa and other places. So whether or not the US and Europe did use those capabilities to meddle in Ukraine's elections, the Russians believe they did and it would not be surprising if they tried to answer in kind.

              Countries try to meddle in other countries' internal affairs all the time.

              But let's say for the sake of argument that we should get our panties in a bunch because of it, and go on the warpath against foreign governments that have tried to influence and undermine American democracy. If so, then pray tell me why we have not nuked Israel until it glows, because they have been doing exactly that, very effectively, for decades through its agents, its lobby AIPAC--the third most powerful lobby in DC after the AARP and the NRA--, and its surrogates in the American Jewish and the evangelical Christian communities? They have skewed policy and legislation, huge issues, for all that time and have gotten us into wars that cost American lives over it.

              I mean, if you're gonna get upset about this kind of issue, you gotta take Israel down first.

              Of course, that's if, and only if, there is anything real behind these objections at all instead of the cynical manipulations by the lizard people who want all of us fighting each other instead of them...

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @10:30PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @10:30PM (#621150)

                They were screaming that, actually. Many folks like yourself were either not listening or somehow convinced by Putin's flimsy public denials (kinda like his public denials of active cyber campaigns).

                We do not know, "thanks to Snowden", that the NSA and CIA engage in similar operations. In fact, Snowden was very careful not to release information regarding any operations (because that could put agents in danger). He only released information on capabilities. It wasn't really surprising to anyone in cyber security that the US (like every other major power) has programs dedicated to both domestic and foreign cyber capabilities. We have no evidence that they're being used aggressively. If they were, we'd probably have a Russian equivalent to the DNI report on “Assessing Russian Activities and Intentions in Recent US Elections”. We don't.

                There's a big difference between state funded hacking into a wide range of political and voting institutions and... lobbying.

          • (Score: 1) by bobthecimmerian on Friday January 12, @12:23PM (1 child)

            by bobthecimmerian (6834) on Friday January 12, @12:23PM (#621341)

            Democrats were softeron Russia during Soviet times? What kind of revisionist history is that? Did JFK back off during the Cuban missile crisis? Did Eisenhower announce the US was going to beat the Soviet Union to the moon and push Congress to fund it? Did Lyndon Johnson pull troops out of Europe and start a nuclear disarmament? (Republican) Nixon was the one who pulled us out of Vietnam, not a Democrat - granted that was a conflict with North Vietnamese and Chinese communists, not USSR communists.

            I grant that Obama screwed up with respect to Russia by not doing enough to halt the invasion of Crimea or Ukraine. But the rest of your assertion is flat false.

            And the idea that the Democrats funded Trump's opponents is absurd - any evidence? They would have kept every cent they had to give to their crown princess, Hillary. Again, I'm strongly liberal... which means I'm only very loosely allied with Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid. They're liberal compared to Republicans for things like abortion rights, gay rights, and equal rights for people that aren't white men. But on economic policy, privacy, regulation of the market, etc... there's not much difference. I don't want to derail the discussion further, but the fact that nobody got prosecuted for mortgage-backed securities fraud is all the evidence you need that Wall Street owned Obama only a hair less than it owns Trump.

            • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday January 12, @04:58PM

              by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Friday January 12, @04:58PM (#621444) Journal

              Nixon did what he did for detente with China to isolate Russia. Reagan was responsible for the massive military buildup that pushed the Soviet Union past the breaking point. They were harder on Russia than the Democrats.

              The idea that the Democrats funded Trump's opponents is absurd, because that is not what I said. I said the Masters of the Universe funded Trump's opponents. You might know them by one of their other monikers like the "1%" or "lizard people" or "Deep State." They are the very few who control the levers of power in our society. For them, there is no "liberal vs. conservative" or "Democrat vs. Republican" or "American vs. Russian." They identify with their counterparts everywhere around the world, not with their supposed countrymen. They patronize the same resorts, they attend the same parties, they go to the same universities. They are the ones who funded Trump's primary opponents, just like they funded Hillary's campaign. They're the ones who control the Congressmen who just voted to give them billions more of our dollars.

              Maybe you don't agree that the 1% are real and that they don't collude to undermine our democracy every day. If that's the case, if the evidence doesn't convince you, if you thought the Occupy Wall Street people were all hapless, delusional fools, then that's fine and we can stop right here.

              If you do think the 1% are real and do constitute an existential threat to democracy, then I invite you to consider that beneath the mean words and harsh sentiments Trump is part of a backlash against what the 1% have been doing. When Occupy was shut down I did say that it was going to be the last time the 1% were politely asked to mend the error of their ways, and it looks like that was right. Now they're being rudely told to mend the error of their ways.

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @03:27PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @03:27PM (#620947)

        "If my retire fund is at stake, i'd want it managed by the best, even if they're crooked and aggressive, as long as the returns are there, until the playing field is leveled, then we can talk ethics."

