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posted by Fnord666 on Friday August 14 2020, @04:28PM   Printer-friendly
from the who-picks-what-gets-banned? dept.

YouTube bans videos containing hacked information that could interfere with the election:

As Democrats and Republicans prepare to hold their national conventions starting next week, YouTube on Thursday announced updates to its policies on deceptive videos and other content designed to interfere with the election.

The world's largest video platform, with more than 2 billion users a month, will ban videos containing information that was obtained through hacking and could meddle with elections or censuses. That would include material like hacked campaign emails with details about a candidate. The update follows the announcement of a similar rule that Google, which owns YouTube, unveiled earlier this month banning ads that contain hacked information. Google will start enforcing that policy Sept. 1.

YouTube also said it will take down videos that encourage people to interfere with voting and other democratic processes. For example, videos telling people to create long lines at polling places in order to stifle the vote won't be allowed.

[...] YouTube has also tried to secure its platform from foreign actors. Last week, the company said it banned almost 2,600 channels linked to China as part of investigations into "coordinated influence operations" on the site. YouTube also took down dozens of channels linked to Russia and Iran that had apparent ties to influence campaigns.


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  • (Score: 4, Funny) by Opportunist on Friday August 14 2020, @04:29PM (9 children)

    by Opportunist (5545) on Friday August 14 2020, @04:29PM (#1036593)

    The genuine videos that interfere with the election may continue.

    • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @04:44PM (8 children)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @04:44PM (#1036597) Journal

      When Americans do it legally it's called "participating" in the election.

      • (Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @04:47PM (7 children)

        by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @04:47PM (#1036599) Journal

        To be fair, foreigners who do so legally are also allowed to participate. E.g. a Canadian commenting here about it while NOT on the payroll of a foreign national or government.

        • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Unixnut on Friday August 14 2020, @05:09PM (3 children)

          by Unixnut (5779) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:09PM (#1036606)

          The problem is how do you prove someone is "paid by a foreign national /government"?

          Quite often I have seen on the web (and even on this site), people with opinions contrary to the forum majority be accused of being some kind of "paid foreign agent", which automatically dismisses their opinions as nothing worth considering.

          You can't ask people to prove they are not in the pay of a foreign national/government, nor can you prove it even if you demanded their entire bank statement history. There are just so many ways to conceal it, that it is impossible to prove one way or another.

          > E.g. a Canadian commenting here about it while NOT on the payroll of a foreign national or government.

          This is too broad. Case in point: if a Canadian comments while working for a Canadian company, they are technically on the payroll of a "foreign national", and may well have some vested interest in some outcome to the US that would be beneficial to Canada. Even a US employee working for a non US company would qualify under that definition.

          "Troll armies" have been bounded about as thing, and there are many countries that have dedicated units (some military) whose job is to go online and sway opinions (to my knowledge, the UK, Israel and Russia have such dedicated units), so it is a thing, and you can never be sure that you are just not arguing with people whose entire career involves posting comments on youtube or any other forum in order to sway opinion, the truth be damned..

          Personally, I think it is better to just accept everyone has vested interests in opinions they give (otherwise they would not give them) and what they do, and just concentrate on convincing others that your vested interests are better for them. In essence that is what debates are all about. There are few universal truths out there (outside of Mathematics).

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @05:19PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @05:19PM (#1036614)

            Yeah just like those US units google, facebook, ...

            .. oft times just the regular army goes in post election tho.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:25PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:25PM (#1036797)

            "Personally, I think it is better to just accept everyone has vested interests in opinions they give (otherwise they would not give them) and what they do, and just concentrate on convincing others that your vested interests are better for them."

            It is in your beset interests that we impose data caps, along with lower bandwidth offering at higher prices.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:01AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:01AM (#1036832)

            The problem is how do you prove someone is "paid by a foreign national /government"?

            You find their relation to one of:

            * United Kingdom Foreign and Commonwealth Office [archive.org] ("UK FCO")

            * Russia [archive.is]

            * Saudi Arabia [mideast-times.com]

            * Qatar [wnd.com]

            * Iran [iranpoliticsclub.net]

        • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Friday August 14 2020, @05:43PM (1 child)

          by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:43PM (#1036630) Journal

          foreigners schmoreigners! The president is sabotaging the election, not Russia, or China. Let's get off that bullshit. Concentrate your fire on the enemy closest to you

          --
          La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
        • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @05:47PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @05:47PM (#1036634)

          You can do it on the payroll of a foreign nation too, as long as that nation rhymes with "misrael".

