Russia considers accepting Bitcoin for oil and gas:
Russia is considering accepting Bitcoin as payment for its oil and gas exports, according to a high-ranking lawmaker.> Pavel Zavalny says "friendly" countries could be allowed to pay in the crypto-currency or in their local currencies.
Earlier this week, Russian President Vladimir Putin said that he wanted "unfriendly" countries to buy its gas with roubles.
The move is understood to be aimed at boosting the Russian currency, which has lost over 20% in value this year.
[...] However, Russia is still the world's biggest exporter of natural gas and the second largest supplier of oil.
Mr Zavalny, who heads Russia's State Duma committee on energy, said on Thursday that the country has been exploring alternative ways to receive payment for energy exports.
He said China and Turkey were among "friendly" countries which were "not involved in the sanctions pressure".
[...] Mr Putin's comments on making "unfriendly" countries pay in roubles drove the currency to a three-week high.
However, many existing gas contracts are agreed upon in euros and it is unclear if Russia can change them. The EU relies on Russia for 40% of its gas.
(Score: 2, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @10:11AM (6 children)
could this lead to a ban on crypto?
One can only hope.
(Score: 0, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:01PM (2 children)
It had better. We need to make sure those Russiacel computer dorks understand that they'll never get laid. Real men blow shit up and engage in mass murder and atrocities.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:06PM (1 child)
Thanks for telling everyone, very loudly, what a victim you are.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 29 2022, @03:52AM
You don't understand! This is worse than Clowncels!
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:03PM
Turns out it was the dollar that got banned rather than crypto.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @03:46PM (1 child)
No, this is not going to lead to a ban on crypto but, if this nutty idea were to come to fruition,. the Russian economy would be taken on one hell of a joy ride. If you think the Russian economy is topsy turvy now, you ain't seen nothing yet!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @05:19PM
Laugh, learn, love while you manage your volatile bitrubles.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by bradley13 on Monday March 28 2022, @10:12AM (28 children)
It's not unclear at all. It's a contract, and a contract cannot be changed without agreement of both parties.
Yes, well, this is stupid. The EU needs to stop funding Russia's war against Ukraine. If that means that people have to wear sweaters at home, tough. Otherwise, they are actively funding Russia, which is just a little bit at odds with the idea of "harsh sanctions".
Also, long-term lesson: maybe creating economic interdependence with unpleasant regimes is...not such a clever idea.
Everyone is somebody else's weirdo.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by khallow on Monday March 28 2022, @11:00AM (12 children)
Or to rephrase in a way that doesn't sound like it is even hard to do. A contract can be changed merely with the agreement of both parties.
The percentage that Europe depends on Russia for has gone down significantly. It's now just under 25% [bruegel.org] of imports.
Unpleasant regimes need not stay that way. Economic engagement can improve them. It hasn't worked so far with Russia, but there are a number of examples of regimes that got better: China, Spain, Taiwan, Philippines, Chile, Brazil, to name some examples that come to me.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Monday March 28 2022, @12:40PM (2 children)
> A contract can be changed merely with the agreement of both parties.
Or by appropriate legislation.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday March 28 2022, @12:48PM (1 child)
Only if the other party is subject to that legislation. And well, even then, they can just not honor the contract in a variety of ways, some legal some not.
(Score: 3, Informative) by PiMuNu on Monday March 28 2022, @01:16PM
> Only if the other party is subject to that legislation. ... they can just not honor the contract...
That was the direction of travel I had in mind - e.g. Western powers can (have?) legislated that it is illegal to trade with Russia.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @02:35PM (6 children)
You can be happy to know that your Switzerland has “chosen” to team with the unpleasant US, invaders of sovereign Syria, Iraq, Libya and other places. Some of the citizens may still remember the time when Switzerland was fiercely independent.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by khallow on Monday March 28 2022, @04:32PM (5 children)
War is Peace.
Freedom is Slavery.
Ignorance is Strength.
Switzerland's strict neutrality is not a suicide pact. Ukraine is in a situation that Switzerland has been in at points in their pasts and which they might be again. A world where the strong can just knock over weak countries with frivolous pretext is a world where Switzerland can't survive in the long run.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 29 2022, @09:08AM (2 children)
Oh shut the fuck up stooge. Switzerland is not neutral it is a bank. India is neutral. You guys can't stomach neutrality. Btw, how is Assange doing? Or is he just collateral to doing good?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday March 29 2022, @10:09AM
What's not neutral about a bank? I find it interesting how you're whining about this. You must be pretty far gone to just not get Switzerland's point of view.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday March 29 2022, @09:24PM
For now. I bet they're one Russian atrocity away from not being neutral. And I wonder how the Russian people appreciate being dumped into a sloppy, Afghanistan-style war with neither a reason for being there nor an exit strategy. My bet is that they'll take it poorly - it'll just take some time for everyone to realize that they're not the only ones wondering why things got so crazy.