        And such is the history of the world. Slavery was fine when we really needed the labour. Mistreating workers was fine when we had a glut of workers. We can always say "oh, we were so wrong and we won't do it again" at such time when it's convenient to do so. It takes real strength to not do something when you really, really need to, not after the need is satisfied.

    • (Score: 5, Informative) by NewNic on Thursday January 11, @02:37AM (13 children)

      by NewNic (6420) on Thursday January 11, @02:37AM (#620772) Journal

      Whether or not there is history, there is a clear conflict of interest here.

      Deutsche Bank is the bank that was laundering money for the Russian oligarchs at the same time it was lending money to Trump when no other banks would. Nothing suspicious there.

      #DrainingTheSwamp!

      --
      Conservatives: Make my portion of the pie a larger proportion of the total. Liberals: Increase the size of the pie.
      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by KiloByte on Thursday January 11, @03:32AM (6 children)

        by KiloByte (375) on Thursday January 11, @03:32AM (#620786)

        So you say Obama spared those poor bankers because of his good heart? The link was just a bit less direct.

        Here's a law we need so badly:
        Poland, Dz.U. 1921 nr.30 poz.177 (also Dz.U. 1920 nr.11 poz.61): Art.2: An official, guilty of accepting a gift or another material benefit, or a promise thereof, [in matters relevant to duties], shall be punished by death by shooting.

        --
        Ceterum censeo systemd esse delendam.
        • (Score: 2) by hemocyanin on Thursday January 11, @08:52AM (4 children)

          by hemocyanin (186) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @08:52AM (#620849)

          Would that include bribe laundering (aka, being paid millions for short speeches)?

          • (Score: 2) by KiloByte on Thursday January 11, @11:11AM (2 children)

            by KiloByte (375) on Thursday January 11, @11:11AM (#620881)

            Yeah, that's too obvious a trick. Likewise campaign donations (an outright monetary gain) or no-show-massive-salary employment after the term ends (promise).

            Not surprisingly, politicians won't enact this particular law, and if forced to, would leave every conceivable loophole open. But it can happen, like it did in Poland less than a hundred years ago with the law I quoted — with a literal death penalty. A murder affects a single person or at most their relatives/friends, a crooked official affects millions.

            --
            Ceterum censeo systemd esse delendam.
            • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @06:03PM (1 child)

              by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @06:03PM (#621003) Journal

              How I wish we had that law. The Constitution for the Second American Republic must include it.

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @07:45PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @07:45PM (#621057)

                Either under the definition of treason, or under a federal law involving providing material aid or services to a (hostile or not) foreign regime.

                Having said that, America has been so long having different interpretations of laws for the 'politically connected/public figureheads' than they have for the 'common man' that I am unsure it matters anymore except in situations where the former cateogory is making an example to keep the attention of the latter category from their other longrunning misdeeds.

          • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @06:05PM

            by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @06:05PM (#621005) Journal

            Don't forget donations to Presidential libraries and post-administration charities.

            --
            Washington DC delenda est.
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @04:45PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @04:45PM (#620976)

          Be crooked individual who wants to abuse power for profit.
          Think hard.
          Dig up some cases and come up with moralizing grandstand to abolish death penalty for serious crimes.
          Argue that if we don't punish serious crimes with death, why punish things that are "less" serious, such as white-collar crimes.
          Reduce punishment for scumbaggery to a slap on the wrist with public support.
          ????
          Profit.

      • (Score: 2) by arslan on Thursday January 11, @03:37AM (4 children)

        by arslan (3462) on Thursday January 11, @03:37AM (#620787)

        So no other American politician had had to make policies that affect companies that has dealings with their private ventures? This kind of stuff is not uncommon.

        He's not cherry picking DB for the waiver. Its an extension of an existing waiver from a former president. You can of course draw all sorts of conclusions and conspiracy theories from it - but in the ends it is just speculation and poo flinging.

        • (Score: 5, Informative) by Whoever on Thursday January 11, @03:44AM (1 child)

          by Whoever (4524) on Thursday January 11, @03:44AM (#620791) Journal

          Most recent presidents have chosen to put their holdings into a blind trust, in order to avoid this exact problem.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:51PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:51PM (#621030)

            Does tax law allow for assets to be put into a blind trust without causing a tax event?

        • (Score: 4, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @05:52AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @05:52AM (#620814)

          This kind of stuff is not uncommon.

          Possibly. It is also illegal, immoral, and possibly fattening. And for a sitting Precedent, unconstitutional. See: Emoluments Clause.