  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @04:51PM (3 children)

    by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @04:51PM (#1036601)

    When they say "hacked", they don't mean "partisan hack", because if they did that most of the major news networks couldn't post anything political anymore.

    --
    The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
  • (Score: 4, Informative) by SomeGuy on Friday August 14 2020, @04:53PM (3 children)

    by SomeGuy (5632) on Friday August 14 2020, @04:53PM (#1036602)

    In other words, Youtube is absolutely the last place you should go to find any kind of information about elections. Well, perhaps second to last after Fox News. :P

    Not that there are any reliable sources of information these days. Time to dig around and find a newspaper. Harder to do since libraries are closed or limited.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @07:02PM (1 child)

      by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @07:02PM (#1036669)

      There are reliable sources of information: Collections of peer reviewed studies, legal documents, widely acknowledged experts in the field, etc.

      What there aren't are reliable summaries for people who don't have the background needed to understand who is completely full of crap. And that's very intentional: There are entire industries of people whose job it is to lie convincingly to as many laypeople as possible, because even if they don't convince everybody they'll convince enough people that what should be a settled issue is now a "debate" with "valid arguments on both sides", and now all the laypeople are confused.

      A good Baloney Detection Kit can help. Another good rule is that if 99% of people who have the training and experience to know something about the subject under discussion say X is true, and 1% say X is false, the odds are very very good that X is true.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by HiThere on Friday August 14 2020, @08:07PM

        by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @08:07PM (#1036721) Journal

        Well, that's true for certain values of "reliable". Demanding certainty is almost certain to get you information that's at least slightly false.

        E.g. I can't decide whether Kamala Harris is owned by the copyright lobbies, or whether her position is negotiable. Or perhaps she was just a "gun for hire". In any case I find her better than Pence, if not by as much as I'd like. Sometimes you have to live with uncertainty and make the best choice you can.

        P.S.: Newspapers weren't all that reliable either. Check out how the war with Cuba was started.

        --
        Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:04PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:04PM (#1036809)

      "In other words, Youtube is absolutely the last place you should go to find any kind of information about elections."

      Isn't there that bannedfromyoutube site?

  • (Score: 2, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Friday August 14 2020, @05:40PM (4 children)

    by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:40PM (#1036628) Journal

    All the interference and outright sabotage is coming from the president, and everybody is yammering about youtube and facebook and Russia and China. Looks like the magic still works. We are so doomed

    --
    La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
    • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:33PM (3 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:33PM (#1036651)

      It's true! At night Trump sneaks out and rips up Biden signs from people's front yards! He laughs an evil cackle while he does it, too!

      • (Score: 2, Informative) by fustakrakich on Friday August 14 2020, @06:43PM (2 children)

        by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday August 14 2020, @06:43PM (#1036656) Journal

        Please, don't be an idiot. He is stealing mailboxes! [king5.com]

        --
        La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
        • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 14 2020, @07:17PM (1 child)

          by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @07:17PM (#1036681) Journal

          At last. I've known since about 1969 that all those blue boxes were just surveillance devices. I was happy to see the last of those blue boxes dragged out of my neighborhood, and dumped into the swamp. Let it report on the snakes and fishes and alligators.

          /me adjusts tinfoil hat

          • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @04:01AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @04:01AM (#1036938)

            I thought they were where you emptied your dog's pooper-scooper. Guess now I'll just have to put it in the red ones.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 14 2020, @05:41PM (4 children)

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @05:41PM (#1036629) Journal

    The problem is the implementation. The progrssive woke corporations have deplatformed a helluva lot of American citizens who do have the right to interfere in American elections. So, like many reasonable sounding laws, the policies at corporate levels are wide open to abuse.

    Wake up, America. Corporations have no more right to influence American elections than do foreign governments. For the people, by the people, of the people - not for the corporation.

    • (Score: 4, Informative) by HiThere on Friday August 14 2020, @08:11PM (2 children)

      by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @08:11PM (#1036725) Journal

      But didn't the Supreme Court decide that corporations were people? I think it was the legal clerks decision in Santa Clara vs. Union Pacific, but the Supreme Court upheld it. So that's about 150 years of legal precedent you want to overthrow. (Not a bad idea in my view, but unlikely to be successful.)