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday March 29 2022, @05:23PM (1 child)
I mean damn, it's a pretty bad fucking sign when even Switzerland allies against you!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday March 29 2022, @09:25PM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @05:33PM (1 child)
So, they went from Authoritarian system to a Totalitarian one now, not sure that is better. People live temporary better because Xi has not been in power for that long. Just wait another 10 years when he goes crazy over his "legacy" and invades Taiwan.
The current one is not so good either.
Perhaps you are talking about few decades timescale, but in that case it's also not much better either. Economic engagement tends to make regimes less likely to wage war since they are very much affected by it too. But in case of Russia, if the regime is delusional, they can explain away the positives and negatives. Putin was talking almost a decade ago about "ready to be isolated". Remember when they were trying to isolate their DNS system some time back?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday March 28 2022, @06:41PM
The other way around. They went from a totalitarian nightmare to a merely oppressive authoritarian state. Baby steps. Similar thing with Brazil. I didn't say either was perfect, but rather that they had improved.
Explain it away, sure, but we'll see who listens when there are tens of thousands of casualties so far and a economic mess at home - with some flimsy concern about "denazification" behind it all.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:18PM (1 child)
A couple of thoughts about that...
"I am altering the deal. Pray I do not alter it any further." -- Darth Vador
"If you owe the bank $100, they own you. If you owe the bank $1 million, you own them." -- Anonymous
(Score: 5, Touché) by deimtee on Monday March 28 2022, @12:37PM
You need to update that.
"If you owe the bank $1 million, they own you. If you owe the bank $1 billion, you own them." -- Anonymous
If you cough while drinking cheap red wine it really cleans out your sinuses.
(Score: 2) by Thexalon on Monday March 28 2022, @12:41PM (5 children)
The Europeans have been aware of this problem for a good long while, especially since there have been a couple of incidents that involved Russia turning off gas pipelines to punish them for some diplomatic slight (I think complaining about their actions in Chechnya). Which I've been generally convinced was at least as much of a motivator for the longstanding push for EU countries to switch to renewables as environmental concerns.
The US has also been plainly aware of the issue, for quite a while. The Obama administration's efforts to get a new government in Syria were motivated in large part by the desire to build a pipeline from Iraq and Saudi Arabia through Syria and Turkey and into Europe. And more recently, the Biden administration has been heavily focused on arranging an alternate source of oil and gas for Europe from places like Venezuela, the UAE, and Saudi Arabia, and I'm quite certain that was a focus of Biden's trip to Europe this week.
In the last few days, Germany and the US have announced plans to drastically reduce Russian gas imports [ft.com], so I think it's safe to say they know it's a problem and are handling it.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:50PM (2 children)
Why is the US trying to build a pipeline to *Europe*? Shouldn't Europe be doing this? Do they even want this pipeline?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @07:41PM
Because as slow as US bureaucracy is, it is a racehorse compared to the EU. Europe should be building it themselves, but if it is to be finished this century then someone else needs to step in.
(Score: 2) by Thexalon on Monday March 28 2022, @09:43PM
The US wasn't planning on paying for it or doing the construction, just setting up the conditions where one of the multinational oil companies can do that.
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
(Score: 0, Troll) by PiMuNu on Monday March 28 2022, @01:15PM (1 child)
> Which I've been generally convinced was at least as much of a motivator for the longstanding push for EU countries to switch to renewables as environmental concerns.
Unfortunately, Germany has been struggling for energy security since their decision to reject nuclear power.
The decision followed the massive Tsunami that killed 10s of thousands of people and released untold volumes of chemical waste. Oh it also damaged the Fukushima power plant, resulting in the death of a handful of people (during the un-necessary evacuation).
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @07:02PM
Then why don't you go live there with your family, or better yet, Tchernobyl ?
(Score: 5, Informative) by ikanreed on Monday March 28 2022, @01:51PM
Here's a fun fact about the immutability of contracts: it's a social construct enforced by governments, and/or mutual trust.
If one of those doesn't apply(international relations) and the other is clearly falling apart, it's just fucking paper.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @02:03PM
It all depends on who or what enforces it. Without effective enforcement, the contract is worthless. In this case, who is going to enforce the contract between countries?
These things happen all the time. Most disputes never make it to court. One party violates the contract, and the other knows that fighting it will be more costly than sitting down and negotiating a new contract. It happens all the time. Contracts are not as rock solid as they appear to be.