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by DeathMonkey on Thursday January 11, @06:42PM

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday January 11, @06:42PM (#621028) Journal
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:55PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:55PM (#621033)

        if you're not hiding some of your financial activities it just means you're a skank.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Thursday January 11, @02:40AM (4 children)

      by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @02:40AM (#620774) Journal

      It's the rich taking care of the rich, no matter how you slice and dice it. These same SOB's will pounce on an old woman's delinquent mortgage, but cut deals with each other.

      --
      Hawking believes that alien life forms will likely be simple and primitive, or, as they’re known on Earth, Democrats.
      • (Score: 2) by arslan on Thursday January 11, @03:41AM (3 children)

        by arslan (3462) on Thursday January 11, @03:41AM (#620789)

        Don't we all know it. In the good old days we'd be sharpening our pitchforks, now we just whinge on the internet or stare at pictures of celebrity pets...

        • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:11AM (2 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @06:11AM (#620817)

          Trump has a pet? Oh, you mean Steve Miller!

          • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday January 11, @04:07PM (1 child)

            by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @04:07PM (#620957) Journal

            Yeah, it was Bannon for a while, but the fat bastard kept pissing all over the carpet and going outside the litterbox...

            --
            I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
            • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @06:08PM

              by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @06:08PM (#621008) Journal

              He should have had the discipline to refrain from posting on Twitter while drunk. Or he should have done as my brother-in-law, who has constructed incredibly elaborate mechanisms in his life to be able to spend as much of it stoned out of his mind as possible without getting arrested or fired.

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
    • (Score: 3, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Thursday January 11, @04:42PM

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Thursday January 11, @04:42PM (#620975) Journal

      Just want to check whether my frothing-at-the-mouth should be directed at Presidents in general, or Trump in particular.

      Trump campaigned on doing the exact opposite of this.

  • (Score: 5, Touché) by fustakrakich on Thursday January 11, @04:36AM (12 children)

    by fustakrakich (6150) on Thursday January 11, @04:36AM (#620803) Journal

    Damn! Could have voted for Clinton if I wanted that...

    • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday January 11, @06:10PM (11 children)

      by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @06:10PM (#621009) Journal

      “Instead of a Dark Lord, you would have a queen [goodreads.com], not dark but beautiful and terrible as the dawn! Tempestuous as the sea, and stronger than the foundations of the earth! All shall love me and despair!”

      It springs to mind every time this subject arises.

      --
      Washington DC delenda est.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @09:26PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @09:26PM (#621099)

        with an alleged hebephile and definitely serial philanderer as her 'first man'/'former president'...

        That is just as terrible as a 70is year old man-child whose only success has been being propped up by others trying to get a cut of his fortune/prestige/glory for the past 50 odd years.

      • (Score: 2) by dry on Friday January 12, @02:02AM (9 children)

        by dry (223) on Friday January 12, @02:02AM (#621228)

        On the other hand, that Queen would have had Congress watching her every move and fighting it. Now you have the Dark Lord being allowed to do whatever he wants.
        Anyone who believes in hamstringing government would be happier with a less powerful Queen then a more powerful Dark Lord. Of course, I guess if you like the Dark Lord...

        • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday January 12, @03:35AM (8 children)

          by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Friday January 12, @03:35AM (#621242) Journal

          It seems to me Congress is fighting nearly everything Trump wants, too.

          --
          Washington DC delenda est.
          • (Score: 2) by dry on Friday January 12, @03:44AM (7 children)

            by dry (223) on Friday January 12, @03:44AM (#621246)

            Not as hard as they would have fought Hillary.
            Even better would be to try to fix the whole system in such a way that you could have more choices then the Dark Queen or the Dark Lord, but that is easy to say and very hard to implement.

            • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Friday January 12, @04:39PM

              by Phoenix666 (552) Subscriber Badge on Friday January 12, @04:39PM (#621436) Journal

              Hillary is one of them. They would have play-fought her. She would have been forced, forced, to go back on her campaign promise of shutting down the Trans-Pacific Partnership. They would have had to, like, totally twist her arm to get the tax package they just passed.

              But, yes, we do need more, better options. It is a big job. Nevertheless, it is a big job we cannot put off anymore. We have to scrap all of DC. We have to scrap the First American Republic. There are good bits from the First Republic to reconstitute in the Second American Republic. The Bill of Rights remains sterling. We need to put sharper teeth in its defense, such that nobody from, say, the NSA should ever again countenance violating it lest they hang the way their colleagues must hang at the conclusion of the First Republic. We need checks and balances to curb corporate power and the influence of wealthy individuals or families. If we don't, then democracy in the Second American Republic will be stillborn. We need a federal government whose departments are distributed around the country, such that nothing like "inside the Beltway thinking" can arise again. We need very strong transparency and ironclad whistleblower provisions such that patriots like Snowden never have to fear holding the powerful to account again.