      --
      Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @06:29PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @06:29PM (#1037184)

        they decided that money = speech. no money, no speech.

        • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Sunday August 16 2020, @01:14AM

          by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Sunday August 16 2020, @01:14AM (#1037299) Journal

          That was a much later decision. Also a bad one, but not the one I referred to.

          --
          Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:36PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:36PM (#1036773)

      The fediverse awaits!

      What do you propose instead of corporations to manage capitalism?

  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Phoenix666 on Friday August 14 2020, @05:43PM (35 children)

    by Phoenix666 (552) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:43PM (#1036631) Journal

    I think it's dangerous territory to have a content platform censoring speech at all. It's too easily abused. Shutting down malicious foreign state actors sounds good on paper, but it's too easy to cross the line to shutting down speech you don't like from actual citizens and using that accusation as an excuse to do it.

    More broadly speaking, Google, Facebook, Twitter, and the rest of Big Tech have already been censoring voices they don't like on their platforms, shutting down channels/accounts on increasingly flimsy pretexts. They might think they're protecting democracy in so doing, but they're actually critically undermining it; shutting up voices they don't like doesn't make those voices go away, it simply makes them angry(ier?) and drive them to express themselves in less salubrious ways. In America, we call people who do what Big Tech are doing, "fascists."

    In a pluralistic democracy, the proper response to ideas and arguments you don't like is to counter them.

    --
    Washington DC delenda est.
    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @06:47PM (25 children)

      by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @06:47PM (#1036660)

      We've been over this many times: You have the right to speak. You don't have the right to use somebody else's PA system to give your speech without their permission. You have the right to put a sign on your lawn. You don't have the right to put a sign on somebody else's lawn without their permission. You have the right to put up a website. You don't have the right to put content on somebody else's website without their permission.

      Google, Facebook, Twitter, et al do in fact have the right to censor their contents, for whatever reason they damn well please. If you have an account on any of those sites, they told you that in the legal contract you agreed to (but probably didn't read) when you signed up. Don't like it? Go to a different website that will allow you to post your material, or set up your own website.

      And you're going to say "But the audience is on Google / Facebook / Twitter et al!" So what? You don't have a right to demand that people listen to or read your stuff if they don't want to. And if you're going to argue "But without Google / Facebook / Twitter, my speech won't mater politically", I should point out that QAnon started on 8-chan where there are specifically no censorship rules, and now has millions of citizens and a congressional candidate claiming to believe it.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
      • (Score: 2, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 14 2020, @07:20PM (13 children)

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @07:20PM (#1036683) Journal

        You're walking a thin line there. Your tech companies are working hard to sway the elections. No company or corporation has the right to silence dissenting voices. You're asking us to accept that the KGB would have been a good thing, if only it weren't run by the state.

        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @07:33PM (12 children)

          by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @07:33PM (#1036692)

          No company or corporation has the right to silence dissenting voices.

          That's just it: They aren't silencing anybody, they're forcing them to use different tools to get their message out. Those are not the same things.

          And if you don't believe companies have the remove people from their privately-controlled spaces based on the content of their speech, try going on a loud, angry, and possibly obscene tirade in a fancy restaurant and see how long it takes for you to be kicked out.

          --
          The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
          • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 14 2020, @07:53PM (11 children)

            by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @07:53PM (#1036711) Journal

            A restaurant doesn't put itself into business by claiming to be a public forum.

            A better analogy would be the town square.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @08:16PM (3 children)

              by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @08:16PM (#1036728) Journal

              Show me where YouTube claims to be a public forum.

              A public space owned by the government is just about the work analogy possibly.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:29AM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:29AM (#1036850)

                Youtube opened its gates wide in the early days to gain usershare.

                2006 "Come, come to YouTube. We welcome all. Copyrights and standards are for old people. No, pay no attention to our competitors. Come, come to YouTube"

                2013 "Ok guys, we're implementing automated DMCA requests now. I'm sure you understand."

                2020 "All videos will be actively monitored to meet State Department recommended guidelines and party political requests"

                The speed and alacrity of the turnabout could only be done as shamelessly in silicon valley.

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @01:57AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @01:57AM (#1036890)

                  At one time, wasn't their tagline "Broadcast yourself"?