(Score: 3, Touché) by mcgrew on Monday March 28 2022, @02:04PM
It's a contract, and a contract cannot be changed without agreement of both parties.
Darth Putin: "I have changed the terms. Pray I don't change them again. The Dark Force has nukes."
mcgrewbooks.com mcgrew.info nooze.org
(Score: 2) by crafoo on Monday March 28 2022, @03:34PM
these contracts will have clauses in them that cover many situations where the contract will no longer be valid or it can be re-negotiated.
Claiming it is not unclear just means you have never actually seen one of these contracts or know anything about them. You do write authoritatively though, so you have that.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @08:09PM (2 children)
Yes, but if you want oil or gas it's choosing between bad and worse.
Up until a few weeks ago, Russia wasn't close to the bottom of that list. In my eyes it was even above US at that point. (Carpet bombing the entire middle East for several decades and keeping Gitmo open put that near the bottom)
(Score: 2) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday March 29 2022, @05:32PM
Well if ya don't like decades worth of bombings in the middle east then I've got news about Russia for ya! [wikipedia.org]
Hell, they're even trying to sneak in a few right now while we're all paying attention to Ukraine! [middleeastmonitor.com]
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday March 29 2022, @09:48PM
This is just a nickpick and doesn't materially change your argument, but carpet bombing is a very indiscriminate sort of bombing. Basically the plane flies at high altitude and drops a large amount of unguided ("dumb") munitions. It's highly inaccurate no matter the other conditions of the battlefield. The last war where genuine carpet bombing occurred was the Kuwait War in 1991, delivered by B-52 bombers against Iraqi positions. From what I'm reading, it is claimed that B-52s were delivering cruise missiles and precision guidance ("smart") munitions in later wars. As far as I know, everything else delivers precision guidance munitions which are pretty accurate or directed munitions (like the A-10's autocannon).
The problem isn't the bomb delivery, which can deliver lethal munitions to within meters of the target, sometimes much less. But rather the military intelligence which determines whether a target should be bombed. Because as we know, those same "smart" systems can deliver a bomb to the middle of a wedding as easily as they can to a group of bad guys. It's the conspicuous, repeated failing of the people who plan and direct these strikes and their leadership.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:07PM
https://youtube.com/watch?v=jdy2E-62Py0 [youtube.com]
(Score: 4, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @12:38PM
Sanctions seem to be working.
Now if Germany would just stop sending cash.
(Score: 0, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @02:33PM
I want to venture into the unexplored world of becoming a crypto Oil Barron!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @05:29PM (2 children)
so let's see how this might go:
we assume the electrical energy used for crypto comes from burning russian fossile fuels.
russia empties its "free" natural energy resources and gets ... crypto in return?
so the germans and french and other smart european engineers and scientist don't "make" anything with the energy they get from russia ... but mine crypto all day long.
so eventually the free underground ancient tanks are empty, the world got a bit warmer and russia has a ton of crypto and the other enegineers are sitting on idle, unpowered crypto mining rigs?
not sure i would call this a win-win situation?
ofc, dumping the crypto when the underground storage emptyness needle approaches ... well... empty into "real" money -aka- coupons for fossile fuel -aka- dollars is a option... tho i guess having a bazillion gazillion dollars is still worthless if there's not a baked bean can anywhere on the planet that can be purchased.
what is prolly most realistic, is to keep the crypto craze going by allowing some purchase of fossile energy, like a marketing gimmick ... which ofc is energy wasted on a believe in higher return thus keeping the wastefull energy consumption (of fossile fuel) going?
would be funny if the fusion reactor wasn't completed before fossile ran dry, because of a missing 2kwh which was used by a crypto fanatic trying to mine just one more crypto coin :D on that very last day.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 28 2022, @05:50PM
geez, haven't figured it out yet? what's going on in the world today is about getting the oil smeared and gas addicted lemmings to march over the approaching cliff IN A ORDERLY fashion, not sending them to rehabilition to cure them from fossile energy addiction and freeing them from being a lemming ...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 30 2022, @02:39AM
huh? The ruskies won't just be selling their oil for crypto and then sit on said crypto - they'll use it to exchange for other resources because crypto is currently not regulated nor controlled in sanctions and there's a market for it.
Also, you don't need to mine crypto for them to start to use crypto - there's already enough in circulation and its not a 1-to-1 relationship between mining and usage. Obviously if mining velocity drops there's an impact to the denomination value.
As long as there's enough alternate minded folks in the world, which seems to be in abundance, that have enough distrust into the modern established monetary system, this alternate currency will continue to be used and hence have value.