              --
              Washington DC delenda est.
            • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Saturday January 13, @01:41AM (5 children)

              by fustakrakich (6150) on Saturday January 13, @01:41AM (#621637) Journal

              Even better would be to try to fix the whole system in such a way that you could have more choices then the Dark Queen or the Dark Lord

              I suspect those weren't really the only choices you had on your ballot... And before that, there was a choice to nominate other people entirely. I see no problem that can't be corrected by the voters themselves. In fact, they are the only ones to do it.

              • (Score: 2) by dry on Saturday January 13, @03:02AM (4 children)

                by dry (223) on Saturday January 13, @03:02AM (#621662)

                I'm not American so didn't have either on my ballot, but it sure seems like the average American only sees those 2 choices. Last election was one I would have thought would have had a record number of 3rd party votes.

                • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Sunday January 14, @12:37AM (3 children)

                  by fustakrakich (6150) on Sunday January 14, @12:37AM (#622015) Journal

                  it sure seems like the average American only sees those 2 choices.

                  Yes, they have deep personal issues they refuse to acknowledge. However,it is entirely natural. The same phenomenon is expressed in different forms all around the world. So it's difficult to distinguish Americans from anybody else after you throw out the cultural cruft. I mean, nobody can say Europe, or any other continent is any better off.

                  • (Score: 2) by dry on Sunday January 14, @08:40AM (2 children)

                    by dry (223) on Sunday January 14, @08:40AM (#622125)

                    True.
                    The difference is the American political system seems to promote a two party system at all levels of government all over your nation.
                    Here, with a first past the post system, there are 5 parties in Parliament. In some areas it is party a vs party b. Other area a vs c or the regional a or b vs d. Occasionally a 3 way race and a regional party in Quebec vs everyone else.
                    Provinces all vary. Some of the parties are connected to the Federal ones, some are local to the Province. Most are different from each other.
                    Municipalities, at least in my part of the country, don't even have political parties. You have to vote for individuals.
                    All these elections happen separately.

                    • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Sunday January 14, @03:55PM (1 child)

                      by fustakrakich (6150) on Sunday January 14, @03:55PM (#622192) Journal

                      The difference is the American political system seems to promote a two party system at all levels of government all over your nation.

                      Yes, and I'm saying that it's a distinction without a difference. The results end up being the same. The real issue is public apathy, and simple lack of respect (and right now a lot of antipathy in the US and Europe). It has the same direct relationship to corruption and poverty everywhere on the globe whether it's through one party or a hundred. The political system itself is a reflection, not the light.

                      • (Score: 2) by dry on Sunday January 14, @08:16PM

                        by dry (223) on Sunday January 14, @08:16PM (#622260)

                        OK, thanks for the clarification

  • (Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @07:01AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @07:01AM (#620829)

    Fund and support terrorists you get a fox news place(olie north, GB serior) , scam the citizenry ? there is never any punishment, the right wing is correct it's not a democracy it's a republic like rome, so get to groveling plebs, know you senetor and get sucking. Trump is a crazy man and may be the only hope for humanity since he might actually press the button we all hoped Regan would have done in the mid 80's

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @11:19AM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @11:19AM (#620888)

    After all the Orange Clown knows fat cats deserve second (well 100th) chances.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_(president)#Legal_affairs_and_bankruptcies [wikipedia.org]

    • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @12:28PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 11, @12:28PM (#620908)

      The trumptastic orange clown is nothing when compare to people like reagan or bush, he is making progresses because you all are fucking liberals, 10 degrees to the right of fascist if it affects you personally, All we have now is you choice of the flavour of fascism that is the only choice left, thanks a lot boomer liberal assholes, you fled and gave us hitler, you fled and gave use mao, you fled and gave use pol pot failure is rewarded in this society so you got away with all of it

      Again I m clearly alt right so I need to be suppressed, wait I am worse I am an an Anarchist, morissy must die,, you get it if your a socialist

      • (Score: 1) by nitehawk214 on Thursday January 11, @06:13PM

        by nitehawk214 (1304) on Thursday January 11, @06:13PM (#621010)

        Well we can tell you are not in favor of funding public education.

        --
        "Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
    • (Score: 2) by DannyB on Thursday January 11, @08:33PM

      by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Thursday January 11, @08:33PM (#621075)

      This is a major fail on Trump's part.

      If he's going to take away the punishment from banks, he should put it onto some other. Not Jesus. But maybe onto, oh, let's say, scientists. Yeah, scientists! Those pesky scientists! Science has a strong left wing bias. Climate change. How reproductive biology works. Evolution. And the history of scientific research is severely lacking in those researchers having a profit motive! Einstein's Relativity (special, general). Maxwell's Electrodynamics. Newton's Laws Of Motion. Idiots all who could learn from someone more prohpet profit orientated1.

      1their is know such word.

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