                  I don't think they would follow State Department guidelines in 2020. That is a Trump administration division. If Biden wins, then maybe. Currently, they will follow guidelines provided by ownership, within the limits of what influencers on Twitter approve of, and their vocal staff won't walk off for.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @02:24AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @02:24AM (#1036903)

                Private property open to the public.

                Like a shopping mall, a restaurant, etc...

                It's private property. It's open to the public.

            • (Score: 2) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @08:45PM (6 children)

              by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @08:45PM (#1036746)

              The town square is a publicly owned space, and the only people that can (legally) kick you out of the town square are the government. Social media websites are privately owned, and if you don't like their rules you can take your eyeballs and your content elsewhere. That's an important distinction.

              --
              The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
              • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday August 14 2020, @09:14PM (5 children)

                by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @09:14PM (#1036762) Journal

                You make it sound so easy to take your views someplace else.

                Take Gab, for instance. All those people kicked off of a more-or-less public forum. They went someplace else, only to see the public forums come after them. "We won't rent you server space!" Oh - money. The Woke people control a lot of financial institutions - and refuse to transfer money to them. Kinda like happened to Wikileaks and Assange. Yeah, it takes some degree of governmental cooperation to pull it off, but one can always find a sympathetic judge if one shops around.

                In today's real world, we see monopolistic megacorps deciding what people are permitted to think. And, that all good with most of you.

                • (Score: 2) by Thexalon on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:13AM

                  by Thexalon (636) on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:13AM (#1036839)

                  You make it sound so easy to take your views someplace else.

                  That's because it is quite easy to take your views someplace else. How easy, you ask? You're doing it right now.

                  --
                  The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @07:17AM (3 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @07:17AM (#1036990)

                  So the Capitalists are suddenly all about Communism because they feel discriminated against.

                  It is the most hypocritical thing in the world, since basically the dawn of recorded history conservatives have been prejudiced against anyone "different" and used to murder various groups for religious affiliation, sexual choice, skin color, and probably many more.

                  And now that the private ownership of capital is supposedly working against conservatives they are suddenly all about forcing people to do what they want. And no the baker did not end up having to bake a gay cake, but he did have to bake A cake. He simply didn't have to put a "gay" message on it.

                  So whine away you fucking retard hypocrite, once you contradict your own deeply held beliefs for partisan reasons (you're being fed lies), well, you're the identity politicking piece of shit.

                  • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday August 15 2020, @02:00PM (2 children)

                    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Saturday August 15 2020, @02:00PM (#1037069) Journal

                    Uhhhhh - capitalism is a fairly recent development, measured in hundreds of years. If you were paying attention in school, you would know that our recorded history extends back thousands of years. Can you spell "Babylon"? Or "Greece"? How about "Egypt"? "China" and "Laos" would be good. Try "Indus". Bonus points if you can spell "Jiahu".

                    So, the ills of humanity can be blamed on something other than capitalism for most of recorded history, and all of pre-history.

                    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @11:08PM (1 child)

                      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @11:08PM (#1037644)

                      Could you please go take your stupid somewhere else? You contradict yourself 1/2 the time, hold hypocritical viewpoints, and you support fascism cause "dem leftists" with no concrete rationale beyond "some people rioted" while saying mass shooters are just "lone nuts."

                      It is too much, you're too old and stupid, lucky for you we have a constitution that works to protect your existence. Sadly for you, you are working hard to help fascists undermine your own protections.

                      You're such a fool.

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:02PM (3 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:02PM (#1036719)

        If they choose to exercise editorial control, they need to be fully liable for any libelous statement any user has posted there against anyone.

        • (Score: 2, Disagree) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @09:35PM (2 children)

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @09:35PM (#1036771) Journal

          Soylent News exercises editorial control. Should we be fully liable is some AC posts some slander?

          • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:28PM (1 child)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:28PM (#1036798)

            Do provide examples how SN is exercising editorial control here in the comment section.

            • (Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @03:48AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @03:48AM (#1036928)

              Do provide examples how SN is exercising editorial control here in the comment section.

              It should be obvious to anyone here who views the posts that are alleged to have been written by aristarchus.

              Clearly there is someone secretly editing his posts to make him out to be some kind of rabid lunatic who is tilting at the alt-right windmill. Nice try, editors, but we can see through your charade!

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Phoenix666 on Friday August 14 2020, @08:09PM (3 children)

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Friday August 14 2020, @08:09PM (#1036723) Journal

        And we've been over it just as many times, Thexalon, in saying that as much as that is true according to the letter of the law now, the practical effect is the same thing as saying that the phone company can choose to not connect your calls because they don't like your politics. Let's not be coy about what that practical effect is--you are silencing them by artificially limiting who can hear. Let's not pretend that you're not. Silencing people whose politics you don't like is going to redound on you catastrophically.

        It is dangerous.

        --
        Washington DC delenda est.
        • (Score: 2) by Thexalon on Friday August 14 2020, @09:01PM (2 children)

          by Thexalon (636) on Friday August 14 2020, @09:01PM (#1036756)

          the practical effect is the same thing as saying that the phone company can choose to not connect your calls

          And by that exact same logic, any system for filtering phone spam is bad and wrong - after all, the spammers are just sharing their opinion that they have something very important to tell you about your car's extended warranty, and why should that get blocked and your speech not get blocked?

          --
          The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:11PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:11PM (#1036761)

            Not at all, if it is the end user choosing not to listen.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:57PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:57PM (#1036783)

            The phone company doesn't block spammers, they ring through then, after receiving the call, I can block that number from ringing through the next time. Nothing done proactively by the phone company.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:40PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:40PM (#1036775)

        Fe di verse!

        Build your own platform and connect it to the fediverse! It's the capitalist thing to do!

        Mostly what I'm interested in is whether some kind of right-wing negaverse will emerge if most of the fediverse doesn't care to link with fascist-oriented nodes.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:42PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @09:42PM (#1036777)

          oops, meant to respond to Phoenix instead

      • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:08AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:08AM (#1036836)

        You don't have the right to use somebody else's PA system to give your speech without their permission.

        And they don't have the right to outsource their moderation to foreign agents of a banned terrorist organization [archive.org] and gaslight everyone about whether it is happening or not while pretending that they are only banning "hate speech". This is a crime called treason [cornell.edu], and the penalty is death for all co-conspirators.

        (and they ban people for saying that as "incitement to violence")

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:49PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:49PM (#1036661)

      So the best idea with videos about how to interfere with people's ability to vote is to say please don't do that? Let alone you requiring that someone host your content? Sounds like you want to nationalize social media, sounds awfully communist to me!

    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by HiThere on Friday August 14 2020, @08:26PM

      by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Friday August 14 2020, @08:26PM (#1036738) Journal

      There's a real problem here. In the first place you're absolutely correct, but in the second mobs aren't democracy either.

      ISTM that democracy has a scaling problem. This isn't unusual, as almost ALL organizations do. Democracy's scaling limit seems to be around 500 people, but only that high if they're constrained to be calm and reasonable. Beyond that point you need additional structuring rules. (Actually to even approach 500 you need lots of structuring rules. The House of Representatives only has 435 members, and it has many structuring rules, including a Sergeant at Arms, and it still breaks down occasionally.)

      That said, I don't trust commercial interests either, and Facebook is an especially bad example. attrib: "They 'trust me'. Dumb fucks." -Mark Zuckerberg.

      Roberts Rules of Order was an attempt to scale up the system (well, to make it more efficient in smaller groups). Slashdot and later Soylent News attempt to solve the problem with moderation to limited success. They still need super users with "supercow privileges" to handle some cases. But without the structure you have a mob, which may be emotionally stimulating, but which is almost guaranteed to make bad decisions. The choices will be made by the loudest and most emotional voices.

      --
      Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:13PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:13PM (#1036792)

      The abuses are already present. Corporate media outlets like CNN, MSNBC, etc. are all monetized on Youtube, whereas independent content creators like David Pakman and Kyle Kulinski routinely have their videos demonetized, and sometimes outright removed due to bogus copyright claims. Youtube's algorithms are also aggressively promoting corporate media videos, whereas before it was more neutral.

      It turns out that Silicon Valley oligarchs aren't your friends. Who knew?

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:17PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:17PM (#1036813)

        Perhaps more people should do Youtube videos specifically detailing how IP laws are hindering free speech and how the law should be changed to prevent this.

    • (Score: 2) by Tork on Saturday August 15 2020, @08:09PM (3 children)

      by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Saturday August 15 2020, @08:09PM (#1037221)

      I think it's dangerous territory to pretend like something new is going on when private businesses have been catering to the wishes of their customers for centuries. I was going to joke that soon you lot will suddenly scream about censorship when your neighbors put out campaign signs in their lawns opposing your political views, but what would have been a light-hearted busting or your balls has in recent months become more of a prediction of the next level of stupidity we can expect in the near-future.

      --
      🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
      • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Sunday August 16 2020, @05:32PM (2 children)

        by Phoenix666 (552) on Sunday August 16 2020, @05:32PM (#1037535) Journal

        I think it's dangerous territory to pretend like something new is going on when private businesses have been catering to the wishes of their customers for centuries.

        Alright, then. So you'd be OK with AT&T, Verizon, or some other private business running your phone service to cut you off because they don't like your political leanings? It's the same thing as what Google/YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, and other Big Tech companies are doing. Are you OK with Amazon refusing to deliver anything to you because they don't like your political leanings? Why not, because by your logic they're a "private business?" Oh, wait, you need them? Well, too bad, according to Tork's logic.

        Do I really need to spell out, letter by letter, why this sort of thing is dangerous for a country that wants to be a pluralistic democracy? When we play at this sort of thing, we're not a country anymore but a civil war. If that's what you guys all want, if that's what you're hungering for, then you'll get it.

        --
        Washington DC delenda est.
        • (Score: 2) by Tork on Sunday August 16 2020, @05:46PM

          by Tork (3914) Subscriber Badge on Sunday August 16 2020, @05:46PM (#1037544)
          All of the services you mention can cut me off right now anyway for practically any reason. Someone could accuse me of nose-picking and I'd have no legal recourse if they shut me down over it, true or not. If they want to cut off half their revenue because of who they think their customers will vote for then what else would you want the government to do?
          --
          🏳️‍🌈 Proud Ally 🏳️‍🌈
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @11:39PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @11:39PM (#1037652)

          So you'd be OK with AT&T, Verizon, or some other private business running your phone service to cut you off because they don't like your political leanings?

          We had a regime like that, back in the 1950s when "good, respectable" white people would "call out" and "deplatform" businesses that would dare to serve black customers.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @06:45AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday August 16 2020, @06:45AM (#1037385)

      When I saw "hacked information", I thought of whistleblowers releasing internal information, like what happened to the democrats in 2016.

      Weren't the democrats high on "whistleblowers" sometime last year for the previous anti-Trump campaign until they pivoted to Covid-19?

  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Friday August 14 2020, @05:51PM (1 child)

    by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:51PM (#1036636) Journal

    Youtube is doing squat compared to the interference from the president. He is the real danger and little is being done. Congress took the month off, so, I guess, good luck!

    --
    La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
    • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:29PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:29PM (#1036688)

      But this story is much better for stoking conservative faux outrage that fewer and fewer people care about them.

  • (Score: 2) by captain_nifty on Friday August 14 2020, @05:56PM (1 child)

    by captain_nifty (4252) on Friday August 14 2020, @05:56PM (#1036638)

    To often one side of the two party duopoly of this country convinces their supporters to support and enact laws and policies that will favor them when in power, only to decry those powers when wielded by the other* side. *A good working theory would be that they are the same side who both desire more power.

    I really wonder if these policies would be enforced if negative information came to light from questionable sources that made Trump look bad.

    In general I think the whole foreign hacking shtick is absurd, how about rather than complain about what negative (but true) information was released by unlawful means they could try to be less evil shits.

    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:02PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:02PM (#1036641)

      Chinese propaganda favoring the Biden campaign is fine.

  • (Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:32PM (1 child)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @06:32PM (#1036650)

    They report false (out of context) statements and report hacked info all the time

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:36PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:36PM (#1036742)

      Fox is worse, ban them first.

  • (Score: 3, Informative) by progo on Friday August 14 2020, @06:45PM (3 children)

    by progo (6356) on Friday August 14 2020, @06:45PM (#1036657) Homepage

    What about all those times last summer when Tulsi Gabbard made a hit in the news cycle and was immediately shadowbanned for it from her Google Ads and Youtube videos for about a day and a half each time? Is that kind of election meddling okay for Google to do itself?

    • (Score: 2, Flamebait) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @07:44PM (2 children)

      by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @07:44PM (#1036704) Journal

      [CITATION NEEDED]

      • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:00PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:00PM (#1036785)

        Tulsi Gabbard Files $50M Lawsuit Against Google for Post-Debate Ad Ban [pjmedia.com]
        Tulsi Gabbard, Democratic Presidential Candidate, Sues Google for $50 Million [nytimes.com]

        Judge dismisses Tulsi Gabbard’s $50 million ad lawsuit against Google [engadget.com]:

        ...US District Judge Stephen Wilson rejected the case, explaining that the campaign "fails to state a claim that is legally sufficient to implicate the First Amendment" and failed to show "how Google's regulation of its own platform is in any way equivalent to a governmental regulation of an election."

        Google originally explained that it suspended the Tulsi Now, Inc. ad account for suspicious activity. There was a sudden increase in spending after the first Democratic debate, and Google's system automatically flagged the account, which was reinstated shortly....

        As Wilson pointed out, it's common for tech companies to have some sort of automated system to detect cybercrime, and under Gabbard's argument, "every media organization that took steps to prevent foreign cybercrimes could potentially implicate the First Amendment."

        Does not sound like shadowbanning.

        Wilson, Stephen Victor [fjc.gov]:

        Nominated by Ronald Reagan on September 9, 1985, to a new seat authorized by 98 Stat. 333. Confirmed by the Senate on October 16, 1985, and received commission on October 17, 1985.

        • (Score: 3, Informative) by progo on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:22AM

          by progo (6356) on Saturday August 15 2020, @12:22AM (#1036847) Homepage

          The same day this happened, you could not find any videos published by Tulsi Gabbard on YouTube, unless you searched from a non-USA IP address.

          This is shadow banning and election meddling, and I don't believe for one minute that the multiple times they suspended her adwords account for suspicious spending that they really suspected a problem on her end. They didn't want her to spend lots of money to bid on ad spots while she was a hot media story for a day.

  • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:32PM (8 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:32PM (#1036690)
    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by HammeredGlass on Friday August 14 2020, @07:43PM (6 children)

      by HammeredGlass (12241) on Friday August 14 2020, @07:43PM (#1036702)

      Congress fucked the USPS. It's not the President's job to fix their mess. He should not be dumping taxpayer dollars down that bottomless pit of a badly setup pension funding requirement which the USPS is uniquely obligated to pre-pay for longer than any other pension system in this country.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:59PM (5 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @07:59PM (#1036717)

        Lol The President is openly saying he won't fund USPS to make sure ballots aren't delivered and you are here licking the shit stain off his ass.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:11PM (4 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:11PM (#1036724)

          Elections are a state matter. If the Democrat governors want to rig the elections in their favor, then they can buy a reply permit and pay for the postage.
          All of us small-d democrats must oppose the Democrat plan of unsupervised voting, as we opposed the Republican scheme of requiring ID to vote.

          • (Score: 4, Informative) by DeathMonkey on Friday August 14 2020, @08:18PM

            by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday August 14 2020, @08:18PM (#1036729) Journal
          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:23PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @08:23PM (#1036734)

            You mean I have to go find and then buy an overpriced postage stamp in order to make my voice heard even though my dumb ass mailman will probably misdeliver my ballot to my neighbors like he's done for the last 20 years? Fuck that.

          • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:28PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:28PM (#1036799)

            If the Democrat governors want to rig the elections

            Perhaps you or Donnie could provide evidence that mail-in voting is subject to widespread fraud. You're basically accusing both the postal workers and the local police of colluding to overthrow democracy.

            I'd expect this shit in some 3rd world "shithole country", not the USA.

            But hey this is America, the greatest country on earth. Or so they keep telling us. And yet one side would have you believe the postal service is corrupt.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:30PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @10:30PM (#1036800)

            Unsupervised voting? What a total non-issue.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:24PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 14 2020, @11:24PM (#1036817)

      Relevant image [twimg.com]

  • (Score: 2) by shortscreen on Saturday August 15 2020, @03:52AM

    by shortscreen (2252) on Saturday August 15 2020, @03:52AM (#1036933) Journal

    Stop trying to redefine anything you don't like as "interfering in an election." That's 100% BS.

    Now the real question... Is Youtube EXPECTING damaging information to come out for some reason?? (And what kind of mental gymnastics would be on display if it went against the other team instead of their team?)

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